Valentine General Discussion / Social Thread!

Discussion in 'Valentine' started by GHNeko, Sep 3, 2013.

  1. GHNeko

    GHNeko Hardest Community Lurker

    Fukua
    For general things that can't be pinned to other threads as well as some social chit chat.

    You can use this thread for quick questions instead of making new threads, as well as seek out advice and hang out.


    I'LL START.

    WHY IS SOLOTINE SO BAD.

    HOW DO I OPEN PEOPLE UP.

    halp
     
  2. Fedora_Ninja

    Fedora_Ninja Never asked for this.

    Steam:
    Fedora Ninja
    Valentine
    Cerebella
    Big Band
    Agreed. It's fun finding out combos and resets with Val, but I can't figure out a neutral game outside of j.hk and air dash j.hp/j.mp.
     
  3. GHNeko

    GHNeko Hardest Community Lurker

    Fukua
    Well you're forgetting dead cross zoning from the ground and from super jump height. Getting the life advantage makes the neutral a lot easier since they're forced to approach and you can take advantage of that.
     
  4. Choose Goose

    Choose Goose #sadboys

    Valentine
    Ms. Fortune
    Double
    Any advice on neutral game vs Parasoul? I keep eating eating j.HP all day.
     
  5. Camail

    Camail Well-Known Member

    As long as your aren't jumping in like a mad man Parasouls j.hp shouldn't be a huge issues. Are you still talking about solo val? Because if not you can just use your assist against her if she keeps trying to hit you with a j.hp. Parasouls mobility is really bad so the distances she can do her j.hp at are pretty limited.
     
  6. ashxu

    ashxu its time to ape

    Location:
    down under
    Steam:
    ashzu
    Valentine
    Big Band
    Fukua
    Does anyone have any real combos for her that work universally? All the combos people recommend me are really situational or require very precise ADF timing for little result (only 6k damage)

    I would review what good Valentine players I meet use but no replays.
     
  7. Dagwood

    Dagwood Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Canada
    Steam:
    Dagwood
    PSN:
    crond1zzle
    Parasoul
    Cerebella
    Double
    Use your mobility to your advantage, stay above people/away from them and use assists to start offense mostly
     
  8. GHNeko

    GHNeko Hardest Community Lurker

    Fukua
    Against Parasoul, I tend to rely on Savage Bypass and j.HK but those arent really great tools since Parasoul's j.HP beats S. Bypass and Val's j.HK start up is massive.

    If they're spamming it, a simple run up and crouch punish is totally plausible as well. Lord knows I've done it a lot. But this only works on parasouls rising j.HP. Not falling. Against falling j.HP, you have to be attack before her move hits, which isnt hard since Parasoul's j.HP start up is not super fast.
     
  9. Camail

    Camail Well-Known Member

    You're not gonna get optimized combos without putting in some work, a lot of her combos rely on air chains so the weight and reference point of the characters matter a lot. I have an essentially universal corer bnb in the new valentine thread that does 8.2k without vial, adding ~1k of damage per level. One way to avoid this is to use short combos with very good mid-screen resets. And you find those by experimenting.

    The fact of the matter is that every character is slightly different in how you do combos, especially for Valentine. Even if you find a good combo that doesn't need any input changes, you will ALWAYS need timing changes for every character.
     
  10. ashxu

    ashxu its time to ape

    Location:
    down under
    Steam:
    ashzu
    Valentine
    Big Band
    Fukua
    Guess I should of put an emphasis on the "little result" part.

    I have two combos right now that I can do with a good success rate but they only do 5-7k damage, I just feel they're more effort than they're worth. (Especially since one requires you to load up a vial beforehand)
     
  11. GHNeko

    GHNeko Hardest Community Lurker

    Fukua
    I have a 6k~ (Give or take 500 since I'm going off memory) combo that is universal and works both mid-screen and corner. The only problem is that you have to vary up timing due to character weights and hitboxes.

    EDIT: I'd also like to add that we should take the number of hits per combo into consideration due to how meter works in this game. My combo I'm talking about is like around...20-25 hits?
     
  12. ashxu

    ashxu its time to ape

    Location:
    down under
    Steam:
    ashzu
    Valentine
    Big Band
    Fukua
    The universal mid screen combo I'm using is 32-33 hits, does about 5.1k damage, requires 1 meter and requires a purple vial.

    Where can I find the weight chart for the characters? (As in lightest to heaviest characters, I can't find them at all on the wiki despite seeing them before)
     
  13. Fedora_Ninja

    Fedora_Ninja Never asked for this.

    Steam:
    Fedora Ninja
    Valentine
    Cerebella
    Big Band
    According to Mike in the latest Salty Cupcakes, there are 3 weight classes. Double being the heaviest, Parasoul and Cerebella being the second heaviest, and the rest are all normal weight. Painwheel just has a wonky hitbox.
     
    ashxu likes this.
  14. ashxu

    ashxu its time to ape

    Location:
    down under
    Steam:
    ashzu
    Valentine
    Big Band
    Fukua
    Hmm, alright. I thought each had a different weight but if there's only 3 weights then that makes things a lot easier.
     
  15. GHNeko

    GHNeko Hardest Community Lurker

    Fukua
    I'll try to get my BnB on video today. Keyword try.

    I, unforunately, get FPS drops with recording software, but I'll keep trying.

    A part of my combo, I feel is a lot stronger than the typical j.HP xx j.MP j.HP so hopefully people start using it instead.
     
  16. Shin ATproof

    Shin ATproof I BRZ I Shin ATproof

    Location:
    Metallicana, Judas
    Steam:
    Shin_ATproof
    PSN:
    Shin_ATproof
    XBL:
    Shin ATproof
    Valentine
    Yeah Valentine's movement is her greatest asset when it comes to neutral game. Her j.HK is a strong move in the air but if you use it with jumping back or using double jump to stay above an opponent, you can win many air-to-air exchanges or simply just control the space allowing you to move freely. Also in hitconfirm or blockstring, using her airdash cancels allows you to do things like mixup and even screw with people's pushblock. Any of her moves with momentum like j.MP, j.MK or c.LK usually keep you in your opponent's face midscreen or corner.

    If you're running YoloValentine, you need to really work on movement, blocking, pushblocking and guard cancels....especially in the corner since she doesn't have a "get off me" move like a DP or DP assist to get the pressure off her. It's tough but very doable, especially in the current version of Skullgirls since Solo characters are more viable because of the undizzy system shortening combos.

    As far as Valentine vs Parasoul, I seem to get pretty good results in beating out Para's j.HP if I jump back and do j.HK....but yeah, just doing something like block and punish works too, it's what Parasouls deserve when they are playing braindead like that.

    I've been working on implementing her input lag vial into both corner and midscreen since it seems to help open up her options for mixups/resets. I'm finding it better than having a poison vial for a combo since the potential reward is higher than the guaranteed damage output form the drain.
     
  17. GHNeko

    GHNeko Hardest Community Lurker

    Fukua
    laughing @ bolded.

    Do you think we could play some matches today over steam? Like a FT20, so I can get critique on my Solotine? If that's possible, that'd be fantastic because I totally could use critique.
     
  18. Shin ATproof

    Shin ATproof I BRZ I Shin ATproof

    Location:
    Metallicana, Judas
    Steam:
    Shin_ATproof
    PSN:
    Shin_ATproof
    XBL:
    Shin ATproof
    Valentine
    I'm always up for a match. I don't really feel like I'm that good to critique/teach anyone lol but if you pick up anything in our fights then that'd be cool. Hopefully I can learn something too!
     
  19. Camail

    Camail Well-Known Member

    cr.lk, cr.mk, cr.hp, j.hp, AD, j.hp xx HK Savage Bypass xx EKG Flatliner does 5k damage and doesn't need a vial. It also doesn't needs timing changes for any characters. You should either optimize your current combo A LOT more or just switch to a more efficient combo.
     
  20. Legend

    Legend Spanish Member

    Valentine
    I wanna know the very basics. My question is simple: What kind of char is Valentine? How am I supposed to play her? What is she good at? :/
     
  21. Camail

    Camail Well-Known Member

    She is a rushdown character that excels in air mobility and cross ups. She has poor anti-airs so you will want to play her from higher angles. Scalpels is a really good super that I love a lot. But her most defining feature is her ability to move pretty much anywhere she wants.

    Oh, and her normals are pretty good so you can control space.
     
  22. ashxu

    ashxu its time to ape

    Location:
    down under
    Steam:
    ashzu
    Valentine
    Big Band
    Fukua
    Gonna assume you play her solo in which case don't. She needs assists to be good.
     
  23. destruction_adv

    destruction_adv Yare Yare Daze

    Valentine
    Filia
    Double
    She's very good at rushdown, and generally, you'll want to play her as part of a team, with assists to back you up. She's got stupid good hitboxes on a lot of her moves that extend far beyond her hurtbox. Her mobility is also very good. She's also got some really nice supers.
     
  24. Legend

    Legend Spanish Member

    Valentine
    Its impossible to play her solo? And, generally, is viable in this game to play just one character? I mean, I prefer to main 1 char than 2 or 3.
     
  25. destruction_adv

    destruction_adv Yare Yare Daze

    Valentine
    Filia
    Double
    Well, a solo Fortune got 4th at EVO, but Valentine is probably the worst character to go solo with.
     
  26. RemiKz

    RemiKz Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Norcal
    Steam:
    remikz_
    PSN:
    RemiKz_
    Peacock
    Filia
    Cerebella
    ^ And solo fortune is probably the best solo.
     
  27. ashxu

    ashxu its time to ape

    Location:
    down under
    Steam:
    ashzu
    Valentine
    Big Band
    Fukua
    Fortune's head arguably acts as a pseudo assist tbh
     
  28. @OmniSScythe

    @OmniSScythe Valentine Player



    Thoughts?
     
    Dime, Camail, Vadsamoht and 2 others like this.
  29. Icky

    Icky 工 レo√乇 ㄚo∪ ღ ツ

    Location:
    Lonely ole Rhode Island
    Steam:
    Ickybonez
    Big Band
    Cerebella
    And only two solo players even made it to top 32, both of which are ungodly amounts of good at the game, and one of which who strongly believes solo is terrible and plays a team now.
     
  30. mcpeanuts

    mcpeanuts Anchor Peacock is the future

    Location:
    Massachusetts
    Steam:
    may_contain_peanuts
    Double
    Big Band
    Peacock
    Not bad. I would have liked to see more situational combos (how to convert off of throws, air to airs, weird starters, etc). Even if it's just a quick note like "grab them, do c.HP, then go into this other combo", I think that would be a useful thing to include in a guide.
     
  31. RemiKz

    RemiKz Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Norcal
    Steam:
    remikz_
    PSN:
    RemiKz_
    Peacock
    Filia
    Cerebella
    That video was helpful. Only complaint is the font isn't exactly the easiest thing to read at a glance. For something like this, I suggest a san serif font instead of a serif. I'd also avoid the italics. I think you were trying to match the blue text on the white to match valentine but I think black on solid white or white on solid black is the easiest to read.
     
  32. @OmniSScythe

    @OmniSScythe Valentine Player

    Those are things I will definitely add in a later video, as well as a more detailed take on converting such and such into a combo. Tbqh I originally had all of the above recorded and ready but then certain pre-MDE changes had me remove them.


    Thanks for the advice, I'm still getting used to premiere so I wasn't able to use the font and style I had planned at first.
     
    mcpeanuts likes this.
  33. Camail

    Camail Well-Known Member

    If you could put inputs down on the bottom that would be great.
     
    ashxu and @OmniSScythe like this.
  34. ashxu

    ashxu its time to ape

    Location:
    down under
    Steam:
    ashzu
    Valentine
    Big Band
    Fukua
    I guess it's interesting, I might use the Pulsr combo.

    I don't think the first one is that good. Doing a simple (ground string) -> j.HP ADF j.HP Bypass Flatliner will be 5k-5.3k and it's incredibly simple to do, just got to get the ADF timing down.


    For the text, I think you should either tone it down or make it more legible. I also don't think it's necessary to list the moves on the video itself. Write them down in the description and maybe tag the combo on the bottom right so people can easily reference the combo shown in the video to the inputs in the description. I know personally I just copy paste a combo I want to learn into the Win7 Sticky Note desktop gadget and put it side by side with Skullgirls so I can easily reference it while I'm playing. Also you should make a quick note on each of the combos for which weight class it works on. Light/Heavy/Double.
     
  35. Camail

    Camail Well-Known Member

    The classic combo has been drastically nerfed, so yes its an OK combo to use if you are panicking but having a BnB combo that is at least 6k is pretty much required to make any impact in the game. 7-8k is preferable. And he already does say which weight classes they work on right underneath the name of the combo. The Pulsr combo works on everyone but double, then he gives a double specific combo.
     
  36. @OmniSScythe

    @OmniSScythe Valentine Player

    It's meant to be a practice combo before working on the harder stuff, as well on the matter that the continuation of it is shown a minute after which is even on damage compared to the average corner combo.


    Will try to make it a separate part of the video so the game footage is uncovered by text next time.

    There's limits on the description it seems, so here's a pastebin http://pastebin.com/tB0XMJ8y.
     
  37. destruction_adv

    destruction_adv Yare Yare Daze

    Valentine
    Filia
    Double
    Hey, I'm trying to add a third to my team of Valentine and Fillia, I'm stuck between Peacock and Double, any suggestions about that.
     
  38. Camail

    Camail Well-Known Member

    Double gives you stronger assists and 1 meter dhc into catheads. If you really want to zone pick peacock, you team order would have to be Valentine/Peacock in either order, then filia as anchor. You should decide based in what playstyle you like.
     
  39. destruction_adv

    destruction_adv Yare Yare Daze

    Valentine
    Filia
    Double
    Hmm, I think I'll go double then, really I was just picking based on who'd offer me more using Valentine, and since double's hornet bombers is apparently still awesome, I'll go with that. Had a few matches earlier now that my net is finally back up (and I had a few matches of mcdonalds wifi, that was the best thing ever) with peacock and double and Double felt better to me.
     
  40. ashxu

    ashxu its time to ape

    Location:
    down under
    Steam:
    ashzu
    Valentine
    Big Band
    Fukua
    Is there any use for Mortuary Drop? It's a command throw so it doesn't work when the enemy is blocking or being hit and it's slow as hell so you can't exactly use it for resets.
     

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