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An Attempt To Bring People Back Into SG That May/May Not Work But Hey We Tried

keninblack

keninblack

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Alright, so it turns out that A LOT of people who heard/used to/want to play SG in the FGC, still think the game is like it was in Vanilla. Now, regardless of how you feel about how the game was/is now... I'm pretty sure we can all agree that Vanilla Skullgirls and the current version of Encore, are two pretty different things.

I get it though, you tell your friends "BOMBER'S FINE NOW" "ITS NOT ONE TOUCH DEATH"

But hey lets try SHOWING them with a couple videos Mkay?

So my plan is to go over in detail the following things...

-Vanilla, and the things you can do with Vanilla.
-Encore, and what it does in the mechanics to fix what happened in Vanilla.
-Character specific videos as to what changed with each character over time, for better or worse.
-Whatever else you guys should think I could do.

THINGS I NEED!

-Ima check with @winnie because he might still have it on his 360, BUT I NEED A CONSOLE WITH THE ABILITY TO PLAY VANILLA. I don't have anything like that.

IF YOU HAVE A CONSOLE (PS3 or 360) WITH VANILLA SKULLGIRLS, LET ME KNOW. I'll gladly discuss how I could get it via mailing/meet up whatever. Sadly I won't be able to supply much but my undying gratitude and i'll probably thank you in the videos. Obviously, when done, you'll get your console mailed/returned hassle free no question.

SOMEONE WHO IS GOOD WITH VIDEO EDITING BECAUSE I CANNOT DO VIDEO EDITING.

I can voice over game footage with my mic/capture card no problem however.

So yeah I dunno hit me with ideas and thoughts guys. I know I know "it wont change anything" bleh maybe it wont but at the very least, if I pull this off... If someone says "BLAH BLAH HK BOMBER BLAH BLAH TODS" you can just LINK them these couple of videos and show them that this shit doesn't sail anymore.
 
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@herbvijkl has some old ass version on ps3 where Fortune HK is still the launcher with head on.
I'd have to ask him exactly how old it is.
 
People's problem with the system in Vanilla was one issue. Another was presentation and roster. So any demonstration in that respect would help as well.

Also according to @render tweets, people think Skullgirls have an intimidatingly steep learning curve. Therefore it may also be useful for tutorial videos be broken down bit by bit like this video series: https://www.youtube.com/user/novriltataki
"Airdash Academy" and "Guilty Bits" are the main examples I speak of.
 
True i'll go over roster changes and how it added characters.

However I feel like the presentation of the game is too opinionated to go over.

If you don't like the art style/music/etc, you probably still wont like it and thats fine, thats just how certain people are. I definitely will go over the things that HAVE factually changed to the best I can doe
 
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keninblack said:
True i'll go over roster changes and how it added characters.

However I feel like the presentation of the game is too opinionated to go over.

If you don't like the art style/music/etc, you probably still wont like it and thats fine, thats just how certain people are. I definitely will go over the things that HAVE factually changed to the best I can doe

I was thinking more of showcasing things like the double snap effects and super finishes but thinking back, that can simply be added to the rundown of system changes. But yeah, the tutorial vids should follow a similar format I think for people to wrap their heads around the game and characters.
 
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Grunt said:
plz don't call it Skullbits
Can we do an indiegogo for this for 30k and only make what was it... 6k?
 
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lmao there's already too many "bits" videos.
Call it 101 or something cuz like, Skullgirls kinda sounds like SCHOOLgirls already.
 
I like Schoolgirls.

I also have vanilla on 360. Am willing to send it to whoever.
keninblack said:
If you don't like the art style/music/etc, you probably still wont like it and thats fine, thats just how certain people are. I definitely will go over the things that HAVE factually changed to the best I can doe
Make sure to cover how Valentine's red crosses changed color
 
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Mike_Z said:
It'd be pretty easy to record a vanilla combo in Encore and show it doesn't work...

I want vanilla to show other things outside of combos too.
 
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call it DID YOU KNOW SKULL GIRLS

Mike_Z said:
It'd be pretty easy to record a vanilla combo in Encore and show it doesn't work...

as if your average person would know what a vanilla combo was like in the first place to know the difference
 
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Mike_Z said:
It'd be pretty easy to record a vanilla combo in Encore and show it doesn't work...
I think seeing things side by side will help people who stopped paying attention more than saying "You used to be able to combo more here" or "this used to take up much more time" or "this used to be really good, but trust me it's worse now". And then there's other things like Green Bounce. If people haven't touched it in a long time, it'll be harder to conceptualize just how much of a difference things make, I think.
 
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keninblack said:
Mike_Z said:
It'd be pretty easy to record a vanilla combo in Encore and show it doesn't work...
I want vanilla to show other things outside of combos too.

Yeah, combos are only a fraction of it. There needs to be a more all encompassing display that sends the message:
"You remember this game? Okay, it has gone through changes since the last time you saw it! This is what is different and this is what has been added. Interested!?"
 
I've got Sony Vegas and have moderate editing experience by just toying with the program. If no one else is up for it I wouldn't mind editing up some clips. Be aware that it will be simple. Nothing super fancy. Just some clips with simple transition effects and text on the screen if need be. Along with any background music/speech. If you're wanting anything more than that. Someone else with more experience and better software should do it.
 
You could probably just ask for permission to use somebody's combo that they recorded back when Vanilla was a thing. Try @severine
 
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I can see one thing you might want to consider. If the message you're going to be using is "All of these problems with Skullgirls are fixed! You should play it now!" then the response some people will have is "If it's fixed, why are you still changing it? And why learn the game now if everything will change again in a few months?". One way around this would be to release this video series after the main changes are done, or else use that to your advantage and say "And if you find something that's wrong, you can always complain to our wonderful developers!" (Sorry Mike), but then the response will probably be "So what you're saying is that they aren't able to balance their own game?".

I'm certainly not saying I agree with these counterarguments, but it's something that is probably worth thinking about when you set the tone of the videos.

EDIT: This isn't a rant against the way the beta is being used to better the game (I think its great) or the fact that the game actually receives balance updates (something some other games sorely need), but you can't ignore the fact that some people find its presence unusual in a genre where you have traditionally been given a game and the choice to either deal with its issues or move along.
 
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People that are going to make those kinds of arguments aren't going to be swayed by whatever people say or do with these videos. They are a lost cause, they don't want to play the game and just shit on it.

This video is for people that may be interested in the game but haven't picked it up because of hearsay of Vanilla or haven't played it since Vanilla because they didn't like something mechanically about the game. The video would be made to illustrate to them in a side by side comparison of the changes the game has gone from how it was originally to current. It's to show it's an entirely different game and maybe more in tune with what they like.

There have been game trailers for updates to games in the past that are like: "You can do THIS now! Check it out!" but this takes it a step further to show off how Encore is different from the past iteration of Skullgirls most people know of. Too many people don't know there is a big difference with Encore from the game they once knew. So instead of having people explain over and over again the differences, it's often best to show them so there's a utility to making this and better still, it can be distributed widely.

It's mind boggling that people actually think the game is difficult to play so another series similar to Airdash Academy being a tutorial to explain the game may prove to be helpful as well.
 
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showing how broken this game was won't really help people who are new to try to get back into the game, just saying
It's a lot better to show a nice pretty package of the product then when it was a broken mess(i'm exaggerating but yeah)
 
Was it really "broken" or just something they didn't like? People seem to handle how "broken" games like MvC3 and UMvC3 are and they know the difference between both versions. This would serve the same purpose. "The game has changed, you may like it now, here is what has been changed"
 
Honestly the biggest problem we've had IS the massive learning curve in retaining new players and especially in getting people who already play other games to stick around.

There is no getting around the fact that Skullgirls has a massive learning curve of mechanics and oddities, tutorials definitely help. For example I have @worldjem 's amazing defense thread. I've had to info dump all the pushblock mechanics and nuances to players over and over, having resources like that really helps.
 
Tomo009 said:
Honestly the biggest problem we've had IS the massive learning curve in retaining new players and especially in getting people who already play other games to stick around.

There is no getting around the fact that Skullgirls has a massive learning curve of mechanics and oddities, tutorials definitely help. For example I have @worldjem 's amazing defense thread. I've had to info dump all the pushblock mechanics and nuances to players over and over, having resources like that really helps.
I don't really think some new players are just ready to put in time, it's not like playing any other fighting game will be any different. Even Street Fighter 4 you'll still get your shit kicked in from time to time.

In fact I stopped playing SF4 for that reason and thought Skullgirls would be a better chance for me because it was a new game on Steam. I was sort of correct in that aspect.
 
Yeah but there is a looooot of required knowledge for SG at a low to mid level. You can't just come from another game and get by on your fundamentals, unless you have played a ton of MvC2, of course.
 
If they can watch the EVO 2014 Top 4 and still think it's like Vanilla SG, they're not trying to give Skullgirls another chance.

And all fighting games have the perception of a steep learning curve, regardless if they do or not. And honestly, compared to shootbangs and whatever else is hot, they are.
 
Tomo009 said:
Honestly the biggest problem we've had IS the massive learning curve in retaining new players and especially in getting people who already play other games to stick around.
There is no getting around the fact that Skullgirls has a massive learning curve of mechanics and oddities, tutorials definitely help.
Tomo009 said:
Yeah but there is a looooot of required knowledge for SG at a low to mid level. You can't just come from another game and get by on your fundamentals, unless you have played a ton of MvC2, of course.
You either severely overestimate what a mid-level player needs to know, or don't know much about other games.
Just because most of what there is to know about SG is made obvious by the game or by me doesn't mean there's more to it than any other game.
 
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It depends on your definition on what a "mid-level" player is. I think I'm a low beginner player. But I'll beat a lot of people online because so many don't have a bnb or know when block and not hit buttons.
 
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Skullbytes
Skullgirls: Explained
Skullgirls: Demystified
Skillgirls.

Trinity Handbook
Ms. Victoria's Lesson PLan
Skullheart's Pulse
Medici Mafia Hitlist
Female Intuition: Guide To The Intricacies of Skullgirls
Learn You A Skullgirls
.. all I got

I can contribute video editing.
 
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Mike_Z said:
You either severely overestimate what a mid-level player needs to know, or don't know much about other games.
Just because most of what there is to know about SG is made obvious by the game or by me doesn't mean there's more to it than any other game.

I'm speaking from personal experience... and trying to get MANY people into the game.

What I mean is there is a lot of required knowledge to even get started with SG, this has particularly been a problem with getting people who already play other FGs to pick up Skullgirls.

Maybe I shouldn't have said mid level, maybe I should have said required knowledge to be able to understand what they are doing wrong when they play against our players over here. A lot of what is difficult to explain is actually the pushblock mechanics, tends to be long winded, so Worldjem's thread has been amazing in helping get new players up to speed quickly.

I'm sure I'm not alone in saying that getting enough info to newer players tends to be information overload, so I and others here have been trying to teach players with more of a trickle of info instead of huge information dumps.


You can say I don't know much about other games if you want, I play plenty of fighting games. I want to get more people into this particular fighting game though, we are slowly growing here in our scene and its been great.
 
I honestly disagree that SG has a lot of required knowledge to get going compared to other FGs. Tutorial + one/two combos + a few pushblocking tidbits should work fine for the most part. No need to tell them how to do PBGC, burst baits, tricky resets of any of that shit. Keep it simple.
 
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ive had a couple of people in my local scene show concerns that teh game is really hard to pick up/lots to learn, and to play the game at a high level i would kinda agree with them. well, not so much the hard to pickup part but there is a lot of little nuances in the game.

the players in question have played a vast number of games too and for a v long time. ive been taking SG to my locals for 2 years (off and on between patches) and have never had more than 1 hrs worth of interest per person.
 
I can see anyone complaining about any fighter for being too much to get into, but what's special about SG compared to other fighters? What more does SG have? It doesn't have 50 characters to learn moves matchups and strategy for and the motions are all as easy as fighters get. IPS, Undizzy and the nitty gritty of pushblocks aren't worse than other game-specific systems in other fighters I can think of offhand.

Edit - When fighting game people say SG is too much to get into, you should probably interpret that as: "I don't want to be a jerk and insult your game but I don't want to play a panty shot fighter."
 
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Its that the skullgirls community is very expositive about tech, combos and mix ups, so when you go online it's possible that most people you play knows everything about it and you might as well get completely recked without knowing that stuff. That's why the learning curve is so steep, there's no time to find stuff out for yourself, it gets a little overwhelming.
 
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Midiman said:
Skillgirls.

Whenever I say it too fast, I end up saying this so I vote for this
 
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