Mashing Supers

[Pali]

Like people don't mash on assists or one frame crouching shorts or pushblock?

All of those options don't work, you mash on assist its easily punished. And you can never mash a super a crouch short isn't mashed either because if you do you get punished, like i said mvc2 you can't mash you pushblock you'll get guardbroken. Pushblock doesn't even work in mvc2 really

 

[iLoli]

Because Mvc2 is a 15 year old game with established strategies.

Undizzy is new to this version of the game and it wasn't even a thought the last evo.


Give it a year or 2 and people will say "why are you mashing, you know he has burst baits on deck, who doesn't?"

 

[Pali]

Because Mvc2 is a 15 year old game with established strategies.

Undizzy is new to this version of the game and it wasn't even a thought the last evo.


Give it a year or 2 and people will say "why are you mashing, you know he has burst baits on deck, who doesn't?"

Burst baits aren't even that good tbh most of them are obvious and you can see it coming, no one will fall for the same poop set up 2 times in a row. A reset can still be mashed on and thats the primary thing you're going to be doing, like @Dime_x said you shouldn't have to be worried about 3 options when you're going for a reset that defeats the purpose of a reset heavy game. Tbh if you go for a reset and the opponent has 2 meters they get to go on the offensive because you tried to do a reset, that's goofy imo.

 

[KhaosMuffins]

Whats with defending scrub tactics? try to mash on mixups in mvc2 or guilty gear and you'll get bodybagged everytime.

Basically what this game is doing is turning it from professional play to dumbed down baby mode play for casuals. Skullgirls is a casual game you can mash someone out with a solo miss fortune atleast once or twice by knowing just basic combos.

To be honest, this is still better than previously where if Fortune simply landed a jab on you then you were dead.

 

[iLoli]

Burst baits aren't even that good tbh most of them are obvious and you can see it coming, no one will fall for the same poop set up 2 times in a row. A reset can still be mashed on and thats the primary thing you're going to be doing, like @Dime_x said you shouldn't have to be worried about 3 options when you're going for a reset that defeats the purpose of a reset heavy game. Tbh if you go for a reset and the opponent has 2 meters they get to go on the offensive because you tried to do a reset, that's goofy imo.

Sorry in advance Vulpesbabu.

 

[Pali]

To be honest, this is still better than previously where if Fortune simply landed a jab on you then you were dead.

I agree/disagree since most people didn't have the execution to actually complete it, most people would drop it.

Sorry in advance Vulpesbabu.

As cool as that is... everyone who's smart knows not to burst in the air. Not trying to shit on the video or anything but i don't see that working more than once, i always burst on the ground never in the air.

 

[iLoli]

I think it's best to consider that a precursor.

This game is very young and undizzy/new ips is even younger.

Soon people will be resetting in the burst baits, and layers will stack.

 

[Dagwood]

Well Pali is right most burst baits are pretty obvious... They're too quick, so they require your opponent to be mashing blindly. rather than waiting to reversal at the right time, or being tricked into thinking you hit IPS/undizzy by accident.
That one in the IsaVulpes vid is very intriguing though, it shows the possibilities of burst baits.

 

[Pali]

Well Pali is right most burst baits are pretty obvious... They're too quick, so they require your opponent to be mashing blindly. rather than waiting to reversal at the right time, or being tricked into thinking you hit IPS/undizzy by accident.
That one in the IsaVulpes vid is very intriguing though, it shows the possibilities of burst baits.

For me to be intrigued i'd like to see a ips bait string that leads to a kill on a character.

 

[View619]

Encore has never been at a "top level SG tournament" (i.e. EVO), so I don't know what you're talking about. Anyway, I'll just put you on ignore and make myself oblivious to your constant crying; not worth my time, tbh. Good luck dealing with the "scrub tactics" though.

 

[skull person]

Hi Pali,
I seriously don't mean to come off as antagonistic or sarcastic, but if you find the time, could you type up a list of changes you'd like to see to Skullgirls to make it more your kind of game? I'm seeing a lot of disagreement and not a lot of solutions from both parties.
Also I'm sorry if you've already done this but I think a few ideas in one post would be helpful for discussion.

 

[Pali]

Hi Pali,
I seriously don't mean to come off as antagonistic or sarcastic, but if you find the time, could you type up a list of changes you'd like to see to Skullgirls to make it more your kind of game? I'm seeing a lot of disagreement and not a lot of solutions from both parties.
Also I'm sorry if you've already done this but I think a few ideas in one post would be helpful for discussion.

It's not my game to make those decisions, i enjoyed the game how it was when it came out. Others complained, i didn't even mind after the 1st patch making HK bomber worse still people complain. And then when combos got watered down a bit i started doing dhc kill combos... yet again complaints. I just don't understand what kind of game this is supposed to be it's been so fucking wishy washy and dumbed down for lower level players. Nerfing peacock when she wasn't even that great... yet another complaint from scrubs that gets put into action, catheads nerf as well. Is it supposed to be rushdown? or undizzy so we can go back to neutral and be fair and hold hands and kiss?

Lets not forget about no real nerfs to filia either, since "you know who" plays her she can't get touched. If you're going to make a game about resets its apparent what the general teams are going to look like. Atleast older skullgirls versions had more variety.

 

[Zidiane]

try to mash on mixups in mvc2 or guilty gear and you'll get bodybagged everytime.

This game is actually called Skullgirls. Maybe you should play Skullgirls when you play Skullgirls. Or do you play BlazBlue when you play Street Fighter? Do you also play Tekken while playing UMVC3?

It doesn't matter what you think of a game or what it allows, you have to play the game you're playing, not the one you think you should be playing.

For me to be intrigued i'd like to see a ips bait string that leads to a kill on a character.

To clarify, you mean combo, bait, they burst, combo, and then the characters dead?

 

[Pali]

To clarify, you mean combo, bait, they burst, combo, and then the characters dead?

I mean a 100% combo, meaning if they burst anywhere in it they will still die. Unburstable 100%.

 

[Age]

I mean a 100% combo, meaning if they burst anywhere in it they will still die. Unburstable 100%.

So your complaint isn't that people mash reversals, it's that they can do anything...at all...after a single hit.

just clarifying

 

[dekillsage]

Wasn't it also because your opponent was ass?

Chill son my reads are godlike.

I'm not a masher.

 

[Mike_Z]

Whats with defending scrub tactics? try to mash on mixups in mvc2 or guilty gear and you'll get bodybagged everytime.

- Probably the most famous counterexample of all time:

That entire clip is mashing reversals, dude. Hit the ground? DP. Getting mixed up? DP.
It just happened that the god tier (and even most of the top tier) all ended up with terrible reversals, but you'll still see it from characters that HAVE reversals constantly. If ever there were a spot to actually change your mind, this would be it...but there isn't, of course. Your Jugz are too Heavy, the momentum is unstoppable.
- Guilty Gear has air techs which remove the ability to mash reversal supers in the air. Nice! They also remove the ability to do a reset that is less than IIRC 40 frames, or get any kind of meaningful mixup afterward, and you can still mash post-tech VV RC full combo. Versus ground mixups you can mash VV RC or super with the 10-ish characters that have 0f supers and be 100% safe, or mash throw considering they give you 6f of throw invincibility after hitstun or blockstun.
[edit]Have a mashing-reversals-either-works-or-you-can-RC-for-pressure clip from GG, too:

Basically what this game is doing is turning it from professional play to dumbed down baby mode play for casuals. Skullgirls is a casual game you can mash someone out with a solo miss fortune atleast once or twice by knowing just basic combos.

What's the matter, not winning anymore? That's the game's fault, right? You don't get to make the other person not play for an entire lifebar now?

On the one hand, we have everyone complaining about the game being too hard. On the other, we have Pali complaining about this.
If you think punishing a blocked reversal super for 3/4 life and your opponent being down a bar isn't a reward, I don't know what to tell you.

I personally DO NOT want to have to think hella hard about resetting my opponent. I understand that that can lead to balance issues, but at the same time, i also understand that this is a new game and doesnt have to follow the EXTREMELY flowchart formulaic and and archaic block to bait, attack to mixup mindgame that has been around for forever.

Each time you post, Skullheart should turn your entire page-long wall of text into a hyperlink that links back to this post, with that part in bold.
@Vadsamoht how hard is that?

MOD EDIT: Probably only about 30 minutes of coding, but I'd personally rather shove my face in a blender than touch XenForo's scripting system again.

Blocking is defense, attacking is offense. You would perhaps prefer to mixup by blocking?
I swear, even you don't even read your own posts.

 

[Krackatoa]

As cool as that is... everyone who's smart knows not to burst in the air. Not trying to shit on the video or anything but i don't see that working more than once, i always burst on the ground never in the air.

I mean a 100% combo, meaning if they burst anywhere in it they will still die. Unburstable 100%.

Strings that are unburstable, but lead to a kill (Effectively subverting the IPS and Undizzy system) are rendered impossible due to the fact that bursting after a projectile hit allows you to block after burst invuln. This is where you find most instances of 100% setups.

I said this earlier in the thread, but there are a number of situations where you can trigger a burst during common Air-Throw/Frame Trap windows, instead of going for Air-Throw/Frame Trap, and if they are pressing buttons (To tech, or mash air super), you can kill them with the follow up. The key is putting them into situations where they want to press buttons, not necessarily mash out a super/special.

Double Car xx Install leads to certain death if you do Barrel Loop > Burstable s.MK xx Car DHC Install. Right after Barrel is a common, low-level reset point for Double, and the DHC leads to an advantageous situation, if they don't take the bait. The thing is expensive as hell at 2 meters, but probably one of the simplest and most damaging burst baits available for the team I play that doesn't sacrifice offensive momentum (Most shitty baits aren't actually baits, the player just hopes the person fell asleep at the controller). Recently I've been trying to figure out how to catch people pressing buttons during places where Double and Painwheel normally air-reset, they're not as suited to other characters (Double's j.HK counts as a projectile, I think? This kills a lot of potential setups I have on my list).

 

[Mike_Z]

Lets not forget about no real nerfs to filia either, since "you know who" plays her she can't get touched.

THIS crap, I'm not going to stand for. Either you provide some suggestions as to what to change that aren't "bring back 100% combos and let me counter every super post-flash so I can play a 1-player game again", or you shut the hell up.
Filia lost active frames/hitstun/blockstun/startup/disjoint hitboxes on j.HP, lots of the invincibility on Gregor, damage/range/startup/advantage on j.HK, multi-Airball dashcancel combos, unpunishable Airball, unpunishable air Gregor, damage on Fenrir, sliding on s.HK, part of the supercancel period on Updo/Drill/Hairball, and a bunch of other smaller things I can't remember right now. [edit - Remembered another, the inability to pushblock during Hairballs.]

You want to insinuate (or I guess just flat-out state) that I do that kind of thing when I spend 90 hours a week wading through awful threads like this trying to make this game as fair as possible?
I consider every opinion, even your worthless ones.

Screw you, Pali, you mouthbreathing waste of space.

 

[Sydoh]

This thread has outlived its usefulness. I can't see any more discussion coming from this.