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Indivisible: Lab Zero's Action-RPG! (General Discussion)

Kit Ballard said:
I still say that they should enforce some kinda lawyer-y stuff
First off, that's impossible to do. It is impossible to enforce an agreement that someone MUST sign in order to participate in a service, without a clear idea of what the agreement means UNTIL they have participated.
You know those license agreements everyone just clicks OK on before you install software? Those aren't legally enforceable either, by the same standard.

Secondly, I'll level with everyone - part of the reason I personally don't want to use fan ideas is because if we do, said person can be a huge annoyance by wandering around and going, "Yeah you see that? That was ME!" It wasn't freakin' YOU, you didn't make it happen. You didn't do any of the work. You said some words.
I've had enough of that to last a lifetime. So I prefer just saying we're not using fan ideas, and if someone suggests something we already thought of we don't have to put up with that level of ego. :^)
 
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E!Damnation said:
Never forget Juju, right? I mean, that guy was a huge douchebag. I mean, he should have felt honored that his idea (because it was just that, an idea that Alex Ahad fleshed out) was being considered to be part of the Skullgirls lore. If Lab Zero approached me saying "hey friend, we liked your idea, would you like us to buy it?" I'd have screamed, then told them they could use it for free. Yeah, I admire them that much.

Kit Ballard said:
I still say that they should enforce some kinda lawyer-y stuff to let us say cool stuff without having it being knocked out of the final game.. it's so early into development, and it's going to be hard as fuck to stop people from saying what they'd like without totally boning the rest... It's gonna happen... as it has been proven several times over already..

Unfortunately, people are generally stupid and douchebags. He was an example of the stupidity humanity sinks too.

I don't care what people say, I will insult that guy to the day I die. I have never experienced someone so stupid and incompetent as h was. Getting a character like JuJu erased from history, simply because he couldn't read a fucking document and keep his trap shut. His arrogance and dumbshitness was his undoing and he deserves every single but of ridicule he gets.

I will say though, he was a necessary evil for us. It teaches Lab Zero not to risk such things again, and it teaches us that if we want our dreams to happen, it takes time, effort and money. Simple as that.

And what @Mike_Z said above me.

Regardless if he was necessary or not, he's a fucking retard and can go fuck himself. Thanks for killing a character that had the potential to be awesome. Hope hell has a nice spot for you. :)

I apolgoize, I just hate wasted potential. Especially if it's wasted due to incompetence.

Anyway that little rant out of the way, back to Indivisible.

I can't honestly decide on who is my favorite: Ajna, Phoebe or Razmi.

Giant Girls with Spears sounds pretty awesome.
 
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I'm spreading the word as much as I can through tumblr, even trying to reach certain fandoms, like Steven Universe (you know, giant women? Phoebe? Sadly, it's a toxic fandom and apparently they're upset after a recent drama) and the Avatar fandom, but a lot of them usually say "please fund this cause I'm broke" and that's okay, but maybe tumblr isn't exactly the best site to find potential backers, at least not in huge amounts. I'm worried about the stupid ones who prefer to spread negativity like "they won't make it", "1.5 million? Not even Destiny is that expensive!" and "the guys behind the titty fighter? fuck off cishet scum". One guy said he was going to eat his shirt if L0 makes it, so I'm spreading the word of our lords and saviors, so I can rub it in his face.
 
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E!Damnation said:
I'm spreading the word as much as I can through tumblr, even trying to reach certain fandoms, like Steven Universe (you know, giant women? Phoebe? Sadly, it's a toxic fandom and apparently they're upset after a recent drama) and the Avatar fandom, but a lot of them usually say "please fund this cause I'm broke" and that's okay, but maybe tumblr isn't exactly the best site to find potential backers, at least not in huge amounts. I'm worried about the stupid ones who prefer to spread negativity like "they won't make it", "1.5 million? Not even Destiny is that expensive!" and "the guys behind the titty fighter? fuck off cishet scum". One guy said he was going to eat his shirt if L0 makes it, so I'm spreading the word of our lords and saviors, so I can rub it in his face.

Yeah...tumblr doesn't seem like the right kind of place to spread news, but the effort is commendable! We just gotta keep trying, lets make that guy eat his shirt.
 
E!Damnation said:
"1.5 million? Not even Destiny is that expensive!"
Er? Please point me at the people that said this.
Here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_video_games_to_develop
Destiny cost $140 million, not $1.5 million. Destiny is nearly ONE HUNDRED TIMES as expensive as what we're asking for. A HUNDRED TIMES!
Activision has actually said how expensive Destiny was fairly often as part of their publicity! How can you miss that?

How is it that people can still be so clueless as to the cost of things...?
 
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Mike_Z said:
Er? Please point me at the people that said this.

tumblr_nwv7gz9Sic1uhevs2o1_540.png

Not roasting anyone... yet, but as you can see, I've been trying to fight against a lot of ignorance on that tumblr site. Not pictured is the video where you explain why Lab Zero needs 1.5 million. I believe in you guys, that's why I'll keep helping the campaign until the very end.
 
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My favorite is Kushi and Altun for sure.

When Mike mentioned empathy as the one of themes that the game is going to communicate in the interview with Newgamernation, I was reminded of One Piece. This may be a far off stretch and I don't actually know for sure if empathy is a theme in One Piece. I suppose it is and is best expressed when Luffy is bawling. One Piece and Indivisible are starting to share a few similarities. For example, the way the protagonists explore the world, meet new people, learning about their story and "recruiting" them after. I'm looking forward to how well empathy will be expressed.
 
Kyugetsuki said:
When Mike mentioned empathy as the one of themes that the game is going to communicate in the interview with Newgamernation, I was reminded of One Piece. This may be a far off stretch and I don't actually know for sure if empathy is a theme in One Piece. I suppose it is and is best expressed when Luffy is bawling. One Piece and Indivisible are starting to share a few similarities. For example, the way the protagonists explore the world, meet new people, learning about their story and "recruiting" them after. I'm looking forward to how well empathy will be expressed.
One of the greatest values in the world of One Piece (especially in the eyes of Luffy) is the feeling of friendship, fellowship, comradery. That's why term 'nakama' is thrown around alot in those series. Also that's why Luffy always gets mad when somebody else mistreats or betrays _their_ nakama - he thinks that value of fellowship is universal. Also he's trying to befriend pretty much everybody who he stumbles upon. So these are really prominent themes of One Piece, yes.
 
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Sadly, the kinda people that mindlessly bandwagon on the "it looks good but it won't get funded anyway" are subconsciously under the misconception that we're asking them to donate the 1.5mil straight away instead of contributing a small amount. I don't particularly blame them though, I guess it's human psychology to act like this when they get thrown into an unfamiliar situation without the proper knowledge that 1.5 million is not that large a sum when you look at it from a game dev business scale.
It's a lost cause to waste energy on trying to convince them otherwise, until we get to a higher amount at least.
 
This will evolve into a shitstorm mike, but now that you made a tumblr you MIGHT (as in not neccessarily) clear things a bit about one specific group of people that called one of your supporters "cis shit" about the campaign. One native to tumblr I mean.

DON'T START A DISCUSSION ON THIS POST OR THINGS WILL GO DOWNHILL I SADLY ASSURE YOU
STAY CALM AND EVERYTHING WILL BE FINE
 
ArgonBern said:
This will evolve into a shitstorm mike, but now that you made a tumblr you MIGHT (as in not neccessarily) clear things a bit about one specific group of people that called one of your supporters "cis shit" about the campaign.

I suggest you do not argue with these kinda people. Nothing you say will satisfy them.
 
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infected melon said:
I suggest you do not argue with these kinda people. Nothing you say will satisfy them.
Completely agree with Melon. Besides, as I said, I'm more worried about the guys who think they know how to run a business and create game with a few bucks. Mike has all the right in the world to be mad: L0 are trusting us, they know we're a loyal and well-informed group of fans, but there's still a ton of ignorance, and people who will whine when they realize Bloodstained is NOT Symphony of the Night 2.
 
fortunately tumblr isn't the jungle it used to be. Regardless, it is still a huge fucking mess and i wouldn't be surprised if people spread around false info about the game and LO.
 
E!Damnation said:
Completely agree with Melon. Besides, as I said, I'm more worried about the guys who think they know how to run a business and create game with a few bucks. Mike has all the right in the world to be mad: L0 are trusting us, they know we're a loyal and well-informed group of fans, but there's still a ton of ignorance, and people who will whine when they realize Bloodstained is NOT Symphony of the Night 2.

well, it's one thing to be silently mad about dumb people being dumb, and a complete other to then feed them the ammunition to shoot back at you and give them the opportunity to show more of how dumb they are
reason and logic doesn't work there, it just gives them another perspective to nit-pick and the only winning move is not to play

don't focus on correcting 2-3 shitposters who wouldn't have backed anyway, and instead focus on getting the attention of those people who don't know about Indvisible yet, the contests are one such way and I really like the idea, I even think it should be a rule to not post them on Skullheart because setting up a twitter account/posting on the official facebook page is easy and is more public, posting here feels like preaching to the choir
 
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I felt like this was the problem all along. Do people simply refuse to acknowledge that the prototype is not representative of the full game?
I think that's the case, the prototype is so well made people actually believe it represents the scale of a full 20-30 hour RPG.

edit: Also let's stop focusing on the negativity here.
 
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WaterMystic277 said:
Why the fuck was Shantae fucking 400k?

Having played a few Shantae games, they are quite short. They are quick but very fun romps.

I also don't think it is really fair to compare to other devs. Lab Zero isn't Wayforward, they aren't Bungie, or any other dev. To make a game of the scale they want, which is much grander than any Shantae game, they need more. Also quite simply, while Wayforward's care to animation is good, Lab Zero is in another league, but that detail is expensive.

It also isn't fair to pick on Wayforward in general. Their dev team makes great games, and they are delivering with their game with the same sort of promised quality (a year late, but they met stretch goals so obviously it takes longer).

Now I feel like MN9 was a disappointment, given the early concept art we seen, but that probably didn't work out looking that way because they needed to port it to every platform in the world... that and I don't think they were interested in doing the same sort of 2D animation LZ does, despite a really nice screenshot that would lead you to think it is Megaman with the artistic qualities of nice 2D games.

Those sort of shady works is why LZ put out the prototype. They're just more respectable than that and want you to get legitimately excited for the game, because I mean a nice prototype does say more in principle, and it has proven useful to have Let's Players air on their channels to spread the word and all.
 
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WaterMystic277 said:
Why the fuck was Shantae fucking 400k?
The kickstarter goal of $400k is presumably nowhere near the full budget for the game, and it looks much worse than Indivisible when it comes to production values anyway.
 
rekijitsu said:
It also isn't fair to pick on Wayforward in general. Their dev team makes great games, and they are delivering with their game with the same sort of promised quality (a year late, but they met stretch goals so obviously it takes longer).
I wasn't picking on them.
I was pretty vulgarly but honestly asking why they asked for 400k?
 
Firstly, I think that remark about Destiny was a pretty obvious exaggeration. I'm not arguing that you have the right to point out his wrongness with a straight face, but it probably wa an overkill. But I don't really care either way.
E!Damnation said:
when they realize Bloodstained is NOT Symphony of the Night 2.
It better not be! I kinda want Aria Of Sorrow 2 TBH but Bloodstained obviously would be it's own thing. In any case IGA get much more experience since SOTN, I hope it won't make same mistakes. And by mistakes I mean hodgepodge of ideas and mechanics and vast areas of nothing. Don't kick me for not being a fan, I'm not saying game is bad =O
WaterMystic277 said:
Why the fuck was Shantae fucking 400k?
I don't know which one you are talking about since I own only Risky's Revenge - Director's cut and boy does this one look cheap =/
They rotated pixel sprites, visual style is all over the place, character portraits are drawn, not pixelated, and most confusing of all - font is just so basic it's not even funny. I mean, they probably didn't have sufficient funds for fancy visuals, I can understand that, but font was really standing out.
I probably should just shut up now.
 
WaterMystic277 said:
I wasn't picking on them.
I was pretty vulgarly but honestly asking why they asked for 400k?
Because a collection of reasons led them to believe that asking for $400k was the best way for them to raise the amount they needed to make the game. That's all we know.
We have no idea what the real goal was, we can only speculate if it was higher or not. Perhaps $400k was enough for them to make a version of it they deemed acceptable. Perhaps $400k was a reasonable amount that would probably let them raise their actual goal by continuing after they hit it. Perhaps they were counting on also making money in sales afterward (since they will). There's no way to know. All we can know is that they asked for it, and they made the game.
 
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E!Damnation said:
Not roasting anyone... yet, but as you can see, I've been trying to fight against a lot of ignorance on that tumblr site. Not pictured is the video where you explain why Lab Zero needs 1.5 million. I believe in you guys, that's why I'll keep helping the campaign until the very end.

Eh? Wasting your energy on dumb non-gamers? Try another community man. Even /v/ would be better.

Also, i would've said "Why don't you eat your shit right now, and possibly get fucked while you're at it ;)"
 
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Cheesedragon said:
Also, i would've said "Why don't you eat your shit right now, and possibly get fucked while you're at it ;)"

I think you should keep this kind of thing to yourself, this isn't the way we want to portray our self's to the outside community. People who don't care about Indivisible can still spy on this thread, and telling people to go take themselves out to a nice Italian restaurant because they don't understand something is super elitist. And it's generally in poor taste.
 
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Did they announce any contests during the Valkyrie Profile stream then?
 
eh..... I found one comment on the Mike Z rant video stating that the person wished Mike would and I quote "stuff"

sigh... i don't understand, why people can just say these things with out realizing what they are saying is just horrible. I wouldn't wish anyone anything like that, much less Mike.

I'm sorry it's just that one comment made me angry and sick to my stomach.
 
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Scar said:
I think you should keep this kind of thing to yourself, this isn't the way we want to portray our self's to the outside community. People who don't care about Indivisible can still spy on this thread, and telling people to go fucking die because they don't understand something is super elitist. And it's generally in poor taste.
Seriously don't do this. This is over the top and unnecessary. Keep in mind we do have the no personal attacks/no threats of bodily harm rule, and while I'm not going to take any action as I know this wasn't the idea of the post, consider this a warning to stop.
 
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I've seen indie point-and-click adventure games fix the 'too much required money scares people away' thing by diving the game in chapters, like The Journey Down (in which our beloved Shockdingo is a VA!) who's gonna close successfully their 3rd chapter kickstarter in 3 days.

It surprises me how common this is but many people really don't get the quality difference between flash animation most 2d indies are made with and LabZero's hand-made animation. A sprite in Flash animation is like a puppet made of vector pieces drawn separated, put together and moved to similate movement. It takes time but much less than drawing frame by frame. Not to add that flash animation doesn't even have smears most of the time. Comparing Shantae to Indivisible is like comparing Rick and Morty to Avatar The Last Airbender
 
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Meow-Professor said:
Seriously don't do this. This is over the top and unnecessary. Keep in mind we do have the no personal attacks/no threats of bodily harm rule, and while I'm not going to take any action as I know this wasn't the idea of the post, consider this a warning to stop.

Should i have triple sp tagged it?
 
infected melon said:
no, just kept it to yoursef
shitflinging doesn't do anything for either side
I actually think the warning was directed to me.
 
chickenwithtie said:
The Journey Down (in which our beloved Shockdingo is a VA!)
Hey, that's great, @Shockdingo, congratulations!
Ninja said:
i don't understand, why people can just say these things with out realizing what they are saying is just horrible. I wouldn't wish anyone anything like that, much less Mike.
Yeah, if I know Mike, internet trolls don't bother him much, if at all. It's the comments where people get stuff factually wrong, those are the ones that kill him on the inside! :P


Also,
EVERYONE CARRY ON
WARNINGS WERE DISPENSED
RETURN TO YOUR NORMAL ACTIVIES​
 
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