Requesting advice!

Paging @Skarmand to the thread, he's the best keyboard player I can think of so hopefully he'll know some sick tipz n trix

CatsOfMsFortune said:

I didn't see this reply until just now, but if you can get him to give me some advice as a keyboard player, I'd very much appreciate it. I did get some tips from @FunkyHellboy on his stream yesterday but I'm always itching to get better with my mains. I could also work on a secondary, just in case I need to do such.

Definitely just keep playing and you'll get better. Also if you need some experience, join my tournament on Saturday, @Dawn111 is the best keyboard player I've seen, and trust me I have seen a LOT. I'm sure he can help. And he does come to the tourney and stream alot so give him a chance when you can. He will denifinatly be ok with helping you.

@zeknife @noaa @Colossi

some pretty great keyboard players

and I REALLY recommend you to practice your inputs, being able to do DPs(the "z motion"), QFCs and, later on, 360s consistently is a very big deal. Try doing some on training facing both sides from time to time, the consistency will really help improve your execution and will give you more tools in neutral.

CaioLugon said:

@zeknife @noaa @Colossi

some pretty great keyboard players

I didn't know any of these dudes played on keyboard, wild

CaioLugon said:

and I REALLY recommend you to practice your inputs, being able to do DPs(the "z motion"), QFCs and, later on, 360s consistently is a very big deal. Try doing some on training facing both sides from time to time, the consistency will really help improve your execution and will give you more tools in neutral.

Something I used to do back in vanilla was pick Double and starting from the corner do L Hornet Bomber over and over, I wouldn't stop practicing until I could go from one end of the screen to the other and then back again and if I messed one up I would start again from the beginning.

mcpeanuts said:

Something I used to do back in vanilla was pick Double and starting from the corner do L Hornet Bomber over and over, I wouldn't stop practicing until I could go from one end of the screen to the other and then back again and if I messed one up I would start again from the beginning.

This works well. Once you can do motions by themselves consistently, add some complexity like dashing, first blocking before inputting move, pressing another button before doing the motion, etc

Anyone who plays on keyboard should first check for potential ghosting issues before banging their head against impossible inputs
http://www.microsoft.com/appliedsciences/content/projects/KeyboardGhostingDemo.aspx
Use this to check stuff like holding various directional combinations while pressing other combinations of attack buttons (Grab, assist calls, PP, KK etc) and seeing if there's something that doesn't work. Basically any inputs you think you might be doing in-game, test them and see if they register properly on your keyboard (If you have a mechanical keyboard or some other specific anti-ghosting design this is a non-issue)

SG inputs are lenient enough that you don't really need any special tricks or things to watch out for, besides pressing buttons until it becomes second nature


Also keep in mind you have the privilege of four macro buttons since you can check "use right stick assists" and bind those to any key you like (I don't know if this also works on controllers)

As a 'keyboard' player myself, I can tell you right now that 360s certainly aren't impossible, and are in fact quite easy ever since Mike put in a little more leniency a few months ago. Sure it takes a little more practice, but now you can even just tap the four cardinal directions (in any sequence and returning to neutral after each) to get them to come out so it's just a matter of grinding it until whatever technique you use becomes second nature.

Re. Keybindings, I'm assuming that you're using your middle finger to hit the 8 and 2 keys - I'd recommend at least trying a more standard WASD layout or if your keys aren't low-profile then the arrow keys might be better still because you can then use the middle of your middle finger to press down and the tip to press up during a 360 motion (I don't do this, but some people find it useful so I'd suggest at least trying it out). Using the arrow keys might prevent ghosting as well, though in my experience ghosting over the numpad is rarely an issue.

As for 'Z-motion' moves, I can help you there. I assume that you can do a standard fireball/quarter-circle-forward motion without difficulty, but for completeness what I do for that is roll my fingers across the down and forward keys such that things happen in the order:
This becomes second nature pretty quickly and isn't hard to do (and IMO actually feels cooler than doing QCF on a stick), though I suspect a WASD-style layout could help (e.g. try binding to the numpad-5 key with your current bindings and try this).

Going from this to the DP motion isn't that difficult but it does require you to mentally say "OK, I want a DP now" when you first try it. First, just try to do forward followed by quarter-circle-forward (). The process is this (not any harder than just doing a QCF):
1. press
2. release

3. press
4. press
5. release
6. release

This won't come out as a DP with SG's input (it would in, say, SFIV), but to turn this into a legit DP motion all you have to do is force yourself to not let go of the and keys when you do the motion instead of autopiloting into a QCF. I do this by pressing the two keys slightly harder when I decide to do a DP instead of a QCF, and then just hold them down until you've hit the punch/kick/whatever.

Oh I just read what layout you're currently using
I think it benefits to use a hitbox-style layout where you get one finger for each direction (I use ASD-Space for left, down, right, up, and the numpad for attack buttons)
Committing to a control scheme that requires you to reposition a finger every time you want to switch from down to up seems like a bad idea. You want everything to be as theoretically effortless as possible, even if it is less intuitive at first.

Okay so... here we go.

CatsOfMsFortune said:

I can't use the 360 command grab Blockbuster with Cerebella because I'm using a keyboard

You might not be able to do a 360, but the reason for it is NOT because you're using a keyboard. You might be surprised how easy it is to input a 360 on 4 keys in Skullgirls. Yes, your layout for the directions is probably the issue. I'd also like to know what are the buttons you're using for punches, kicks and macros.

CatsOfMsFortune said:

at least, for my keyboard setup as I use the numpad's 8, 2, 4, and 6 for Up, Down, Left, and Right respectively

Okay that's it. You NEED to change your layout.

In order to do so, answer these questions in order:
1. Do you prefer to use your right or left hand to input directions?
2. Is your keyboard mechanical?
3. Do you really rely on your macros? Are the existance of those a priority for you? Can those serve another purpose if needed?

Regarding question 1 - personally, I like to input directions with my left hand. This already narrows down some options I have on layout. I can use the "standard" WASD for directions, and find myself a range of 6 or 8 buttons for the rest (the numpad is awesome for those).

Or maybe pushing the WASD closer to the rest. If you input directions with your right hand, there's some good options too. The numpad buttons "8, 4, 5 and 6" make a good layout of directions, and can be a great alternate to the standard arrow keys. As for the 6-8 buttons, anything goes in that case.

If you want some examples, I uploaded here some layouts I know people use. The one I personally use is the green one.

Regaring question 2 - After setting up the perfect design that suits your hand position and comfyness, comes the bad part. The part where GHOSTING is a factor. You'll maybe notice that if you press a certain amount of specific buttons, at some point your keyboard will simply ignore your inputs. Which and how many buttons vary from keyboard to keyboard.

So yeah, head over to this awesome website where you can interactively test button combinations and check what works and what doesn't. Keep in mind it will be nearly impossible to find a layout for fighting games that absolutely denies any type of ghosting. On the layout I use, I can't charge downback and press any medium buttons. (Yeah, I can't do c.mp > xx L Shot as Parasoul. I'm also restricted to using LP+HP for crouching pushblocks). So if you NEED to have a restriction, choose one that affects you the least.

IF YOU HAVE A MECHANICAL KEYBOARD ignore everything I said about ghosting. These modern high-priced noisy things have absolutely NO ISSUE handling multiple button presses simultaneously.

Regarding question 3 - If you ABSOLUTELY CAN'T find a good way to deal with ghosting, you can use a macro to get hold of a problem. These are extra buttons that can be assigned to regular tasks that may or may not be affected by ghosting. This is where problem solving becomes a necessity and some heavy theorycrafting might come before you. In the multiple keyboards I've played in, I've never felt the need to correct anything with macros. So there's that.

Good luck, fellow keyboard player! I'll be watching this thread if you or anyone have any questions :)

The above post is good, but it's worth pointing out that having a mechanical keyboard doesn't necessarily mean you won't have ghosting issues, and likewise having an 'ordinary' keyboard doesn't necessarily mean you will.