General Beginner Q&A Thread!

Discussion in 'Beginner Forum' started by Liam, Jun 12, 2015.

  1. shuckle

    shuckle Diamonds are for a really long time

    Steam:
    steamcommunity.com/id/sshuckle
    Cerebella
    The throw macro is actually how I do Pummel Horse in the first place, I'm just curious why it sometimes does Battle Butt instead. The input I was doing was the exact same as far as I could tell.

    Never knew that tool existed, thanks! This explains the ghosting issue very well, and why side-by-side key presses like UIO work fine but L-shapes like say UJK. Unfortunately I don't think I can get a setup that works any better.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2016
  2. Jeph

    Jeph New Member

    Steam:
    www.steamcommunity.com/id/JephAllLuckNoSkill
    Filia
    Why is Mono audio not an option? Could they make it an option? The directional sound really messes with me because I can still see both characters on screen. I don't want sound coming from my right if it's right in front of me.
     
  3. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    Probably not the best place for this question! But if you think this is important to you maybe @Mike_Z can impliment a -mono launch option if it's very simple.
     
  4. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    Hey there, I'm still working out how my team works and was wondering how to do crossups with Valentine/Parasoul/Eliza or how to find out ways to add a crossup after a combo ends.

    Also, how often should I go for grab resets? I know they're important, but I don't know how often to use them.
     
  5. Lex

    Lex Skill pending

    Location:
    Scotland, UK
    Steam:
    Lex
    PSN:
    Ilexyellowdog
    Valentine
    Filia
    Double
    For Val you can cross up with IAD, j.HP. You can also cross under the opponent by doing AD, j.LK during combos while they are in the air or by fast falling with j.MK (1), j.HP (whiffs). Backdash, airdash, j.HP also crosses up some crouching characters.

    With Parasoul you can jump over them and use back (?) j.LK for cross ups.

    Eliza can cross up with IAD, j.HP I believe as well and cross under with launcher, Sekhmet (either her L attack or her H one).

    You should use grabs in resets to try and condition the opponent so that you can do better starters (like cr.LK to catch them upbacking or a burst bait to catch their tech attempt). So you should use it if you notice that all of your resets are getting blocked or if a character is doing armoured/strike invincible stuff (e.g. Peacock's DP is not throw invincible and Bella's level 3 is armoured so they can both get caught by throw).
     
  6. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    IAD = instant air dash, right?

    Anyway, thanks, I'll work with this and see how it turns out.
     
  7. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    IAD is instant air dash yeah.
    ADC is cancelling an air normal into an airdash.
     
  8. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    M'kay, I think once I nail this crossup/crossunder/grab reset thing I can throw people in a vortex.
     
  9. shuckle

    shuckle Diamonds are for a really long time

    Steam:
    steamcommunity.com/id/sshuckle
    Cerebella
    One time I deflected Squigly's Battle Opera, but the projectile remained and chipped me. Every other time I've reflected it it faded away almost immediately. Was I hallucinating? Are there special conditions for it?
     
  10. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    There's been some bugs in the past where it sticks around when it shouldn't, like when she gets hit by Deathcrawl.

    If you have the replay where it happened you can upload that, if not then there isn't much that can be done.
     
  11. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    Hey, I was wondering what a frame trap looks like and what needs to happen for something to qualify as a reset?

    I was playing against my friend and dropped my combo for a super short time then immediately afterward used a light where he tried to attack to start another combo, but idk if that counts as a frame trap.
     
  12. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    Yep, that's usually a frame trap.

    If you do a jab and your jab is say +3 (which means you recover 3F before the opponent) and then you jab again after, that means your opponent won't be able to put out a move and make it hit faster than yours will.

    This results in them getting counter hit and flashing red with the broken heart icon.

    Note that reversals will still usually blow through frame traps.

    Also a reset basically means drop your combo, hit them again.
    It's very loosely defined, but generally they are fast.
    There's no special bonus for doing a reset fast or slow, besides how much Undizzy drains until they get hit again.
     
  13. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    Thanks, so with frame traps I should always use jabs that are + instead of -, right?

    And since they can use a reversal to blow through one, I think that just applies to reading the opponent.
     
  14. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    With normals like jabs, even negative ones can be used for frame traps.

    Since you can cancel a jab into a medium to make it a true block string, you can just leave a tiiiiny gap in between of 1F or a little more.

    Parasouls jab jab is unsafe or at least negative, so if you fully let it finish and then jab again you'll always lose to anyone hitting jab.
    However if you do jab jab then cancel into a medium just as you leave that gap, you'll counter hit their jab.
     
  15. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    Thanks, I'll test this out.

    Also, its possible to punish throws without supers or invulnerable moves, right?
     
  16. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    Each character has something they can do, most require you to make a read.

    Usually jump straight up and then hit a falling button will punish the throw.
     
  17. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    What about air throws? I noticed my friend was able to air throw me after I intentionally dropped a combo in the air.
     
  18. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    Try and pick an option to end your air combo that is more +.
    Air throw resets are extremely powerful because you can't counter them unless you have an air super, all you can do is tech or not tech.

    If you turn on attack data and set it to "advanced" in the training room, the game will actually dynamically tell you how + or - you are after you finish attacking them on hit or block.

    Test that to find a set up that works for you.
    Launcher > Jump > Delay > Air Throw works for every character.
     
  19. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    Okay, so this is going to be a very simple question... how do you deal with things like j.HK from Fukua, j.HP from Beowulf, maybe j.HP from Parasoul? I play Eliza, Parasoul, SOME SQUIGLY, and Valentine, so far I just used s.MP from Eliza, but sometimes that just gets baited out which is bad, and I jumped higher than Fukua with certain characters, still needing help, though.

    Now, for a more complex question(s).

    I have rarely seen Big Band and Painwheel players who were actually really good, my friend mains Big Band and he's really good and I know basically nothing about the matchup, like what to look for to punish, what to try and bait out, what to absolutely not do (so far I hear jumping constantly is a bad idea).

    Painwheel I also have the same problem with, except I don't have any friends who main her, but I really don't want to run into a master Painwheel who's going to make me cry because I don't know crap.

    Also, what do I do to deal with Filia once she gets going? Don't see her too often, but when I do I struggle a lot when she gets in and starts a combo.

    AND FOR THE LAST QUESTION, how do I get out of this vortex of wanting to play many characters and learn them, but not being able to do it all at once? It's like I'm having an identity crisis here.
     
  20. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    If you block an attack in the air, you enter air blockstun.
    If you touch the floor while in air blockstun, you instantly recover.

    If a move is +25 when it hits you on the floor, and you block it in the air, and one frame after you airblock it you touch the floor, you shave off 24 frames of blockstun, meaning you can usually punish them.

    This is called Land Canceling.
    It will help you vs Parasoul jHP and Beowulf jHP too.

    [Horus Dive Example]
    [Fukua JHK Spam Example]

    Another option vs obvious jump ins that you can't deal with even when you know they are coming: Call an invincible anti air assist.
    (Examples: Napalm Pillar / Updo / Beat Extend / Fiber Uppercut / H Chair Toss)
    H / M A-Train (The Anti Air grab) are unblockable if you are traveling upwards.
    So if you jump and he does it, you'll get grabbed.

    If he is wrong and you do not jump, he slides into you and it will never hit you if you are standing so you can punish him.

    M / H Brass have armour, and hit long range.
    If you block those, especially H Brass, you can punish it.

    L Brass has no armour, but is safe (-5).
    However if you air block L Brass, usually you can punish it with land canceling.
    If you always try and land cancel vs L Brass, he can call you out and go for M / H A-Train to grab you when you jump.

    H Giant Step is the slow version, but it's fullscreen unblockable so you have to jump it when he uses it.
    L Giant Step is the fast version, and it's safe usually unless you land cancel it.

    Beat Extend is his reversal, it costs no meter and it's invincible. The L and M version you can throw because they are fast.
    The H version (Where he says "Beeeaaattt EXTEND") is fully invincible and you can't mess with it, but all Beat Extend versions are punishable on block.

    SSJ (Super Sonic Jazz) is the fastest move in the game.
    It has 2F start up before the super flash.
    It hits like a truck and has armour and has a fantastic hurtbox.

    You have to learn how to bait this and punish it.

    With Big Band basically he has a lot of tools that are really risky but give him big reward if he's correct.
    This is in exchange for him being able to get hit by an instant overhead by the entire cast.
    If you pick any character and jump forward and a hit a light button, it hits Big Band high even when he's crouching and it's completely unreactable for him to deal with so he has to guess.

    That is his big downside.

    Vs most Big Bands you have to be very comfortable with baiting his reversals and letting him kill himself until he smartens up and you can apply riskier pressure.
    It's a hard balance at low level play.

    Reversals + Block high + Have good defence.

    It's hard. Filia is balanced around having a tiny bit of a hard time finding an angle to open the opponent up, and then being an absolute fiend up close.
    Again, at low level player it's very hard to play good neutral which is worthy of keeping her out of your face so she doesn't hit you, so it can be lopsided until you get pretty good.

    You'll find someone(s) who really speaks to you.
    You have to find out what you really want in a character and what kind of assists / team dynamics are the most appealing to you, and smartly build a team around it.
    There's no bad characters but there are some bad teams.

    For example:
    I like space control at long / mid range.
    I like zoning.
    I like long buttons.
    I like being annoying.
    I like assists that can make my reversals safe.
    I like assists that let me convert off my long ranged attacks and projectiles.
    I like having a way to peel people off of me.

    My team is Parasoul (H Shot) / Robo-Fortune (H Beam) / Double (L Bomber).
    Beams let Parasoul convert off L Shot hits and make her jump ins safe.
    H Shot lets Robo-Fortune cover the gaps in her zoning and help apply pressure from far away.
    L Bomber provides a way to get opponents to back off once they are close and I feel uncomfortable.

    You'll find the things you like eventually as you keep playing.
    It only took me 3 years : )
     
  21. shuckle

    shuckle Diamonds are for a really long time

    Steam:
    steamcommunity.com/id/sshuckle
    Cerebella
    What is a micro dash and can you do it with using a PP macro
     
  22. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    Cancelling the start up of a dash into something very quickly.

    Basically just a tiny nudge forward to allow you to reach something.

    Like Bella does micro dash CLK CMK after MGR.
     
  23. shuckle

    shuckle Diamonds are for a really long time

    Steam:
    steamcommunity.com/id/sshuckle
    Cerebella
    Oh, I thought it would be a bit more intricate, like "you gotta hold P + P + LK" or something.
    I always drop MGR > cLK > cMK and just go for MGR > cLK > cMP > CHP instead.
    So it's completely doable, I just have weak inputfu. Thanks Liam.
     
    Liam likes this.
  24. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    OH MY GOD THIS LAND CANCELLING CHANGES EVERYTHING.

    I just blocked and pushblocked and then tried to go from there, but this sounds like a more useful tactic to defend then punish.

    Some questions about it, though.

    1. Does this mean a j.HK from Fukua can be punished at any time or are there ways to make it safe and if so how?

    2. Can this work against any air move that can hit an opponent?

    For Big Band, I guess the game is just knowing how to punish things that don't hit and being aware of what Big Band is doing along with what you should or shouldn't be doing.

    For Filia, I need to work on my defense in general, but I don't pushblock often as I want people to use unsafe moves so I can punish, while pushblocking can get some pressure off of me, suppose that's just finding a balance of what to do when defending.

    With characters, I can narrow it down, I think I just feel like I can enjoy a lot of characters and don't have any strong preferences for certain ones.

    Although, with my current team, Valentine, Parasoul, Eliza, I'm comfortable with it and enjoy it, though, what's the real difference between L shot and H shot from Parasoul? I was able to use both of them for combos, so the only thing I'm noticing so far is that both travel at different speeds.

    Anyway, thank you for all this advice, and if I make a list of things I would enjoy doing in the game, say zoning, among other things, would that help with narrowing down characters to use/try and learn?
     
  25. Lex

    Lex Skill pending

    Location:
    Scotland, UK
    Steam:
    Lex
    PSN:
    Ilexyellowdog
    Valentine
    Filia
    Double
    Land cancelling Fukua's j.HK does allow for a punish but they can cancel to j.HP which will make them + on block. If they cancel to j.HP then you can pushblock them out though which will get you out (or start to get you out) of their pressure.

    You can land cancel vs any move an opponent does in the air but vs many there isn't really much point and vs some the opponent may still be plus. When you see an opponent has an obnoxious move in the air test it out in training mode to see how you can punish it.

    You really want to push block Filia out because she can do a heap of mixups on you that are all safe. Going back to land cancelling though, you can land cancel punish her IAD, j.LK, j.HK if you have a fast jab.

    The difference between them is their speed. L is slower than H. This makes them useful for different things. L is good for approaching the opponent as you can go in behind/in front of napalm shot to cover you and make stuff safe. H shot is better for zoning due to how fast it is (it can also make some stuff safe).

    Characters who are zoners or at least have an element of zoning to them I'd say are Peacock (fullscreen zoning all the time), Robo (keep away), Parasoul (mix of zoning and rushdown), Valentine (some keep away followed by rushdown), Fukua (decent fullscreen zoning as well as up close pressure though this is weaker in beta due to M Shadow changes). I think your current team is fine though, Parasoul and Val provide a nice middle ground between zoning and rushdown.
     
  26. Bleediss

    Bleediss Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Steam:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/Bleediss
    Parasoul
    Double
    Eliza
    Thanks, I'll pushblock against Filia and I think L shot will work slightly better, it'll allow Valentine to try and get in while being safe along with Eliza.

    Anything you would say is very important to do with Valentine specifically, though? I hear playing patiently and looking for an opening or having your opponent come to you so they can hopefully make a mistake and you can punish them is really important.
     
  27. shuckle

    shuckle Diamonds are for a really long time

    Steam:
    steamcommunity.com/id/sshuckle
    Cerebella
    Is it better to go for a hard knockdown setup, or a burst bait? When do you go for one versus the other?

    What I'm currently assuming is:
    -If you go for a burst bait, they might be able to alpha counter out of it and get out of there, so if you want to keep that character in you should go for a hard knockdown
    -If you go for a hard knockdown you have to watch out for what your opponent can do as they wake up, like a reversal or a safe DHC like something > Cat Heads
    -You can't go for a hard knockdown if you've used your DHC so you should burst bait anyway
    Please correct me if I'm wrong.

    If I'm trapped in the corner and I manage to hit the opponent with a DP assist like Beat Extend and switch the sides, how should I end it? Should I just try to reset them instead?
     
  28. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    If you're doing burst baits it helps to also do other things at the points where you go for a burst bait.

    If you do cMK > Air throw a bunch, then you can do cMK jump back jMP (IPS) to bait their air throw tech, popping their burst.
    Burst baits are great when you mix them up with other things that force the opponent to have to hit a button.
    If you always do a burst bait every time and nothing else, it's not very scary and the opponent doesn't have to think.

    You can do a burst bait from jHK or jMP when you haven't used up your OTG so that if they try and burst or ground tech it will pop the burst, forcing a hard knockdown.

    Instead of going for a hard knockdown, you can try and armour through a burst attempt and turn it gold, and then stop beside them.
    This puts their Undizzy from 240+ to 0, and basically has the same result as a hard knockdown except they can't reversal without 1F timing (very very hard) after they leave the burst because they're actually airborne for 1 or more frames which eats their reversal inputs.
    So like at full Undizzy, experiment with sHP > Pummel Horse, sLP (Undizzy Proc) > M LNL through their burst.

    On the whole, figuring out when to use burst baits / resets / hardknockdown is player preference and not a science.
    The only thing you need to do for sure is kill people when you have the meter to do so.

    So, pick the ones you like the most for each situation.
    I'm assuming you mean OTG and not DHC.
    Also you can't hard knockdown if you've used to OTG as Cerebella no, but Pummel Horse can sort of be a hard knockdown if you just let the stagger timer run out.
    Other characters can do hard knockdowns even after spending OTG, like Beowulf, Parasoul, Painwheel and Eliza for example.
     
  29. shuckle

    shuckle Diamonds are for a really long time

    Steam:
    steamcommunity.com/id/sshuckle
    Cerebella
    MikeZ is probably busy so I don't wanna bother him with a question about his team. Maybe someone else will know instead?
    sHP > Beat Extend > Battle Butt is very inconsistent for me as to where the opponent lands, I have no idea when it'll be one or the other. I'm sure it's a timing thing but I can't pin down exactly which side they will be on.

     
  30. Flying Cactus

    Flying Cactus New Member

    Steam:
    Bobbobmac
    Peacock
    I've been having this issue with my PS3 controller where if I move my left stick too aggressively or click the stick I preform Macro 1. I'm not sure if it's because Skullgirls has a bind I'm unaware of, a controller malfunction (I don't have this issue with an Xbox 360 controller), or if motion joy is unreliable. I put this in the beginner thread because I really have no clue as to how I can fix this or whats causing it. If you have had this issue or if you need to ask any question I'm all ears.
     
  31. Fumako

    Fumako Jimbob

    Location:
    The Medici's Cellar
    Steam:
    Fumako
    PSN:
    Fumako
    Big Band
    Peacock
    Hi, I've used motioninjoy and a ps3 controller for about 3 years (Yes, I use the left stick too, had to move to ps4 controller though).
    I'm thinking it's maybe a hardware issue? Try to go into the set-up/settings part where you get to see buttons light up when pressed. Go wiggle your stick around.
    Or maybe you just set L3 as macro 1 and forgot about it?
     
  32. Flying Cactus

    Flying Cactus New Member

    Steam:
    Bobbobmac
    Peacock
    Now that you mention it, I got rid of all the macros and I'm having the same problem with different buttons being pressed when I waggle my stick. Also where do I find the set-up/settings part? Is it in Skullgirls or is it a Windows thing?
    (Thanks for the quick reply!)

    *Edit: It must be my controller since it acts up in other games. I've never heard of this problem though. Could also be motionjoy...
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  33. Fumako

    Fumako Jimbob

    Location:
    The Medici's Cellar
    Steam:
    Fumako
    PSN:
    Fumako
    Big Band
    Peacock
    it's in the motioninjoy thing itself.
    I don't remember since I moved to mac and I don't have to use drivers here...
    Definitely your controller.
    If you want to make sure try this:
    http://skullheart.com/index.php?threads/scp-xinput-wrapper-for-ds3-ds4.8686/
    Current best thing to use imo

    Goodluck with your stuff! ^-^
     
    Flying Cactus likes this.
  34. Wrestlemania

    Wrestlemania The Steel Chair

    Location:
    Badstreet USA
    Beowulf
    Cerebella
    How's everybody doing today!
    If any of you little Wulves know where I can get my hands on a list of charge times?
    Hollar if ya hear me!
     
  35. Liam

    Liam ... Administrator

    Location:
    West Canada
    Steam:
    Skarmand
    PSN:
    Skarmand
    Robo Fortune
    Double
    36 frames from the frame you input a direction. (The frame you press it doesn't count).
     
  36. Wrestlemania

    Wrestlemania The Steel Chair

    Location:
    Badstreet USA
    Beowulf
    Cerebella
    Thank you ma man!
    Much appreciated.

     
  37. DangDen

    DangDen New Member

    Location:
    Vietname
    Steam:
    maverickhunter00
    Eliza
    Double
    Squigly
    so, i recently play skullgirls on steam. Everyone i play online with only play until they win 3 game or until they lost 3 game, and then they quit .. ? It is how rank game work ? I play in Asia server
     
  38. WayForger

    WayForger Dai-Gurren Dan Lore Moderator

    Location:
    Boston, MA
    PSN:
    Wayforger
    Unknown
    Unknown
    Most players go by the tacit best of three rule. If you'd like to keep playing with someone you should send them a message or go into a lobby (if you are on PC - I'm a bit out of date with whether or not it lobbies were added to console).
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2016
  39. Fumako

    Fumako Jimbob

    Location:
    The Medici's Cellar
    Steam:
    Fumako
    PSN:
    Fumako
    Big Band
    Peacock
    I'm assuming you mean quick match?
    Here's how it works: if you care about your ranking only the first game counts, every proceeding game (up to whoever gets 3 wins first) does not count irregardless of the winner. Also, Quickmatch immediately quits the match after a player reaches 3 wins, these players aren't quitting on you :P

    As WayForger said above, if you want to play more than best-of-3s you should either add people you meet on quickmatch (Don't worry, we don't bite!) or join/create a lobby.
     
  40. DangDen

    DangDen New Member

    Location:
    Vietname
    Steam:
    maverickhunter00
    Eliza
    Double
    Squigly
    oh, thank you for the information
     

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