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Squigly General: Art of the Daisy Pusher

alexpi said:
wait, you can kara command throws out of other specials?

Only super command grabs.
I mean I guess if you were running titan knuckle as the assist or some other normal you could kara to normal command grabs though.
 
alexpi said:
wait, you can kara command throws out of other specials?
I used to be able to kara something into Diamond Drop after a stunt double, but maybe it's been fixed, because I can't get it working in the lab anymore (or maybe my timing is bad) (or maybe I'm just crazy).

Cerecopter cancelled into Showstopper always works, though.
 
I knew about cancelling into showstopper since it's a super, but canceling one special into another is a "shouldn't be possible" thing given the SG engine.
 
alexpi said:
I knew about cancelling into showstopper since it's a super, but canceling one special into another is a "shouldn't be possible" thing given the SG engine.
It definitely shouldn't be possible, but for some reason I still remember having done it. I've been looking through old posts to see if I can find a record of having mentioned it before, but no dice! So let's pretend I didn't say anything so crazy.
 
Emuchu said:
It definitely shouldn't be possible, but for some reason I still remember having done it. I've been looking through old posts to see if I can find a record of having mentioned it before, but no dice! So let's pretend I didn't say anything so crazy.
I also remember it being a thing. 90% sure it got patched out.
 
Squigly damage

Format: [move name]: [minimum damage] : [damage/undizzy]

s.lp: 100 : 6.666
c.lp: 90 : 6

s.lk: 70 : 4.666
c.lk: 60 : 4


s.mp: 190 : 9.5
c.mp: 100 : 5

s.mk: 130 : 6.5
c.mk: 130 : 6.5

s.hp: 310 : 10.333
c.hp: 360 : 12

s.hk: 275 : 9.166
c.hk: 302.5 : 10.083


j.lp: 50 : 3.333
j.mp: 110 : 5.5
j.hp: 300 : 10

j.lk: 40 : 2.666
j.mk: 100/160/220/280 : 5/8/11/14
j.hk: 295 : 9.833

lk divekick: 60 : 3
mk divekick: 80 : 4
hk divekick: 355 : 17.75

Liver Mortis: 275 : 13.75
Liver Mortis (Charged): 385 : 19.25

Drag 'n' Bite: 270 : 13.5
Drag 'n' Bite (Charged): 530 : 26.5

Draugen Punch: 180 : 9
Draugen Punch (Charged): 427.5 : 21.375

Arpeggio: 242 : 12.1
Arpeggio (Charged): 517 : 25.85

Silver Chord: 120 : 6

Tremolo: 250 : 12.5
Tremolo (Charged): 460 : 23


SBO: 375
Daisy: 650
Level 3: 2470

Observations:
c.HP is better than s.HP at high scaling (I like to use it past 10 hits)
Don't go for mediums in stancel loops if you intend to reset (Wastes undizzy for bad damage, s.MP ruins spacing for c.HP loops if used more than once)
Any divekick except HK is bad
Silver chord is bad
Charged stance moves are great
Getting all four hits of j.mk is optimal as fuck, and I'm pretty sure possible with universal timing on everyone except non-corner Double.
 
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Silver chord is kind of important for optimal damage, especially in corner. It's the only way you can combo into Daisy Pusher which is your best damaging super and you can build a charge after Daisy Pusher with time to finish the combo.

If you find a combo that lets you use all hits of j.mk consistently, I'm eager to see it.
 
I'm just theory fighting here because i have a terrible squigly. But recently ive realized that i was approaching one of my characters (my 2 plus year main, painwheel) all wrong. I was trying to make her into a val style character that could convert assists easily... And well that isnt the easiest thing for pw to be doing.



So.... I was thinking about squigly and how i basically was trying to do the same with her and thinking that she sucked cause she didnt have the best assist confirms ever and stuff... Compounded with her sbo not actually being a safe on block dhc for most things because it will wiff behind the opponent, along with her not even having the best dhc synergy with many characters.

But then i was thinking... If i dhc to sbo on hit and it wiffs... I STILL HAVE mucho pressure from the sbo. I can now get charge.... Perhaps even 2 sets, for free against some characters, and i can put the opposing character in the corner because they will run from sbo...

Of course not everyone will run from sbo. But the point is that perhaps squigly doesnt need to actually make contact with her dhc in order for good things to happen. For instance, the opponents undizzy will fade while sbo is active so there is the high end chance to do 2 full undizzy combos by dhcing into sbo and letting the opponent recover?


Just some random thoughts. I dont particularly watch squigly players play so for all i know this has been her mainline strat since day 1... Or its been tried and found to be extremely lacking "shrugs"
 
Dime_x said:
So.... I was thinking about squigly and how i basically was trying to do the same with her and thinking that she sucked cause she didnt have the best assist confirms ever and stuff

I usually use c.hp > chord for assist confirms. Works fairly well with mk and lk bomber at least. I've seen Neon/Bit strife confirm off of copter assist with j.mk.

I can convert off of fiber occasionally with j.lk > j.mk >hk divekick, though I usually forget I can do that.
 
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Dime_x said:
I'm just theory fighting here because i have a terrible squigly. But recently ive realized that i was approaching one of my characters (my 2 plus year main, painwheel) all wrong. I was trying to make her into a val style character that could convert assists easily... And well that isnt the easiest thing for pw to be doing.



So.... I was thinking about squigly and how i basically was trying to do the same with her and thinking that she sucked cause she didnt have the best assist confirms ever and stuff... Compounded with her sbo not actually being a safe on block dhc for most things because it will wiff behind the opponent, along with her not even having the best dhc synergy with many characters.

But then i was thinking... If i dhc to sbo on hit and it wiffs... I STILL HAVE mucho pressure from the sbo. I can now get charge.... Perhaps even 2 sets, for free against some characters, and i can put the opposing character in the corner because they will run from sbo...

Of course not everyone will run from sbo. But the point is that perhaps squigly doesnt need to actually make contact with her dhc in order for good things to happen. For instance, the opponents undizzy will fade while sbo is active so there is the high end chance to do 2 full undizzy combos by dhcing into sbo and letting the opponent recover?


Just some random thoughts. I dont particularly watch squigly players play so for all i know this has been her mainline strat since day 1... Or its been tried and found to be extremely lacking "shrugs"
She has a great assist confirm with meter.

236MP xx 214LK + MK, can even convert off HP Brass with it.


She doesn't play anything like Val, she basically has 2 positions she wants to be in. far away at neutral and in close pressuring.

The key is how to transition from the first to the second, because of her horizontal mobility it seems difficult at first, but her toolset actually makes it quite easy. Your main goal is to either get a charge, use an assist to cover yourself and get in with 236MP xx 214LK+MK or something, OR push your opponent into the corner where your horizontal mobility doesn't matter in the slightest.

On pressure... I'm pretty sure you've seen what she's like when pressuring, divekicks, assists into mixup, stance cancels for safety/mindfucking etc.
 
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:)

Yeah i wasnt really talking about assists in combos or even assists used in chain with your first hitconfirm. I'm talking about things like jumping backwards and calling updo/pillar and being able to confirm it.... Or even just blocking a heavy blockstun normal and then your assist hitting and you still being able to convert.

I'm not saying she cant confirm assists, that would be ridiculous to say. I'm saying that trying to play her as an assist confirmer might be folly when she, may, have other better strategies to apply.

Like in the pw example, instead of trying to confirm my assists or even tech chase, ive gotten far far better results by just using my assists on hit to setup nail patterns and then fly in under the cover of the nails.

I thought perhaps squigly might be the same, only she uses meter to do such things, but as in the case of like pw, even with a brass or bomber knockdown it can be tough to get a full charge of nails out so one may have to settle on a fake or just a level 1... But with squigly, an sbo used for pressure would be guaranteed after a hit brass.


And i could certainly be flatout wrong about the merit of such a tactic. I'm not a squigly player :)
 
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So I've been using Level 1 draugen punch occasionally.

It actually... may not be horrible. I've stuffed quite a few jump ins and even got out of some resets with it. You just have to recognize when you'll actually be able to survive the vulnerable frames. If you're quick you can cancel it into opera as well.
 
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Sometimes I start the round with draugen punch. It catches a lot of Filias, Fortunes and Valentines off guard and I always get at least 1 full charge when I succeed.
 
I always start most of the match jumping backwards and hitting HP for a long range poke. When the next round starts, however, I switch to Draugen Punch.

mindgames son
 
If people are jabbing out of your launch>divekick crossunder reset, just divekick and then do level 1 draugen punch. I've caught quite a few people this way, and it's sort of like a shitty version of double's delayed luger to catch jab mashers.

The hitbox isn't too horrible either
 
Hello, everyone! I'm a horrible Squigler! Just letting you know I'm gonna be stalking here :3
P.S. I'd appreciate anyone that tries and helps me becomes not as much of a horrible Squigler.
 
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If you have meter and you are mid screen and get a happy birthday you can get a mid screen double snap.

No charge or assist requires 3 bars, s.hk > MH SBO > charge dragon stance > combo into arpegio > LM SBO > center stage >snapback

No charge but you have a dp or multi hit assist available requires 1-2 bars depending on assist, s.hp > call assist and charge dragon stance > center stage (LM SBO if you have to) > snapback

If squigly has a corner carry happy birthday combo or a way to midscreen snap back by herself with less meter, I would love to know.
 
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I was referring to ways to get midscreen double snap without a charge at the start, but I still like your videos. Especially the 2nd one since I was way too lazy to find all the assists it works with.
 
Ah okay, sorry about that.

I should say that from my testing most commonly picked assists can work on most/all team combinations once you know the right setup, and ones that keep them standing are by far the easiest. A notable exception is Fiber Upper; can't find a way to do it (maybe I just suck.)

Here's a no charge start version featuring Butcher's Blade assist:
 
one of these days i need to practice this stuff again
 
Anyone know a good blockstring for Squigles? Been wondering for days.
 
with or without charge? Usual plan with charge is to do c.lk, c.mk, s.hp x2 with stancels varied at different points. General safe one that's not super easy to pbgc is c.lk, c.mk, s.hpx2 xx arpeggio. Arpeggio and Drag n Bite are safe on block, but Drag is harder to do stuff with as you can't confirm a stray hit of it into SBO against the whole cast and I find Drag easier to PBGC.
 
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alexpi said:
with or without charge? Usual plan with charge is to do c.lk, c.mk, s.hp x2 with stancels varied at different points. General safe one that's not super easy to pbgc is c.lk, c.mk, s.hpx2 xx arpeggio. Arpeggio and Drag n Bite are safe on block, but Drag is harder to do stuff with as you can't confirm a stray hit of it into SBO against the whole cast and I find Drag easier to PBGC.

I kinda disagree with this. Sure its "safe" but by the time you get c.mk or s.hpX2 you are already push blocked out or you are pbgc'd either way you give up your offence.

I've been having some success with c.lp and varying the amount of hits and chaining into c.mk/f.hp(overhead) or c.hp, while calling a lock down assist in between. Since you are running up to them they are mostly holding down back you they are prepared for you c.lk and are ready to push block you out. With the variable amount of hits from c.lp you can mess with their push block and get a mix up with and assist or chain into f.hp or even a grab.


ALSO WHILE I'M HERE SOMEONE PLEASE HELP ME WITH THIS

I'm finding sbo kinda shitty, in addition to having pretty much the whole cast counter super it if you don't level 2 sing before, i can't get any offence even when a level 2 sing to sbo because you can just push block squigly away. Any one else any any tips with getting the most offence with an sbo lockdown?
 
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call a lockdown assist while your opponent is blocking sbo, wait for pushblock then do something or bait the reversal. put it out in front of the opponent and raw tag. Don't try to use sbo as lockdown against val, eliza, and cerebella. Use it at neutral against filia as it stops all her options. Then get a charge so you actually have a way to get her off you if she starts her offence. Use it to anti air your opponent. Use it after you pushblock to lock the opponent down or punish their whiffed attack. Use it to make draughen punch -5 on block or completely safe if they pushblock.

Instead of doing all of that though, you could drop squigly because she's garbage.
 
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It's worth nothing that c.lk>s.mk>c.hp is a true blockstring. s.mk randomly has a ton more blockstun, just enough to get you into c.hp. I can't check frame data atm, but c.mp might also give you enough to go into c.hp.
 
The main point of c.mk is that it keeps you in range to continue your combo. s.mk does have more blockstun +10 if you seria cancel but I see no point when squigs can just cancel anything on block to make it safe. Although now that I'm typing this, +10 does sound like you can keep pressure but I'm pretty sure pushblock ruins that.
 
Well you have to react to the assist coming on screen, more lenient if you have seria. If you don't like c.mk, you have to use different combo routes as c.mk is the only normal that keeps her in range for s.hk. I suggest c.lk > c.mp > c.hp/s.hp > silver chord. I don't think you can connect a c.lk after your hp, so you may lose out on a lot of damage. s.lp and the 2nd hit of c.lp can link into c.lk so it is very easy to tell whether or not you hit. However, it's a one frame link. Honestly I think c.mk is fine and is way less work than anything else. You should just work on stance canceling it to protect yourself.
 
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This is a guide I developed for intermediate-level Skullgirls players who want to pick up Squigly as a main or as a sub.


The tech displayed here was developed 'in a vacuum' (my friends don't play Skullgirls, my neighborhood doesn't have an FGC, and my Internet is lousy), so it's not as tournament-grade as I'd like, but I did the best I could.
 
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@4Leaf Bro put it in the tech thread :p do you think new Squigs players are gonna look here for this kinda advice? ...no :/ you did all this work...put it up where people will see it.

Not my cup of tea on the guide in regards to info. If people are learning combos have them build good optimiEd habits. They don't have to do the whole thing or you can simplify it, but like the c.lps in combos had me like :/ also thing to think about...35 minutes of reading(??)

but super cool bro. Way to go on making content. Not criticizing but offering advice so it's more palatable for newcomers. Despite being long as all hell, mount lovers guide is superb. I'd follow that route man.

Once I get real time I'll make a COMPLETE guide. Upon final retail, I'll get on it
 
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4Leaf said:
This is a guide I developed for intermediate-level Skullgirls players who want to pick up Squigly as a main or as a sub.


The tech displayed here was developed 'in a vacuum' (my friends don't play Skullgirls, my neighborhood doesn't have an FGC, and my Internet is lousy), so it's not as tournament-grade as I'd like, but I did the best I could.

Thanks, changing ground string from

Blah blah > st.HP > Lv.1 Cancel > st.LP > st.HP > Chord > st.HP

To

Blah blah > st.HP > Lv.1 Cancel > st.LP > st.HP > Chord > st.MP > st.HP > Lv.1 Stancel > st.LK > st.MK > st.HK

I'm studying Squigly because I want to pick her back up so I'll come back here with stuffs soonish
 
Nuuance said:
@4Leaf Bro put it in the tech thread :p do you think new Squigs players are gonna look here for this kinda advice? ...no :/ you did all this work...put it up where people will see it.

Not my cup of tea on the guide in regards to info. If people are learning combos have them build good optimiEd habits. They don't have to do the whole thing or you can simplify it, but like the c.lps in combos had me like :/ also thing to think about...35 minutes of reading(??)

but super cool bro. Way to go on making content. Not criticizing but offering advice so it's more palatable for newcomers. Despite being long as all hell, mount lovers guide is superb. I'd follow that route man.

Once I get real time I'll make a COMPLETE guide. Upon final retail, I'll get on it


I don't think there's a way to make Squigly palatable to beginners at all. Seria Cancels are a really huge execution barrier.

As for the light normals inside the combos - I don't think I'll ever get rid of that habit. It sort of works as a hit-confirm for me - a carry-over from USF4. Also, with that I could intentionally insert some blockstring gaps and bait something out, theoretically.

Regarding the length - it is what it is because it contains everything I have to say on the subject. At least it's 1.5 hrs less than that guide you mentioned (which I HAVE seen, but never completed - really good info in there, but too much meandering).
 
peacock ruins everything as usual
 
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