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Another training diary that no one will read or care about

Stop up backing is my advice to you because I always seem to catch you doing that also you're valentine no need to be scurr.

I can't really remember our matches but for the most part you'd up back and cr.lk would catch you. Also try learning to pb or ag because you won't escape my el gatos if you don't (or call assist faster whatever works)

don't desperately charge napalm pillar (I don't really know if you do this but tons of parasouls do it and that gets them killed.)

good luck
 
Just played a FT15 with @Night Phyre , final score was 7-15, his favor.

I need to set up OBS on this new HD so that I can record shit like this. What I got from memory:

Bella s.HP -> Level 3 means for a way to combo into it.
Still suck at doing combos.
Still suck at mashing supers on defense. Piano method seems more consistent than using my dash macro to do the super in that situation; need to get that into muscle memory. Need to experiment with piano method on PBGC.
Val resets work well when opponent tries to deal with them "honestly". Mashed supers blow me the fuck up when I try those resets, though. Not having that many points for a reset (two at midscreen, three in the corner) probably isn't helping.
Now that I've switched away from Copter assist, that corner oki thing that I used to do with Val is much less effective against someone willing to push buttons.
Still not effective with the Parasoul overheads; the only time I ever hit with them is when the assist I use to set them up hits, and the over head combos off of the assist. My only real way to open someone up with her is still Spiral Flare.
I need to learn how to moderate my usage of Bella Glide; it's an amazing tool, but I can't help but go into either "never use it at all" mode or "use it always" mode. Gotta start mixing up Bella Glide and Tumbling Run on approaches.
 
Cynical said:
Still not effective with the Parasoul overheads; the only time I ever hit with them is when the assist I use to set them up hits, and the over head combos off of the assist.

It's about recognizing the situations where you can land it. For example, everyone at some point falls for dash in c.lk->bHK, so it's good to look out for that range where you know you can dash in with the cLK and do it when the momentum is relatively on your side. Another pretty good one is, in some scenarios, after landing when you do something like a jHP, just do a raw overhead, it trips up people more than you think it would. And there's always reset points in combos, such as at the end of the normal Napalm Shot loop for an extremely basic one that opens people up more often than it should.
 
Played a set with @Krye. Lost 7-2, which is two games more than I thought I'd win after the first six games.

After spending some time in the lab with him, learned that the Val j.lk -> s.lp crossunder that everyone knows can be made to not cross under based on when you do it after your airdash; do it early, it won't cross up; do it late, it will. So far, results in actual matches have proved pretty promising.
 
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http://www.twitch.tv/nightphyre/b/522942932 Turns out, @Night Phyre was recording our set (thanks man!)

Watching this, holy shit I suck at getting charge motions to come out correctly. Also, too many times I tried a pushblock when my assist was getting combo'd and fucked up, getting a backdash instead, and *really* eating pain for my troubles.
 
You're getting better bro! Work with Night Phyre on Cere/Para and I'll work with you on Val. You shall be me and Night Phyre's little Painwheel <3
 
Played a streamed set on @dekillsage 's "lrn2play" stream.

I'm waiting for him to stop the stream so that I can watch it in archives, but some stuff I've already taken:
In Val mirror, for my midscreen combo, use my "Squigly method" instead of my usual "Filia/Fortune/PW/whoever" method. More consistent (when I actually finally got the restand in the last game, the reason is because I decided "fuck this shit, I'm using the Squigly method, and seeing if it works better", and it did).

I "know" how to combo into Bella lvl 3, but under pressure I still don't have it; I just revert to the "normal" ending. Bad.

Need to figure out how much credit to give someone when I've shown them a reset a couple of times; one game, I got bopped pretty hard after going for an Excellabella reset, thinking that Sage would jump because I'd gone Diamond Drop there twice.
 
That's the thing man. Don't change the reset (especially if it's a unique reset to you) until they evade it. Let them evade it one more time and then go for the excelbella.

Or you can play Val like me and just be a jackass about resets. ^.^
 
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Cynical said:
I got bopped pretty hard after going for an Excellabella reset, thinking that Sage would jump because I'd gone Diamond Drop there twice.
Don't do that, go for a cr.lk instead. Beats upback just as well as excellabella, but you get SOOOO much more off of it landing
 
Icky said:
Don't do that, go for a cr.lk instead. Beats upback just as well as excellabella, but you get SOOOO much more off of it landing
this
 
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I need to do a LOOOOONG-ass training session on Val (c or s)lp -> c.mk -> c.mp.

Not because it's hard to do or anything, but because I've got too much muscle memory built up over my worse s.mp pressure route that it still comes out, and I curse myself for it every time.

EDIT: Inspired by the advice @dekillsage gave to a previous Val player, I just tried s.HK ~ s.MP (for HP LnL call)-> Dead Cross -> dash up -> s.LP -> stuff, and it combos. A bit dubious on low-crouchers, though, because you probably can't dash far enough in time to get a c.LP if you were near the edge of s.HK's range. Also, you'll probably need to follow up with s.MP instead of c.MK, because you need the vacuum effect to pull them within range of your launcher.
 
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Fuck, why am I still even bothering?

1-4 in Skullbats. Dead last of everyone who actually played (two people came in behind me for leaving after their first game). Literally 0 completed combos (I sure do love how much this game's retarded input code drops button presses). Got bodied by people with less than half of my experience.

I have literally 100% completely wasted 400 hours. So fucking pissed and frustrated.

Oh well. Only 2 weeks until I go 0-7 on stream vs. Fullbleed. Then I can pretty much quit.
 
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man you're way too hard on yourself... you arent bad

Your val is good, but your other chars you seem to drop most stuff. you got the neutral & pace of the game down fine, you just need to tighten up your offense.
With val it seems like the only reset you do is throws. Go for fastfall c.lk sometimes or do safe pressure w/ an assist call. You don't seem to use assists in your pressure/resets enough. I upbacked & mashed raw tag and it beat most of your setups.
 
Dagwood said:
man you're way too hard on yourself... you arent bad
Yeah, coming in dead last is always the sure sign of being "not bad".

Anyways, whether Val or Bella is the character where things actually happen always seems down to the luck of any given game, but Parasoul being a total disaster is a known issue that's been the case for over 200 hours. I wish I could drop her; unfortunately, thanks to a bad choice of main character 400 hours ago, I'm forced into either her or Filia for an assist, and I can't play either fucking one at all. Nothing I can really do about this; Parasoul is totally impossible for me, no matter how much I train with her (I've spent more time working on her specifically than either of my other two, and to absolutely no avail).

I really fucking resent that the game forces me into a character that's literally nothing but an assist, but there you have it.

Two weeks, and I can finally say "fuck it, I'm done."
 
Cynical said:
I really fucking resent that the game forces me into a character that's literally nothing but an assist, but there you have it.

It doesn't tho
 
But it does. Val without DP assist she can convert off of is non-viable. Duos are also non-viable (they actually have less total health than trios even after adjusting for the damage boost, roflmao.)
 
Cynical said:
Duos are also non-viable
Does TJ know this?
Anyways you're thinking about ratios in too narrow a way
Sure, 2v3s have similar "adjusted" health but that doesn't give you the full picture
as a 2 v. a 3 you get more out of pokes and reversals, esp. just burning meter on pbgc reversal since it does comparatively more damage
with 2v3 ratio it's not unreasonable to regularly get a poke or two and then kill off one conversion -- while they always have to reset you at least once
2s also recover total health faster since recovery is percentage based
 
Cynical said:
Yeah, coming in dead last is always the sure sign of being "not bad".

Anyways, whether Val or Bella is the character where things actually happen always seems down to the luck of any given game, but Parasoul being a total disaster is a known issue that's been the case for over 200 hours. I wish I could drop her; unfortunately, thanks to a bad choice of main character 400 hours ago, I'm forced into either her or Filia for an assist, and I can't play either fucking one at all. Nothing I can really do about this; Parasoul is totally impossible for me, no matter how much I train with her (I've spent more time working on her specifically than either of my other two, and to absolutely no avail).

I really fucking resent that the game forces me into a character that's literally nothing but an assist, but there you have it.

Two weeks, and I can finally say "fuck it, I'm done."

You gotta look at what actually happened, not just the results.
you beat me once, and the second game was close I basically won because I mashed super. Then the third game I mashed raw tag and got out of the corner lol. Really you do fine in the neutral you just need to keep your momentum better once you get it.

Duos are definitely viable, i think you would probably do better with Val+Bella since,from what I saw you didn't even call pillar very much.. Sure "technically" the trio is better, but, playing trio is much more punishing if you make mistakes. And they don't punish others' mistakes as hard either.


Also val doesn't "need' a dp assist, sure its good, but team construction doesn't always have to be top-heavy.
For example something like Val+Bella+Double. Sure val would be better off with dp assist, but now you got dynamo->Catellites as a plan B.
 
Cynical said:
But it does. Val without DP assist she can convert off of is non-viable. Duos are also non-viable (they actually have less total health than trios even after adjusting for the damage boost, roflmao.)
They're not-optimal at the highest level of play. That doesn't really matter for you; solo is likely to be better for you if you can't actually play your other characters.

To put it really simple, if you're playing 3v3 and your first two chars are dead while you have only damaged the opponent's point char to half life, do you just drop your stick? You're playing 1v3 there except without bonus damage/life, and it is still quite possible to make a comeback.
 
I can vouch for 1v3 Filia comebacks =D Cynical, bro. I got you. Let's get to work.
 
Came back for a brief session. Left convinced that ever touching this game again was a mistake.

I can confirm that DP assists are important enough to Val that even not knowing how to play Para, it's still better to keep her on the team. And, as soon as I have to do anything with her, EVERYTHING goes to shit. No amount of practice with either her or Filia will ever get me to a point where I can play them. Which, by extension, means that they won't get to a point where I can put Val on my team. So, unless I'm willing to start over literally from square one and throw four hundred fucking hours out the fucking window, there's nowhere for me to go.

Fuck this game.
 
My parasoul is pretty good. And extremely basic. I use shit ass combos that are next to impossible to drop and have great reset points. Parasoul is pretty easy to use with an updo or lk bomber assist. It seems you use filia so, yeah.


If you want some parasoul advice, just ask, i have good neutral with her, good reads, and great resets and its all a flowchart that is easy to learn.

As others have said, your val is good. Val/para/filia is a great team. Dont be afraid to run 2 dp assists. And if you dont want to run 2 dp assists then you can just use lp shot with para. Or hk hairball with filia.

Parasoul is easy easy easy to use once you get what shes designed for offensively.
 
I don't run Filia; I run Val/Para/Bella, and I'm actually fairly happy with my Bella (she's very close to as good as my Val). The reason I mention Filia is because I've considered switching to Updo instead of Pillar about a million times to get Parasoul the fuck off of my team, and every time I say "fuck it, I'm putting Parasoul in the trash", I spend two hours in training trying to do Filia combos and end up exactly where I started.

And, trust me, there isn't a basic Parasoul combo that that would be "next to impossible to drop" for me. I struggle getting her basic chains to come out, for some stupid reason, and the only time I can ever get a Pillar is on accident when trying to do c.lk -> b.hk (actually, I get the accidental Pillar more than I do the overhead).
 
Oh... Ok filia combos got you down? I had the same problem heres how to fix the problem that i had...hopefully you have it to so that this fixes the issue:

St.hp launcher into j.lp or j.lk chain:

Delay the jump a bit, and delay the jump attack a bit. Once you have the timing for that her combos are pretty easy.


If you are having troubles with chains.... Just practice those chains.

When sg first came out its chain timing was excruciating for a capcom player like myself. I actually had to spend over 3 hours in training mode trying to learn parasouls st.lk,st.lk,st.mk,st.mk,st.hp,st.hp chain combo and even then it was VERY iffy. But in the end it was all just practice... Nowadays i couldnt drop one of those chains without trying.
 
Dime_x said:
My parasoul is pretty good. And extremely basic. I use shit ass combos that are next to impossible to drop and have great reset points. Parasoul is pretty easy to use with an updo or lk bomber assist. It seems you use filia so, yeah.

If you want some parasoul advice, just ask, i have good neutral with her, good reads, and great resets and its all a flowchart that is easy to learn.

Parasoul is easy easy easy to use once you get what shes designed for offensively.
Dime pls upload a Vid of your Parasoul somewhere
 
I have nothing to prove to you. If you really want to verify it you can ask tomo or Clarence or age.

Also i said she was pretty good i didnt say say she was severin x keninblack x uzu. And i dont usually record my matches either way.
 
Cynical said:
I spend two hours in training trying to do Filia combos and end up exactly where I started.

I have 100% universal and consistent Filia midscreen and corner combos in the Filia combo thread that are about the only thing in SG I don't routinely drop. Filia can be garbage-hands compliant. And her resets are just stopping your combo at almost any point and doing a low/instant j.HK overhead/cross up j.HK overhead/block+call assist mixup.
 
I swear to god, the way this game interprets inputs is fucking ridiculous.

downback -> QCF LPLK? Tumbling Run, not Diamond Drop.
QCF + KK? Bypass, not Flatliner sometimes, for no fucking reason at all.
c.lk -> b.hk? Napalm Pillar. Yes, I've checked this in training mode with inputs on; you don't actually need an up direction to get Pillar if you're charged down.
And, my absolute favorite: QCB + PP? NAPALM SHOT, not Firing Squad. WTF, it doesn't even end in anywhere close to the same direction.
 
From now on, when I see Peacock + Invuln assist, I'm just dropping the stick.

There's literally nothing my team can do about that. If I get touched one single time -- if I so much as block one projectile -- then I lose control for the entire match. Touch any button = get hit, don't touch button = locked down forever with no gap.
 
Yes, that team under my avatar is my actual team.

There's not shit that Val can do against Peacock + DP. Best I can tell, Peacock has a literal 100% strategy here if Val doesn't win a coinflip at the very first moment of the match and then reset Peacock to death (so, in other words, Peacock has to guess wrong on four coinflips, and if she guesses right on a single one, Val doesn't get to play):

Step 1: Throw bombs.
Step 2: When Val gets close, call DP. If she baits and blocks, resume throwing bombs; even if she punishes your DP assist with her own countercall, you've pushed her out. If she's hit, combo, or just keep throwing bombs, either way is fine.
Step 3: Repeat.
 
My experience is that homing plane or DP assist will both beat air bypass.
 
Cynical said:
There's not shit that Val can do against Peacock + DP. Best I can tell, Peacock has a literal 100% strategy here if Val doesn't win a coinflip at the very first moment of the match and then reset Peacock to death (so, in other words, Peacock has to guess wrong on four coinflips, and if she guesses right on a single one, Val doesn't get to play):

Step 1: Throw bombs.
Step 2: When Val gets close, call DP. If she baits and blocks, resume throwing bombs; even if she punishes your DP assist with her own countercall, you've pushed her out. If she's hit, combo, or just keep throwing bombs, either way is fine.
Step 3: Repeat.
Okay, this 'applies' to literally every member of the cast. Does Peacock have a 10-0 matchup against everyone?

Val has the best mobility in the game, saying she loses for free against Peacock is hilarious (she's generally viewed as 'the' Peacock counter..)

www.twitch.tv/torontotoptiers2/b/530025476?t=38m40s

Especially the twitch link is pretty fun, cus JWong doesn't actually play the game.
 
Uh, yeah, that Duck vs. Worldjem video doesn't show anything useful.

I guess I'm supposed to hope my opponent either tags in the DP assist for absolutely no reason, or just decides to not make any attempt to throw any projectiles ever? Because that's exactly what happened in that vid.
 
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