The Legendary Bounty Hunter! Metroid/Samus Aran Thread

Discussion in 'Gaming' started by Evilweevle, Jul 30, 2014.

  1. Evilweevle

    Evilweevle Of course i meant to do that!

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    Im a little surprised there wasnt already a thread for this, so figured it was about time that one of gamings most iconic female characters had her own thread.

    This is for discussing all things related to Samus and the metroid games. You will be expected to name your favourite of the series, best suit etc etc. as well as vent as to why there hasnt been a new metroid game for so long (other M is a touchy subject lol)

    Ill have to admit i was reallly late to the metroid party as the first one i played properly was Metroid Prime on the GC. Good god that is a amazing game, and probably still my fave of all of them. The first time you land on Tallon and the classic music starts is one of my most memorable gaming moments.

    Also i made this thread kinda just because i wanted to post this....
    Show Spoiler

    [​IMG]


    i bought the varia suit statue made by these guys a number of years back and the level of quality is fantastic, so as soon as i saw this (light suit is my fave btw) i had to put down a pre order for it. Q1 2015 cant come soon enough!

    Anyone else a big Metroid/Samus fan?
     
  2. IsaVulpes

    IsaVulpes Just Throw

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    Super is the best game there is.

    E: I don't really dig the rest of the series though
     
  3. Evilweevle

    Evilweevle Of course i meant to do that!

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    lol and here i was expecting you were here to tell me there was already a metroid thread.

    Super is a frigging amazing game too i agree. What is it that makes you not so keen on the rest of them though?
     
  4. KaboomKid

    KaboomKid Sure would be nice. ...TUNA FISH!

    When I was a kid and I rented the original Metroid, I had no idea what was going on. I didn't even know you were supposed to shoot the door to open it! It wasn't until years later that I played Super Metroid, learned the ropes, and played back through the series. Super Metroid is still my favorite, simply for how elegantly it conveys the atmosphere of Zebes, but the later Prime games are very solid. Sometimes I'll boot up a Metroid game just so I can run around in Samus' shoes for a while.

    Speaking of which, I actually didn't know Samus was a woman at the time Super was first released. Since I had such a bad first impression of the original, I avoided material about the series until I picked up an old copy of the Nintendo Comics System, which featured the Captain N comics with her. The comics actually made me more curious about the series, and convinced me to finally rent Super Metroid. I mean, the game looked cool anyway, but I was just worried it would be too complicated for me. I'm so glad I decided to take the leap.

    On the series itself, I'm rather disappointed that people consider Ridley as the main antagonist of the series these days. Sure, Ridley's history with Samus has been greatly expanded over the years, but imo, his frequent appearances in the games haven't offered much depth. Samus' dichotomy with Mother Brain always felt more compelling to me. While one was extremely agile and spontaneous, the other was motionless and calculating. I've always pictured their rivalry like a cat and mouse game, where the mouse is armed to the teeth, but the cat controls every room in the house. Their subtle bout of wits seemed like a nice undertone to a game focused on exploration, moreso than Samus and Ridley's primal confrontations.

    Anyway, it's a good series if you ignore Sakamoto's Experiment on the Wii. Here's hoping that Retro picks up the next installment, if there ever is one.
     
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  5. Smarts

    Smarts #1 IF Fan

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    The first Prime game will always hold a special place in my heart. It was the first Metroid game I played and still is my favorite to this day. I tried getting my hands on every Metroid game I could find after that. Played them all with the exceptions of Prime Hunters, Zero Mission, and that Pinball game. Didn't play or include Other M because I like to pretend it never happened. Ignorance is bliss.
     
  6. IsaVulpes

    IsaVulpes Just Throw

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    Metroid I is just annoying in all aspects. Every room looks the same, you can't crouch or shoot downwards so anything walking on the ground is annoying as fuck, one spends ages without Longbeam which is actually *the worst*, controls feel clunky etc

    Metroid II has some funny things and fixed a lot of problems, but still the issue of every room looking the same, and half the game is rolling around in Spiderball which gets boring rather quickly

    Super is the best game

    Fusion is Super for Babies, with ruined movement and linearity but still an interesting atmosphere. Probably my 2nd favourite metroid game in the end, but it's a step down from "best game in the universe" to "this is pretty okay, fun to play through once or twice"

    Zero Mission is Fusion, with slightly fixed movement compared to Fusion, even more linearity, and no atmosphere at all. At least Metroid learned how to crawl~

    I'm not too keen on the Primes cus I'm no fan of series like this transitioning to 3d much in the first place. I didn't play / see enough of them to give a final verdict, though.
    Prime Hunters actually looked like the most fun out of what I've seen, though everybody seems to forget it exists at all.

    Other M is the worst game
     
  7. Iphantom

    Iphantom Member

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    I agree that 1 and 2 feel too dated these days and Super Metroid is one of the best games of all time. However I have to dispute the "baby Metroid" games for the gba. First of all they have difficulty select, and I can assure you playing through either one on hard is much more difficult than Super unless you're doing some crazy sequence breaking or self-imposed restrictions. Second, they demand you use some pretty advanced Speed Booster techniques to 100% the game while all the advanced stuff in Super was purely for sequence breaks. I also find it strange that you say Zero Mission is the most linear considering there are legit sequence breaks in that game and the only one in Fusion brings you to a room that says "good job getting here, now turn around." I will agree that the atmosphere doesn't match things like the creepy abandoned ship or the imposing feel of lower Norfair(I can hear the theme in my head just thinking about it).

    The Prime series is a pretty drastic departure but they are great games in their own right. The lore and worlds they establish feel very alive and things like the Space Pirate logs make Samus seem like even more of a badass than ever. While they are very different they do the series justice.

    Hunters was atrocious and I guarantee if you played it you wouldn't be saying anything positive about besides maybe liking the design of some of the rival bounty hunters. It's the only Metroid made after Super I didn't finish and that includes Other M. Speaking of Other M, it is also a game. I hesitate to even say it's a Metroid game because besides some fan service like Phantoon and Nightmare showing up it doesn't really have any of the elements that make a Metroid.

    Well, I went on a bit of a rant there. I love this series and I would probably consider getting one of those statue things up there if they didn't cost like 200$.
     
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  8. Lavama

    Lavama Bearer of the Late

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    Other M had potential but dropped the Ball before the field goal. On our side. (Woot American football references for Japanese games). I just recently trudged through Other M, and I'm almost done with the game to put it down for good.

    Wall of text wooooooo (open)
    As for me with my favorite Metroids and such, I got started with Samus through Smash Brothers as that robot thing, which lead to two years later me going and renting Metroid Prime from this archaic place called, "Blockbuster". Ironically enough it busted my block and gave me nightmares for days straight (At Christmas the year before Prime 2 came out I think.), but I loved how the game looked and everything. And, somehow the day after I rented it (Christmas Day) I ended up having a copy of Metroid Prime. I thought that was just cool. It was about this time I realized that when Samus was shocked in SSB64, you could see... Long hair! Samus was a girl! My mind was shattered, but, well, she's still awesome. Then later (January), I was able to convince the feminine parental unit to obtain a completely legal copy of Metroid Fusion (Which I lost three years later for four or five years.), and that was my introduction into the 2D Metroids, which really isn't a bad way to get into Metroid.

    Then Metroid Prime 2 came out, and I got that really close to release, close enough I think it might've been Day 1. And I got nightmares immediately starting that one too. Man I saw the Ing everywhere at night. But the game was still fun and looked awesome, and I trekked on and played still (Including that Christmas I reached the Pirate Facility in the desert place whose name escapes me. Agon Wastes? Logs on the fire were burning like the hull and I was so grounded.), eventually beating the game and looking towards the next Prime with great enjoyment. Which leads me to Metroid 1.

    And getting out of Kraid's lair pretty much ruined that whole game for me. (It's worth mentioning that I saw Super Metroid in EB Games like the last time they even sold Super Nintendo games and I was told some other time. For like five bucks or something. No, I didn't get it.) Out side of that it really only helped me get more into the Metroid series, and then Zero Mission came out (And the Parent's divorcing. Oh yeah, that didn't fuel my need for some sort of coping mechanism.) and then I was able to experience a copy of the original game and actually get out of Kraid's lair. But then I discovered sequence breaking and then got incredibly bored of Zero Mission and how easy it was compared to Fusion (I practically blame the long times of insanity I had from Fusion on the Spider boss. Now I blame 1% runs on the Spider Boss. Nothing's changed I swear), and sold it (Which I regret now.).

    Fast forward a few years, and then in order to finally play Ocarina of Time I let a friend borrow both of my Prime copies, and I took incredible care of his copy of the Master Quest. Only to find that both of my Prime games were put into the VCR at their house by their younger brother, to which the Mom didn't even offer to replace them (I think a certain word is in needing there that rhymes with a certain alien that is friends with a Hawaiian girl, but, I'm not sure on the language of this forum.) So this left me with Metroid Fusion. And a barely bootable Metroid Prime 2 (Which only booted to the Title Screen.) Except I would then go on to lose Metroid Fusion on a road trip to North Carolina to see my new-born Nephew in January of 2006/7. (Still haven't played Super Metroid or Metroid 2.)

    Then Metroid Prime 3 came out and I didn't get to play it until about, 2008/2009 for Christmas one year. I think it was up until here that I kept Zero Mission and decided to get rid of it. I played through Prime 3 and actually ended up feeling a little disappointed once I hit the end of it; There goes nearly ten years of my life down the drain and in a way that I didn't like too much. It was around this time I decided to rebel against Nintendo and purchased Halo: Combat Evolved for PC from a guy named John (Who had an employee ID code that ended in 117. Pure luck.). Nintendo promptly answered with the Prime Trilogy. Which was to be released seven days after my Birthday.

    And so I spent a good amount of time replaying the first two games (And getting incredibly enraged at the Emperor Ing's first form, totally not designed for the Wii. (First time I recall getting a game over in Prime 2 since the first time I got the Space Jump boots...) Then I finally bought/obtained Super Metroid (Off the Wii.), and ironically at the time obtained a Classic Controller with Tatsunoko vs Capcom, so I had a great way of playing.

    The wait time had definitely of been worth it. (And do I need to say more on Super?) Of course, this was about 2011, and I was made aware of the fact that someone had found Metroid Fusion in one of the bags that hadn't been used since we went to North Carolina. Go figure. So the first thing I did was do a speed run of Fusion, and I blazed through it. I was disappointed, yes, but it was still incredible for me. Then, the most insane thing happened: I managed to get the damn SD card I had an earlier copy of Project M on in the CD slot of the Wii, and in the process of removing it screwed the Bluetooth receiver, bricking the Wii with not only all the saves for all the Wii games we owned, but also removing my only legal chance of playing Super. Yay.

    And now we have another Wii and I decided "Why not" and bought Other M for a dollar or two at a yard sale. Honestly, the game play is acceptable, but... Wow.

    Still haven't played Hunters or Metroid 2... Which can be fixed. I just didn't like Hunter's play style that time I played the demo.


    And as for a difficulty select for the GBA Metroids, yeah right. If there were, I don't think I would've sold Zero Mission. I know for a fact Fusion lacks a difficulty mode.
     
  9. Iphantom

    Iphantom Member

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    Zero Mission definitely has a difficulty select. E-tanks give 49 hp, missile expansions give 2 instead of 5, and enemies take and deal more damage. I may be imagining that Fusion had one...still think it's a really solid game though.

    Edit- Just checked, Fusion doesn't have one but Zero Mission does. I think you had to beat the game first which is why you might not remember it.

    Damn now I really want to play Metroid but I gotta go to work. Nice little trip down memory lane though.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2014
  10. Lavama

    Lavama Bearer of the Late

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    Well now I need to re-obtain Zero Mission and give Hard mode a shot. I don't remember one, so I'm hoping I just forgot about it.

    The US release of Fusion lacks one. Speaking of, I think my copy has vanished again.
     
  11. IsaVulpes

    IsaVulpes Just Throw

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    "Super Metroid for kids" does not refer to raw difficulty. It refers to Super putting you in a hazardous environment and saying "Go figure out how to get the Baby Metroid back" - actual exploration of an unknown world, with no warning signs, stuck in a place you don't really want to be in - while Fusion/ZM are more like tours in an amusement park, "Hello adventurer! Go here, it will be fun! After that, explore this area! There will be something interesting! Oh, and there is a boss battle coming up in 5 minutes, ready yourself!"

    In Super Metroid, you are the hero that is going to conquer the world, slaying everything that tries to obstruct your path.
    In Fusion/ZM you are a little kid on vacation, holding the hand of your daddy, and he goes "There will be a rock coming up next, do you want to try climbing? Okay let's do this, heave-ho!"

    Playing on hard mode seems like a self-imposed restriction to me :^)

    Maybe linearity is the wrong word.. there is some degree of exploration in Fusion. Sometimes you get lost. You search for a Data Center, and don't know where it is. After you unlock the Red Hatches, you just try to figure your way back and find the Diffusion Missiles 'by accident'. You feel lost and afraid in Sector 6 (NOC) before you get the Varia Suit. You are in a permanent state of "I do not want to meet the SA-X".

    In ZM, you can sequence break IF YOU REALLY GO OUT OF YOUR FUCKIN WAY TO DO IT. There's a BLINK BLINK GO HERE thing on the map at all times, and you have to REALLY go "No, fuck you, game!" to even attempt to sequence break. At no point ever during the game you actually feel threatened or get the feeling that you are moving through an environment you don't belong in. I don't think that really counts.

    In SM, people sequence break by accident all the time, getting to Kraid/Spazer before HiJump Boots, never collecting several major items, etc; I've seen someone do Phantoon prior to Crocomire because he figured out horizontal shinesparking and never needed grapple.
    You can't sequence break at all in Fusion, and you just won't even get close to sequence breaking ever in a casual ZM playthrough unless you started the game with a "I want to break things" mindset from the get-go.

    As said, I didn't really play them, just saw other people play them and occasionally caught speedruns. The movement seems weird, I dislike the colours (everything is some kinda light brown tint), I don't dig FPSes in the first place, let alone on gamepad, etc. Nothing I saw of them sparked me into wanting to play them, but yeah I don't really know anything.

    What's so bad about it? I just saw a speedrun of it and thought it looked.. interesting. The movement seemed very fluid.

    What ARE those elements? I mean if you compare what Metroid I is to what Metroid Fusion is, there's really not a lot of overlap beyond "You can roll into a Ball and there are Missiles somewhere on the ground". I don't think there really is a Metroid 'formula' (much like I don't think there is a Zelda one).

    Zero Mission has a hard mode after you complete the game, Fusion has one on the JP version only
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2014
  12. MotoEleven

    MotoEleven Big Band's Nemesis

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    Played just about all of them Metroid, Metroid II Fusion Zero Mission Other M Prime 1,2, and 3 (hopefully i didnt forget to name one lol)

    But i would have to say... i cant decide between Metroid Prime 1 or 2 as my fav because number 2 you could do alot more but number 1 had the epic music and boss fights... especally Thardus and Meta Ridley not to mention Metroid Prime and my fav suit would definately have to be the light suit it just looks so bad ass second is the phazon suit... also the annihilator beam was soooo epic!!! it did the work for you also in Metroid Prime 2 i freaking loved the multiplayer... no one could beat me literally....

    If you play project M (a modded version of super smash brothers brawl for wii) Theyre gonna make samus with the light suit as an outfit

    And whos your favorite boss in the metroid series? (Mine would have to be the Thardus)
     
  13. IsaVulpes

    IsaVulpes Just Throw

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    Superrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
     
  14. MotoEleven

    MotoEleven Big Band's Nemesis

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    DAMMIT! THAT WAS THE ONE!!!.... You win this one Isa... Knew i forgot one!!!
     
  15. Evilweevle

    Evilweevle Of course i meant to do that!

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    ehhh, prime hunters was okayish i guess. i was super pumped for that game at first since i was a massive fan of the prime series, aand was kinda hoping for more of the same thing, but, you know i cant actually even remember much about that game now. i dont think it really had anything interesting going on in terms of story or gameplay, plus the multiplayer was ruined because people only ever played on a single map where there was one godlike weapon and basically whoever got to it first won the match.

    i never played 2 but i defo agree that 1 is really frustrating to play. really hard to navigate around and too much time spent trying to recharge your health/ammo so you dont immediately die.

    man oh man i was really super disappointed by metroid prime 2. it doesnt even compare to prime 1 in my opinion and that is largely for the completely forgettable and generic boss fights.

    prime 1 you had the plant boss, thardus,metaridley, omega pirate, metroid prime etc.

    prime 2 you had Bomb Ing, space boots Ing, big Ing (just a lot of Ing bosses which basically all looked the same, all black with spiny legs or whatever, i reallly REALLY dislike all black slime/tentacle/wjhatever bosses. so much lack of creativity)

    ive replayed the other prime games a few times, all except number 2 which i have no desire to replay again. as much as i love the light suit playingg through the game again is not worth it.

    i made these samus themed palettes for robo fortune a few weeks ago too
    varia suit
    Show Spoiler

    [​IMG]


    gravity suit

    Show Spoiler
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2014
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  16. Smarts

    Smarts #1 IF Fan

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    That would be Flaahgra, good sir.
     
  17. Tomo009

    Tomo009 Well-Known Member

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    Gravity Suit Robo Fortune please. I would like it very much.
     
  18. Arcana

    Arcana BTSW | Gayonetta

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    I just started playing fusion and SA-X is scaring the shit out of me, this isnt ev en a horror game but im too scared to play ;-; its fun though I love it, I need to finish super metroid though
     
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  19. Dio Brando

    Dio Brando ZA WARUDO

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    Prime 1 was my first metroid game ever, it came along with my silver gamecube that still works from well over 11 years ago or so, but i remember i was so young and i knew so little of english (none at all) that i kept stuck at the frigate for months, until i finally figured out the scaning system, then i kept stuck at Flaahgra because i sucked at boss battleing back then.

    The worst thing about my Prime experience is that, i lost my save file not once, twice, or thrice, 4 TIMES i lost my save files by different ways and methods, it took me 8 YEARS to finish Prime 1, by that time i had already finished Zero Mission, Fusion, Super Metroid, Metroid 2 and OTHER M, i remember the 4th time i lost my save file it was right before the Metal Ridley fight, i saved at the ship, after i beat the game i felt so overwhelmed of joy and happyness i cried, then i played the shit out of Prime 2 and 3 like anyone would :PUN:
     
  20. I actually played Metroid 2 first on my brother's gameboy, but Fusion was really my proper introduction to series. I really enjoyed the exploration and platforming to get power-ups, the bosses are great and I love the sci-fi setting and atmosphere. I've beat every game except for Pinball, the original, and Other M. If people are interested in the 2-D metroids, there is actually a superb remake being done for Metroid 2 at http://metroid2remake.blogspot.com/
     
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  21. Ktulu

    Ktulu moon2SMUG

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    Jesus fuck I NEED that Light suit figure.

    Show Spoiler
    Anybody got an extra few hundred dollars and a dick they want sucked?
     
  22. Arcana

    Arcana BTSW | Gayonetta

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  23. Ktulu

    Ktulu moon2SMUG

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    Fusion was cool but too linear. It would have worked better if the computer wasn't there telling what was going on and the SA-X was chasing you more often. It wasn't as linear as 2, though. Metroid 2 was literally a straight path the whole game.
     
  24. Arcana

    Arcana BTSW | Gayonetta

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    I dont like the first two very much , Ill probably just play the remakes of them tbh
     
  25. Ktulu

    Ktulu moon2SMUG

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    There isn't much reason to play the first two anymore except for nostalgia or novelty. I'd be super excited for a remake of 2, though.
     
  26. Squire Grooktook

    Squire Grooktook The wind blew all day long

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    Super Metroid and Zero Mission are the best imo.

    Super brings some very fun and deep movement mechanics to the table. Wall jumps, shine sparks, all the hidden moves. Even if you're not into speed running or sequence breaking (for which the game has amazing potential, and is super fun), just mastering these mechanics is a game in itself. It can't be discounted how thick the games atmosphere or how fantastic its set-pieces are. Tops just about anything in any other Metroidvania.

    Zero Mission I like for being one of the most tightest and challenging entries in the series. Fantastic bosses, stage layouts and enemies that keep you on your toes, and it's really well paced too.

    Prime series is good too, though a bit more flawed I think. Echoes has some nice atmosphere and puzzles in parts, but it's hard to ignore the fetch quests and occaisional unclear objectives. Feels like an oldschool adventure rpg in a lot of ways, in both the best and worth ways. Prime 1 and 3 are good, though the latter is a bit too linear at parts, and even the former has its problems (artifact search, some of the boss fights are a little generic).

    Metroid Prime Hunters is horrible single player but surprisingly fun as a multiplayer game. It's like a portable Doom/Quake death match, though not quite as balanced as either.

    Overall, I think the Prime series is a good demonstration for why 2d is generally better for fast paced action gaming. Even in the well designed overworld of Prime 1, getting from point A to point B felt considerably slower and more arduous than the claustrophobic but speedy platforming of the 2d games.

    Hard mode is developer mandated though. It's not a rule that you can suddenly decide to ignore at your leisure. Once you start a game on hard, you're only option to get out of hard mode is to start a new save. You might as well say that beating a game at all is a self-imposed challenge, if that's how you see it.

    Metroid 1 is interesting in some of the same ways Zelda 1 is interesting. It's very rough around the edges, and in the process it doesn't follow a lot of genre conventions that were later established. Much like Zelda 1, it's a lot more free-form and improvisation friendly. You really can wander anywhere you want for most of the game, and the main thing stopping you is how deadly later enemies can be, not developer mandated rails. It's definitely a little clunky in a lot of ways, but like Zelda 1 it's fun and interesting to playthrough every now and then IMO.

    Not a fan of Metroid 2 though.

    Definitely agree, and nice analysis of schemer vs adventurer. I think there's also a lot to be said about Mother Brain aesthetically. Not only does she invoke the classic retro sci-fi trope of a brain in a jar, but her visceral and unnatural appearance is provocative in a way that many of the series other monsters are not. I think it adds to the sense of tension that you aren't simply working your way to another monster at the heart of the labyrinth, but a bizarre (and almost defenseless) bio-mechanical entity hooked up to life support in some sort of sterile machine world. She feels more like an unnatural and otherworldly "abomination" than any of the raging space dragons.

    As Diabetus so eloquently put it "there are only so many things you should pierce, I don't think your brain is one of them."
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2015
  27. Sotherius

    Sotherius Pure Platinum!

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    I don't have much time to read all and participate on the discussion, but i'll put my little story with metroid.

    As someone who grew with little to almost none games on my consoles (Master System, then Snes, PS1, GBA, and since 2011 xbox 360, and now i have a wii u), when i had the snes or the gba, i never got into contact with metroid, but you know, because the internet, i knew the series, the same way i know Final Fantasy and other series considered classics, but in 2014, last year, out of curiosity, i played Zero Mission on a GBA emulator, and i loved that game, and that was my first metroidvania (i mean, almost, i consider megaman zx and zx advent kinda metroidvania-ish, and i played them before), and after Zero mission, i played trough Fusion, and then super metroid (BTW, i bough yesterday Fusion for virtual console on the eshop, but i wish there was zero mission there), and i must say, zero mission is my favorite, i mean, from watching speedruns, and playing by myself, i find the controls superior to super metroid, it has some storytelling, but not as heavy as fusion, a lot of room to sequence break, and also the art and presentation is so goood. Now, i never played any 3d metroid, because i don't have a wii mote with nunchuk yet to buy metroid prime trilogy on the eshop or the means to buy metroid other m for wii to run on disc. But i'm really worried about liking metroid prime, i mean, i heard its praises, but i'm not a fan of first person view in general, the only games i enjoyed were portal and half life 2, and i don't replay those games.

    I really wish that the wii u gets a new metroid game in the future, and they give 3rd person perspective an option if they go back to the prime series style.
     
  28. Squire Grooktook

    Squire Grooktook The wind blew all day long

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    You'll probably enjoy Prime. It does a really great job of translating the Metroidvania style to 3d, probably one of the best if not the best. The presentation is really great too (I know it might look kind of brown-ish on paper but it's got some really amazing art and atmosphere in places).

    Another thing I have to praise is that the combat definitely doesn't feel like an fps cover shooter. The evasive "dodge" maneuver and double jumps gives you a lot of freedom to dodge projectiles on reaction. It's definitely more oldschool and twitchy than the modern cover-shooter fps.

    The only thing to be said negatively about it (besides a few misc nitpicks, like bosses vomiting out health constantly, and some late game fetch quests, etc.) is that the move to 3d makes the game feel a bit slower. It helps make the game potentially more atmospheric and gives the world a sense of vastness, but the greater amount of space makes it take a lot longer to get from point a to point b, and really makes you appreciate how air tight 2d gameplay is.

    Still a great game though. And I think the first person perspective was the best option they could have gone with. It really plays to the series moody, atmospheric strength.
     
  29. Effay

    Effay Active Member

    Steam:
    Effay
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    There has yet to be a better Metroidvania than Super Metroid. Nothing has ever matched the alien atmosphere and sense of loneliness that game had. It was you vs. the world except for your little buddies that taught you how to wall jump and the bird that taught you how to shinespark, but they were a very small part (the fact that you could save them at the end is cool too). I loved that there weren't really any instructions or directions; you just had to figure out what to do on your own. For some reason most of the modern Metroidvanias have waypoints everywhere. Having to explore and figure out how to use what you have to get to new areas is the best mechanic games like this have to offer, and having waypoints completely defeats the purpose. In fact i would say having waypoints disqualifies the game from being classified as a metroidvania.

    Even though there weren't really any cutscenes or dialogue besides the intro and ending, Super Metroid still managed to tell a story. It wasn't a complicated story by any means, but it was there. I remember the anxiety I felt when you beat Ridley and saw the broken baby metroid container where you thought your new powerup would be. I remember the pure terror i felt when I first encountered the grown up metroid baby where i frantically tried pressing every button on my SNES pad trying to break free, screaming the entire time and the relief I felt when it stops juuuuuust before it kills you. The part at the end where the mother brain almost kills you and the baby sacrifices itself to save you was heart wrenching the first time i played it when i was a kid.

    I'm ashamed to say I've never 100% Super Metroid. Maybe i'll get to it one of these days.

    Fusion had a decent atmosphere but was more of an action game than a metroidvania. it was completely linear, with the damn robot telling you where to go all the time. The coolest part was the anxiety around SA-X, and the terror you felt when you ran away from it. Other than that it was pretty boring.

    I enjoyed Prime 1 and 2 when they came out but they didn't really age well. Like @Squire Grooktook said, the pace is pretty slow. Most of the advanced movement from the 2D games isn't present, like running, shinesparking, and wall bouncing (prime 2 and/or 3 had it, but it was far more limited since you could only wall bounce in very specific places). This combined with the fact that there's just more space due to the added dimension can make travel take quite awhile.

    I believe a truly great 3D, first person metroidvania could be made, but they would have to venture quite a bit from the 2D formula.
     
  30. Ruin

    Ruin Hopes & Dreams

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    I have to say that Metroid is my very favorite space marine
    I really like when he shoots the aliens and broods about his space feelings
     
    Ktulu and HeadcrabNinja like this.
  31. Effay

    Effay Active Member

    Steam:
    Effay
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    Eliza
  32. Ruin

    Ruin Hopes & Dreams

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    Big Band
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    I mean
    would you prefer that I say how I actually don't care for Super Metroid
    because I could
    I know my opinions are generally poisonous but hey, it takes a village or what have you
     
  33. Effay

    Effay Active Member

    Steam:
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    Differing opinions can lead to productive discussions. Obvious trolling/baiting leads only to flamewars.
     
  34. Ruin

    Ruin Hopes & Dreams

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    yeah but when my biggest thing about it is "I thought it was boring" it's hard to sound like I'm not trying to stir some pots
     
  35. Squire Grooktook

    Squire Grooktook The wind blew all day long

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    Everything is boring for a reason. For me, Metroidvania's and Mega Man style games are fun, but can't quite reach the same level of heart pounding excitement as something like Contra, thanks to the whole "go back to the beginning of the game if you game over" thing. They're definitely more about atmosphere and just having a good time exploring and throttling the shit out of everything. I can see not enjoying it based on that, though the complaint would have to apply to all Metroidvania's.

    I think it's easy to see why a lot of people prefer Super Metroid out of all the games. It's got one of the hugest and most open-ended worlds, very diverse and memorable sprite art and music, some very unique setpieces, and some really great mechanics to have fun mastering (grappling hook, shine spark, wall jump, super speed, etc.) Zero Mission is up there too thanks to its tighter combat and challenge, but it takes a slight hit due to being not quite as exploration focused (though still better than Fusion IMO) and feels a bit more rigid as a result.

    For me, a good example of "boring" would be Fusion. Not to say it's terrible, it definitely has its moments. But it's linear as heck and doesn't have the challenge or tightness to make up for it. CV: Portrait of Ruin and Order of Elcessia on the DS are similar in how they go for a more linear approach, but they also have harder bosses and normal enemies, more weapons and toys to play with and experiment with throughout, etc. Fusion is just kind of bland in comparison.

    The SA-X scenes are cool though. Probably on par with Fire Emblem's "defend" missions, in terms of under-used awesomeness.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2015
  36. Ruin

    Ruin Hopes & Dreams

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    Honestly, Fusion is my favorite because of how it expresses Samus as a character.
    I'm not one to project myself onto characters, even when a game wants me to, I usually just make up my own bullshit scenario (case in point: my character in Dark Souls is a pyrophile that only fights for the opportunity to set things on fire then fuck them), so a game trying to present a sense of atmosphere that plays to me personally doesn't work because I'm a goofball that doesn't take things seriously
    but that changes when you present a character in that situation and how they're reacting to the world around them.
    Metroid Fusion deeply interested me with the idea that Samus herself was disturbed and even frightened by the SA-X and the goings-on in the station. That's what added a layer of intrigue to the atmosphere that I didn't get in the other games.
    By presenting the idea that, without a repeated reinforcement of that, I was able to more get a feel for the emotions that the game wanted me to feel. Isolation, uncertainty, terror, etc, due to the near constant and looming threat of the nigh-invincible SA-X.
    This compared to Super Metroid, where I found little reason to get invested in the game's atmosphere and didn't really have any particular emotions towards the events of the game, due to Samus' near complete non-presence as a character.
    I couldn't really feel anything because there was very little indication that Samus was even feeling anything, beyond Baby-related indignation when Baby-related events were occurring. Baby-related events were not a constant thing in Super Metroid, to the point that I actually and legitimately forget about the infant metroid being the crux of the plot. This is why I think Super Metroid is boring, because it doesn't and hasn't invoked any particularly strong emotions from me.

    Also, the ending Fusion has objectively the best samus
    [​IMG]
    Just look at that perfection. There's not even a mole to mess it all up.
     
  37. Squire Grooktook

    Squire Grooktook The wind blew all day long

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    Valid stuff, but:

    I dunno, seems like "make up your own character" vs "pretend it's you" are both rooted in the same experience. The classic role playing style gives you opportunity to do either, depending on your preferences. The Metroid's where Samus is mute is pretty much the same in that regard. I don't see a big difference between that, and the way Dark Souls handles it (admittedly, Souls lets you make your own character, but Samus's appearance is left to your imagination till the end anyway in Metroid).
     
  38. Ruin

    Ruin Hopes & Dreams

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    You could call it an impasse of sorts.
    I, as a player, know enough about Samus as a character that I can't make stuff up without going "no Ruin that's stupid" to myself and stifling my dumb brain, but I also can't form a connection without some kind of presentation of character being present in the game, even if I know that the overall existence of personality is in the character.
    Basically, I can't make due with a blank slate that I know is a blank slate, but also know isn't always a blank slate, which is very much the case of Samus for me.
     
  39. HeadcrabNinja

    HeadcrabNinja (ง ͡ ͡° ͜ ʖ ͡ ͡°)ว

    Location:
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    I love metroid
    New game when
     
  40. Squire Grooktook

    Squire Grooktook The wind blew all day long

    Location:
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    Hmmmm, I think this would be a non-issue if it weren't for Fusion, to be honest. Outside of Super Metroid's opening narration, Samus is pretty much an entirely blank slate at all times. Even her history is something present only in the manual, and can be safely ignored if one doesn't care. To me, it's such a thin line, that it's not worth thinking about.

    I do agree, as much as I don't find the actual gameplay in Fusion to be the series best, it did a good job with the story and dialogue. Not too much, not too little. Just enough to get you engrossed and thinking. I also like the twist that the SA-X is the one who saves Samus from the Omega Metroid. As teary as people might have gotten over the Baby/Super Metroid in SM, it's a dark reminder that both the X and Metroids were non-sentient predators and nothing else.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2015

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