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I've been playing Revelations, and while I didn't exactly have high expectations, I am very disappointed.
I haven't finished it yet (at chapter 20, as the majority of my playtime is farming for supports), but everything from the map design, to the balancing, to the story is not good. I wasn't expecting much after all of the negative feedback I had seen, but it definitely is the worst of the three routes imo. It isn't really a bad game either on its own, but compared to the other two (which have their own issues), it's not great.
The gameplay really feels like a mess; the balancing is frankly beyond shitty, the maps are all gimmicky, similar-feeling, and honestly a chore a lot of the time, and the story feels contrived and rushed. A lot of characters are bad, with a decent number of them being useless, while others are fantastic (Ryoma and Xander are somehow even better here). The maps don't really require any strategy and are extremely chokehold focused, which means most of the time you feel like the map is just asking you to throw Xander/Ryoma at everything.
I'm having trouble giving a shit about what's going on most of the time, and there's a lot of moments that just fall flat. For example,
at one point Izana dies, for a really idiotic reason, which is to tell you to go look for a dragon. This goes basically nowhere and doesn't help progress the plot; the dragon is actually the Rainbow Sage, and having that prophecy doesn't enable you to find him, or anything. It's just more of a "Oh, he's the dragon, so that's what the prophecy was!". That knowledge isn't used to accomplish anything, and this really bothered me.
To be fair, it isn't like his death is supposed to be a hard-hitting moment; it just felt useless to kill a character off for such a small thing.
The only thing I really like in Revelations are the supports. Almost all of the added ones are legitimately good, and I've enjoyed reading them. I can't think of one I've not liked, minus two, which are Setsuna and Selena's and Camilla's and Hinoka's.
The interactions between the two royals families are good, too, even in the story. They lead to the best supports, imo (Leo and Takumi being one of my favorites from the royal family supports), as they're genuinely well-written and interesting.
Overall, Revelations is definitely the worst route of the three. It isn't terrible, but it isn't great, either, and that's disappointing.
The funnest thing about Revelation is seeing how long I can grind for supports and children before I engage chapter 18
Or before I go insane
Honestly the latter sounds more probable
Man I had planned 2 playthroughs each path but my all children Revelation run in honestly killing me.I should've picked Lunatic so I could at least have some challenge.
I love Fates, but I have soooooooooooooooo many nitpicks and issues I feel are legitimate. Like seriously.
To kinda keep it short, I feel the children weren't necessary and should have been cut, maybe turn a few into side characters, add them as actual paralogues in the story, Conquest kinda needed it badly for the higher difficulties. Additionally, a lot of story units (Reina, Shura, Gunter, Izana, Fuga, Flora), still don't have any conversations apart from one character and the avatar, some like Reina and Shura even less. I thought they'd have fixed this from Awakening, not made it worse.
Given the game design and increased amount of units you get, the grinding to get all the child units feels like such a slog. Especially since a lot of the child units I feel are even more one-note than before. Not to say they aren't enjoyable, but since they still can't get supports with other adults aside from the avatar and their parents, they still feel completely disconnect, which makes me want them even less. Like, why can't Forrest have a support with Xander? It would make a lot of sense, or a competition between Ryouma's kid and Takumi? Supports between the kids and adults that can't marry said parent would have been great, if only 1 or 2 of them.
Like I said, a lot of this can be seen as a nitpick, but I feel it held the game back from being a more fluid experience.
This game definitely doesn't have nearly as many (good) supports in general,but I like some of the children too much to outright want them gone,and I feel some kids characters only make sense being descendents (I really love Siegbert and Shiro,but I'd be hard pressed to say they're characters could make sense without be descendents[also Soleil goddamn])
I'm pretty torn on whether I like this better than Awakening,but I can at least say all of Conquest trumps 95% of Awakening in terms of difficulty and fun
The other 5% is Priam
The map that made me glad I'm too much of a coward for classic
Also there are no super fucking hype same sex supports like Olivia and Maribelle or Chrom and Gaius
So I just accidentally deleted my Revelation file while making a point to myself
I'm fucking dead forever now
I had twelve of the children--FUCKING TWELVE
I had managed to grind up Odin--FUCKING ODIN
All those marriages and Paralogues and multiple runs through Boo Camp made irrelevant
I think I'm gonna restart on Lunatic now,at least.
Fucking Revelation Chapter 7 on Lunatic tho
I'd say this game trumps Awakening in pretty much every way. More variation in the classes, better designed stages that aren't just enemy rushes, more victory condition, a more refined class system, better skill allocation, more consistent stories, DLC actually worth my money (the legacy unit dlc was not worth the price for the reward imo). It's just infinitely better. Still not up to what I wanted, but my expectations were a bit too high for what I knew was coming anyways.
So far I hate the story tbh. Not too far in as I play like 1-3 chapters a week, but I haven't really gotten any entertainment out of it. The supports feel rushed and trying too hard to develop characters in too short an amount of time, and the main story is thematically/emotionally gimped by Nohr's general assholishness on both routes. Awakening at least rose to the level of a guilty pleasure for me. Here I'm just yawning mostly.
Fucking A++ gameplay though. Probably tied with FE7 as a favorite.
So far I hate the story tbh. Not too far in as I play like 1 chapter a week, but I haven't really gotten any entertainment out of it. The supports feel rushed and trying too hard to develop characters in too short an amount of time, and the main story is thematically/emotionally gimped by Nohr's general assholishness on both routes. Awakening at least rose to the level of a guilty pleasure for me. Here I'm just yawning mostly.
Fucking A++ gameplay though. Probably tied with FE7 as a favorite.
Yeah, a lot of people don't like the story of Fates.
It's funny, because IS really hyped up the story of this game.
It's funny, because IS really hyped up the story of this game.
Yeah. Much like Awakening, they have some really cool ideas, but they just can't seem to get the execution right.
Except, I honestly think Awakening was much better written despite its flaws. It knew what it was (a light hearted, escapist adventure), and (despite some flaws in the second half) it succeeded for the most part. After the prologue, Fates just feels like a complete mess to me, like they didn't know what the fuck they wanted.
I'll keep an open mind though, maybe the finale will make me like it a little bit more when I get there. Which would make it the opposite of Awakening (good first half, fucked up second half).
anyways, Fire Emblem Blazing Sword for the GBA is on the Wii U Virtual Console for about 8 buck and some change. I highly recommend it for its gameplay, story, and general writing. The gameplay is a very classic SRPG experience with a lot of good map design, good units, and good variety. I really suggest to pick it up if you want a good Fire Emblem, which seem to be rare these days.
it's more that I've come to realize that I dislike the Awakening style of getting all the right skills and reclassing and shit
while, I had a lot of fun making as many of my units as I could into Heroes (my favorite FE class), I didn't really get the sense that anyone was really standing on their own merits, even with new stuff like Personal Skills (most of which are trash)
as such, i hope that they dial back on the reclassing stuff in future FEs and let units be themselves again
Awakening had a better story then any version of Fates IMO (not saying a lot, just goes to show how much I dislike Fates story), but Birthright feels incrementally better then Awakening in terms of gameplay. Not by a lot though. Awakening is mostly a solid game (IMO as far as "grind anytime" FE's goes, it's better then Sacred Stones by a long shot), who's failings gets exaggerated heavily.
fire emblem and good story have always been
acquaintances at best
let alone ever married
Yeah it's true tbh.
People like to nostalgia goggle the old games and talk about how they were "mature" and full of "political intrigue". With some notable exceptions, most of them were excuse plots and fairly basic variations of "you beat the bad guys".
Admittedly, most of them were well executed excuse plots that managed to be pleasant and charming enough to make reading them enjoyable if not altogether memorable. And then of course you have the legitimately good memorable storylines like Blazing Sword, Path of Radiance, and apparently Genealogy (haven't played that one myself, though). A notch below that and you have some guilty pleasures like Awakening and Sacred Stones.
I am kinda outright face palming at a lot of aspects of Fates story though, and yawning at the rest.
hoooonestly Fire Emblem should stick to charming simple stories and focus on radical characters, but the current trend of "everyone can S-Rank" is kinda counterproductive to that since a lot of the supports are really basic that lead to a romance as opposed to more insular, character building ones that let us learn more about the characters and their place in the world and relation to other characters. Though, I still enjoy stuff like characters being able to end up together since it also offers closure on their character development as laid out by the supports.
I just the think the eugenics-based character pairing is overall detrimental to the character development, even if I'd absolutely love a proper multi-generational Fire Emblem like Genealogy to be utilized again so that the pairings/child units can actually shine and gain development rather than be spawned by some torrid plot device that allows them to exist. I legitimately enjoy some of the kids in Awakening and Fates but fuck the narrative gives them zero elbow room in the slightest.
I think they are trying too hard to get us attached to side characters (so they can be our waifus/husbandos, of course) when they simply don't have enough time to do it within supports. You really can't develop a character in that way within such a short amount of time, even if you're an A++ writer. I find the "sitcom humor" in Awakening's supports preferable (if not that great in its own rights) to Fates because at least it's not trying so hard.
You need time if you want a character or relationship to have that kind of texture, something that can't really be achieved in 4 fucking convos. It just ends up rushed and unsubtle otherwise.
If they want more meaningful side characters, they need to either add more supports (like double the number of convos AT LEAST), or better yet, give characters more meaningful main/side plot stories (think Jaffar in 7. Now that was great) to develop them alongside the supports.
Of course, that's just my issues with supports, not the main story. Which is even bigger a mood killer imo.
the story is its own barrel of fish, yeah
i actually don't mind the setting of Fates too much. The two kingdoms with the assortment of principalities and dukedoms and fiefs is actually pretty rad, but the smaller parts didn't really get enough focus beyond "well we're here time to fight"
it'd be neat each land got a bit more focus on how the conflict between the two big dogs has affected them beyond "Well Garon is trying to genocide us" or "well we're neutral" or "well, we're trying to beat everyone"
not to mention Nohr is just mordor levels of evil and Hoshido is perfect japan
there's so little moral ground beyond "but these people working for Literally J. Satan are my fam :(" and "Well these are my perfect japanese siblings from my perfect japanese homeland"
honestly, a retooled neutral route for the main campaign with a more in depth and far reaching series of choices would have been a lot more interesting and fun, as opposed to a route deciding single choice.
The only moral quandary in Conquest is killing Shura for the Boots or not (i chose boots)
Aside from a few notable exceptions that I refuse to ever shut up about, FE has always had pretty bad plot, but I feel like the ways that it's been bad has shifted. Most Fire Emblem plots are bad because they're cut/paste jobs with some minor set dressings that barely change anything. Mad King invades a neighboring nation that they were on shaky but peaceful terms with for no reason, a Prince from the invaded nation takes a small army for an attack against the king, picking up support along the way, until they storm the castle and defeat the king, only to find out that a dragon was behind it all. That plot covers nearly half of the games in the series, more so if you stretch it a bit.
Awakening, on the other hand, tries to shake it up a little, but the plot has different problems now. It fails to keep a consistent tone, it relies far too heavily on contrivances and deus ex machina, the story abandons all thoughts consequences, and characters aren't given clear motivations.
With Fates, it's different depending on the version.
Birthright is just more traditional boring Fire Emblem; lost prince of a peaceful nation takes arms against conquerors, repels the invaders, storms the capital, and kills the mad king (Who was being controlled by a dragon, but you need to give us 20 dollars if you want to figure that one out).
Conquest is like Awakening magnified, in a sense. It goes for something original for the series, but gets so so so so so so much wrong. The entire plot hinges on several huge contrivances (How did Azura get the crystal ball, why did it break, why did Garon not know about the Hoshidan throne, why did he say his plans right in front of the people that he wanted to stay loyal etc.), none of the characters have clear motivation, and the tone is fucking nonexistent.
Revelation is just... too bad to even put into words. It's so trash, it manages to have a worse story that FE1; literally having no plot would have been better than Revelation. It's just so... uggh.
Fire Emblem Blazing Sword for the GBA is on the Wii U Virtual Console for about 8 buck and some change. I highly recommend it for its gameplay, story, and general writing. The gameplay is a very classic SRPG experience with a lot of good map design, good units, and good variety. I really suggest to pick it up if you want a good Fire Emblem, which seem to be rare these days.
I'll disagree. Most FE plots are "solid" even if only the exceptions fall into remarkable territory (ie 7 and 9 being remarkably good and Fates being remarkably bad).
Awakening, on the other hand, tries to shake it up a little, but the plot has different problems now. It fails to keep a consistent tone, it relies far too heavily on contrivances and deus ex machina, the story abandons all thoughts consequences, and characters aren't given clear motivations.
I felt completely opposite on the tone. I thought a consistent tone was Awakening's greatest strength: it knew it wanted to be a more light hearted, straight forward adventure, and it kept that up very consistently. It had some darker moments, but they were never taken the point of feeling out of place or "edgy". I didn't notice any character motivation issues either, outside of one specific scene. In fact I'd say it was pretty solid in that department too.
My biggest problems with Awakening are:
-The Wallhart arc is terribly paced and features a villain the characters have no emotional connection with and have no development with
-Deus Ex Machina's and certain characters acting out of character in the last arc, on top of similarly weird pacing. They should have ended the game after the Validar fight tbh (I actually like the way that panned out). Or at the very least cut the interim two missions and the Persona 4-esque "your allies call out to you" moment in the Grima fight.
It had enough pay offs though that I ultimately consider it a "guilty pleasure" alongside the similarly flawed Sacred Stones. At the very least I can say it kept my interest for longer then Fates.
the biggest issue with Awakening is that none of its ballsier moves stick and the Valm arc is terrible in general
i'd also argue that the stuff with Grima/time travel was shit and just an excuse to have kids and shit but that's not as here or there as the bigger picture since the only kid that "matters" (with hard quotations on that) is Lucina who doesn't actually do much once she stops being the Masked Marth
the biggest issue with Awakening is that none of its ballsier moves stick and the Valm arc is terrible in general
i'd also argue that the stuff with Grima/time travel was shit and just an excuse to have kids and shit but that's not as here or there as the bigger picture since the only kid that "matters" (with hard quotations on that) is Lucina who doesn't actually do much once she stops being the Masked Marth
By ballsier moves, do you mean the plotline deaths who come back as spot pass characters? I think it's better if you just pretend that stuff doesn't exist lol.
I give Lucina points for doing some fairly significant stuff before joining the party (which is more then most supporting/secondary lords can say). After she joins the party, I don't think it's that she doesn't do much...it's that nobody does much as everyone slogs through the Wallmart arc. I also like her for bridging the gap between the more drammatic elements of the story (the dark future) and the lighter moments (her supports, and her relationship with her parents). Like for example the part where she tries to convince whatshisname berserker dude not to try and fight Wallhart is probably one of my favorite moments from Awakening. Overall I think she's a pretty fun character. At least, as far as a hit-and-miss game like Awakening goes.
My real problem with her is the bonehead move to put her "I need to kill Robin" plotpoint before the reveal that Robin is Grima or something. It would have made sense if it came after, but as is it's so ridiculously out of character and assholish, especially if Robin is her husband or mother.
Like if you're afraid Robin will mind-controlled backstab Chrom, why not just tie him/her up and leave them out of the fight?
not to mention Nohr is just mordor levels of evil and Hoshido is perfect japan
there's so little moral ground beyond "but these people working for Literally J. Satan are my fam :(" and "Well these are my perfect japanese siblings from my perfect japanese homeland"
Yeah that's the biggest issue IMO.
"hey guys lets write an emotional storyline where you have to choose between two factions, neither of which are completely good or bad, and both of which the player character has an emotional conneciton to"
"Good idea! But let's make one of the factions run by HitlerStalin McSuperSatan, so that nobody on that entire faction is sympathetic, including the player character if they join them."
"Fantastic! We've succesfully ruined yet another good idea. High five!"
Like seriously, the whole foundation of the drama on both routes is just fundamentally fucked.
I felt completely opposite on the tone. I thought a consistent tone was Awakening's greatest strength: it knew it wanted to be a more light hearted, straight forward adventure, and it kept that up very consistently. It had some darker moments, but they were never taken the point of feeling out of place or "edgy".
Strongly disagree. The game goes from fun time Anime hijinks to mass sacrifice to summon a dark god, war orphans discussing the moral implications of time travel, and personal sacrifice vs the good of the world. As for motivation, let's take it a character at a time.
Chroms's motivation for the first bit is 'man, I hate Plegia and love my sister, but my sister's dumb war policy won't let me invade Plegia'. After she 'died', his motivation was ostensibly to carry on her sisters memory, which he does a hell of a job of, after joining an unrelated war and routing Valm'a entire army because some French guy he kinda knew told him so. The only villain whose motivation even kinda makes sense is Walhart, who wants to unite Valm to wipe out Plegia. None of the Grimleal make sense, their entire religion is about killing themselves to summon a dark god to blow up the planet. Even if you assume that the citizenry were taught a different version, which is the only way that makes any kind of sense, Validar still has nothing. Grimia just wants to destroy everyyhing, for no reason other than we need an apocalyptic threat.
The game is also full of ass-pulls. Basilio is alive, despite the fact he got crit'd for 80. Despite the fact that Robin's dumbass plan worked perfectly because Robin is always right, Grimia can just summon themself, completely negating the need for anything in the game. Gangrel is alive, and willing to ally with the family that he hates most. Walhart is alive, and willing to join with the people who crushed his dream. Yen'fey is alive because lol outrealms. Emmyrn is still alive, because l, just... Jesus Christ, it's so dumb. Robin is still alive, because thus games writing is awful.
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