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Skullgirls PC Beta Updates Discussion

Zidiane said:
A series of inescapable moves? But what if they escape?
It simply means a sequence you have preplanned and practiced.

Like an oki setup, a reset, a blockstring into assist into mixup, etc.
 
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So... my setplay is a reset? Solobella doesn't have any real Oki tools (before I could use delayed MGR on an opponent waking up to beat reversals, but maybe that's not a thing anymore), and obviously no assist anythings. I'm still not sure what exactly a setplay has to do with what I was saying.
 
okizemi isn't setplay
setplay is pretty much putting your opponent in a situation where they have to guess over and over and over again until they die. Okizemi is attacking people on wakeup. Some okizemI CAN be set play, but not all okizemi is set play.
 
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I didn't say all oki was set play.

Like just doing a meaty I wouldn't really call set play, but calling an assist and doing a sandoori mixup with cover I WOULD definitely call set play.
 
Zidiane said:
A series of inescapable moves? But what if they escape?

I'm not sure I fully understand it, but it is a mathematical approach. I think a good example is a safe jump.

This article about combofiend actually has good mention about it.
 
Zidiane said:
Solobella doesn't have any real Oki tools.

mate come on

She's a grappler with the ability to set up a slide knockdown. She's all about the real oki tools. Set yourself a sliding knockdown, get to MGR range, mix up between full range MGR, mix up with dash up c.LK c.MP/s.MK whatever into full combo. That is some basic oki, not including safejumps, crossups, and pushblock baits.

I'll give you a pass because you probably didn't know what oki/setplay was until today, and you probably already do these things without having a name for them.
 
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Setplay is just the anime way of saying "Vortex". Hit into knockdown into situation that's highly in the aggressor's favor into another hit into another knockdown wash, rinse, rinse again, and repeat.

I'd just take the setplay comment as a joke.

Edit: Oh my comment was completely ignored whoops whoops whoops.
 
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ClarenceMage said:
She's a grappler with the ability to set up a slide knockdown. She's all about the real oki tools. Set yourself a sliding knockdown, get to MGR range, mix up between full range MGR, mix up with dash up c.LK c.MP/s.MK whatever into full combo. That is some basic oki, not including safejumps, crossups, and pushblock baits.
Oh. I thought Oki was more like that thing Milia (GG) does, where she puts down one of those... invisible... circle things and does something extra as the opponent gets up. I didn't think it was just "attack them while they're getting up". Actually, I'll just go look it up. Not everyone seems to have the same definition here.
 
Yeah setplay is the new hip way of talking about oki.
 
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No no no...

Set play is something more or less like:

Sf4 akuma front throw midscreen>St.hk for spacing and timing reasons, mk or hk demonflip into various demonflip moves or instead of doing a demonflip move you could instead got for a safe jump or the safe jump and cancel into air tatsu crossup...

Okizemi is originally a tekken/3d fighter term for ground game mixups. In tekken however the mixups themselves are what is important, it matters alot less to use "setplays" just to hit your opponent with a sweep as they are teching, or make them guess sweep and then hit them mid.

Setplay is a way of denoting a SPECIFIC TIMING or spacing or both, needed to hit in order for the setup to work.

So going back to akuma, doing something like throw>dash x2>safejump is a near perfect way to describe setplay, because the dashx2 has to be timed right in order to allow for the safejump to occur. The same things goes for many unblockablesetups and crossup setups where if you time them a frame early they crossup, but a frame later and they dont.

So no, okizemi and setplay are not the same. You can use setplay against non knocked down opponents, as an example... Like what happens all day long in sg, or various on hit resets in sf4 such as akuma lk tatsu into a jab to make the opponent air recover and allow akuma to do mixups while the opponent is air recovering... Etc etc.
 
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i just use BB to punch people. and i just use Oki's i find that if i go for a "setplay" i will my booty handed to me. Like i will think that a Parasoul will not wake up napalm pillar cause i'm baiting it and i get caught by the pillar that came out.
 
Night Phyre said:
Whoever came up with some of these new, made up terms needs to be punched in the side of the head. "Setplay," is lame as hell.


I generally defer to wherever i first heard a term coined and used widely.

Abare: virtua fighter japanese term referring to attacking from a disadvantage. Later used by japanese slang to refer to mashers since mashers always attack from disadvantage. Mashers are also "random" which is the american take on the term to refer to a characters ability to hitconfirm from "random" starters.

Fuzzy guard: another virtua fighter and tekken term, used to denote switching blocks quickly to option select ducking throws and highs and blocking lows while also protecting against mids. Means something totally different once american 2d players messed up the term.

Okizeme: tekken term for hitting the opponent while they are lying on the ground. Later came to denote tekken wakeup games and would eventually be adapted to streetfighter around the time that sf4 came out.

Wasnt around during the ST era. No one called vega walldive bs "okizeme" they called it cheap shit... And left it at that.

Setplay: "I" first heard this term from japanese sf4 players to describe at the time what would come to be known as akuma vortex, and afterwards would be used to describe some sakura stuff.

Would eventually be widely used to refer to any timing or spacing specific sf4 setup that used timing and/ spacing sequences to hit the setup perfectly everytime. So back throw immediate wiffed cr.mk xx jump is a setplay.



Tldr:

The japs are better than us and THEY coined most of this terminology so they could easily explain different concepts to each other. Setplay is one of them... So if you have a problem with it... Blame them.
 
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Dime_x said:
I generally defer to wherever i first heard a term coined and used widely.

Abare: virtua fighter japanese term referring to attacking from a disadvantage. Later used by japanese slang to refer to mashers since mashers always attack from disadvantage. Mashers are also "random" which is the american take on the term to refer to a characters ability to hitconfirm from "random" starters.

Fuzzy guard: another virtua fighter and tekken term, used to denote switching blocks quickly to option select ducking throws and highs and blocking lows while also protecting against mids. Means something totally different once american 2d players messed up the term.

Okizeme: tekken term for hitting the opponent while they are lying on the ground. Later came to denote tekken wakeup games and would eventually be adapted to streetfighter around the time that sf4 came out.

Wasnt around during the ST era. No one called vega walldive bs "okizeme" they called it cheap shit... And left it at that.

Setplay: "I" first heard this term from japanese sf4 players to describe at the time what would come to be known as akuma vortex, and afterwards would be used to describe some sakura stuff.

Would eventually be widely used to refer to any timing or spacing specific sf4 setup that used timing and/ spacing sequences to hit the setup perfectly everytime. So back throw immediate wiffed cr.mk xx jump is a setplay.



Tldr:

The japs are better than us and THEY coined most of this terminology so they could easily explain different concepts to each other. Setplay is one of them... So if you have a problem with it... Blame them.
I just don't like the arbitrary usage of Japanese terms by non-Japanese players. Why okizeme? Why not ground hits? Why yomi? Why not mind games? It's not like we don't have words to describe these concepts. And then, why on earth are we using the English word, "setplay," if *that's* Japanese? Why not the Japanese word for that?

Setplay is just a shitty term, it sucks at conveying what it means. If all you end up with is some new, vague made-up terminology, why not just stick with the Japanese term? And if you're going to bother translating, why not make a term that accurately describes the concept?
 
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Setplay is a pretty clearly defined sports term that has probably been used for longer than fighting games even exist
It also has nothing to do with looping back into itself or being a "continuous series of mixups"
A corner kick ideally leads to a goal, not to "additional corner kicks which the opponent has to defend against all the time".
It just so happens that in FGs, set plays usually lead back into themselves (eg hard kd, setup, land another hit > combo into hard kd) or to death - but that's not part of the definition

If I land a hard KD, then whiff sLP, call low assist and do dashjump jMK .. I got an ambiguous setup on wakeup.
If I now just end my combo in a super, he didn't have to "guess over and over and over". It was still a setup.
Setplay is, simply put, doing setups. If you regularly say "Wow, that was a neat setup", then the player you're watching has strong setplay.

Oxford: "Set Play (Sport): A prearranged manoeuvre carried out from a restart by the team who have the advantage."

I'm not sure how it "sucks at conveying what it means".
The adjective "set" means, quoting the dictionary,
- adjective "set"
94. fixed or prescribed beforehand: "set rules"
96. deliberately composed; customary: "set phrases"
99. completely prepared; ready: "Is everyone set?"
- A "set play" is a "fixed/deliberately composed/completely prepared" course of action during a game.
In sports, this usually happens after something like a free kick, as it's difficult else to *really* prepare things (due to the natural fluctuation of where players are on the field and how they act)
In fighting games, this usually happens after something like a knockdown, but can also readily happen after "any" hit (as both characters are locked in a specific animation for a set amount of time after you connect with say a cLP)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Set_piece_(football)
"attacking players spend much time rehearsing them; set pieces are one area where tactics and routines can be worked out in training in advance of matches."

E: I'm sure Mike will be hyped when he sees 30 new notifications in this thread and then it's all some silly linguistic discussion
 
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I get it now. In SG, it would a thing you have setup if you force your opponent to block an assist. There is no specific place for it to occur like on kd, its a thing you have once your opponent is in a place you want. More or less.
 
@Dime_x yours is the definition that best accords with what I've read on it.

Is this fair to say? Set play seems to be about eliminating choices from the opponent, while mix-ups are about forcing wrong choices?

For example, no matter how you play an Akuma KD, if they know the frames, you are waking up to a disadvantage every time (though not necessarily in Ultra since apparently delayed wakeup was specifically designed to counter set play). In other words, there is no right decision, as the choice has been eliminated from you.

Meanwhile, a basic cross-up on wake-up could in theory be reversed with a DP or something similar making it an Oki decision, but not a set play.
 
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We're shoehorning real sports terminology for vidya, then?

- Having more characters alive than your opponent now known as a power play.

- Incoming character now known as a throw in.

- Last-character catheads now known as endgame fouling.
 
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I don't know if this was supposed to show that set play is a silly term
If it did, it kinda accomplished the opposite
I love your terminology

"In a power play situation, you not only get a sure setplay against the opponent's throw in, but -given that the time control is imminent- can even spend your excess meter on endgame fouling"

Hype
 
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Make another thread if you if you want to talk about 'setplay', 'Oki', etc term and how it relates to SG if the current discussion is gonna get this far off tangent. Thread purpose is for Beta feedback on updates remember that.
 
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Setplay the setplay discussion heh

also I totally feel this damage reduction on Eliza's level 3 lol, the buffer on light Osiris is nice, nothing too drastic with her changes

also Mike Z could you maybe put all the current changes into the next patch notes or something, I completely forgot what most of these changes are
 
Come to think of it, why don't we have a compiled list at any given time about what's different from retail to beta?
 
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This is all the changes including the ones that got reverted. Now all that's left is to work out the ones that stick.
 
I removed most of the stuff that was reverted. I'm still gonna do some clean up.
I like the idea of having easy access to all of the current changes. Should we keep a wiki page for this or something?
 
Which wiki do we use as a forum?
 
Couldn't we just make a topic, sticky it, and have someone regularly update the first post? Maybe lock the thread so that it's for information only.
 
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just edit the first post to have it
 
That works. I was thinking about a wiki page because we would have easy access to an specific character's stuff by those links but we can do pretty much the same thing with spoilers.
If @Number 13 or another mod doesn't mind editing the first post, that'd work nicely.
If not, I woudn't mind keeping a thread like that.
 
Added link to OP for now since I'm in a car atm so stuck using cell. Do you prefer instead for me to simply copy the info on the OP and organize sections by spoilers?

Alternatively we could also do the separate locked sticky thread too.
 
There is some cleaning up to do in that link. I'll do that and order them in spoilers so you can add that to the OP.
The only advantage of having a separate thread would be me having more freedom to edit it, but there aren't really many relevant reasons to want that.
 
And done. It should be a lot better to read now.
- Pushblock always returns you to neutral afterward, regardless of the direction you're holding. Allows PBGC into moves ending in DB or B, but requires you to pay a little more attention after pushblocking.
- Filia and Fukua have a voice clip on dashjump.
- Filia/Fukua downed and OTG frames are in the same place they used to be.
- Replays now write out the explicit assist number picked rather than the name, to avoid weird problems.
- Training Mode "Drama" setting applies to both players.
- PC doesn't load 8bit art at all, saves like 1/2 sec loading time and 10MB of memory.
- Cancelling into a super just after you kill someone in a 1v1 Down does not cost you the meter, except Big Band's Lv5 because otherwise you get stuck.
- The IPS display in training mode (with Attack Data set to Advanced) now flashes to indicate a Pushblock Guard Cancel opportunity for player 1. Note that this only occurs when you are actually cutting off some blockstun, not every time pushblock ends.
- Drama (undizzy) bar now flashes when full.
- Altered controller side choice screen to be able to display the long names of USB devices for the PS4 version, and probably the PC version eventually.
- Sprite update order now depends on current team order instead of match-start team order. Upshot is that commands like MP+HP+HK, which could be either assist or tag, are now ALWAYS assist whereas before they would vary between assist or tag depending on which of your characters was currently on point.
- PP+K is a valid pushblock command but not a valid throw tech command.
- Controller side choice screen now displays the device names instead of just "Controller 1", like PS4 does.
- Added a number in front of the custom controller names on controller select screen.
- The timer now greys out when characters want it stopped (Daisy Pusher, etc) or when time is about to run out and characters decree that Time Out can't happen (Ultimate Showstopper, etc). In Training Mode, either condition causes it to be greyed out so you can see when they're true.
- Pushblock guard cancel (PBGC) green flash now happens on normal attacks/throws/tags in addition to specials/snapbacks/supers.
- Added a nice slick animation for full undizzy bars.
- In 1v1, first Down lifebar is blue, 2nd-plus Downs are yellow.
- Stunt Double freezes the opponent for 9f longer than in the Real Game while jumping in. There is still a gap where the opponent can react, but it is much shorter.
- Final in-game portrait for Big Band, not recycling an animation frame.
- KK is now a dash shortcut and a valid pushblock command just like PP.
- Assist vulnerable frames before attacking 4f->3f.
- Fix flashing round timer during things like EKG Flatliner in Versus. Now it is properly grey while time-out is disabled.
- Tags now autocorrect like all other special moves, the exiting character will face the correct direction before the incoming character starts their action.
- Fix assists teleporting before landing under certain specific conditions (facing backward and having them blocked for most of their descent).
- Add 1200 health to everyone's lifebar (at 1.0, multiplied by the normal ratios for solos/duos). Lets you live through one more hard hit, gives you a little bit more of a chance vs some optimized junk.
- Double-snap required distance to corner reduced by 1/3. After being snapped, assists must hit the wall within 10f. (Real Game distance is 15f.) Just enough to affect most round-start double snaps.
- Solos will keep up to 1/3 a bar of red health vs a trio and 1/2 vs a duo (none in 1v1). Hitting the solo with a snapback removes all accumulated red health. The solo hitting with a snapback restores 2/3 red health if they hit a point character and 1/3 red health if they hit an assist.
- Characters do not go into preblock vs air attacks, only close ground attacks.
- Characters can block high during jump startup with UB or B.
- Can't shake stagger on counterhit.
- Cerebella has a back-of-the-head hitbox in standing hitstuns.
- Cerebella's air regular-hit-frames now have feet in her hitboxes like everyone else does.
- Fix some backward ground techs so they can't be crossed up in the corner: Cerebella's faceup, Double's faceup, Eliza's facedown, Filia and Fukua's faceup.
- Double's Flesh Step will no longer push the opponent for the first 4f that it moves. This means it may have different properties since it crosses behind them 4f sooner.
- Training Mode crossup indicator was showing up for crossing up things that are not the point character, like Napalm Tears.
- Big Band is now able to parry from preblock/block idle/postblock. In 99% of cases this doesn't matter, but in that other 1% it matters a lot.
- Fix bug where an extra wheel stuck around when cancelling Painwheel's Pinion Dash into her Lv3.
- Parasoul's snapback will not set off tears. Now she can snap characters that have tears near them.
- Big Band's Beat Extend can't be shaken for more hits if the point character blocks it, even if you hit an assist. Like Fiber Upper, etc.
- Dead assist characters are now always rendered behind everything else.
- Squigly's HK divekick combos to the 2nd hit properly vs Eliza's cr.HK, and other armored moves if it breaks the armor.
- Painwheel will not unfly if you are already holding 2 Punches and press the 3rd one. She will still unfly if you are holding a single punch and press another, or if you press/release two at the same time.
-Squigly's Sing->SBO works like it is supposed to again, I broke it in the Beta with the undizzy blockable-supers experiment.
- Double's Nightmare Legion now pulls in the opponent with the first hit, like Painwheel's Lv3. Should fix cases where it connected with the first hit but missed the followups.
- Adjust hitboxes on Filia's/Fukua's air knockback frames to match everyone else; they no longer drop out of A-Train -> Lv3.
- Double can chain s.LP->c.LP or c.LP->s.LP, thanks whoever pointed out she couldn't.
- Double-jump startup is no longer throw invincible.
- Characters whiffing hits on their own throw victims do not produce whiff sparks.
- Painwheel's ground HK Buer xx Thresher and air MK Buer xx Thresher now work on everyone. (I can't do this to air LK Buer without changing where the opponent is released to be drastically lower, which would alter lots of followups.)
- Painwheel's Buer Thresher now applies proper damage scaling after the last hit, will no longer scale damage up when done late in a combo.
- Squigly's Seria Tremolo segments retract faster because there are more of them. Now is 2f better on hit than regular Tremolo, instead of being over 15f worse. Still worse on block.
- Remove non-counterhit recovery frames on Filia/Fukua/Double s.LP, and Filia/Fukua s.LK. They were a leftover artifact of Filia being the first character.
- Increase launch height of Big Band's snapback.
- Airdashes can now be cancelled into negative-edge and motion+P+K specials/supers, in addition to regular motion+buttonpress moves.
- As per the Beta Experiment, after pushblock you still return to neutral even if there is blockstun remaining, but you can't call an assist until your
blockstun WOULD have ended normally. You can still pushblock-guard-cancel into attacks, tag, etc, just not assist.
- Ms. Fortune can recall her head between Downs.
- The first 2f of Cerebella's Kanchou slide startup are now super-cancellable, to help with run->super if you aren't perfect with your 2 punches.
- Selective character passthrough (end of Gregor, Beowulf's tackle, etc) no longer happens vs wakeup animations.
- Airborne knockback portion of wall-stick hitstun now has collision with other characters. Fixes some DHC issues with Beowulf.
- Fix abnormally long hitstun caused by trading with Fukua's beta fireballs.
- Sekhmet's j.M would sometimes wrongly count as IPS Stage 1 despite being a ground attack, since it is kind of a weird attack. Now it always properly counts as Stage 2.
- Teching Fortune's/Double's airthrows late no longer puts the teching character on the wrong side. (Global fix for all throw techs.)
- Big Band's j.LK now follows the same rules as other multi-hit highs, rather than only being high for the first hit even if the second hit is the one that makes contact.
- Big Band's ground parry no longer ends up standing in the air vs certain moves like Double's Lv3.
- Eliza's j.MK has correct blockstun for a Medium instead of a Hard.
- Hitstun bar displays after launchers.
- Sekhmet no longer gains meter when her attacks connect vs opponent pushblocking, Fortune's head, or armored moves/another Sekhmet.
- Crouching preblock (only crouching) will now happen vs air attacks, which changes nothing but removes a buggy instant-overhead setup.
- Fix just-frame standing-block-in-air/stop air momentum bug when tapping a button after certain super flashes. You still won't get an attack but you will continue your normal jump arc.
- Double's Bandwagon Rushdown has new dust that possibly more easily indicates which side she's coming from.
- Fukua's super fireball starts closer to her, hitbox expanded downward in the back; now connects fully on both block and hit vs crouching Valentine/Filia/Fukua in the corner.
- Fortune's head hits for Headbutt/Zoom/Sneeze/Nom/golf snapback no longer have corner pushback on Fortune's body.
- Redo the opponent's thrown reaction for Excellabella to look a little more fluid; fix Double's upside-down thrown frames to be in the right order.
- Big Band's LK A-Train is properly throw invincible on the active frame.
- Increase kara window on Big Band's j.HK (to H Cymbal Clash) from 3f to 6f.
- Allow Down to be held for longer after the LK during the motion for Big Band's Satchmo Solo.
- Super-cancel window on Cerebella's Diamond Drop and Merry Gorilla now ends before they go active, like all other command grabs.
- Fix Daisy Pusher armor cancel bug with Painwheel/Big Band/Cerebella.
- Extend Painwheel's F+HK hitboxes back toward her a bit so it won't whiff against close crouching Squigly.
- Fix startup of Lenny so there is no longer a frame after Peacock drops him where he isn't shown.
- Fix blocking bug at the end of Double's Flesh Step.
- Equalize everyone's airthrow to 7f startup, 3f active. Total length on whiff unchanged. Affects Painwheel/Squigly (+1f startup +1f active), Valentine (+1f active), and Parasoul (-1f startup).
- Equalize everyone's ground and air throw tech animation lengths.
- Fix some cleanup errors in Eliza's stand hit low and cr.LK.
- Fix two training mode bugs: The ability to toss your head and subsequently break the tutorial in Punishing, and the Lock'N'Load part of Cerebella's tutorial not counting hits in Beta.
- "Assist OK" lights properly indicate you can't call assists after a PBGC until your blockstun would be over.
- Fix physical extent boxes on Cerebella and Fortune's air block animations.
- Fix stuttering bug with air preblock at specific distances.
- Being hit out of snapbacks now puts you in standing hitstun instead of crouching hitstun.
- Fix Stunt Doubles (alpha counters) in the Beta.
- FINALLY fix the RoadRoller-letting-Peacock-move bug, after two years!
- Valentine's poison counter now properly beats Painwheel's Lv3.
- Valentine faces the proper way after Savage Bypass on block or when it doesn't cross behind the opponent.
- Valetine's counter super will not step out of the corner if she is in the corner, but will still step forward otherwise.
- Valentine's s.MK hitboxes expanded downward and inward so that the 2nd part misses less on crouching characters.
- Adjust the way that s.MK works so that there is no longer 1 frame between several of the hits where if you do s.HK the opponent will recover in time to block it.
- Fixed Argus Agony vs Egret Dive in the Beta.
- Filia's s.HP /\ j.HP airdash j.LP/LK->j.HK crosses over the opponent again, and s.LK->s.MK->s.HP /\ instant j.HK now hits everyone, even the characters it didn't hit before!
- Filia no longer passes through Big Band if he parries Gregor Samson. Gregor should also wallbounce sliiiightly better when far from the wall, maybe. Maybe not.
- Physical extent fixes.
- Because she's been hanging out so much with Carol, Filia's Ringlet Spike now sticks the opponent in place for 55f once per combo and scales damage to 50%.
- Because she's been hanging out so much with Fukua, Filia's j.HK is once again untechable even when not chained into, but is no longer an overhead.
- Filia's normal-jump backdash j.LK has the same trajectory as IAD j.LK.
- Filia's j.HK is also not overhead when chained into, previously was using Real Game info there.
- Updo assist comes out at the correct position relative to the point character instead of 100 pixels further forward than any other DP assist.
- Taunt is now super-cancellable at any time. You still only get the bonus at the end.
- Taunted Tenrai-ha drop is not used up until you drop a Tenrai-ha, Lv1 and Lv2 items do not get rid of it anymore; Tenrai-ha removed from un-taunted Lv3 item drop choices, can only be dropped after a taunt.
- Argus Agony small laser volley length reduced from 90f to 60f; damage and knockback on big laser increased to compensate. (Argus-item-Argus still works, Argus-LK George-Argus does not.)
- Item drop released during blockstun will not drop until 20f after blockstun ends; item drop held through blockstun can still be manually released immediately after blockstun ends.
- Startup on fake teleport (QCB+K~P) is 6f longer.
- If any assist is on the field or locked out (i.e. Peacock is unable to call an assist), Peacock can't teleport behind her opponent; HK teleport becomes MK teleport instead. Solo Peacock / Peacock with all teammates dead can teleport behind at any time.
- Peacock's H teleport is now M teleport only when your assist is incoming or attacking, once they get hit or start their taunt you can H teleport like normal, and lockout doesn't change anything.
- j.MK is now overhead. It's not gonna be a low, and she is in the air, and it's slowish, so we might as well try this for a bit. You pretty much always block it high anyway, but now she gets some mixups with landing.
- Increase hitstun on last hit of Argus Agony's big laser to help the 2nd part combo better now that there is more knockback. Blockstun unchanged.
- Argus Agony's little lasers now pass through Lenny, but still push him.
- Redrew hitboxes on Peacock's c.MK and j.HP to match the effect more closely, they both extend further out now.
- c.HK slides faster, further, and is active for longer.
- c.HP damage 950->900.
- s.HK damage 1100->1000.
- c.MK startup 16f->15f.
- s.MP startup 15f->14f.
- s.LK startup 12f->9f, it's almost like it's a light attack or something!
- LK George is now -2 on block. Advantage on hit still the same.
- Argus Agony unscaled damage returned to approximately the Real Game value; scaled damage still much less than Real Game, and staying that way.
- Airthrow tosses the opponent a bit further away, still possible to combo with falling j.MK (or previously held SoIDs).
- Airthrow leaves them slightly closer.
- s.HP cannonball +1f of hitstun, blockstun unchanged.
- Lenny finally works the way he SHOULD have from the beginning:
--- Explosion always knocks the enemy away from Peacock regardless of positioning relative to Lenny / Lenny's facing direction.
--- Explosion always knocks Peacock and her team members the opposite direction from enemies.
--- If a hit will push Lenny toward the enemy he slides further; if it will push him away from the enemy he slides much less far. This way he stays near them when he is hit.
--- After Lenny has been hit by any little laser from Argus Agony, he will automatically explode when Argus finishes (little lasers from the same-team Peacock immediately bring Lenny's life to zero).
- Cerebella's Diamond Deflector only reflects projectiles, it is no longer a physical hit without reflecting; upon successful reflect, it now only makes Cerebella invincible to projectiles, not all hits.
- Cerebella's Devil Horns invincibility stops after the active frames, super cancel period 8f shorter. (Extra time on both was a mistake in the original script. Ultimate Showstopper after blockstun ends still possible but now a 3f window.)
- Improve the opponent's movement on Cerecopter, maybe. Hopefully followup supers miss less often?
- Lock'n'Load L/M/H damage 1075/1450/1800 -> 900/1150/1400; M version 1f faster startup (combos off s.HP); H version 3f faster startup.
- Excellabella -4f recovery on whiff.
- DHCs into Cerebella's Ultimate Showstopper can now always be jumped post-flash as long as you are not committed to an action.
- Kanchou travels faster when she's going behind the opponent; s.HP->Kanchou now works on Big Band and Beowulf.
- j.D+MP has bigger vertical hitboxes while falling and longer opponent hitstop. Can hit more often and followup more easily.
- Cerecopter damage redistributed, base damage almost the same (-100 or so), fully scaled damage 721->520.
- Merry Go-Rilla no longer strike invincible during startup, still throw invincible on grab frames. Should maybe be invincible on the 1f before the grab but let's see.
-Widen hitbox on Parasoul's s.MP back toward her body a bit to prevent whiffs in some odd cases.
- Tears tossed within the first 10f of a jump, and then manually set in place by releasing the button, will now appear smaller for 30f and detonate smaller when hit during that time. The smaller detonation has much less blockstun and hitstun, and does much less damage, but might be a better alternative to nothing.
- Parasoul's Silent Scope is now more like the super that inspired it: Startup longer, still not invincible; recovery shorter, -18 on block instead of -48; sniper now waits for a target for up to 60f, and will hold their fire as long as the crosshair is not over anything vulnerable; damage 1500->1750; recovery longer on hit.
- Silent Scope now causes crumple even vs airborne opponents...that might be too good but let's see how it goes.
- Silent Scope now crumples from any height, even Nekhbet Breaker or Valentine's Lv3.
- Silent Scope now allows combos like it used to when it hits a grounded opponent.
- Parasoul's Silent Scope -18 on block -> -20. (Bikes range from +0 when Parasoul is in the corner to +19 if the opponent is in the corner, Scope is always at least -20.)
- Cat Spike no longer floor bounces if you only hit with the smack.
- Decap Attack (hitting the head) no longer gives Fortune meter for hitting the opponent; still gives the opponent meter.
- Painwheel's Hatred Install is now QCB + KK and has an extra 3-frame window to cancel to it during the startup of ground Flight. Painwheel still ends up on the ground if you cancel late. Flight startup itself was not changed.
- Painwheel's ground HK Buer now works like Excellabella/A-Train: Unblockable when opponent is on the way up in a jump; hitbox expanded; active time 4f->2f; super-cancel window very short, ends before active frames; does not cause preblock on ground opponents. (It already would not hit grounded opponents before this.)
- Increase flight speed Forward by 0.5 pixels/frame, Back by 0.5 px/frame, Up by 1 px/frame, Down unchanged. Install no longer makes her fly faster.
- Counter super +5f active counter period, -5f recovery period.
- Adjust angle of air shuriken/syringe tosses. LP is shallower, MP is unchanged, HP is flatter.
- All levels of lag vial only go away if Valentine is hit by a super or snapback, and count down at half speed when she is in hitstun.
- Savage Bypass assist starts ahead of where it used to.
- Air Savage Bypass allows Valentine to move afterward on hit only. Limited to 2 per jump, and they must be different strengths.
- Air Bypass hits for(750/825/900) and scales damage to 66%.
- s.MP all hits combo to s.HP, s.MP->MP drags downward vs air to improve comboability.
- Valentine can counter bursts, with both versions of her counter super.
- Can catch bursts with counter supers, but doing that now scales any followup combo to 50% for both versions. Countering other moves besides bursts does not scale the following combo.
- Mortuary Drop forward movement distance increased by ~90 pixels to help it connect after pushblocks.
- Level 3 won't slide past the opponent, should greatly improve usability.
- Double's Luger +6f blockstun, now is -5 at point blank. Not plus but mostly not punishable.
- Double's s.MP startup 15f->13f, damage 500->550, hitstun and blockstun +4f, recovery -4f.
- Sped up Nightmare Legion. Again. :^)
- Added new super: Monster! (No official name yet.) QCB+KK / 214+KK, places a puddle. If the opponent gets near the puddle it will attempt to attack them. Can be faked out with extended limbs like Testament's trees. Placing another puddle, getting hit, or getting thrown gets rid of any existing puddles unless they have already begun the attack. Puddle startup 15f, remains out for 540f, attack startup 9f.
- Increased minimum damage on Double's car super to 990 from 730.
- c.HP is now a cross between Fukua's and Filia's, with bigger hitboxes, better framedata, vulnerable boxes along the braid, and damage 950->900.
- All Luger bullets are 1.5x as big.
- H Luger bullet travels at a steeper angle, much faster, hits after s.HK in the corner vs everyone now; will only hit after it bounces off the floor; launches grounded opponents; and knocks the opponent much higher, once per combo.
- Hornet Bomber modified: L version 12f startup, invincible through first 2 active frames, 2 hits, doesn't go as high as before, 1200 damage. M version 14f startup, not invincible at all. H version unchanged.
- Lv5 command is now D,D+KK so it does not overlap with Monster.
- Monster does not activate if an invincible opponent touches it, only vulnerable characters; prevents time-outs when it grabs like all other grab supers; animation sped up a small bit; time after bite before opponent drops from ceiling 40f->20f; no longer adds undizzy; damage now 1750.
- Nightmare Legion hitpause for morph hits 8f->9f (Real Game is 15f, this is still quite a bit faster).
- Lower head hitboxes on Squigly's c.LK and c.MP to match the animation better and give her some low profile attacks .
- Tremolo hits low (once, like any other multi-hit low attack).
- On whiff or block, Seria Silver Chord retracts faster and has shorter recovery after the tail fully returns to her.
- Seria Drag'n'Bite -4f recovery (now +11 on hit, -7 on block), can easily link into stand/crouch LP and LK.
- Squigly's Tremolo is no longer projectile invincible, but her head hitbox has been redrawn so that it more closely matches the art. Seria Tremolo still hits low, but regular Tremolo has been reverted to a mid hit.
- Daisy Pusher specifically disallows tagging for 4f after it goes active, all other actions by the enemy are OK.
- Big Band can jump out of the recovery from a successful parry.
- Shortened blockstun on Big Band's Beat Extend, all strengths.
- Big Band's MK and HK A-Train startup -3f. MK A-Train is now only 1f slower than Excellabella.
- Redistribute damage on Khepri Sun. Fully scaled damage ~4100->~3700.
- Added 5f buffer window after L Osiris Spiral to more easily link normal attacks and continue.
- Physical extent fixes
- Fukua's L shadow is immediately ground techable, can no longer be OTG'd after.
- Removed strike invincibility on Fukua's HK drill. Now the assist is not any different! :^P
- Super fireball no longer causes sliding. Ground version is blockable post-flash (air already was).
- Forever A Clone all versions +15f recovery on Fukua (roughly until after the shadow hits); all versions do 750 damage; M version blockstun -3f.
- j.HK scales damage to 90%.
- Drillationship L/M/H startup 10/15/20; H version +6f recovery, strike invincible again on startup, for longer than before!
- (Forever a Clone) All animations are 44f long, L 22 startup before shadow appears and 22 recovery; M 26+18; H 30+14. (From the Real Game this equates to L +8f recovery; M +1f startup, +7f recovery; H +7f startup.) ; L/M/H blockstun 20/21/22f. ; At point blank L is +/-0 on block, M +14f, H +20f. ; M shadow pulls airborne opponents downward faster on block.
- Fukua's 90% scaling on j.HK properly interacts with Lv5's 200% scaling, instead of forcing it back down to 90% immediately.
- She's now putting a bit too much of herself into each one, so she can only create one at a time and she needs to wait for some of the energy to come back to her before she can make another.
- The wraith grants Tension (meter) upon returning to Fukua. The farther the return the more she gets, up to 2x the Real Game meter for travelling the full screen. If the fireball hit (including vs assists or projectiles) you get the most, if it was blocked you get less, and on whiff you get none
- Same DHC-to-grab-super fix for Fukua's Lv5 as was done yesterday for Cerebella's 360. (DHCs into Cerebella's Ultimate Showstopper can now always be jumped post-flash as long as you are not committed to an action. )
- Fix Fukua's HK Drillationship wrong 3f of invincibility as assist.
 
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