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Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night

shoryusatsu999 said:
Wow, Bloodstained is doing well. It's already passed the $1,850,000 mark. I wouldn't be surprised if it hits 2 million before the day is out.

Speaking of 'vanias, I've never really gotten into the series before, but for some reason, Bloodstained just makes me want to go grab one or two of the Metroidvanias and blaze through them. Is anyone else here like that?

I personally feel the DS trilogy is the best, featuring the best pacing and difficulty balance, but SOTN is still interesting due to the absolutely staggeringly beautiful environmental art and host of obscure (sometimes inconsequential) secrets.

Although I don't think it's as good gameplay wise, if you plan on starting the DS trilogy with DAwn of Sorrow, I recommend playing Aria of Sorrow on GBA first. Has a really cool story twist, and Dawn will spoil that in the opening, heheh.

Ktulu Victoria said:
I've seen gameplay and haven't been impressed. The level design is bland to me. That's personal opinion, though.

Aesthetically, or gameplay wise? Was this recent footage or old stuff?

AdenPhoenix said:
The way the stretch goals work and the achievement system seem kind of gross to me, I would really like a new Castlevania game but the way this Kickstarter is set up makes me want to stay away for now. Does anyone else feel this way?

I'm fine with everything but the stretch goals. They don't have anything to show, at the moment, but I'm used to the days of seeing a few awesome bits of concept art for a game 2 years away in a magazine, and getting hyped from there.

I'm not super hyped. None of the Igavania's were masterpieces in terms of level design, but they were all solid-excellent and well paced adventures. I look forward to what I'm sure will be another solid to excellent romp through a sub-genre that I mildly enjoy with top notch music.

Only thing I'm debating is whether I'll just plunk down the 15 bucks or so for digital (pretty inconsequential, I remember when gba games I'd beat in a day cost 30 bucks, not to mention I buy less games these days) or go for physical (even if the game is just decent at best, the artwork and owning a little piece of history to display is tempting...)


Anyway, I think the stretch goals might be a result of them hitting the funded mark way earlier than they expected. I mean 1 mil before the first day is even over? Holy shit.
 
Aria of Sorrow is one of the GBA games, yeah? I believe its on the Wii U eshop, right?
 
also, play Dawn of Sorrow.
because more Soma is good for the soul.
the art is NOT bad! SHUT THE FUCK UP MATT AND LIAM!
DON'T CRITICIZE MY FIRST CASTLEVANIA I OWNED!
 
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Heheh, I won't argue, but I certainly prefer Ayame Kojima's art, or the artist for Eclessia.

From the more traditional exploration based approach, DOS is out and out best IMO. Portrait and Eclessa sway things a bit more towards linear paths and combat, and on that front Eclessia is a joy to play with its new combo mechanics and more refined challenge.

Also if you do play Aria, just make sure you see the true ending. It's a bit annoying figuring out for the first time, moreso than the comparatively streamlined Upside Down Castle unlock in SOTN.
 
I don't mind that people don't like the anime artstyle.
I liked it, and I felt it was something I never saw in games at the time.
it was like you were playing a game adapted from an anime IMO.
 
Haven't played IGA games beyond Dawn of Sorrow and now almost done with Aria, I see Ecclesia recommended a lot, what's so special about it?

shoryusatsu999 said:
Speaking of 'vanias, I've never really gotten into the series before, but for some reason, Bloodstained just makes me want to go grab one or two of the Metroidvanias and blaze through them. Is anyone else here like that?
I had played the pre-Metroid stuff as well as Symphony of the Night and Dawn of Sorrow, this got me to go pick up the GBA games though, having a blast with Aria right now, thinking of trying Ecclesia next.

North888 said:
Aria of Sorrow is one of the GBA games, yeah? I believe its on the Wii U eshop, right?
Yes and yes, seconding the recommendation.

Squire Grooktook said:
Anyway, I think the stretch goals might be a result of them hitting the funded mark way earlier than they expected. I mean 1 mil before the first day is even over? Holy shit.
I don't know, they had all the achievement stuff and funded art ready to go. It's definitely at least a weird situation.

I mean, I expect this game to be at least solid and have a good soundtrack, as said I'm just not sure that putting down a pre-order this early before we know nearly anything is the best idea, I'm probably going to do it though because I like physical copies.

I some how didn't mention that I think the art is pretty not great, probably because my point was about the way the kickstarter itself is being run, but yeah, that counts a bit against it for me, I know Kojima was busy, but this is just... Anime, with nothing really standing out yet. Then again, they cited Xrd as what they want in terms of visual presentation for the game, that could be pretty great.
 
AdenPhoenix said:
Haven't played IGA games beyond Dawn of Sorrow and now almost done with Aria, I see Ecclesia recommended a lot, what's so special about it?.

Well, one of the guy who helmed all the old Contra games lent a hand with designing it IIRC, and it's definitely apparent in the games (much superior) boss fights.

Beyond that, Eclessia just made the hack and slash action a bit more involved. They let you hold two weapons at once now, one on each button, and you can chain from one attack to the other for bigger damage attack strings, as well as combine them for a dual attack which varies depending on what combination you have equipped. There are also some fun gimmick abilities tossed in for variety, like the magnet ability or the late game limited flight.

Combine that with the more challenging basic enemies and bosses and you have a game that just feels a lot better to blaze and slash through. It also has a unique twist on the structure of the game (first half of the game leading up to the obligatory bad end has a more linear structure, similar to the older games, but the true ending path unlocks a massive Dracula Castle to explore in more Igavania style, with a very satisfying bump up in difficulty).

The atmosphere, art, and music are all lovely too. Perhaps the strongest of the Igavania's after SOTN. Has some very likable characters as well.

Also Through Sorrow's Fucking Distortion.

AdenPhoenix said:
just not sure that putting down a pre-order this early before we know nearly anything is the best idea,

I will be genuinely surprised if it's not an at least decent game. Plus it'll have Michiru Yamane's music. I don't see a ton of risk honestly.

AdenPhoenix said:
I know Kojima was busy, but this is just... Anime, with nothing really standing out yet.

Disagree on that front. I personally think the art and "crystal skin" motif is just gorgeous. If Miriam had a typical same-face look, I'd agree. But the character art has a degree of personality and detail (especially Miriam's face <3) that looks to me like a nice compromise between Ayame's style and something more anime-ish. I'm definitely impressed by the art we've seen so far.

The big question is, will the actual gameplay looks like shit? I'm not sure I have confidence that a project like this could deliver charismatic 3d visuals on par with Xrd. Then again, even older anime styled 3d games have looked pretty good in the past (any PS2 Shin Megami Tensei, Battle Fantasia, etc.), but I'd still be more comfortable if I found out that at least the characters will be sprites.
 
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Squire Grooktook said:
They let you hold two weapons at once now, one on each button
I thought it was rather odd that feature was in Symphony but not in any of the later ones I've played.

You certainly sold me on the game, thank you, can't wait to start it.
 
AdenPhoenix said:
I thought it was rather odd that feature was in Symphony but not in any of the later ones I've played.

You certainly sold me on the game, thank you, can't wait to start it.

Good to hear, plus I ninja edited in some responses to the rest I missed lol. Sorry I was a bit slow.
 
Squire Grooktook said:
Disagree on that front. I personally think the art and "crystal skin" motif is just gorgeous. If Miriam had a typical same-face look, I'd agree. But the character art has a degree of personality and detail that looks to me like a nice compromise between Ayame's style and something more anime-ish. I'm definitely impressed by the art we've seen so far.
The face is the only part of the art I like, I'll give you that. I just said I don't like the art very much thus far, it's just how I feel, I did note at the end that since the game is 2.5D anyway, anime for Xrd, it could easily look better just by being fleshed out in 3D. As said, I'm probably going to throw enough for the physical version in because I doubt this will be anything worse than solid.
 
Yeah. As much as I enjoy the audiovisuals in the post SOTN Castlevania's all Castlevnia's, what'll really make or break this is how Inti Creates handles the gameplay.

I was a little disappointed in their recent effort for Azure Striker Gunvolt. Didn't like it at first, but when I realized the scoring system is basically screaming at you "PLEASE SPEED RUN ME!!!" I started to appreciate it a bit more. It still felt a bit drab level design wise, but I can blame missteps on the attempt to create a new franchise with a completely new playstyle (the aforementioned speed running score chase).

Hopefully since they're just making a straight up SOTN clone, we won't see the catastrophic mishandling of the formula that the original Mega Man Zx was. Man that game's progression was convoluted, but I can blame attempting to shoehorn Mega Man ideas into a metroidvania for that (linear stages + select-able mission structure, etc).
 
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here's what I want.
don't intentionally cater to speedrunners.
that's all I ask.
leave enough room for speedruns.
don't make it the focus.
because I am sick of MN9 dash porn.
fucking disgusted even.
 
I hope Miriam gets a forward dash that looks like she's backdashing
 
I hope that they (un)intentionally make dash cancelling super hard/needs a bot to do it to help do it.
that's when you know they know what's up.
 
SanoBaron said:
here's what I want.
don't intentionally cater to speedrunners.
that's all I ask.
leave enough room for speedruns.
don't make it the focus.
because I am sick of MN9 dash porn.
fucking disgusted even.

IMO you can "cater" to speed running without interfering with other parts of the game.

For example, I fucking love RNG. I love dodging unpredictable patterns. But speedrunners tend to hate it because it makes their mission luck based.

There's really a simple solution. Just put rng in sections where it won't cause the speed of the situation to vary (ie boss pulls back and shoots a random pattern, and you can't even hit him while he does it), or balance all possible patterns so that if optimally reacted to, they'll give you the same time.

SanoBaron said:
I hope that they (un)intentionally make dash cancelling super hard/needs a bot to do it to help do it.
that's when you know they know what's up.

Or they could just make whatever dash mechanic they go with not over powered or dumb. Why worry about execution barriers when there's nothing broken to abuse with them in the first place?

If this game's movement was a combination of Mega Man Zero and Sotn, I might cry tears of joy.
 
just make it like super metroid.
you have a very solid regular movespeed from the start
add in a metroidvania backdash for defensives
and maybe give a super metroid powerup like an unstoppable run.
that'd be my ideal castlevania.
 
Well since we're on wishlists, this is what I want:

1: Make it so you can attack while moving on the ground. Jumping attacks being overwhelmingly better for both offense and defense is one of the biggest problems with the Igavania's imo. Being locked in place while attacking makes sense for the Classicvania's, because they were all about the strict punishes and offensive/defensive footsies game, and jumping attacks had limitations and risks of their own due to the jump physics. But the Igavania's more acrobatic controls and enemy patterns would just feel better if you were able to do run by slashes, plus being able to move while attacking mid air just makes jump attacks needlessly better. I see no reason for grounded attacks to be so limited and clunky when you have so much aerial control.

2: Please put in actual environmental hazards and platforming instead of just rectangular rooms full of tanky enemies (the other biggest consistent problem with Iga's games). Rogue Legacy proved this was 100% possible and fun in an exploration focused game.

3: Sort of a pipe dream, but take a page from Demon's/Dark Souls and put a fairly lengthy amount of time between each checkpoint. Keep the excitement and tension high. On that note, if the difficulty balance takes a page from Order of Eclessia overall, I'll be good.

4: Agree about the slightly faster normal move speed.

5: Look to Eclessia and Dawn for power up inspirations. Stuff like Floating Armor, Magnus, the Flight Glyph, Black Panther Soul, etc. Bring on the fun movement mechanic abilities.

6: Make the bosses rng-ish and unpredictable instead of boring pattern memorization fests. I want this for every game ever.
 
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also, I really hope it will be 2D sprites on 3D planes.
those always looked so great to me and unreal engine could make some great environments for sprites to interact with.
just look at Xrd and how well all that blends.
 
SanoBaron said:
also, I really hope it will be 2D sprites on 3D planes.
those always looked so great to me and unreal engine could make some great environments for sprites to interact with.
just look at Xrd and how well all that blends.
Xrd is 3d everything, though.
 
SanoBaron said:
just look at Xrd and how well all that blends
I don't know why people keep saying this today, it's weird, Xrd is 3D models. The characters and moves are not sprites. That's why this is 2.5D and mentions Xrd as an inspiration.
 
Mike_Z said:
They make a big point of swinging the camera around after every KO...

I'll admit, when I first saw the first trailer, the models looked so good that I still wasn't sure if it was hand drawn animation or not after the first spin around.
 
Squire Grooktook said:
I'll admit, when I first saw the first trailer, the models looked so good that I still wasn't sure if it was hand drawn animation or not after the first spin around.
The Youtube mangling actually makes them look better; in person in 1080p you see all kinds of polygon edges and stuff.
They are amazing, but when you really look there's no way you mistake it for 2D.

Back on topic, Inti Creates is not going to pull that level of anything.
 
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Mike_Z said:
Back on topic, Inti Creates is not going to pull that level of anything.

Agreed, don't see something like Xrd coming out of anyone like Inti for awhile.

That being said, I think they have options for decent visuals. A sprite/3d background mix could work. Even all models could work if it looked as decent as say, Battle Fantasia.

I just hope they still have the same skill crafting 2d action gameplay as they did when Mega Man Zero was being pumped out. Gunvolt was slightly disappointing, but I wouldn't discount their ability to make a fun action game on that alone.
 
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wait I thought 2.5D is when everything is 3D but viewed from a 2D plane like Xrd, or is it like Portrait Of Ruin with 3D things while the main character is a 2D sprite?
 
Arcana said:
wait I thought 2.5D is when everything is 3D but viewed from a 2D plane like Xrd, or is it like Portrait Of Ruin with 3D things while the main character is a 2D sprite?
2.5d generally means 2d gameplay with some 3d graphical elements. It doesn't necessarily mean they don't mix sprites in either. Klonoa is one of the most notable and earliest 2.5d games, and most of the characters are sprites (in the first game, at least).
 
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SanoBaron said:
in my defense, I really forgot the models were 3D.
and also I am a bit of a big idiot, soooo yeah...
I know a very pretty game with 3D backgrounds and 2D sprites, I know it's a game you play.

Mike_Z said:
Inti Creates is not going to pull that level of anything.
I don't think anyone expects them to, I'm just hoping the art style works well in 3D, they said they're aiming at Xrd-like, I hope whatever the result is looks decent.
 
AdenPhoenix said:
I know a very pretty game with 3D backgrounds and 2D sprites, I know it's a game you play.
It is also referred to as "2D". :^P

Squire Grooktook said:
2.5d generally means 2d gameplay with some 3d graphical elements. It doesn't necessarily mean they don't mix sprites in either. Klonoa is one of the most notable and earliest 2.5d games, and most of the characters are sprites (in the first game, at least).
Klonoa was sprites because back then sprite were the EASIER (and better looking) way of doing fully animated characters. That's not the case anymore. 2.5D now usually means "fixed-camera 3D".

Sprites are MORE work, which means MORE money and time, for LESS flexibility. You can't do costumes, which means no DLC, which ("90% outside funded" by people who want profit) by itself probably secures it as 3D.
You can hope all you want, without gameplay footage - just remember reality exists. Mighty No. 9 could have been sprites, and arguably would've looked better for it, but it isn't for those same reasons.
 
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Mike_Z said:
It is also referred to as "2D". :^P

Yes but he specifically phrased it as "sprites on a 3D plane" earlier.
 
Honestly, when I think of what a hi-def SOTN would look like, I think of something Vanillaware would do, not really Xrd. It's a shame, because I think Inticreates could pull off that look if they really went for it.

But yeah, there's no way Iga's team is going to achieve Xrd's style if their criteria involves cutting corners. Eventually they'll just have to settle on a look that they like, and admit that shaders alone won't make everyone happy. If they can manage a cohesive look with the 3D models, similar to Trine 2 or something, maybe it could turn out all right.

Actually, if most of the enemies are composed of stained glass pieces, the dynamic lighting on them could be pretty interesting. That might be a nice excuse for them to highlight the characters from the BG without making it feel forced. I'd still love to see them achieve this stuff using 2D sprites, like Skullgirls did, but oh well.
 
KaboomKid said:
Honestly, when I think of what a hi-def SOTN would look like, I think of something Vanillaware would do, not really Xrd. It's a shame, because I think Inticreates could pull off that look if they really went for it.

Both Mega Man Zx games were beautiful. I would have loved something like that.

Alas, sadly I can't argue with what Mike said. Unless someone on the team is just really adamant about going for sprite art (would be a dream come true if this is what Iga's overseeing brought to the project), I can agree it won't be likely to happen. Won't be holding my breath, at any rate.

Best I'd hope for from 3d graphics is maybe something that looks as charming as Battle Fantasia. Pale Gothic character designs looked lovely in the PS2 era Shin Megami Tensei games (particularly Nocturne and Digital Devil Saga) too.
 
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KaboomKid said:
Honestly, when I think of what a hi-def SOTN would look like, I think of something Vanillaware would do,
yo, don't say stuff like that cuz it just gets my hopes up for a George Kamitani designed Castlevania.
 
Can we talk about Bloodlines?

Maybe it's just the genesis fanboy in me but there is something about this one that I really like. I think the soundtrack is really good too! Probably my second or third favorite (after Aria of Sorrow and CV1). Plus the boss fights are pretty good compared to most of the earlier castlevania games.

Terrible as it is, CV64 has an atmosphere and universe I really like. It's super engaging until you encounter this fellow.

latest

Man they really had it going and the spoil it all by a skeleton on a motorcycle.
 
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