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Blazblue

yeah but he's still the rival with the main character, and they're both blond, and they have white and blue, and they both use swords!
everything about Jin just makes me wish he played more like Ky!
 
SanoBaron said:
everything about Jin just makes me wish he played more like Ky!

Isn't Jin pretty much BlazBlue's answer to Ky moveset-wise (though I would love for the two to have divergent character evolution so that way they can be unique from each other whilst still fitting in the general mold).
 
Domayv said:
Isn't Jin pretty much BlazBlue's answer to Ky moveset-wise (though I would love for the two to have divergent character evolution so that way they can be unique from each other whilst still fitting in the general mold).
They have obvious similarities, but they are much more different than Sol/Ragna's similarities.

On the topic of centralfiction I am excited for Hibiki, I loved him in the story mode and he looks fun.
 
OFF TOPIC

Spencer said:
BB, P4AU, GG, and others are simply more fun to me because there is less bullshit (well... regarding assists anyway... obviously).
This is factually wrong. I think the key here is "at the level of people you're playing against, in the versions of the games you played".
Looking at the puppet characters...
GG Eddie has had match-practical unblockable loops since forever, here's AC+R's version:
Hellmonkey used to do this stuff to me all the time in regular AC, so did every Eddie. It was why he was the bestest character.
Here's Xrd's version:
Zappa has easy-practical infinites with Dog, real not gonna-end infinites, which also lead into pretty much guaranteed resets at any point:
And he has his sword BS, which is not RESETS but is pretty much THE thing that makes him S++ in GGAC+R, and it's basically a controllable-anywhere assist with highs and lows:
Carl had this in BBCT:
And in GG, if you hit the puppet and the character on the same frame you do NOT hit the character, so Eddie is absolutely protected by standing on top of Little Eddie.
(I don't play P4, sorry.)

And for non-assist things, Arakune has had unburstable high-damage or 100% combos in pretty much every version, here's CPs:
Kokonoe had unblockable Black Hole loops:
Blazblue also has a bunch of "random crossup" resets vs ground bounce-tech, where neither you nor the opponent can know which side you'll have to block on. Those are extra fun.

LIKE I SAID BEFORE I think the main reasons you're confused are:
- BB/GG give you air techs, which means there aren't as many good resets vs air. So the ones that are super good you have to do vs ground. They still exist, and are harder to block than things in SG because there is no unblockable protection nor Absolute Guard. And you're confusing this+no assists with the fact that SG doesn't have air techs + has assists. (MvC3 has air techs + assists, and resets vs air there are generally very bad.) A slow projectile like Venom's ball covering his crossup is just as good as an assist reset in SG.
- You're playing people who are worse at GG/BB? I mean I have to guess at this but if you didn't know about / have to fight the stuff listed here...
 
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All that's very fair. I guess when I say "bullshit" I am referencing things that I feel should have a place in a game (unlike unblockables and infinites), which is not fair of me for sure. I am mostly just trying to capture what it is about 1v1 I prefer to MvC style team games... granting a hypothetical, the things that would make up the core differences between SG (a game that takes unblockables and infinites into account at its core) and it's 1v1 counterpart that also takes those into account (which I don't think exists).

In any case, the answer to the question as originally posed is probably best stated as "because I find them less fun"... is that less controversial?

And I think we do agree completely on this (seriously, can you imagine Valk's rushdown or Arakune's neutral weaknesses being completely shored up with assists?!? Gross...):

Mike_Z said:
About whether you'd buy it if they made it a team game...if they don't fix unblockables in BB and they make it a team game, it'll be very abuseable.
 
Matty said:
They have obvious similarities, but they are much more different than Sol/Ragna's similarities.

So what do you think Ragna should need to make him more distinct from Sol, like have Ragna be a rekka-oriented character (since he has a rekka with his Inferno Divider and his Unlimited version has a rekka with his Dead Spike, and I was thinking that rekkas could go well with Ragna).

For a fun fact, if I were to translate Sol's health and damage values into BlazBlue verse, then Sol would have higher health (11,500 compared to Ragna's 10,000) and deal, on average, higher damage than Ragna.
 
Ragna's already pretty rekka oriented with all the follow-ups his attacks have
one more wouldn't really make a difference
 
Spencer said:
@Squire Grooktook @Mike_Z @Dime_x

First, Squire... try not to condescend with the "at your level" bullshit. If you'd like to get some SG games in, I'm down, and I'm sure you'll find me to be plenty decent.

Actually, I was talking specifically about Marvel Vs Capcom 2, even though the same concepts apply to Skullgirls.

I didn't mean to condescend, but it's true for both of us. Things like "defense is too strong" or "I hate zoning with assists" doesn't reflect anything but our specific weaknesses. High level play is a completely different beast in both games, and I've seen enough high level replays of both games to tell cheesy tactics like "hide behind a wall of assists" is far from the dominant tactic.

Just saying, "I know what I played" is not a valid argument for a fighting game or anything with a massive amount of depth. I've played Starcraft 1 and 2 quite a bit, but I don't claim to know what real high level gameplay is like in either.

Ps: One thing I've learned with fighters, is if you wanna test if something is as cheap or dominant as you think it is, try playing against a better player while using those tactics yourself. I learned very quickly that in MVC2 (and by extenstion SG) "hide behind assists and projectiles" will NOT be a get out of jail free card from rushdown against anyone who knows what they're doing.
 
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TechPowah said:
Give Ragna a fedora, and Sol a top hat

that doesn't change anything gameplay-wise

Ruin said:
Ragna's already pretty rekka oriented with all the follow-ups his attacks have
one more wouldn't really make a difference

Well, in my eyes, for an attack to qualify as a rekka, it needs to have more than one follow-up, and by that I mean "attack, then followup, then followup" not "attack, then more than one possible followup you can choose from and either will end the attack". I would not classify Sol's Volcanic Viper as rekka because it only has one follow-up and that's it. I would not classify Ragna's Hell's Fang as a rekka because it only has one follow-up and that's it (I would, however, classify Inferno Divider as one because it has a followup and after that followup two possible followups that you can choose from). If you want a good example of a rekka-oriented character, look up EX Kyo and Fei Long
 
OFF TOPIC AGAIN

Spencer said:
All that's very fair. I guess when I say "bullshit" I am referencing things that I feel should have a place in a game (unlike unblockables and infinites), which is not fair of me for sure. I am mostly just trying to capture what it is about 1v1 I prefer to MvC style team games... granting a hypothetical, the things that would make up the core differences between SG (a game that takes unblockables and infinites into account at its core) and it's 1v1 counterpart that also takes those into account (which I don't think exists).
My point was that your distinction between "1v1" and "MvC style" is NOT VALID for puppet characters, because those have "assist bullshit" in otherwise 1v1 games. And there are characters with slow projectiles that also have "assist bullshit" setups in 1v1 games, generally with the added bonus of the projectile being unable to get hit. So do you just ignore those characters entirely when talking about those games, or what?
And the extension to my point is that generally 1v1 games deal POORLY with those types of "bullshit", because the systems are not designed to accommodate what can be done with a controllable second hitbox, such as unblockables or not being able to hit the point character and the 'assist' on the same frame...so in GG/BB the "assist bullshit" is actually WORSE than it is in SG. It is less common because you can fight characters that don't have access to it, but when it comes up you have LESS recourse.

Spencer said:
In any case, the answer to the question as originally posed is probably best stated as "because I find them less fun"... is that less controversial?
Yep! Stating an opinion is fine, nobody can argue that - everyone has 'em, based on reality or imagination or whatever. Trying to defend your opinion as factual, or as based on some kind of fact when it isn't, is less fine. :^)

Capcom's JJBA game is "1v1", in your parlance, because you choose one character and it's 2/3 rounds. Yet most characters have a puppet, and the unblockables and left-right mixups are much less possible to defend against then they are in SG, and practical 100%s and infinites exist...and Skullgirls is "MvC style", even though it is possible to play solo vs solo. (You're actually far more likely to see a solo-solo match in Skullgirls than you are in JJBA, too, because of the relative tier placements of the assistless characters in JJBA.)

So I guess I'm trying to say your distinction is arbitrary and kinda meaningless to people who aren't you? :^P You're free to like something better or worse, but when you try to argue that what you like is based on facts, make sure it is. <3

Kongk4 said:
Let me help you with that if you don't mind...
I appreciate it, but that's a system bug, and doesn't have to do with either puppets or slow projectiles. I tried to ignore things that are just "the game is broken in some way unrelated to Spencer's point".
 
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OFF TOPIC RE: Puppet Characters and the Game Systems Who Were Not Designed For Them
Oh, man the Naruto games are bad. Like, they capture the feel of the show perfectly, and it's terrible. I didn't play any of the ones that were more wide open, but the early ones. Hoo. That Kankurou is a beast. He's the guy with the puppets in the series. The ninjas are always teleporting behind each other for surprise attacks, and the game attempts to emulate this. You can, at the press of a button, use some meter to teleport right behind your opponent or thereabouts. You can't block behind you, though. I guess that keeps the reward for that system in place. Cue cat and mouse nonsense. Kankuro (at least in CoN2) can sandwich the opponent between himself and his puppet rather easily, and then they're basically dead, because they just can't block both him and the puppet.
 
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Ok ease off on the derails now that kept starting and stopping since last page. This is a Blazblue topic. It's now getting off tangent [Not even about the hypothetical tag mode that this game may or may not get anymore] at this point with this many non Blazblue related posts in a short time. Either make a new separate topic about this somewhere else [I'm willing to move those OT posts into the new appropriate thread] or drop it now.

Anyway just came by to drop off this link I found in DL that gave a short/easy summary of what Naoto is since this character seems to be confusing a lot of non LN readers.

http://abyss-of-the-azure.tumblr.com/post/123969382693/naoto-kurogane

Also that character select screen has a ton of character select icon space left so I wouldn't be surprised if all that is filled up during the arcade, initial console release, and the inevitable extend version release.
 
Ok. I'm honestly, hopelessly, and utterly confused
What the fuck is Bloodedge Experience?
Is this like?
Sanctioned Fanfiction?
EVEN AFTER READING I'M STILL CONFUSED ABOUT RAQUEL ALUCARD
 
maybe it's the Rachel Alucard from the timeline where Biff gets the Almanac?
 
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Jutsei said:
Ok. I'm honestly, hopelessly, and utterly confused
What the fuck is Bloodedge Experience?
Is this like?
Sanctioned Fanfiction?
EVEN AFTER READING I'M STILL CONFUSED ABOUT RAQUEL ALUCARD

- BEE [Light Novel] is in the same vein as Remix Hearts [Manga] where it's apart of the expanded universe of Blazblue in media besides the original fighting game series. There is at least two Visual Novel games as well that takes place in the BB verse. In this case, a big prequel with Naoto as the main protagonist.

TBtotqj.jpg


- Raquel Alucard [above image far right] is the adopted daughter to Clavis Alucard of the Alucard Clan as opposed to a true daughter [Rachel]. Unlike Rachel she looks more like a teenager instead of a loli. Naoto/Raquel sort of have the same kind of relationship as Ragna/Rachel via both Alucards came to save them from death[I mean actual permanent death]/replacing arms in their time of need.

Edit: Anyway have a feeling this game will start pulling characters that originated from different Blazblue media [either as just mentioned cameo/references, NPCs, or even playables] since Remix Hearts being referenced in CP, further exposed in CPE, and of course now a playable BEE character in CF. I mean think up of new designs if you already got a treasure trove of them in the expanded media? You also get the added bonus of giving more incentive for the demographic who was apart of your expanded media to buy your game now.
 
I wonder...Is there going to be a young Valkenhayn costume maybe then? And maybe an alt playable version of Relius to match...I guess I'd doubt them doing that much for Relius, but they completely redid Noel, I could see them making a young Valkenhayn skin for this as well. That'd be pretty tight.
 
Yeah but Noel was the special snowflake because she is kind of one of the most popular ASW characters ever [only edged out by Ragna by a few hundred votes in the men division].
PJNLGnu.jpg
Both Valk/Relius were in the 20~ range in the Men division with 1/8th the votes compared to Noel. If they are gonna make alts when this game is still on sprites it would be paid dlc knowing ASW [like the Noel one] and it's likely priority to the more popular characters that will yield them the more suck- I mean consumers.
 
True. I'm wondering how they'd do a story mode for the two of them, then? More time travel shenanigans? It'd be interesting to see Valkenhayn and Relius' reactions to that.

Actually...hold on...How long ago was BEE? We're talking Ragna's ancestor and Rachel's old adopted sister, right? How old does that make Relius?
 
North888 said:
Actually...hold on...How long ago was BEE? We're talking Ragna's ancestor and Rachel's old adopted sister, right? How old does that make Relius?

I mean he floated around in the boundary for god knows how long. Given that Valk is 100-200 years old (can't quite remember) and Relius is still kickin', your answer would probably be "Pretty damn old"
 
BE takes place before Phase Shift and after XBlaze (XB took place about 50 years before the Dark War, right?). Relius is about 18 (and he's actually a decent human being here), in the first book Valkenhayn's not a butler yet, and Clavis is not in a wheelchair yet. I don't remember if a specific year was given or not.
 
It looks like Hibiki came straight out of Attack on Titan with that sword thing.
 
Footage from today's test stream for Friday's live stream. You get to hear the character select music which is pretty awesome (starts at about 1:27).

 
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I still prefer the Chronophantasma character select theme. This one has too much guitar.
I do prefer the way this one looks much better, though.
 
i look at that character select screen and all I can think this:
"That's a lot of empty space for more characters."

i can't wait for BBCF Extend.
 
Zazz said:
i look at that character select screen and all I can think this:
"That's a lot of empty space for more characters."

i can't wait for BBCF Extend.
That's probably just going to end up being DLC. Nine, for one, seems to be DLC.
I don't know who else they're going to add at this point. I really hate the light novels, but Mai from Remix Heart is the only person I can think of who might make it in.
Except for Jubei, of course
 
Nine is probably gonna be a time release character for the arcade
everyone else is either gonna be added into the console release or DLC/Extend fodder
that's what I think at least
 
Zazz said:
i look at that character select screen and all I can think this:
"That's a lot of empty space for more characters."

i can't wait for BBCF Extend.

A-01 or riot imho
 
Alpha-01 is supposed to be the Master Unit, right?
I can't imagine them not making her playable
especially since we definitely need more Murakumos
 
Ruin said:
Alpha-01 is supposed to be the Master Unit, right?
I can't imagine them not making her playable
especially since we definitely need more Murakumos
Yeah, You're right. Because we need rule 69 and someone who actually uses scythes in this game
VhYYTNY.jpg
 
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Holy moly another game already? Is BBCPEX even ported over here yet?

Look i'll be honest, a series of events and SG winding down made me have interest in playing Continuum Shift Extend again, but it really seems like they sold out hard after that. Between the 3 initial newcomers just being blatant fetish appeasement (Huge boobs, manly muscles and traps, woo!), the terrible character art compared to CS, the mechanics changes and all the expanded universe manga stuff messing with the main story really put me off from the series for a while. The main reason however was because i knew i would have to wait forever for the definitive Extend version with all the characters to be ported over (and it just has a month ago, so i did have to wait forever). So now i have to buy CPEX, see if it's any good, and wait for the definitive EX version of this, which actually does look a lot better than CP, to be ported?

Aaaaaagh!
 
hey, Amane is not a trap.
he is just a god damned beautiful sommabitch and he don't need to dress by your rules.

also, Bullet's appeal isn't her boobs.
it's butt floss, and thighs.
 
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Amane is the most beautiful, everyone else is peasants, etc, etc
 
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Amane is only visible because he feels you are worthy to look at his beauty.
and everyone is worthy because that is how abundant Amane's kindness is.
 
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Cheesedragon said:
Holy moly another game already? Is BBCPEX even ported over here yet?
BBCPE came out a few weeks ago.

You have a year before CF even gets to US/EU. You've got time.

Edit(s): I've always found BlazBlue to be too much on the "so much of a parody it's become an entry" side of things, when it comes to it's setting and characters. I've found that if you don't take it for what it is, you're going to have a terrible time-- I did for a while.

As for purchasing extra content? Characters are $7~ a pop, that's slightly measly for how much they may or may not change the game (to me).

As for re-releases? As long as they come a year in-between, it sucks, but at least it's only been.. well... a year? Assuming the game is fine, I should have gotten like, Assuming I get 8 hrs of playtime a week, 416hrs of time, or 312hrs if you take off a quarter, which is 5.2hrs per dollar.

Although I didn't buy anything past CSE so there's that!
 
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Midiman said:
BBCPE came out a few weeks ago.

Edit(s): I've always found BlazBlue to be too much on the "so much of a parody it's become an entry" side of things, when it comes to it's setting and characters. I've found that if you don't take it for what it is, you're going to have a terrible time-- I did for a while.

Yeah, i pretty much try to accept games for what they are, but how is BlazBlue a parody? I'll admit things got kinda tongue in cheek after the first entry, but CT was rather serious and dark.

Midiman said:
Although I didn't buy anything past CSE so there's that!

Yeah, me neither, not yet anyway. I'm glad you addressed everything else but what about my complaints about CP that put me off from it?
 
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