Bagpipe taunt input (suggestion inside)

[Muro]

For starters, input history:

1.

2. (hold 4 seconds, release)

3. (hold 1,5 seconds, release) ( instead of worked too)

4.

(1) was just a placeholder. (2) worked for a lot of people. (3) had a tendency to cause accidental taunts. (4) is the current one.

Writing this because as a pad user I find (4) very uncomfortable and difficult. It has been there for 2,5 months with Big Band soon to be released. That being said, much to my sadness, I don't expect the input to be changed at this point, and I'm guessing other Big Band players would stab me for making such a suggestion in the first place.

I had an certain idea that would make pad users happy while not bothering anyone else. I'm aware it's without precedence in Skullgirls, but what if the taunt had two inputs? Say, keep the (4) but make (2) working as well. I don't see anyone making (2) by mistake, it's generally less handy for stick/hitbox/keyboard players anyway so it wouldn't act as a buff, while for players such as myself it would make powering up specials a ton less frustrating.

Thoughts?

 

[Flotilla]

2 was godawful, I don't see why you would want it back but if it didn't replace 4 I wouldn't mind it being there.

I do agree that the current taunt input, while being the best of the non-placeholder taunt inputs, is a little unwieldy. I see tons of other decent Big Band players constantly miss it, I miss it myself every once in awhile. I can't even imagine doing it on pad.

 

[Buri]

I kinda agree with this because even after getting the hang of it on Stick, I've played with a PS3 Pad later and it took me about 5 tries to get it right every time, I can't even understand why it feels that much harder.

I think 1 would be good actually. I don't mind crazy inputs for taunts but BB gains so much with his taunt that it's execution shouldn't be a hurdle.

 

[blufang]

I like the current one, I just use it after a knockdown sometimes. It seems to come out every time (on stick).

 

[Ninja]

I have no problem with the current input for Big B's taunt. It's at the right level of execution where the player must actively think about doing the taunt where and when in a combo or after a hard knock down. Going to any other of these inputs would be a downgrade; #1, #2 are far to easy to do given the buff the taunt gives to Big B. As of right now the two taunts in the game are used to buff the character, Peacock with her taunt (, , , , ) makes it that her lv3 shadow of doom become the Tenrai Ha which it great for mid combos. The bottom line is a character that uses a taunt that buffs them should have the taunt harder to execute making the match balanced.

 

[Arcana]

As a pad player i used to hate that input (still kinda do), it took me a while to figure it out, mastering the timing is something that we have to work at, though input 3 still is my favorite

 

[Buri]

Going to any other of these inputs would be a downgrade; #1, #2 are far to easy to do given the buff the taunt gives to Big B.

The bottom line is a character that uses a taunt that buffs them should have the taunt harder to execute making the match balanced.

I disagree with that concept. The ONLY option that actually balances execution and benefits is #2, that actively gimps your gameplay in order to come out (you lose 2 kick buttons for a few seconds, if you want to taunt after a combo you have to think of a combo that uses only 1 kick button). #1 and #4 take exactly the same amount of time and skill to use after you get used to the inputs, the difference is that one is much more intuitive.

 

[RetroStation]

I think (1) would be fine as a secondary input for pad users because BB already has a secondary input: & for Beat Extend, as opposed to doing &

 

[Muro]

2 was godawful, I don't see why you would want it back

It's requires a setup, but I find that preferable and less annoying than executing the current input.

It's at the right level of execution where the player must actively think about doing the taunt where and when in a combo or after a hard knock down.

I'd agree - for keyboard and stick players. The execution is noticeably harder and more inconvenient on a pad, though. My point isn't to make it easy as much as to make it not uncomfortable.

I think 1 would be good actually.

I think (1) would be fine as a secondary input for pad users...

I think (1) would be too easy, to the point where it wouldn't be an alternate as much as everyone dropping (4) to do (1) instead. Also, I'm mixed on building in a teabagging motion into a taunt input.

...because BB already has a secondary input: & for Beat Extend, as opposed to doing &

That's a good point, an alternate input for a move (and one introduced to make life easier for pad users, at that) actually isn't without precedence in Skullgirls after all. T'was a blessing, too.

 

[Immaevilspacewhale]

What about QCB, F + PP?

 

[RemiKz]

I play on pad and the current version is perfectly fine IMO.

It lets me do stuff like this easily

The HP at the end of the combo was actually from my taunt input ( >, HP, MP, LP, >)

It's kind of similar to how you would combo into supers in Vampire Saviors.

 

[Karlaaldana]

As a pad player I understand the frustration that can be felt as the result of not landing a taunt at the first try.. I think that using F-LP, MP, HK-F would be a nice improovement as for most of the time my finger is on the right trigger instead of the right bumper (I don't know if it's just me).

Or maybe F-LP, MP, MK-F but I don't how unconfortable would be for the stick players.

 

[juju_for_president]

I also play pad, and I hate the input. I would be fine with just about anything else at this point, although I really like the idea of a second input in addition to the current one, so everyone who is already used to it isn't forced to adapt to another change.

 

[Muro]

@Mike_Z, could I bother you to share your opinion on giving Big Band's taunt an additional alternate input to make the life of pad users a bit less grim?

 

[Mike_Z]

I have very little problem doing it on pad, but that's because I don't use default SF layout...

Pick a motion from Vampire that you like better, then we can watch everyone else complain about how it's now a more difficult input.
I already changed Beat Extend and his Lv5 for pad. Gah.

 

[Chrono_Tata]

What about QCB, F + PP?

That's a bit too close to the Lvl 3 input for my liking.

 

[Muro]

Pick a motion from Vampire that you like better, then we can watch everyone else complain about how it's now a more difficult input.

Hence the idea of making it an alternate/additional input, so that players could choose which is less troublesome for them.

The current is taken from Morrigan's Cryptic Needle.

I'd say an input from another of Morrigan's supers, the Darkness Illusion is on the same level of complexity while being noticeably more user friendly on a pad with the default layout.

 

[Kawalorn]

Hey, I'm perfectly fine with any input as long as it isn't a charge one. I want to do the taunt whenever I want.

 

[Detective Q]

You know, I came to this forum after they changed Big Band’s taunt for the last time, I wanted the old one (would be the 3rd option here) back because I couldn’t do the new one with pad. Yes, that was the primary reason for me to come here, what a shame.

That being said: After some training it’s no problem to do the current taunt with a gamepad, and some people around here know I’m just using a plain old Xbox 360-controller.

You have to figure out the exact momentum and pace, you can’t rush it, at least I can’t because than the input screws up. But other than that, it works. Sometimes I rush the input down and the taunt doesn’t come out, but that’s my problem, if I do it right and careful it works every time. And it has the benefit that you can’t do it accidental like option 3 that happened a lot.

I don’t know if an additional second input would work quite well, and the one from Darkness Illusion seems even more complicated than Cryptic Needle. I think the problem for most pad-players is that they have HP assigned to either RB or RT, back buttons. You can always have one finger back there because that’s where you hold it anyway, but at the same time you have your thumb on the primary buttons. If you press HP with your index finger and then attempt to press MP with the thumb, it messes up things. That happened to me. With a stick you can piano the input, that’s not possible with the standard controller layout.

I know it sounds stupid but: Train the move. Hit training mode, do it over and over again until you figured it out. If a scrubby player like me can do it with the 360-pad, so can you guys.

 

[DARKNESSxEAGLE]

Ok I just went in training mode having never done this taunt before (I'm on PS3 pad) and I don't see the problem. Forward, R1, Triangle, slide down to square, forward. Only times I've messed up are when I've hit the last forward too early or if I skip triangle and go straight to square.

I'm not sure how well sliding works on Xbox 360 pads though.

 

[Mike_Z]

If you're having the problem I think you're having, I can make the current input easier. Lemme try something.

 

[RemiKz]

I'm honestly having a hard time understanding how the input is difficult or even inconvenient on a pad. How is the new suggested input any easier? This is coming from a pad player. You are just doing a reverse LP MP HP, like I'm sure most of you are familiar with doing, with forward inputs tacked onto the front and back.

 

[Evilweevle]

honestly this is all in the muscle memory. you could make it 10 inputs and once you practice it enough itll be like second nature.

 

[Mao]

I play on ps3 controller and I can actually do the input fine. Still want to know what this idea is though

 

[Professor Icepick]

Oddly, I play on pad (6-button) and I'm having no issues with the current input, because I just slide down the buttons. The third one was my favorite though, because I'd pull off the taunt after a successful Brass Knuckles.

 

[Arcana]

In the next Beta update, BB taunt is going to be easier to pull off, it is still the same input though

 

[Ninja]

In the next Beta update, BB taunt is going to be easier to pull off, it is still the same input though

Easier, how? Is the timing to do the input going to be longer? If so, by how much?

 

[Mike_Z]

It's already REALLY long, you have 60f to enter it.
No, there's just a few extra ways you could be doing it, so I'm gonna change a bit of the detection and see if helps.

 

[Sanger Zonvolt]

Question, why isn't it just the first input? Was there an issue with that one?

 

[Mike_Z]

Not complicated enough - taunts are optional junk (whatever you may think, even if they have effects) and thus have to use overcomplicated motions that to me exemplify a problem with fighting games. :^)

 

[Muro]

Since I don't know what was the nature of the fix in the latest update, I unfortunately can't say how much it helped with what I write below.

I spent some time in the lab trying to figure out an easy way to do the taunt. Continued having problems when I kept doing it the "old" way. But then I noticed something that caused a breakthrough.

Nothing's stopping you from holding a once pressed punch button for no matter how long as the following ones are pressed. For example, when HP is pressed, it doesn't have to be released before the input is continued even all the way to the end. It made all the difference to me, since it eliminated the spasmodic unpressing of buttons and also allowed to do "MP, LP" by "press Y and hold, press LB (macro 1, LP+MP in my case)" instead of "press Y, slide to X", a slide which proved to be somehow problematic.

Also, you can press the second "->" before LP and it still works as long as you hold it while LP is pressed. With those things in mind, the input transformed from annoying to both comfortable and easy to do repeatedly. This is a slowmo of how its display looks in my case.

Sorry if anything of the above was an obvious thing I failed to notice earlier. It's a tip that no one gave me and that helped a ton once I realised it, so I figured I might as well share it for the chance that it will help others as well.

 

[Mike_Z]

Both of those were the fixes. (^.^)
Previously you needed to press each Punch by itself, and you needed to let go of F during the LP spot. Plus now it doesn't care when you release F as long as you release it and press it again.

 

[Muro]

Thank you, based Mike Z.

 

[AceZTeller]

Ok, that fix must have really done it's job. MUCH more consistent on the MK -> C. HK -> Taunt now.