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Allow Valentine's lvl2 to work with burst baits?

ashxu

ashxu

its time to ape
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ashzu
Valentine Big Band Fukua
As of now if you do her lvl2 and predict a burst bait, the lvl2 will activate however it won't do anything to the person bursting out. My suggestion is to allow the lvl2 to successfully connect with the enemy because I can't really see much use for the Super. It costs two bars and is pretty situational right now due to how much of a gamble it is to pull off. Using it for burst baits is a lot more reliable in my opinion.
 
does the burst count as a hit?
I think it's an interesting idea, but why not just do a combo in the meantime?
Plus it's a counter, so it better as a punish for slow moves and Double's car.
And I'm pretty sure you can pbgc it during multihit moves
 
wouldnt the attack work if a poison is loaded?
 
the counter super works in a way kinda like super armor, where you take the hit for no damage. If you turn on the hitstun bar in training, you'll realize that hit stun still occurs (albeit shortly) on Val while the counter animation goes on. So, currently when trying to use it for burst baits, you spend 2 meters, the opponent becomes invincible and is able to block, and thus the freezing/lvl3 vial injection doesn't connect. And if you had a vial it was wasted. Lame.

Considering how valuable 2 bars are and how hard you have to read when the opponent is going to burst, I agree that the counter super should work as a burst bait. Though making that work would technically make it an exception to the burst bait rules.
 
Fedora_Ninja said:
Though making that work would technically make it an exception to the burst bait rules.
Well as far as I know bending the rules isn't exactly something out of the question.

Cerebella's Grab Bag can be teched and as far as I know command throws as a general rule can't be teched?
 
Technically it's grabbing bella before the startup of Grab Bag. Since Bella input a throw for the grab bag command, she techs the opponent's air throw.
 
- Grab Bag can indeed be teched, because otherwise she'd get a guaranteed full-damage command grab on characters without an air super available, since Grab Bag is continually active so you'd need a reversal 1f-throw-invincible move to escape it.
- Val's counter won't work on bursts because the point of a burst is to ESCAPE. The entire point of a counter super is to be situationally useful but extremely useful in those situations. It's already the only thing that can beat Car, etc. (And because it would be an incredibly easy way to set up a burst bait since there are at least a few situations you can put them in where the hitstun is long enough that if they aren't bursting you can combo after the counter's failed stance...)
 
Mike_Z said:
- Grab Bag can indeed be teched

Well then. Nevermind my blabbering. I'll be off in training mode countering cars now.
 
I never knew her counter super worked on Double's car.

But if you can counter it, why not just block and punish? why use her lvl2?
 
ashxu said:
I never knew her counter super worked on Double's car.

But if you can counter it, why not just block and punish? why use her lvl2?

I can think of a few reasons. Blocking gives them a chance to DHC into something safe. Or more chip damage which may kill you. Or the car itself could chip you out. Also if you have a poison vile loaded you can get a lot of damage for those two bars you just spent. I'm sure the other viles could be of good use too.
 
ashxu said:
I never knew her counter super worked on Double's car.

But if you can counter it, why not just block and punish? why use her lvl2?
Say you pushed a button, a button that would be punished by car. Do a counter and now Double is punished instead.
 
Bit_Strife said:
I can think of a few reasons. Blocking gives them a chance to DHC into something safe. Or more chip damage which may kill you. Or the car itself could chip you out. Also if you have a poison vile loaded you can get a lot of damage for those two bars you just spent. I'm sure the other viles could be of good use too.
I can see avoiding the car and moving towards the corner to set up double as being a use for the reversal since she can't do anything for a small period of time after the super (32 frames or about 1/2 second) and she always appears in front. Also, you are talking using countervenom on the car, you may wanna double (:PUN:) check that since if car is invincible, wouldn't it avoid getting hit? Can't check myself currently, am at work.
 
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Broseidon Rex said:
Also, you are talking using countervenom on the car, you may wanna double (:PUN:) check that since if car is invincible, wouldn't it avoid getting hit? Can't check myself currently, am at work.

Counter makes everything un-invincible. When Val was first shown, it was demonstrated on Filia's DP.
 
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Broseidon Rex said:
I can see avoiding the car and moving towards the corner to set up double as being a use for the reversal since she can't do anything for a small period of time after the super (32 frames or about 1/2 second) and she always appears in front. Also, you are talking using countervenom on the car, you may wanna double (:PUN:) check that since if car is invincible, wouldn't it avoid getting hit? Can't check myself currently, am at work.


Ten points for the pun.

I did check and it all works fine. There supers where that's a bit of an issue, but not for car.
 
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