• As part of the relaunch of Skullheart, ALL previous threads have been archived. You can find them at the bottom of the forum in the Archives (2021) section. The archives are locked, so please use the new forum sections to create new discussion threads.

Fukua How do I deal with mixups?

M

medivh

Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2015
Messages
40
Reaction score
4
Points
8
Age
37
Steam
medivh
Robo Fortune
I started playing this game 2 weeks ago and I am still learning.But learning this game is the by far the worst learning experience for me so far.

I played competitive games like warcraft 3, starcraft 1 2,wow pvp, dota 1 2,LoL and street fighter 4 but none of those games made me this frustrated.
Any decent player I played against tried some kind of reset to put me in a loop and beat me over and over and over again.By the time I find a way to get away from it I already lost like 20 games in a row and he just changes the reset.

So whenever I get comboed I am likely to just gamble between options I have been given? Does this change if I improve? I have just lost to a some squigly player right now who kept double jump attacking me into combo into low-throw- super mix-up thing for like 20 games.
I had zero enjoyment from those games even tho I won some by luck.

It seems like I either completely destroy my opponent 10 20 times in a row by my opponent doesn't know how to deal with certain move or I get reseted all day and eat combos for weeks.Losing is fine but losing 10 20 games in a row without dealing any damage doesn't motivate me about learning this game.

How can I deal with this frustration?
 
Your MMO and RTS skills won't do anything for you here...but SF4 is a slower skullgirls so that should've helped.
I'd recommend finding someone to play against who is around your skill level. Try looking for a sparring partner in the beginner section of the forums.
The more you practice against someone, the better you'll get at blocking and anticipating mix up opportunities. You'll also get better at anticipating the play styles of certain opponents.

If you're getting hit from the air start air grabbing, blocking high, or using any anti-air attacks (e.g Big Bands A-Train).
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
I was going to type out a long response but I'm on my break so fuck that mobile sucks.

I made this video to help people understand what resets are:

Of course you're already passed that I understand the wall you are facing right now.

I'm going to start working on a way more in depth look into blocking mix ups and dealing with this vortex game.
So thanks for inspiring me to do that.

For now though, consider this, Skullgirls has really fast and scary easy mix up, but it also has VERY fast invincible reversals on almost the whole cast for one bar. If your opponent is recklessly throwing highs lows and throws at you, level one supers will blow through most mix up attempts unless they specifically set up to counter your reversal.
If you rely on them too much, you're likely to get hit by long damaging counter hit combos though. So you have to find the balance and make a read on if you think it is a good time for a reversal.
Just like with Ryu's Shoryukens, etc.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: FuLLBLeeD, Datagram, medivh and 1 other person
Defensively speaking, its a tough game to learn. But skarmands advice is spot on. Level 1 supers blow right through most reset attempts. So if you know that your opponent is going to try a high/low/throw you can level 1 super right through it with most characters.

Beyond that, if you have a good dp assist behind you (which you should have) then you can try to predict your opponents mixup and block correctly while using the assist macro to come out and punish your opponents offense. But that is super risky because you could predict the mixup wrong and get hit, resulting in a double snap situation where you lose a character.

The best defense, as always, is to try and not get hit in the first place. Try not to block any of your opponents normals, and if you do, pushblock them out so it isnt easy for them to get a mixup off on you.


Another thing to remember is that using tags as reversals in this game can be very good. Certain tags such as bellas tag and big bands tag can serve as reversals. They are of course very unsafe, but they require no meter to be used and can reset momentum.

And then theres the old safe dhc:

Get a character with a nice big or good gtfo super such as bellas level 1 or big bands level 1 and do them, then dhc into a safe on block super such as doubles cattelite super. Now youve not only stopped momentum, youve actually completely turned things around and are on the offense... For 2 meters.

So there are definitely options for you to learn to use. No one can just attack for free in skullgirls.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
@ Dime_x
I play solo fukua right now so I don't have any assist characters.I guess spamming her QCK KK when i am cornered or getting mixed up is the best idea? This game is really confusing with one character already for me so I don't want to make the game more complex at the moment.
 
Fukuas defense is weird. Shes designed to be very weak to throws.


Idk which super that is of hers, but if its the BFF super then yes that is fully invincible for a looong time. The problem is that it is also super slow and can be baited easily.

Idk what state fukua is in right now on beta and retail, but on some versions she has a strike invincible attack (HK drill) into a safe on block super (fireball super) so you can try and make use of that.


Fukua is less about invincible move defense though, and more about really good neutral defense. Her fireballls allow her to control neutral very well, and her j.hk is a ridiculously good air to air attack at closer ranges.



Personally though, were i you, i would runan invincible assist, even if you dont want to really learn the second character for awhile, its better to learn to use assists from the start rather than learning to use your character without assists first.

Its easier to learn to use a character while having a good assist, than without imho.

I did it for my pw/double team for the first 2 months i played the game and it was by far the best decision i ever made in regards to learning how to play sg.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
@ Dime_x
As you said BFF is really slow.If they are in the air while I am rising up I generally miss BFF :( I only play on retail and her hk drill is strike invincible but I dont know about fireball super safe or not.

In neutral game I dont know what to do against jump ins.Even if I try to pushblock they just keep coming and catch me eventually.Also some characters have air dash or double jump so it confuses to hell out of me.
 
Fireball super is not invincible at all and is slow, but is safe on block. Training mode's Advanced Attack Data will tell you this stuff.
HK drill - to super fireball on block, to super drill on hit, or mixup afterward - is a decent reversal attempt, though it loses to throws.
QCB+throw (armored grab) is also a decent reversal if they are attacking during a reset.
Vs jump-ins you can jump back HK which will lead into a blockstring or combo, you can cr.HP which is a decent antiair with her and leads to full conversions, or you can block and pushblock.

Fukua isn't a character that wants to be on defense, though, so you need to block when you are. She has extremely strong offensive and ranged tools.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
Mike_Z said:
HK drill - to super fireball on block, to super drill on hit, or mixup afterward - is a decent reversal attempt, though it loses to throws.
QCB+throw (armored grab) is also a decent reversal if they are attacking during a reset.
Thanks! I will practice this now. I was already doing QCB+throw after combos but I didnt know anything else so I was getting predictable with that move.

" Fukua isn't a character that wants to be on defense, though, so you need to block when you are. She has extremely strong offensive and ranged tools."

I dont know when I should be defending, attacking or zoning in my matchups.I checked the fukua match ups thread but it was mostly about squigly match up.
It would be nice If there was a basic guide about a what to do against other characters.
 
Solo is underpowered because you cant regen. Dont play solo unless you're one of those people that have play this daily.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
Fumako said:
B-BUT THE SOLO BIGBAND DAMAGE
I GO PUNCH AND LIFEBAR GOES AWAY
SO TRUE:/
 
fukuafannum9 said:
Solo is underpowered because you cant regen. Dont play solo unless you're one of those people that have play this daily.
Problem is I am overwhelmed with this game now.If I try to learn another character from zero again I will probably lose all of my interest.I have 50 hours played time on steam and I am pretty sure I spent 35 40 hours of that time in training mode.
 
medivh said:
I am pretty sure I spent 35 40 hours of that time in training mode.
I know that spending time on training mode is helpful, but don't spend the majority of your time there.
I suggest just learning a basic BnB for midscreen and corner and going on lobbies/quickmatch.
After that you just keep going, swallow your pride and take those losses like a man. You're not going to learn fancy combos this way, but you will learn what to do in neutral and how to respond to situations, plus you learn quite a few neat tricks in random matches~
At most I suggest you just spend 30 minutes to an hour in the training room to learn new combos/practice blocking blockstrings/practicing a new trick you found/etc. Just don't spend the majority of your time there, just spend bite-sized chunks every now and then.

Also, for defense, I suggest just pushblocking a lot to prevent them getting in, maybe practice pushblocking multi-hitting moves. Also, move a lot and don't stay still or just walk backwards for extended period of time (Read more than 2 seconds). One last thing, are you using a team or are you running solo?
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
Fumako said:
I know that spending time on training mode is helpful, but don't spend the majority of your time there.
I suggest just learning a basic BnB for midscreen and corner and going on lobbies/quickmatch.
After that you just keep going, swallow your pride and take those losses like a man. You're not going to learn fancy combos this way, but you will learn what to do in neutral and how to respond to situations, plus you learn quite a few neat tricks in random matches~
At most I suggest you just spend 30 minutes to an hour in the training room to learn new combos/practice blocking blockstrings/practicing a new trick you found/etc. Just don't spend the majority of your time there, just spend bite-sized chunks every now and then.

Also, for defense, I suggest just pushblocking a lot to prevent them getting in, maybe practice pushblocking multi-hitting moves. Also, move a lot and don't stay still or just walk backwards for extended period of time (Read more than 2 seconds). One last thing, are you using a team or are you running solo?
I am playing solo fukua. I learned a basic 40 hit bnb combo and I learned how to convert from L M H shadows, throws and BFF.I also learned a basic high low throw armored throw mix up with that bnb.
 
medivh said:
I am playing solo fukua. I learned a basic 40 hit bnb combo and I learned how to convert from L M H shadows, throws and BFF.I also learned a basic high low throw armored throw mix up with that bnb.

Do you do these things during a match reliably? Do you get the opportunities to do these things in a match? Most importantly, do you avoid attempting these things when it would let your opponent get the advantage?

Also, 40 hit bnb? With Fukua? Why have you been making it that long? I'm guessing you are using j.MP several times in there. I find c.LK s.MK s.HP j.LK j.MK j.HK on repeat (add c.LP/j.LP to the beginning each chain of the second loop) followed by a reset or QCF+KK (drill super) to KO works quite reliably, the only trick being to get the j.LK/j.LP out quickly after the jump cancel. IIRC 15 hits is the limit before you get minimum damage scaling on every hit.

In your description, I see no mention of fireball use or finding ways to put in j.HK>HP. If you can get the read right, j.HK>HP 3 times followed by one loop of the above combo is a great confirm.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
fukuafannum9 said:
Solo is underpowered because you cant regen. Dont play solo unless you're one of those people that have play this daily.

Someone hasn't been playing the betaaaaaaa

As a solo character in the endless beta, you now regen 3/4ths(?) of your red life by snapping out the point character. It's super useful, and it's saved my buns plenty.

medivh said:
I learned a basic 40 hit bnb combo

It's not a good idea to gauge combo quality by hits, since the amount of hits a combo has is completely irrelevant to the amount of damage you do. I can do 80+ hit Big Band combos that do only 4.5k damage, whereas my normal 55-hit corner BnB does 8.6k damage.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
Shadowfury333 said:
snap
C.LK S.MK S.HP J.HK S.MK S.HP

J.HP J.HK C.LK S.HP J.MK J.HK

S.LP(X2) C.MK(3 hits) C.HP HDrill xx SDrill

Damage: 7514. Meter gain: .4
I am doing this one.Sorry for the confusion.Its pretty basic and yeah I can do things I said in the previous post easily in matches.I havent practiced j.HK>HP loop yet.I will start practicing it tomorrow^^.

I dont do anything fancy with my fireballs yet.I try to zone my opponent and try to read his movement patterns.I try to mix up with mp hp ground hp air fireball and Instant air hp fireball.I havent found any use of lp fireball yet.
 
Flotilla said:
Someone hasn't been playing the betaaaaaaa

As a solo character in the endless beta, you now regen 3/4ths(?) of your red life by snapping out the point character. It's super useful, and it's saved my buns plenty.



It's not a good idea to gauge combo quality by hits, since the amount of hits a combo has is completely irrelevant to the amount of damage you do. I can do 80+ hit Big Band combos that do only 4.5k damage, whereas my normal 55-hit corner BnB does 8.6k damage.

I started practicing bella as my second character.So I wont be playing solo fukua I guess.I am thinking about using fukua as point character and using cere assists to help me on defending or mixing my oppopent up.But I am not sure bella is the best character for the job yet.
 
Bella is very good with Fukua.

As for the mixup game in Skullgirls, it is very difficult and reversals are necessary sometimes to get out of situations where you are pressured, as a lot of pressure in this game is very hard to block.

I'm not trying to white knight myself and say I'm godlike here, because I'm far from that, but what I try to do when I think about how to block in this game is all about the setups. There are certain BnB's and strings that characters do for combos, like your Fukua combo. These combos normally have certain "reset points" where a skilled player can either cross you up, go high/low, or throw you at that point. A good example would be Valentine's one air string that allows her to get a quick Crossup-J.HP after a certain air string. A player can obviously reset you anywhere in a combo, but there are places where it is more advantageous and more ambiguous to do so.

The point here is that if you start realizing what these strings are, you'll start to understand what options the other character has for resets at that point. This just comes from playing people and paying attention to what you are getting hit by and remembering what set up that hit. By using this you can make more educated guesses on where to block and, after a while, be able to react to these mixups.

If I'm full of crap right now feel free to tell me, but that's the way that I look at it. You also gotta learn when to pushblock things in certain situations, that really helps relieve pressure and lets you get back to neutral.
 
That's not a bad combo, mostly because the frequent shifts back to ground provide several reset opportunities. Switching in a throw instead of the second c.LK, or waiting a couple more frames first to reset the combo (mixing liberally with j.HK or other aerials) seems on paper like it would work nicely.

Just to double-check, are you training solo vs solo (or duo vs duo, or trio vs duo)? That's the only way to get accurate damage readings, every other situation will scale your base damage.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
Shadowfury333 said:
That's not a bad combo, mostly because the frequent shifts back to ground provide several reset opportunities. Switching in a throw instead of the second c.LK, or waiting a couple more frames first to reset the combo (mixing liberally with j.HK or other aerials) seems on paper like it would work nicely.

Just to double-check, are you training solo vs solo (or duo vs duo, or trio vs duo)? That's the only way to get accurate damage readings, every other situation will scale your base damage.
Yeah I always train solo vs solo.It works nicely in games too.My problem is mostly about defending or what to do against certain playstyle.

I have problems against squigly players who jump and dive kick me all the time...
I have problems against filia and her instant air dash and air hairball...
I have problems against Big band and his brass and throws.
 
While this isn't always the best option, do you know that blocking in mid-air can't be mixed up? You block everything when airborne, the only downside being that you need to be careful about not getting caught out when you land.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
Or caught low. If you up back on the ground and your opponent does a low, you are stuck in preblock and get bopped for it.

That is how the low/throw 50/50 works and why it is so powerful in SG.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mcpeanuts and medivh
Thanks for the advices for but I uninstalled the game.I tried my best but then I realized no matter how much I learn I wont enjoy this game.Its just too reset heavy.Either I do something that my opponent doesnt know how to answer or its the opposite.I dont enjoy winning or losing like this.
There were games i couldnt even do one move because I didnt know a certain reset.It is almost impossible to have fun for me with such a punishing game.
Sometimes I felt like I was playing I wanna be the guy.
 
medivh said:
Thanks for the advices for but I uninstalled the game.I tried my best but then I realized no matter how much I learn I wont enjoy this game.Its just too reset heavy.Either I do something that my opponent doesnt know how to answer or its the opposite.I dont enjoy winning or losing like this.
There were games i couldnt even do one move because I didnt know a certain reset.It is almost impossible to have fun for me with such a punishing game.
Sometimes I felt like I was playing I wanna be the guy.


Its ok dude. Not every game is for every player.

Dont take this the wrong way, but perhaps a much less reset heavy game might be up your alley?

You should try out smash if you havent given up on the fighting game genre as a whole.

Smash is a very fundamental game very low on combos and big on spacing and jumpkicks. Maybe give that a try?

Have a good day :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
Dime_x said:
Its ok dude. Not every game is for every player.

Dont take this the wrong way, but perhaps a much less reset heavy game might be up your alley?

You should try out smash if you havent given up on the fighting game genre as a whole.

Smash is a very fundamental game very low on combos and big on spacing and jumpkicks. Maybe give that a try?

Have a good day :)
Yeah I wanna give it a try but I dont own a console.I hope it comes to PC someday.I will definitely try Mk10 when its released^^
 
If you like speed but not resets, the only games on PC that come to mind are Melty Blood Actress Again Current Code (which you can't buy, but there is a small community) and some older Arc System Works titles, mostly Guilty Gear XX #Reload and BlazBlue Continuum Shift Extend. I guess there's UMvC3, but I don't know how that plays in practice.

If Guilty Gear XX Accent Core +R, Under Night In-Birth, Guilty Gear Xrd, or BlazBlue Chronophantasma were on PC I'd recommend them more readily as alternatives.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
I live in Turkey so I need a game with good netcode too.I couldnt play street fighter without lag most of the time.Only countries I could play without problems were Sweden, Finland, France, Germany and of course Turkey.

So I dont know how good the netcode is for the games you have mentioned.Skullgirls has REALLY good netcode so that was the main reason I got interested in the game for the first place.
 
medivh said:
Well yeah it was fun until it wasnt fun anymore for me.

To make a radical suggestion - what about playing against the computer?
Go on Arcade Mode, work out a difficulty that's challenging but fun to play against and play that. That's what I do. I know I'm nowhere near good enough to play against other humans - heck, I can't even beat the CPU on Nightmare. But I'm having fun, because I've found a difficulty I like playing at.

I'm pretty sure I'm about to be hounded off the site with pitchforks and torches, but I figured it was worth a try.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
Man-In-Crowd-4 said:
To make a radical suggestion - what about playing against the computer?
Go on Arcade Mode, work out a difficulty that's challenging but fun to play against and play that. That's what I do. I know I'm nowhere near good enough to play against other humans - heck, I can't even beat the CPU on Nightmare. But I'm having fun, because I've found a difficulty I like playing at.

I'm pretty sure I'm about to be hounded off the site with pitchforks and torches, but I figured it was worth a try.
I played against cpu when I first started the game.I didnt try nightmare but it wasnt fun for me.I just spammed my bnb and it was working fine.
Playing against cpu wont make you better against humans tho.You should start playing against people asap man^^
 
  • Like
Reactions: mcpeanuts
Meiynas said:
RIP another solo Fukua. :'(

Cya Medihv.
I hope there will be skullgirls 2 or an expansion so I can come back^^.
 
Melty Blood Actress Again Current Code just got good netcode (proper rollback and everything), but all of the other mentioned games use input delay netcode, and are thus only playable with nearby opponents.
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
medivh said:
I played against cpu when I first started the game.I didnt try nightmare but it wasnt fun for me.I just spammed my bnb and it was working fine.
Playing against cpu wont make you better against humans tho.You should start playing against people asap man^^

Fair enough. I'd have thought there was a difficulty setting that was the right balance of challenge and doability, but I'm not you so what the heck do I know?

Actually, working up bot difficulty did help me get used to how the tough fights (ie. against humans) work and how you have to play them.
There is a much simpler solution - don't play humans. There. I said it. When Lab Zero brings out a thing for online that lets you play against people of the same skill level, I will happily play online all day against other noobs who can't combo. Until then? Being resetted to death all afternoon isn't my idea of fun. I know I speak only for myself when I say this, but I'm perfectly happy playing bots thank you.
 
If you want good netcode, your only choices on PC are Skullgirls, Melty Blood or a game on Fightcade.

Hell, if you wan't good netcode on ANY system the options are basically the same. SFxT maybe? haha
 
  • Like
Reactions: medivh
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back