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Why do experts taunt beginners?

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You stop playing and let the other guy killing you for free because you are losing? And you are complaining because your opponent doesn't like it (like i would) ? I can assure you that this behavior is the most irritating and frustrating that we can meet in this game. It's just a whiny attitude.

So here is the tip of the day: stop doing this right NOW and get along with more players of your level. It's not that hard: after playing against one that is a little more better than you, you look for them and invite them for endless matches. Best way to progress.
 
You're two pages late beuzer.

Problem already solved.
 
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Just wanted to note that for any who haven't followed my training journal I started since Dime started training me, I haven't spent a ton of time against arcade opponents, most of my time has been in training mode, but I have found the time in arcade mode I have spent to be very helpful for all the reasons Dime listed. I'm against moving opponents actually trying to fight back, unlike what I've been beating up on in training mode, but they're still making enough mistakes that I actually can occasionally land an opener and try to turn it into the full combo I've been practicing unlike when I play online.

I wouldn't play purely against the computer in arcade mode for fun (though I did find the story modes a lot of fun in this game), much like just practicing combos in training mode it gets monotonous after a while, but I've found playing against the arcade mode computer on nightmare to be a good next stepping stone from just practicing against training mode dummies and seeing improved success against said AIs actually makes me feel like I"m accomplishing something, lets me see actual improvement which in and of itself only motivates me more to keep training. Conversely, every time I have stuck my head back on quick matches to see if my training will help there, the result has not changed at all, still usually get perfected or maybe do a little block damage prior to my defeat. I have spent more time in casual - beginner lobbies though as people have suggested and definitely found the skill level there closer to my level (mostly) and thus the experience more enjoyable.

Anyway, having followed Dime's advice on this and found great results from it, I would highly recommend to others who hope to actually get better to seriously consider taking advance of nightmare difficulty arcade mode as a bridge between training mode and playing real players, especially if your just starting out, but even if you're just wanting to practice executing a new combo in a live match against a (relatively) unpredictable opponent.
 
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@DanTheMeek

Yeah, continue to play the computer, but make sure that you are getting beginner lobby matches in as well.

Right now, if you can stomache it, it should be one part training mode, one part ai practice, and one part people practice.

You want to start to play people as much as possible, but imho, until you get the ability to go around 50% or so in beginner lobbies I think you should be spending more time in training mode and versus the computer practicing execution.

The reason, which others seem to just gloss over is you've already shown frustration so I want to try and give you the most rewarding path to experience as possible... If not at a slower pace.
So this imho is the least frustrating path.

Frustration isn't conducive to learning in most people, it is conducive to quitting. So I want to try and curb that frustration as much as possible.
 
Frustration is a part of getting good though. If you just baby someone with positive reinforcement for beating up something that barely fights back it's gonna hurt them when they play real people unless they're literally only doing it to get a solid grip on fundamental shit like movement or confirming under any kind of pressure which are already pretty easy in skullgirls. Those are also both things you can practice against other players (ideally of a skill level close to yours) while learning other important things like how to not get hit by something other than the predictable mess that is skullgirls' AI, but hey, then you don't feel as good about yourself so why bother?
 
Frustration isn't a part of getting good.

Every game I've ever been frustrated in, consistently, I've never been good at (and I no longer play)

I haven't been frustrated much at all by skullgirls, and funnily enough it's one of the games I'm best at... Coincidence? Probably not.

If anything I would say that the "good" type of frustration ( if there is such a thing... Which I sincerely doubt) comes after one has made it to intermediate level... Which dan..IS NOT AT Therefor the frustration that he is experiencing isn't the good kind. THERFOR its best to keep that to a minimum.

Also, there is a huge difference between being challenged and being frustrated.

Frustration is almost never a good thing, it makes one want to quit, and like one is not progressing.

Does anyone here that is good play the game to feel a sense of helplessness? Do they play the game to feel a sense of wasted time?

I don't. And if I ever felt that way about sg I certainly wouldn't be playing it any longer.i have a feeling that what you consider frustration is simply a challenge.

But they don't go hand in hand.

Frustration is to challenge as dehydration is to thirst.
 
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Play to win each match regardless of their skill level. If you are voluntarily surrendering matches, you belong in a different game genre. You won't improve without a competitive mentality.
 
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Players who give up during a match just because they are losing deserve to be taunted; if the connection quality is rubbish then it's okay. That's called wasting the other player's time and deserves no respect. If you're not enjoying the taunting, feel free to quit and be blocked from any future opportunities to actually learn from those players hands-on and ask questions (they won't be answering your questions after that, trust me). Losing is a part of the learning process.

Suggestion for finding more players willing to put up with your behaviour of quitting after getting put into a combo once, play something else. That's a terrible attitude to have in a competitive genre. Also, stop blaming the combo length for your losses.
 
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DanTheMeek said:
So I don't know if it just takes 100 games for quick match to actually place me or what, but 95% of my quick matches are against players infinitely higher level of skill and ability then me. I can usually tell within the first 5 seconds of the match cause the moment I dare to do anything but hold back (or some times even in spite of doing so) I end up watching myself get juggled in a 30+ hit combo. At that point I begin the hold my stick toward my opponent, walking toward them in an "I concede, please just do you're favorite, highest damage combo, and end this quick please so I can return to the queue and hope next time I'll be against some one as weak as myself". But 9 times out of ten when I do this, the opponent, once they realize I've stopped fighting back and am actively aiding their ability to kill me, stop attacking me. They jump around the screen, block in the corner, and do all sorts of various things, but they refuse to attack me and end it. Usually I'm forced to either go get a book to read until we time out, or start fighting again just to try to force them to start their game ending combo, which they often do if I force them to by attacking enough (though so times they're so good at evading even that becomes a waste of time and I just go back to my book) but regardless, I don't understand this behavior. If one player did it, okay, whatever, but again, this probably happens in about 90% of my matches. The other 10% being the 5% that actually just kill me, and the 5% who are at my skill level so we play out a full match and I usually still lose, but at least its competitive and their combos are as short as mine so I feel like we're both actually playing instead of like I'm watching some youtube combo video.

Now I'm not saying there's anything wrong with these guys using there crazy long combos on me, that's part of the game and I know that's always a possibility at the beginning of any match, they put more hours in the training lab then I have and they deserve to enjoy a game of solitaire against me while I walk into their attacks as a reward, I admit I wish the quick match system would find more casual level opponents for me, but maybe such players just don't exist, I don't know, but more importantly, I'd really like to know why so many of the strong players won't let me get back into the queue, isn't their own time precious, wouldn't they rather be playing some one who could give them an exciting match rather then dancing around the screen or repeatedly jumping to either side of my character, occasionally light punching my head? Also, is there anything I can do to reduce this behavior, should I just keep throwing out random attacks to give them counter hit starters or something, try to work on pretending to fight back more believably? All thoughts appreciated.
 
I'll be honest; I don't taunt. I rather fight to the bitter end, win or lose and enjoy the fight rather than to taunt a beginner just learning. Everyone need to earn their stripes someday and rather than to give a person their stripes, I make people "earn" then through me.

So, don't expect me to taunt. :/
 
When I fight a beginner and I realize it mid-fight, I just choose Parasoul, as I don't know how to play her. This is hoping that the beginner in question doesn't leave the game afterward.
 
I'm shocked that this thread is still going, but since it is, I'm going to try to illustrate for those who don't understand why some players like myself quit, why we quit.

Consider the following scenario. Two men are alone in a room together, one has a gun pointed at the other (the results of extensive training, maybe a background in this genre even before this game), the other has his hands tied behind his back and a blindfold over his eyes (their lack of training and ignorance to the gap in skill not only limits their ability to fight back, but makes them blind initially to just how over matched they are). Again and again the blindfolded one trys to struggle, trys to tackle or take out his captor, only to get knocked around and put in his place by the one with the gun. Finally, after getting repeatedly and completely physically dominated, the blind fold moves up enough that the blindfolded guy sees the gun in the other hand and realizes he has no realistic chance of escape, so he drops to his knees and lowers his head, accepting his fate that he is to die.

Unfortunately for this captive, even though the man with the gun's ultimate goal was to shoot and kill the captive from the start, rather then take the opportunity to do what he was here to do from the beginning, or be grateful for the captive for letting him complete his mission, or even to take pity on this clearly physically and now mentally defeated as well opponent, he takes offense to the fact that his captive would want to stop struggling. It turns out that even though his job was to kill him, he actually took more pleasure from watching his captive struggle then from the actual kill so this pisses him off when the captive stops struggling. As a result he doesn't grant the captive his wish, instead he just keeps threatening to shoot but not doing it, emotionally tormenting the helpless captive, doing everything he can just to try to taunt him into wanting to fight back again.

Finally the captive snaps emotionally and dashes with everything they've got at the captive, once more with hope, no matter how bleak, that they might knock the gun away. And then, and only then, when the captive has not only been mentally and physically dominated, but emotionally as well, only when they've been denied a chance to die with dignity and once again have hope of escape, does the man with the gun, gun the captive down and smile with satisfaction.

----

Now I understand that's a pretty extreme and over the top analogy and not a perfect one by any stretch, but its still not a bad representation of how a player, such as myself, feels in these situations. You've mentally and physically dominated me, my hope of getting out of this alive, while not 0, is like 0.0000000000001%, so rather then continue to struggle meaninglessly I try to accept my fate and just let you end it... and this actually offends you, you weren't playing me to beat me like I was you, you were playing me to see me struggle, to see me squirm beneath your thumb, and if I won't struggle or squirm its no fun anymore, so you refuse to end it, you taunt me, jumping around me but refusing to finish me, and only when I try to struggle again, give you reason to believe I believe I might have regained some semblance of hope of winning, do you dash that hope by finally obliterating me.

Just food for thought, and I don't really mean offense to anyone by this so I apologize in advance if anyone takes it that way, was just a thought that came to me about how to best describe what these situations feel like from the end of the player whose giving up.
 
Skullgirls will always be Skullgirls

TUE4f-245.png
 
DanTheMeek said:
0.0000000000001%
You still have a chance. Nothing risked=nothing gained.
I read through the paragraph and still feel that the blindfolded man was able to improve, since he went from blindly thrashing about to being able to see the situation. Now, suppose that captive had to go through that scenario 1000 times. Sure, the first hundred or so he'd fail miserably. But what if he started to think about his actions and his captor's actions before he goes through a scenario, trying out different strategies to win? Sure it may still prove fruitless in the end, but if he does something different everytime, he'll always be learning.

As for individual people, they may not be taunting, they may just want to be playing a fun match. If they think they are dominating, they may do non-winning strategies to have fun. I know a couple of people who will start doing not optimal stuff to mess around, hopefully for both sides to have a chance. But that's a indivdual-by-individual basis.
 
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DanTheMeek said:
you weren't playing me to beat me like I was you, you were playing me to see me struggle, to see me squirm beneath your thumb, and if I won't struggle or squirm its no fun anymore, so you refuse to end it, you taunt me, jumping around me but refusing to finish me, and only when I try to struggle again, give you reason to believe I believe I might have regained some semblance of hope of winning, do you dash that hope by finally obliterating me.

I think you've got it all wrong. Me, and others like me, pressed the find match button to play Skullgirls. I don't care how good you are, I just want to hit the play button and play the game, not the training room. If anything you're taunting ME.
 
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DanTheMeek said:
You've mentally and physically dominated me, my hope of getting out of this alive, while not 0, is like 0.0000000000001%, so rather then continue to struggle meaninglessly I try to accept my fate and just let you end it... and this actually offends you, you weren't playing me to beat me like I was you, you were playing me to see me struggle, to see me squirm beneath your thumb, and if I won't struggle or squirm its no fun anymore, so you refuse to end it, you taunt me, jumping around me but refusing to finish me, and only when I try to struggle again, give you reason to believe I believe I might have regained some semblance of hope of winning, do you dash that hope by finally obliterating me.

Perhaps it's a reflection of my unnatural love unwavering allegiance for the Spider Queen Juri Han, but this is partially true IMO. The most fun part of the hunt, is the chase. You want a challenge as you bring someone/something to it's knees. You want the target to fight back. To make it interesting. To make you work for it. To let you savor the victory even more. And then when you lose, the concept that you can still grow and get even better is exciting. It's not about obliterating your hope of winning, its about fighting somebody who wanted it just as much as you and coming out on top. When you give up and stop fighting, its not fun because you clearly didnt want the win.

If I wanted to fight something that didn't fight back, and wanted 100% guaranteed victory, I would just plug in a second controller and beat on a lifeless opponent all day. There is no satisfaction in that though. Fighting games are designed purely with the competitive mindset being brought to the table. You want to win, but deep down you want to earn it. When someone sets down the controller, it's insulting because I've poured weeks, if not longer, of my time into a game in the hopes of taking down stronger opponents, but you can't be bothered to even try? When you give up, I am merely beating on a training dummy, when I could be fighting somebody who will play, and learning from the experience. It's a waste of everybody's time if you quit playing. Either fight back, or just close down the game so I can get to a real opponent. When I start jumping around without blocking, its not an "Lol you suck scrub im gonna play with you before I kill you.", its actually a "FUCKING FIGHT ME YOU ASSHOLE! I DONT TRAIN JUST FOR YOU TO LAY DOWN AND TAKE IT!"

To quote Augus from Asura's Wrath "The only reason we fight, is the fight itself.". There is nothing else past it. We fight, for the sole purpose of fighting. Not some deeper meaning that you seem to have deduced from reading too much psychology based shit.
 
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Skarmand said:
I think you've got it all wrong. Me, and others like me, pressed the find match button to play Skullgirls. I don't care how good you are, I just want to hit the play button and play the game, not the training room. If anything you're taunting ME.

My hero~
 
As a bit of an exercise/experiment, I changed my steam name to "Can't push buttons" and queued up for quick matches. I did nothing but block, tech throws, and try to defend resets to the best of my ability.

People were absolutely fucking livid that I wasn't "actually" fighting back, despite actually trying my hardest to make the best of a weird handicap/situation.
 
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You probably don't need to butcher every green player that comes your way. I'm probably nuts for thinking that cultivating some new blood for our game is worth a little HP. If the skill gap is that big, I'm gonna win. But I can do it with movement, reaction counters, and single-string punishes, using it as a training exercise for my lacking fundamentals. And just as importantly, I don't run off a possible new player that our very modestly-sized community could stand to have.
 
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hlvn said:
As a bit of an exercise/experiment, I changed my steam name to "Can't push buttons" and queued up for quick matches. I did nothing but block, tech throws, and try to defend resets to the best of my ability.

People were absolutely fucking livid that I wasn't "actually" fighting back, despite actually trying my hardest to make the best of a weird handicap/situation.

I think I saw you on Hops stream. Hops wasn't really mad he was sort just WTF. It was pretty funny and interesting though.
 
OP quit the game, can lock thread. You new players need to research what fighting games are and stop expecting experienced players to handle you with kiddie gloves. Also, you need to stop being lazy and post up asking for matches with other beginners.
 
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I've seen some dumb analogies in my time but wow that was a really dumb analogy.

What you're trying to describe is nothing like a guy tied to a chair being emotionally tormented or whatever by a guy with a gun. Your analogy implies an imbalance in power and a large difference in tools available to the two players which is wrong.

It's more like two guys with guns, one who knows how to use it effectively as a result of hard work and dedication, and one who just picked it up, doesn't understand anything about it and whines like a child then throws his gun on the ground when someone else uses it more effectively than he does. He then posts on the internet about how experienced people messing around to give him a chance but still beating him makes him feel bad.

If you try to take that chance and fuck up, instead of complaining about how that damages your self-esteem you should take a step back and consider why you fucked up. Maybe even consider how you could avoid making the same mistake in the future. I hear that's an important part of getting better at fighting games.
 
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As a fellow newbie, you could at least take the chance to practice your blocking while the other guy tries to destroy you.
 
Hey since this thread has been beaten to death, add me on Steam guys. Can't go from scrub to EVO champ without having to face ERRYBODY. Yep, even the Ducks, Omnis, Sevs, and MegamanDSs of the world.
 
DanTheMeek said:
snip

I'll offer a better analogy. It's like a runner who quits a race because they're in 2nd place. The other analogy is a bit too extreme.
 
wiredgod said:
If you think playing Skullgirls is disheartening, wait until you get out of college.
So true, I graduated end of 2007 with my bachelors degree in computer science, and from 2008-2011 I was working in a high school cafeteria as a "cafeteria lady" to make ends meet while I used my degree for an over sized book mark. In 2012, because I wasn't making enough money serving angry hormonal teenagers food I was forced into taking a job at a home warranty company call center and let me tell you, I spent a year at that company and I would not wish even a week of that job on my worst enemy, it was truly the most horrible experience of my life and I routinely found myself fighting the urge to drive the wrong way into traffic just to end my nightmare of an existence. If you've ever worked a similar job, you understand, if you haven't, you really REALLY can't possibly understand how bad it is to work 6 days a week, 10 hours a day, in a job where all you do is give people bad news who then do everything in their power to personally emotionally destroy you and instead of trying to calm them down or hang up on them as they curse you out and tell you how they plan to write down your name and make it theirs lifes goal to see you ruined, you have to continue to try to convince them to not cancel their contract with your company.

Anyway, in 2013 I finally got a job with my degree and one I love to death and pays me more then I ever thought I'd be making, but it was absolutely hell to get to here after college.
 
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It isn't that hard to understand the concept of fighting games in general.

If you are weak, you will be extinguished, if you are strong, you will be rewarded with newfound capabilities.

If you appreciate this game like you say you do, you will find a way to get better at it like those among you.

I don't even play this game, but I am more then satisfied with my lackluster ability in it. I am not a scrub, I simply choose not to get better at this specific game because I do not like it. But one thing I don't like more than this game, are potential players who decide its more important to do battle with themselves rather than their opponents.

Before I even play anyone else I would start thinking about my own problems first. I'm pretty negative but your aura is massively working against your ability to get better at the game, in other words, its better off to just kill yourself because that is all you are doing when you play.
 
Icewave said:
It isn't that hard to understand the concept of fighting games in general.

I didn't experience this at all haha. In fact quite the opposite... I see beginners even now getting into games like SG and thinking its all about "xx hit combos" without understanding what is actually at play during the game that is allowing their opponents to be all over them, not understanding the concept of proper defense and having little to no knowledge of any kind of spacial awareness or control.
 
Broseidon Rex said:
You still have a chance.

I've been hit by infinities at the start of rounds in Marvel and came back from a magic pixel when they dropped the combo. Stuff happens.

Icewave said:
If you are weak, you will be extinguished, if you are strong, you will be rewarded with newfound capabilities.

 
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As someone who spend a stupid amount of time on Quick Match, I usually back off because my comfort zone is 3/4 screen away. It's really not because I am trying to taunt or go easy or anything. My reaction time is bad and I need the distance to react. I only do combos when the opportunity presents itself.

So if you ever see a Bella that just dash back and forth on the other end of the screen waiting for nothing to happen, that might just be how the person plays.
 
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123stw said:
As someone who spend a stupid amount of time on Quick Match, I usually back off because my comfort zone is 3/4 screen away. It's really not because I am trying to taunt or go easy or anything. My reaction time is bad and I need the distance to react. I only do combos when the opportunity presents itself.

So if you ever see a Bella that just dash back and forth on the other end of the screen waiting for nothing to happen, that might just be how the person plays.
Wait, that's how you normally play? I figured you were just trolling me.
 
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