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2D Fighting Newb

ToyDingo

ToyDingo

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BrodiMAN
Ms. Fortune Ms. Fortune Ms. Fortune
Hi all,

I'm not a newb to fighting games, but I am a newb to 2D fighters. I'm a veteran of Virtua Fighter, Soul Calibure, and Tekken. But I suck massively at Street Fighters, KoF, and Skullgirls.

Any tips for making the transition over to 2D? What are general things to look out for? What the hell is a "cross up"? etc etc etc...

I know this is a very general topic, but I'm not even sure of the right questions to ask.

Thanks...
 
Did you go through the SG tutorial? There are a lot of the 2d basics there. That's a good place to start.
Cross up is when you jump over an enemy with an attack forcing them to change block direction. Most blatant example of this is SG is Parasoul's jumping back+lk. That only hits backward.

The mixup in that is if you jump on top of them so neither of you really knows which way to block. You can see the center of the characters with advanced Hitboxes on in Training mode.

ps I need VF5 tips.
 
Thanks for the reply.

Yes I went through the tutorial which is really really good. One of the best tutorials in a fighting game since the training mode in VF4Evo.

Still applying that stuff is very difficult if you aren't aware of the mechanics of 2D fighters. And the tutorial doesn't do a great job of explaining "how" to play the game. It does a GREAT job of explaining the mechanics, but not the strategies. Perhaps it wasn't attempting to do that.

A main question I have is how do I start my offense? I played a Squigly player today who had Parasol as an assist. I couldn't get near the guy. And when I did, I ate a 30 hit combo everytime.

That's my question...if that makes sense :(

Also, if you want to know how to play VF, add me on PSN (BrodiMAN) or visit virtuafighter.com...
 
Depends on the character you're playing and whether or not you're on a team. If you're going solo, well, it depends on your character. If you're using a team, it might be a good idea to try to countercall an assist when you see them use their own.

Out of curiosity, what was the Squigly assist?
 
Nap1400 said:
Depends on the character you're playing and whether or not you're on a team. If you're going solo, well, it depends on your character. If you're using a team, it might be a good idea to try to countercall an assist when you see them use their own.

Out of curiosity, what was the Squigly assist?

Squigly was the main, Parasol was the assist. I don't remember the name of it, but it was the one where Parasol would jump in, and slam her umbrella on the ground and a big splash would come up, preventing me from getting close to Squigly as she jumped backwards and continued to pressure me with ranged attacks.

Also, I'm usually a solo player, I could never get a handle on the games that used teams/assist.

2D fighters don't make sense to me :(
 
Ah, Napalm Pillar. That's a DP assist, one of the most common types of assists you're going to see in this game. It's invincible during the startup, so you can't hit her out of it before she attacks.

The best way to deal with it is to bait it out. There's a period of time right after she uses the assist that she's vulnerable to your attacks, so if you anticipate when she comes out, you can block it and punish her. If you have an assist of your own, wait for her to use the Pillar and call your own assist to cover yourself in case Squigly tries to attack you while you punish the assist.
 
In 2d games traditionally there is something called "footsies". Footsies is a poking to gain advantage.
Usually a character has a range at which she has an advantage at over another.

IE Parasoul vs Fillia: Parasoul wants to keep Fillia at the tip of her umbrella moves since at that range every normal Parasoul uses beats Fillia's. Parasoul wants to keep this up until she can land a hit confirm into a combo (something like lp,mp,hp,hp). Fillia on the other hand is trying to get inside Parasoul's umbrella range once there she can use her short but +frames on block moves clp is +6, clk + too but don't remember exactly.

Fillia will do this by trying to punish a wrong move by Parasoul. If Parasoul gets in the habit of throwing napalm shot at a certain range or situation. Then Fillia can guess that and jump over or slide under the shot to start her offense. Fillia can also try to bait and whiff punish by dashing in and out of Parsoul's range.

Assists kind of blow all that up but should be thought of another extension to it. They are just extra moves for the point character. If Fillia has Double Butt assist then her range and options for attack go up exponentially. She can call Double outside Parasoul's normal's range forcing Parasoul into defense.

Most offense in SG is started by throw out an assist as a poke. If Double Butt assist hits try to hit confirm off it or try to gain a positional advantage. A counter to that is calling an assist in defense, ie Napalm pillar, to punish.

As a solo (don't play solo it sucks) you have to be very defensive. Try to bait out the assist by jumping in while blocking. If you play fortune like your tag says use your air mobility to dance and bait out bad moves from the opponent. And watch @KhaosMuffins Fortune guide.

Does this help or make any sense? I don't know anymore.
Do you have more specific questions?
 
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.42. said:
In 2d games traditionally there is something called "footsies". Footsies is a poking to gain advantage.
Usually a character has a range at which she has an advantage at over another.

IE Parasoul vs Fillia: Parasoul wants to keep Fillia at the tip of her umbrella moves since at that range every normal Parasoul uses beats Fillia's. Parasoul wants to keep this up until she can land a hit confirm into a combo (something like lp,mp,hp,hp). Fillia on the other hand is trying to get inside Parasoul's umbrella range once there she can use her short but +frames on block moves clp is +6, clk + too but don't remember exactly.

Fillia will do this by trying to punish a wrong move by Parasoul. If Parasoul gets in the habit of throwing napalm shot at a certain range or situation. Then Fillia can guess that and jump over or slide under the shot to start her offense. Fillia can also try to bait and whiff punish by dashing in and out of Parsoul's range.

Assists kind of blow all that up but should be thought of another extension to it. They are just extra moves for the point character. If Fillia has Double Butt assist then her range and options for attack go up exponentially. She can call Double outside Parasoul's normal's range forcing Parasoul into defense.

Most offense in SG is started by throw out an assist as a poke. If Double Butt assist hits try to hit confirm off it or try to gain a positional advantage. A counter to that is calling an assist in defense, ie Napalm pillar, to punish.

As a solo (don't play solo it sucks) you have to be very defensive. Try to bait out the assist by jumping in while blocking. If you play fortune like your tag says use your air mobility to dance and bait out bad moves from the opponent. And watch @KhaosMuffins Fortune guide.

Does this help or make any sense? I don't know anymore.
Do you have more specific questions?

That helps alot dude, atleast gives me something to work on. As a solo player I'm playing defense 90% of the time. I guess I need to learn when I can and cannot get a hit in. Just some of the combinations of characters seem like an impenetrable wall of.......stuff.....

I'll try it out, and thanks for the vid.
 
Here's my advice concerning this game:

Don't play solo. (I've played solo since this game's release. It isn't a good idea.)

And.... that's pretty much it.
Also, if you ever want an online training mate, hit me up.
 
Try picking an assist. A lot of people have ass second assist characters that they hope they never have to use. In mvc2 the best assist characters were crap on point. In this game all characters are good.

Try Fillia as an assist she is pretty easy to use on point anyway too.
 
Anyway, as for the whole footsies thing, basically it all boils down to this: Nothing is safe.

Fighting games aren't like shmups or 3d character action games (Bayonetta, etc.) where you can basically dodge everything on reaction. Almost every thing you can do or not do in a fighter is punishable in some way. If you keep that in mind, you may have an easier time understanding how approaching your opponent works. Try to find the most effective (probable to succeed) tactics but remember don't get too caught up in "playing safe" as pretty much everything is a gamble.

For more stuff on footsies: http://sonichurricane.com/?page_id=1702
 
Pushblock... like... a lot. Its really important in this game, especially if you don't have an asssist to help your defenses.
 
Lots of good info in this thread.

Thanks guys. Also, 42 I accepted your invite on PSN, we should get some practice in one day :D
 
It really depends on the game you're trying to learn, however the tutorial section in SG will help you greatly.
 
ToyDingo said:
Lots of good info in this thread.

Thanks guys. Also, 42 I accepted your invite on PSN, we should get some practice in one day :D
Whenever you see me online.
 
What are your best practices to successfully land a hit confirm to start a combo (while avoiding being in the receiving end)? I'm using Peacock and it's difficult to land a hit confirm with her short-ranged fast normals. She appears to be beaten out at all times when up close. Big Band has short-ranged fast normals as well, so I think I'll also have a hard time using him.

I know that Peacock is meant to be a zoner, but I seem to enjoy her more when used in close quarters.
 
MaverickHunterX said:
What are your best practices to successfully land a hit confirm to start a combo (while avoiding being in the receiving end)? I'm using Peacock and it's difficult to land a hit confirm with her short-ranged fast normals. She appears to be beaten out at all times when up close. Big Band has short-ranged fast normals as well, so I think I'll also have a hard time using him.

I know that Peacock is meant to be a zoner, but I seem to enjoy her more when used in close quarters.
You could try setting the training dummy to random blocking and just try your hit confirms like that. Or just play arcade mode focus on hitting hit confirms.
 
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NUMBER ONE IMPORTANT DIFFERENCE BETWEEN 3D FIGHTERS AND 2D FIGHTERS

3D fighters are primarily about frames, and risk-reward in regard to what move you're going to do next. Most attacks are going to put you at negatives. Being put at significant negatives means nitaku, or even punishment. There's a lot of taking turns, and games tend to be based on making the correct read at every opportunity.

2D fighters are primarily about spacing, pushing the opponent to the corner or some equally horrifying situation, and shitting all over them with your gamut of mixup options. Some attacks are negative, but for the most part you are going to want to stick your opponent in negatives by using plus on block attacks like Jump-in attacks, and then laying on the pressure and mixups.
 
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