@Tomo009
@Prototype
Yeah exactly. Painwheel does kinda do well against val as far as mobility goes... But its an uphill battle because of all the things that val can abuse against painwheel once val understands the matchup and painwheels weaknesses.
Painwheels weaknesses as far as the matchup goes:
Val can double jump over painwheel and gain height priority, painwheel cant do this to val.
Val can call assist from double jump height which is super jump height... Painwheel can not do this.
Val can attack the space directly in front of her air to air via j.mk. Painwheels only facsimile is fully charged j.hp which is incredibly slow and prone to being broken by updo or hornet bomber assist of they are using assists, and if not using assists, vals j.mk will generally clean it out wither way, plus val can do fun stuff like jump forward j.mk xx airdash j.mk for really hard to avoid pressure.
Neither characters fireballs are very great in the matchup with one real exception: vals fireballs have fast startup so they can protect assist calls decently... Painwheels fireball startup is super slow and the fireball itself isnt that fast either making it hard for pw to protect assists with fireballs like val.
Val baits assists flatout ten times better than painwheel ever could because val has a double jump and double jumps allow block. There is no comparison to flight here, double jump wins all day, its faster because it has no startup and it can be blocked during unlike flight.
Val converts assists flatout ten times better than painwheel... I shouldnt even have to use an example here.. Its that obvious.
Vals ground mobility shits all over painwheels ground mobility
Vals air priority is higher than painwheels, her air move speed is better, painwheel only trumps val as far as range is concerned and then its via a slow charged j.hp or an air to ground j.mp. Painwheel has no long range quick air to airs which is a huge point of abuse in the matchup.
Vals flatliner is a better reversal than deathcrawl on the ground, painwheel definitely gets the nod in the air with thresher though. However vals flatliner has the same motion in the air as on the ground so absolutely zero thought is required whereas with painwheel you will get out an install for mashing thresher close to the ground and getting ground reset... So it takes actual knowledge of the state you will be in ... Which is harder and therefor defense isnt as good... But, thresher is a confirm so... All in all probably still in pw favor for aerial reset defense.
-just off the top of my head.
Painwheel can put up a decent fight against val... But its a war of attrition that painwheel loses at intermediate levels. At high level painwheel gets fucking gacked on by val.