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Cartoon General Discussion

Night Phyre said:
My wife actually really likes the voice over in B&P, she says it feels less, "voice actor-y." I don't know if I want every show to go that route, but I like how it works for this show.
Yeah I see what you mean. I just get weirded out because I've never heard anyone say "Cash" like that before.
 
Just saw The Legend of Korra Season 2 premiere and I LOVED it. I will say Mako needs some work with his character development, but I feel in due time he will be a bad@$$ character.
 
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Jutsei said:
Legend of Korra Season 2's premiere was graet.
Korra season 2 has some good and bad parts:
- korra seemed like a mean jerk to everyone
- bolin is pretty great
- that new business guy is awesome
- creepy twins are hilarious. but still creepy
- uncle obvious villain is most obvious villain

i hope episode 3 is better, but damn, korra could be a bit nicer to her dad. her dad is awesome.
 
I think I should stop reading this thread until I start watching Korra.

Unwatched Thread. For now.
 
Vadsamoht said:
Yeah, sorry. I'm not trying to say that Cartoons=Anime - This is how the section was before SH went down and it keeps things a little neater because people were posting separate threads for individual cartoons before.
Well technically speaking all cartoons are anime, but not all anime is cartoons. Let me explain if you consider the literal meaning of anime (animation) then yes cartoons=anime. But as anime as taken a different definition for it self (animated in Japan for a Japanese audience) then all cartoons=/=anime (with a few exceptions arguably). :P
 
TheGoggledGamer said:
Well technically speaking all cartoons are anime, but not all anime is cartoons. Let me explain if you consider the literal meaning of anime (animation) then yes cartoons=anime. But as anime as taken a different definition for it self (animated in Japan for a Japanese audience) then all cartoons=/=anime (with a few exceptions arguably). :P
I don't think that's right, saying that all cartoons are anime is like saying that all martial arts is Boxing.
Anime doesn't literally mean animation, it is in fact "animated in Japan for a Japanese audience." At least that is todays definition of it, and how a word is used today by the people is it's true meaning.
 
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Anime are cartoons. I'm comfortable with watching cartoons. I love 'em. Venture Bros, Metalocalypse, Samurai Champloo, Abenobashi, Aeon Flux, Adventure Time, etc.

People need to get over themselves and just be ok with watching cartoons instead of trying to make the argument that Anime is somehow above that.
 
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Venture bros, Lucky Star, Azumanga Daioh, Regular Show, Adventure Time, Legend of Korra, Avatar the last airbender, Full metal alchemist etc. I have a lot of favorites
 
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Time to continue on with another favorite show of mine.

Freakazoid was an instant hit, but it was short lived and only lasted 2 seasons. The show centers around Dexter Douglas, a typical teenage nerd who one night logs onto his computer and is thrown into the internet where he becomes the craziest, weirdest, and yet the funniest hero ever, Freakazoid! Freakazoid battles villains and saves the world so the story is not complex, but is executed in an interesting way.

The stories all have interesting villains that are unique and are hilarious. Freakazoid himself is just random and hilarious and has great superpowers as well that come from cyberspace. he always makes jokes that will never fail to amuse anyone at all. The artwork and animation look excellent. Characters are drawn uniquely, and the same animation is never used.

The humor in this show is some of the best I have ever seen and is guaranteed to make you laugh until your sides hurt. Everything about Freakazoid is done perfectly. The characters are unique and funny, Freakazoid is a unique and awesome hero, and the humor will never fail to impress.

 
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Steven Spielberg was/is a genius there is no doubting that. It's a shame that Freakazoid wasn't as popular as it should of been as it had the perfect mixture of mature humor, childish humor, stupid humor, and smart humor.
In my opinion the pinnacle of cartoons was at the late 80's to late 90's (bleeding over a little to 00's), not to say that cartoons today aren't great they just aren't my cup of coffee. [though some of my favorite cartoons will always come from late 30's to mid 50's Tom and Jerry and prime Bugs Bunny and Daffy cartoons]
 
Night Phyre said:
Anime are cartoons. I'm comfortable with watching cartoons. I love 'em. Venture Bros, Metalocalypse, Samurai Champloo, Abenobashi, Aeon Flux, Adventure Time, etc.

People need to get over themselves and just be ok with watching cartoons instead of trying to make the argument that Anime is somehow above that.
I've always wondered why people insist that clearly anime styled shows like Avatar: The Last Airbender aren't anime.
If Neon Genesis Evangelion had its entire team move to Europe and do all of its production there, would it suddenly not be an anime, even if the result was exactly identical to the version we have now?
People need to stop thinking of anime as strictly Japanese and more of an art/writing style that originated in Japan. This happened to JRPG's, so why can't Anime follow suit?

Also, the reason a lot of people get offended when people call anime cartoons is because they think the word "Cartoon" implies childishness. And while they're actually right, that's another definition that needs to change, and they're not exactly helping by sectioning off anime and saying "No, this is the serious stuff!" I've watched a lot of anime that fail to be as mature as Adventure Time or Batman: The Animated Series.
 
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I see it this way. Who the "Animated Show" was made for determines the genre. If it was made for Japanese people, it's an "Anime" (Japanese Animation). If it was made for Americans, it's a Cartoon or some other better word.

I hate it when people call The Boondocks an anime just because it looks like one. It's an American made show for Americans. It can be dubbed in Japanese and aired in Japan but it still won't be an "Anime." That's why animation doesn't really have any set genres except for how they are made, like hand drawn 2D or computer animated 3D.
That's why instead of actual genres people refer to Animation by their national origins.

EDIT: Also everyone should watch the South Park episode "The F Word."
 
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Horseman said:
I've watched a lot of anime that fail to be as mature as Adventure Time or Batman: The Animated Series.
I agree. Most anime is far less mature than its audience would like to believe. Blood and tits do not a mature story make.
 
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Denizen said:
I see it this way. Who the "Animated Show" was made for determines the genre. If it was made for Japanese people, it's an "Anime" (Japanese Animation). If it was made for Americans, it's a Cartoon or some other better word.
I hate it when people call The Boondocks an anime just because it looks like one. It's an American made show for Americans. It can be dubbed in Japanese and aired in Japan but it still won't be an "Anime."
That's why animation doesn't really have any set genres except for how they are made, like hand drawn 2D or computer animated 3D.
That's why instead of actual genres people refer to Animation by their national origins.

EDIT: Also everyone should watch the South Park episode "The F Word."
But that's silly.
If someone in Japan made an animated variety show that used dialogue to build up to slapstick humor, why would you separate it from Looney Toons? Wouldn't you have to question the origins of the ideas the creator of this show had, considering he/she used the same format as one of the most famous american cartoons of all time? Why would it matter if it was made in Japan, for a Japanese audience?
Not only that, but there's a severe paradox in your logic. We have an entire culture that's developed around people who like Japanese animation- they are a demographic now! There are Japanese anime series that are well aware of both their Japanese and western audiences and cater to both of them! There are western shows (like the aforementioned Avatar : The Last Airbender) that are clearly imitate Japanese animation to cater to this culture of people who love Japan! The lines between these things are so blurred that one ought to think about why we're drawing lines at all.
What makes animation different to the point where it shouldn't separate its genres like every other artistic medium? Is a slice of life made in the united states, at its core, really any different than a slice of life made in Japan? Like I said, we should use JRPG's as an example; they used to be just "any RPG made in Japan" as they were, and still are, much much different than a Western RPG. Now the split is way more logical; Western RPG's are RPG's based on DnD while Japanese ones are based on Visual Novels. Now Dark Souls can be made in Japan but not labeled as a JRPG.
 
I'm a big fan of much of the cartoons on CN.
But some I just...
...
Do not get at all
Uncle Grandpa? Did you mean: LSD drug trip?
And we don't talk about Annoying Orange
 
Or Johnny Test. Especially not Johnny Test.
 
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Let me be really clear, short, and simple about it.

If Naruto was made by Americans, for Americans, in English, in the U.S., But still looked identical it would be American animation, not Japanese animation (Anime).

If Adventure Time was made by Japanese, for Japanese, in Japanese, in Japan, but still looked identical it would be Japanese animation (Anime), not American animation.

Even if you look Russian, if your Blood is Japanese, you are Japanese.
 
Goddammit I missed The Boondocks today.
 
DDB said:
Or Johnny Test. Especially not Johnny Test.
THAT SHOW IS THE VERY DEFINITION OF GARBAGE
It pisses me off FOR AN ARRAY OF REASONS
First of all
SEVEN SEASONS.
Samurai Jack only got two, maybe three seasons. That was quality. But this garbage got seven!?
Second
NO MATTER HOW SHITTY IT IS, THEY ALWAYS MAKE A PROFIT!
Why? The show is so goddamned cheap to make, that it barely takes any money at all
Third
EVERYTHING ELSE. There's so many things wrong with it, the fact it's dexter's lab but horribly shitty, the bad noises, the bad art. EVERYTHING IS HORRIBLE.
And yet it keeps getting fucking renewed because apparently some people watch it
 
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I would simply say that anime is a term used for animation that relies on a specific cultural heritage. The reason many anime fans specifically point out that instances of non-Japanese animation are not 'anime' is that they don't rely on the same history/background, or try to do so but end up with a product that is tooth-grindingly awful.

Anyway, my original point was that it makes logical sense for the two types of content to be in the same section, so that we don't have endless debates over whether Avatar should be in this section or that section, etc.
 
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Denizen said:
Let me be really clear, short, and simple about it.

If Naruto was made by Americans, for Americans, in English, in the U.S., But still looked identical it would be American animation, not Japanese animation (Anime).

If Adventure Time was made by Japanese, for Japanese, in Japanese, in Japan, but still looked identical it would be Japanese animation (Anime), not American animation.

Even if you look Russian, if your Blood is Japanese, you are Japanese.
I think I got that. I didn't need you to explain with tautology.

Vadsamoht said:
I would simply say that anime is a term used for animation that relies on a specific cultural heritage. The reason many anime fans specifically point out that instances of non-Japanese animation are not 'anime' is that they don't rely on the same history/background, or try to do so but end up with a tooth-grindingly awful end-product.

Anyway, my original point was that it makes logical sense for the two types of content to be in the same section, so that we don't have endless debates over whether Avatar should be in this section or that section, etc.
This argument makes a bit more sense to me, and I thought about it a bit when I was writing out the last two posts... The problem with it is, lots of anime doesn't heavily use Japanese culture but is still anime. For example, how is Gurren Lagann so heavily influenced by Japanese culture that it couldn't have been made anywhere else? And yet, a lot of people consider this show as their favorite anime of all time, despite negligible relations to Japanese culture. What about anime that go as far as to base the setting on an entirely different culture, like Attack on Titan. And, yet again, anime fans love that show. Even if you look at a show that's deeply engulfed in Japanese like Azumanga Daioh, if the entire cast were to live in the United States, would it lose an element so vital to its entertainment value that anime fans would no longer like it? Do they like Azumanga because it's Japanese, and not because of the characters and the comedy? And to reference Avatar: The Last Airbender again, doesn't this show draw from ancient Japanese shinto mythology and culture, especially when it talks about spirits? (It draws from other asian cultures too, but that's aside from the point.) Why is it still separate from anime?
 
Does anyone watch Avengers: EMH? That show is great. I love the banter between Hulk and Hawkeye. The story is good, and the voice overs is solid. I was kinda disappointed when Marvel dropped that show since they didnt renew it for Season 3. Instead they made a new show named Avengers Assemble and it pretty crappy..
 
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Horseman said:
I think I got that. I didn't need you to explain with tautology.
Hey I learned a new word today.
Horseman said:
And to reference Avatar: The Last Airbender again, doesn't this show draw from ancient Japanese shinto mythology and culture, especially when it talks about spirits? (It draws from other asian cultures too, but that's aside from the point.) Why is it still separate from anime?
It's not Anime (Japanese Animation), because it's made by Americans, for Americans, in the U.S., etc...

Japanese Animation (Anime) is not a style or a setting or a story type. Same thing goes for American Animation. They are just terms for describing who made it, who it was made for, where it was made, etc. All of these are terms outside of the actual show. They are separate from plot, setting, art style, etc. They don't connect or affect each other.

It's doesn't matter how much Attack on Titan is based on Germany, it's Japanese Animation. It doesn't matter how heavily The Legend of Korra borrows from Japanese culture, its still American Animation.
 
Denizen said:
Hey I learned a new word today.

It's not Anime (Japanese Animation), because it's made by Americans, for Americans, in the U.S., etc...

Japanese Animation (Anime) is not a style or a setting or a story type. Same thing goes for American Animation. They are just terms for describing who made it, who it was made for, where it was made, etc. All of these are terms outside of the actual show. They are separate from plot, setting, art style, etc. They don't connect or affect each other.

It's doesn't matter how much Attack on Titan is based on Germany, it's Japanese Animation. It doesn't matter how heavily The Legend of Korra borrows from Japanese culture, its still American Animation.
I understand that. I understand that if something was made in Japan then it's Japanese. I also understand that if something was made in America then it's American.
Now tell me why that should have anything to do with genres of animation.
 
Horseman said:
I understand that. I understand that if something was made in Japan then it's Japanese. I also understand that if something was made in America then it's American.
Now tell me why that should have anything to do with genres of animation.
I'm just saying that Anime is not a genre. It's Japanese Animation.

Don't call Avatar or The Boondocks Anime. They may use elements that are typical of Anime but they aren't Anime.
 
Horseman said:
This argument makes a bit more sense to me, and I thought about it a bit when I was writing out the last two posts... The problem with it is, lots of anime doesn't heavily use Japanese culture but is still anime. For example, how is Gurren Lagann so heavily influenced by Japanese culture that it couldn't have been made anywhere else? And yet, a lot of people consider this show as their favorite anime of all time, despite negligible relations to Japanese culture. What about anime that go as far as to base the setting on an entirely different culture, like Attack on Titan. And, yet again, anime fans love that show. Even if you look at a show that's deeply engulfed in Japanese like Azumanga Daioh, if the entire cast were to live in the United States, would it lose an element so vital to its entertainment value that anime fans would no longer like it? Do they like Azumanga because it's Japanese, and not because of the characters and the comedy? And to reference Avatar: The Last Airbender again, doesn't this show draw from ancient Japanese shinto mythology and culture, especially when it talks about spirits? (It draws from other asian cultures too, but that's aside from the point.) Why is it still separate from anime?

I haven't watched any of the anime you listed through to the end, so I'm not really able to debate specific points. That said, when I was talking about culture I didn't mean Japanese culture but rather the culture that Japanese animation has developed for itself. Using an element of Japanese culture or mythology as a central element doesn't make the product anime in the same way that painting a picture using squares doesn't make it neoplasticist.

For example, if someone was to grow up in Japan but never watch/read any anime/manga and have absolutely no exposure to it at all (e.g. hasn't even heard how other people in Japanese society reacts to certain themes, tropes, styles, etc. in it) and then decided to make an animation, the result would almost certainly not be anime. What makes an animation anime, at least in my opinion, is the way that they are influenced both by previous landmarks in Japanese animation (Akira, etc.) and to a lesser extent the way that Japanese Culture views and responds to anime in general. The reason that American animation is often not-anime is that it is often influenced by specific anime titles (e.g. Evangelion) rather than the elements of Japanese culture and Japanese animation culture that led it to be created (the whole Gundam/giant robots thing, and the underlying themes present that can be traced back to the aftermath of WWII in Japan), while at the same time being altered by other external influences (American animation and action movies).
 
Denizen said:
I'm just saying that Anime is not a genre. It's Japanese animation.
Denizen said:
I see it this way. Who the "Animated Show" was made for determines the genre. If it was made for Japanese people, it's an "Anime" (Japanese Animation). If it was made for Americans, it's a Cartoon or some other better word.
Plus, at this point, when it's become so associated with an art style and a writing style and all that stuff... It's a genre.
To cite JRPG's again... something that is literally referred to as Japanese Role Playing Games now refers to a Japanese style of creating RPG's. RPG's that are mad in Japan can be excluded from the genre, and RPG's made in the west can be included in it. Anime doesn't even have the block of its own name working against it, so why do people still insist on separating them by nationality?

Vadsamoht said:
I haven't watched any of the anime you listed through to the end, so I'm not really able to debate specific points. That said, when I was talking about culture I didn't mean Japanese culture but rather the culture that Japanese animation has developed for itself. Using an element of Japanese culture or mythology as a central element doesn't make the product anime in the same way that painting a picture using squares doesn't make it neoplasticist.

For example, if someone was to grow up in Japan but never watch/read any anime/manga and have absolutely no exposure to it at all (e.g. hasn't even heard how other people in Japanese society reacts to certain themes, tropes, styles, etc. in it) and then decided to make an animation, the result would almost certainly not be anime. What makes an animation anime, at least in my opinion, is the way that they are influenced both by previous landmarks in Japanese animation (Akira, etc.) and to a lesser extent the way that Japanese Culture views and responds to anime in general. The reason that American animation is often not-anime is that it is often influenced by specific anime titles (e.g. Evangelion) rather than the elements of Japanese culture and Japanese animation culture that led it to be created (the whole Gundam/giant robots thing, and the underlying themes present that can be traced back to the aftermath of WWII in Japan), while at the same time being altered by other external influences (American animation and action movies).
So we can agree that american animation can be anime? I just want to be clear on that.
Your expressing it in a roundabout way, but you are essentially saying that anime is simply a genre that comes from Japan the vast majority of the time, rather than something that must come from Japan.
 
Horseman said:
So we can agree that american animation can be anime? I just want to be clear on that.
Your expressing it in a roundabout way, but you are essentially saying that anime is simply a genre that comes from Japan the vast majority of the time, rather than something that must come from Japan.
Yes, I'd say that anime can come from outside Japan, but I've yet to see one. Even some of the commonly used examples of American 'anime', e.g. Avatar, I would argue are not true anime but for reasons that are caused by being made in the US rather than just because it is.

The problem is, all anime are necessarily different, and with such a vague categorization (as most media genres are) it's left up to each person to decide for themselves at what stage a production stops being one thing and starts being another.
 
I liked the X-Men, Batman and Spiderman animated series.

Each show taught me something profound. Like the horrors of racism in X-Men, the courage needed to stand up to your fears in Batman, and with great power comes great responsibility in Spiderman.

Also they were badass.
 
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I've also been watching Total Drama All-Stars and I think it's pretty good. I've been following the show since the first season. To be honest out of ALL 5 seasons of Total Drama, I really only enjoyed the first and fifth seasons while the rest were meh. Also speaking of Venture Bros.....
 
Hmmm, I still stand by what I said. No changes.
Zombies8MyLeg said:
Also speaking of Venture Bros.....
I have to get myself a hunting knife...
 
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