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Valentine Safejumps + Safejump OS

ClarenceMage

ClarenceMage

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Valentine Painwheel Big Band

Decided to put this in the OP, since it has the timings for HK HK HK safejumps on the cast


Rolling star avoids it but I'm pretty sure it could get blown up by adding an assist into the mix. Might try that out/record it later.
 
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It's not even by far a safe reset. Only works against people that mash buttons all the time, who are also the people that always fall for obvious burst baits.

Also, Countervenom opens a window to start a combo before the enemy is thrown away. Check this thread for more information about her lvl 2.
 
The safe reset OS is purely to catch the super, if they mash buttons they'll be hit by the j.HP. Also, this setup looks nothing like a burst bait so people are more willing to mash super there. Ultimately, it's a setup used to get people to stop mashing supers so that then you can reset them as you please.

If they don't mash super, you haven't really lost much since you can still lay the pressure on by jumping j.MP call doublebutt lay on more pressure, mix up however you please, or back off after they PBGC to bait air super.

There are ways out of that situation, but they all require large amounts of meter to either DHC into something that won't get countervenomed, or alpha counter out of pressure. Chances are they'll just eat the pressure instead of alpha countering, since alpha countering into safety would require two meters to be consistent (invincible/armoured move into safe super for Double & Painwheel).

If Ms Fortune has only one meter, or has two meters and doesn't have someone to DHC/alpha counter properly into, this reset is completely safe as far as I know.

Also, I know that you can combo off of countervenom but countervenom combos in the corner are just super jump do your optimal bnb, no point in putting them in the video when the point of the videos are the OS.
 
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This is kinda interesting, but they can reaction pb the j.hp, and seeing as you are OSing a reverse dp during the landing, the assist call (assuming you even have a lockdown assist) will be delayed long enough for the opponent to create some established space. Be that as it may, I am aware that this set up really is only intended to be used as super bait and not a reset, but I felt like this had to be brought up, especially given my more relevant response.

As a super bait set up it leaves something to be desired. Honestly I'd rather not even do the counter and just block the super, raw supers aren't very safe on block and I don't want to use the two meters when I don't have to (the increase in damage from the raw launcher ch combo could just be balanced out by doing scalpels mid combo if you want). And I would prefer to just stop pressing buttons instead of giving them the option to pb. The set up is cool, but ultimately I'm not feeling it.
 
Of course the setups could just be done without the countervenom and block punish the supers, but

1. I really want to use countervenom because it looks so damn cool
2. Actually managing to use it in-game is difficult because of its high risk, so if you OS it the risk is only in your execution
3. It does ludicrous damage so if you're up against a duo or even a solo you get to kill them far faster. In 3v3, the full combo that leads into that setup + the punish would probably be enough to kill anyway... So, just save it for if Ms Fortune/Valentine is their last character and you want to catch out a desperation Feral Edge/Flatliner and send a very clear message. <_<
 

Canceling HK HK HK into vial, using the red bounce as a visual cue makes it 500 times easier, since characters fall at different heights.

Things to note: You can j.HP upbac OS vs Bella to avoid command grab. j.HP throw OS vs Peacock, have to do qcf MP to Argus in a very specific timing to avoid it.

I will make a comparison video for the cancel timings on vial later.
 
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Yo, this is really awesome shit. I don't understand Camail and Colossi...how can you not see how good this is? If they hit a non invincible button, they get reset, if they mash something invincible they eat your counter super. Otherwise, it's just like any other failed reset attempt.

Like seriously, you are getting a free reset attempt with 99% less risk than any other non burst bait reset option.
 

Because @Age thinks it's a good idea to be able to do things WELL YOU THOUGHT WRONG
 

THIS REQUIRES ITS OWN POST, THIS IS FUCKING RIDICULOUS
 
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Icky said:
Yo, this is really awesome shit. I don't understand Camail and Colossi...how can you not see how good this is? If they hit a non invincible button, they get reset, if they mash something invincible they eat your counter super. Otherwise, it's just like any other failed reset attempt.

Like seriously, you are getting a free reset attempt with 99% less risk than any other non burst bait reset option.
Well I made it a point to say that is was cool, but my point is that it isn't anything more than a bait. If they are blocking and not bad they will never be hit by it (its either a high immediately after a multi hit high or the opponent is still in the air, there really isn't a reason to mess up defensively), so it will only catch them if they are going for a reversal, and I personally prefer not using 2 meters
In a majority of situations. Rather than os a counter super, you can just block for 10 frames and then go for a tricky reset or simple low/throw mix up. If they mash out super/invincible reversals you will be blocking it, and its probably unsafe so you get a ch anyway. Blockig as a bait is equally as safe and less costly. Also more consistant because you may have no vial or a non damage vial.
 
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Pushblock option select dp or super... Havent tested cause... Busy. But should work and take much of the bite out of this option select.
 
I would like to point out that I am not associating my argument with either of the other two objectors.
 
Dime_x said:
Pushblock option select dp or super... Havent tested cause... Busy. But should work and take much of the bite out of this option select.

Loses to blocking + dp assist.
 
ClarenceMage said:
Loses to blocking + dp assist.
Which itself loses to ground throw. The point isn't that any one defense beats this the point is that there are options to make you mixup your options which makes the safe jump os less powerful.

Also I should certainly be thanking you. Because of this tech I've had to theory fight up the rise of PB os special/super armor moves which should further muddy this safe jump os... Imagine Bella doing Pushblock os armor cancel 360 on the ground or no armor 360 or excelebella... Possibilities.
 
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Camail said:
Well I made it a point to say that is was cool, but my point is that it isn't anything more than a bait. If they are blocking and not bad they will never be hit by it (its either a high immediately after a multi hit high or the opponent is still in the air, there really isn't a reason to mess up defensively), so it will only catch them if they are going for a reversal, and I personally prefer not using 2 meters
In a majority of situations. Rather than os a counter super, you can just block for 10 frames and then go for a tricky reset or simple low/throw mix up. If they mash out super/invincible reversals you will be blocking it, and its probably unsafe so you get a ch anyway. Blockig as a bait is equally as safe and less costly. Also more consistant because you may have no vial or a non damage vial.
You could watch the video again and realize that you only use two meters if they mash something out. It's an OPTION SELECT: "If they do x, this happens, if they do y, that happens." If you choose to reset someone with a normal (which is totally legit if you think they're mashing tech or not paying attention,) this is the same thing as that BUT also protects you for them mashing a reversal.
 
You do realize that I gave a counter suggestion of an os that utilized a delayed reset in order to catch supers, right? That's what I was talking about when I mentioned waiting 10 frames before doing the reset. The 2 meters I was talking about were assuming a succesful bait, as was the delayed reset. I would prefer to have conversations that involved more respect than assuming I don't understand the basic concept of an option select.

Both the counter OS and the delayed reset are used as tools against reversals. I do not want to use 2 meters in this way, I will almost always prefer having those two bars. I also hedged my assertion by saying that it was only a vast majority of cases where I would rather do a delayed reset, which is not an absolute assertion. I have explained the benefits of blocking instead of using this os as both meter presevation if either tool succeeds in baiting and superior safety/ ability to continue pressure if it fails in baiting. This does not immediately make it useless, there is no reason to generalize so strongly, but it does limit the usefulness of it.
 
I'll admit, I just skimmed your response because I was in a hurry, and the way you started off your post made me assume you didn't 'get" was this was even intended for. It was rude of me, I'm sorry.

Blocking is obviously an option too, but not all supers can be punished on block, air gregor, painwheel's air super, big band's air super, etc. etc. I still think this is a sick OS, but if you don't agree then don't use it.
 
Big bands air super is punishable on block now, but still safe on whiff. I also wasn't aware that air gregor was safe, though its not exactly a fun position for filia to be in.
 
I'll give these a run, they look like some pretty great options.

Thanks for posting ClarenceMage.
 
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