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How do I Skullgirls

  1. 100
  2. 100
  3. 100
  4. 87
  5. 76
  6. 67
  7. 58
  8. 51
  9. 44
  10. 39
  11. 34
  12. 30
  13. 26 : Max for moves over 1000 damage
  14. 23
  15. 20 : Max for moves under 1000 damage
 
One of fortune's standard pressure moves is cancelling her block string into fiber to immediately regain distance. You can do this in a variety of ways.

The first is the standard block string that ends in the opponent pushblocking. No one can get back in as fast as fortune can with fiber. Another valuable asset is that a fiber will almost always whiff fiber after a st.hp, so you can do a quick cr.lk, s.hp xx lk fiber to change the timing of the fiber and make your re-entry more varied and unpredictable. Her c.lk is also really godlike and she can convert from any distance so her ground pressure from that entire range is stupidly strong.
Another good pressure move is j.lk, I know of 3 pressure situations off the top of my head that you can use it in. There is the instant overhead that works from a decent range, the iad j.lk which works from almost midscreen. And the j.lk, ad j.lk which works on a lit of people but I don't know why.

J.hp has also received quite the buff in terms of pressure, it can even instant overhead now. Also her st.hp is actually really underused and can be used for poking, you can even whiff st.hp xx hk fiber to catch whiff punishes and also bring you right over there head. Also she can end any combo with a burtstable knockdown because you can link launcher into hk axe kick.

Oh and her run is low profile and really fast, which is good. What in particular were you trying to find in her pressure game?

And head off is super fun ur just dumb.
 
hlvn said:
Damage Scaling

Damage Scaling

87.5% per hit starting on the 3rd hit
27.5% min damage for 1000+ damage hits
20% min damage for hits under 1k.
 
Holy shit I played a lot of Skullgirls today.
  • 0-3 vs. Negus in skullbats. Expected to lose pretty hard. Surprisingly, I felt like I had a really good grasp of the tempo in the first match and that I was playing well, but he either adapted or I fell apart whenever Updos started getting thrown around. He's still much better, but it did make me get the impression that I'm improving generally, and at least know what I need to improve in order to have better footing against him specifically.
  • 3-2 vs. Mayor of the Earth. Bopped him in the two PDubs mirrors, promptly died to his Big Band when he replaced Painwheel, took the third game on hunger. He has really interesting Double combos that involve a tremendous amount of j.HP's which seems like a good idea for a more "whenever you know it'll work" kind of reset rather than a limited/crafted reset point in a combo.
  • 10-something vs. Choose Goose. Decided/Focused on being as aggressive as possible, and it seemed rocky at first, but functional once I focused on finding ways to evade fiber calls. Using throw invulnerability and Val airdashing over Fiber's Y axis worked well enough, could be smoother. The Best Person in the World also recommended dashing + late LK Bomber calls to catch their assist in hitstun and hopefully lock their point down long enough to open them up and have hits on both characters. Definitely worth practicing. More notes and upload after review.
  • Couple fun matches with Corpse, Goose and Fungeons. Just fun casuals with solo/beta painwheel to get a feel for new changes.
  • FT5 with Icky, I think like 3-5? Even without east/west lag, still very free to Big Band. Actually very surprised at how tiny his c.LK animation is for how big the rest of the character is. Played reasonably well on offense, but could've been much hammier, especially on Big Band where instant overheads are so good. I think Icky will probably surprise a lot of people with his tech, pressure lines, and combo/reset routes. Big Band does an obscene amount of damage 2v3, probably in the same 9k-ish ballpark as Bella or Filia. I need to focus on hitting Big Band AFTER his brass or beat extend in order to lock it out and go in. Dead Cross, Nail, Luger, I have good projectiles for the job.
  • FT5 with gllt, maybe 2-5? Crazy as always. More review tomorrow.
 
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hlvn said:
  • FT5 with Icky. Even without east/west lag, still very free to Big Band. Actually very surprised at how tiny his c.LK animation is for how big the rest of the character is. Played reasonably well on offense, but could've been much hammier, especially on Big Band where instant overheads are so good. I think Icky will probably surprise a lot of people with his tech, pressure lines, and combo/reset routes. Big Band does an obscene amount of damage 2v3, probably in the same ballpark as much as Bella or Filia. May be worth matching ratios
I think Big Band/Bella is like the perfect team for Icky cause it does aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall the damage
 
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what the FUCK are fundamentals/spacing

 
Um from what I've seen you don't do these things as fillia:

  • air throw hk hairball dash cancel then stuff
  • airball dash cancel EVER (that makes me really depressed) it's really good please use it ;__;
  • rushdown (looks like zoning almost but filia isn't exactly capable of that)

That's about it I think also by all means do not be afraid to reversal with updo (unless you're really bad at reversal updo.) 'cause if it hits you get a free combo after gregor.

It's kinda weird being bad at the game but also critiquing.
 
Spacing = not wiffing moves that arent meant to wiff.

So you shouldnt wiff any "real" attacks...and by real we mean attacks that you were actually trying to hit with. There's only one real way to never wiff moves that you mean to make contact: slow down and concentrate on not wiffing. Its the slowdown part that makes one players spacing better than another's... The less you have to slowdown, the better a player you are... As far as spacing is concerned.

Iow players with good spacing can play fast and still not wiff.... Much.

When i see you play, many of your approaches seem linear... You go in at obvious times and backup at obvious times... This linearity breeds familiarity in your spacing game and familiarity breeds a lack of fear or apprehension from the opponent.


In a nutshell, try to know more about what is going on, and try to come to the conclusions of whats going on, quicker. Basically just more experience, and study your vids to see where you are going wrong... As an example, watch your own video and look at:

Points where you blocked your opponents assist, or one of their normals... This is a mistake, so see how you got put into the situation.

Look at points where you dropped combos... These are also mistakes. Practice in training mode to get better more consistent muscle memory wherever your drop points are. From the looks of things in the early games of this set, early throw conversions seemed to be a sticking point for you.


Points where you got your opponent to block one of your normals or one of your assists and yet you didnt manage to convert that pressure into a combo/throw. Look at how your opponent escaped the situation and try to make better decisions against that opponent in the future, based on knowledge acquired.


As far as fundamentals and spacing goes, id say that you were fundamentally outplayed here execution wise... You seemed to drop a lot of stuff early and your assist calls werent timed as well as konkretes.


Spacing wise you seemed to just not know as much about it as your opponent. There is a lot to read about your opponents behavior, based on how they space... Like whether they are fast or slow, aggressive or defensive, and what pokes they like to use, what jump patterns they like to use. Like i cant honestly remember, but i dont think konkrete was really double jumping much... And that alone should make your spacing better against him since you can react to his first jump as far as where he's going. Against people that like to jump back and then double jump forward, spacing becomes a bit harder since it looks like they are retreating at first... Which forces you to guess that they are actually going to double jump forward, before they do it.


At which point you are probably very open to a regular jump in since you are anticipating double jump.


Etc etc etc.


Its mostly just time and experience tbqh
 
Watching about half of that video I see a lot of stuff that isn't about neutral. The large majority of missed confirms and drops were on your end. SG is so momentum based that a few on-tilt drops can turn a 10-8 set into a 10-1 set in a hurry.
 
yeah, that set had A LOT of matches that were extremely close, it was less of a 13-2 than the score said
 
To do:
  • defense drills on para 6LP, 6MP, 4HK
  • filia combos
  • filia movement
  • slow motion replays of every hitbox/hurtbox of every single move all four characters have.
  • some form of frame data. on my phone. at all times.
 
hm i only play filia and the only thing i would suggest is that her current movement isn't exactly......orthodox. basically for me i aim to get back on the ground after my airdash but how could i do that? J.hp


primarily at neutral i don't use it to hit someone but rather to get in closer. just use it wisely and should close in the space and depending on the space you can go in with j mp and alternate with a air grab whiff to get back in.

Just my idea of using filia. i'm pretty sure its incorrect so disregard if it doesn't make any sense. i wouldn't mind playing your filia sometime and see what i could do to help.
 
+ Filia BnBs, basic spacing
+ Having fun with Invite to Hells' change of pacing in neutral and protection for Bomber
+ Better Double spacing via jHK spam, sHP, luger directions based more on read than previously.
+ Weird team order working okay so far. Even with the first two characters dead, anchor spot's not as bad as I thought initially.
- several hours' worth of Parasoul block drilling didn't do shit. Will probably take a really really really long time; may as well break it down into sessions before bed for a few weeks.

Generally playing to recognize enemy patterns, their preferred space/tempo, and remembering what decisions they make when presented with or attempting a mixup.
 
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I'm free to reversals and raw tags.

I cannot defend shit from any character in this game and get read like a book; bella kanchous and throws, parasoul high/low mixups that should be reactable but fucking aren't despite spending all week practicing/drilling on them specifically, Filia, Fortune, Val, the list goes on and on. I focus so much on defense and it just doesn't fucking get me anything.

My offense is linear, transparent, and generally ineffective when it comes to getting the hit within one or two pressure strings or approaches. I will invariably get supered/reversaled on my second string if I try to go for one, or lose a staredown if I try to play cautiously. I can make a read and it's right, but I just don't have the baiting tools or punishes that I need to have and that shit just slips away every time.

I have no means of keeping pressure on a trio that frequently switches out and heals.

I make terrible assist calls and often get my second or third killed before they're even off the bench.
 
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I want to get back to this thread and make a huge advice post (for what it's worth) but while it's on my mind.. your Filia didn't scare me at all. And honestly, when I lose to Filia, it's because I'm absolutely frightened out of my fucking mind from trying to defend from her pokes. Yeah, not her mixups. Those are scary! But it's her ability to just dash in and poke me or run up and cLK me that really screws with my head. Your Filia really.. holds back? I can totally understand if you don't want to play that way, but I feel like Filia and Painwheel should be rushing me down and Double should be holding back and I don't feel that's what's happening in our battles. Well, Painwheel rushes me sometimes, but other times she looks scared.

It feels like you're indecisively torn between baiting what I'm going to mash out and being willing to go in, and if you're hesitant, you're giving me ample time to think. When you shut down my thinking process, you beat me. You're playing 2 characters that are great at doing that to me. Filia and Painwheel. (Val and head-on rushdown Fortune are my other two 'oh god my brain just shut down' characters.)

This might only be advice for beating me, I don't know!
 
That's very true, and I would agree with it a lot.

The problem is that I don't really have the kind of brazen fearlessness you really need to go ham in this game and recognize that it's still the right type of play even if it fails or gets reversaled/hitstopped.
I don't know if it's just conditioning from other games or me not really wrapping my head around the specific mechanics of this game well, but I just don't ever feel safe or confident in this game or like I have good choices and actions.

I'm going to take a break and think about stuff. Maybe just watch games and not really take the game so seriously.
 
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hlvn said:
The problem is that I don't really have the kind of brazen fearlessness you really need to go ham in this game and recognize that it's still the right type of play even if it fails or gets reversaled/hitstopped.

I recommend getting slightly drunk and playing QM. Whenever I do this I'm just hellbent on crushin'
 
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Gin and Tonic + Pea/Filia/Bella sounds like a good exercise.
 
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I do it almost every Thursday. And guess what today is! You know where I'll be.
 
hlvn said:
Gameplay footage.

I'm just gonna make note of things I see that you could improve on/straight up fix for your Filia & Double. I don't play Painwheel so I can't help there.

General:
-I don't believe your pressure is linear, so more as you are leaving too many opportunities to get pressure on the table. Any monkey can run a simple high-low-throw mixup once you get pressure, it's just a matter of recognising situations where you can take that advantage.
-At neutral, you need to focus more on making your opponent block shit. Sometimes when you're being overcautious, you're leaving opportunities to make the opponent block right on the table.
-You need better punishes, especially meterless punishes. Specifically, to be more aware of what can be punished and to act on that information. You're letting gllt get away with murder whenever he does something like whiff Showstopper and you don't kill him for it. -Some things, like cerebella's overhead from her run, are punishable if you DON'T pushblock them. It might be hard to confirm but it's worth it if you can see it and don't pushblock it, that way cerebella dies.
-If you can punish something with a guaranteed throw(7 frame), then you can punish it with a jab(6 frame generally?). Jab punishes will lead to bigger damage combos, so try not to punish with throws if you can help it.
-If you're punishing something like a blocked Diamond Dynamo, punish with either your Heavy launcher, or jump->falling heavy normal->heavy launcher. The damage adds up.
-If you're not going to kill with your combo, it's optimal to attempt a reset instead. That way, the opponent has to guess a mixup, and if you succeed then they take more damage than they would've if you just let the combo end.
-You need to be aware of where you can push buttons to take the initiative. If they're doing wack pressure that results in you not having to actually block anything for 5 seconds then you can make them block some shit then go in.

Filia:
-Consider using more IAD j.LK or j.HP to move, since just raw instant airdash moves you horizontal then drops you vertical. Using a normal lets you retain your momentum, lowers your overall air time, increases horizontal distance travels, and threatens space. You can't block during airdash anyway so you're not really losing anything here.
-Consider using more LK Airball to move around as well, since you get to airdash and do air normals after, as well as regular jump->LK Airball->Airdash forward->Call assist ontop of the opponent is a good way to get in. You've been doing too much LK Airball, airdash backwards. That undoes your work of closing the gap with LK Airball in the first place.
-After OTGing with c.LK s.HP, just do j.MK(1) qcb HK, or j.LK/j.LP j.MK(1) qcb HK to pick up. You're dropping that combo way too much and consistency is more important than one or two hits of damage.
-I don't know if you're doing it intentionally to get the tech chase, but don't do j.HP adf j.LP j.HK after you OTG someone from Gregor or an assist. It's better to go into the j.MK qcb HK etc part so that you can get the restand to either finish the combo or lead into another reset.
-Filia vs. Parasoul. Parasoul has the capacity to keep you out, but Filia is much faster than Parasoul. If you see Parasoul whiff an air normal in IAD range and doesn't have assist available to keep it safe, or isn't calling assist, then fucking IAD j.HP in and maul her.
-Stop backing off when you're at mid screen so much. Your job as filia is to rush that shit down and close space. Giving the opponent space is the exact opposite of her game plan. It has its place if you want to bait certain things like assists but for the most part, rush that shit down.

Double:
-More air throws, and air throw resets. Double's air throw game is quite good due to ease of conversion, and since she can do air throw/burst baits that lead into themselves. Doing air throw with double on your opponent's incoming is a good idea if they don't have any air supers(ie Cerebella, Double, Paraosul), since they have to tech it or get thrown if you do it meaty. If you get them used to expecting air throw, then mix it up with meaty hits or gross crossup incoming mixups or whatever since they're stuck in throw animation.
-Your burst bait doesn't work because you're not giving gllt a reason to push buttons. Air throw him in the same situation more, THEN start burst baiting since he'll be pressing throw tech.
-More left-right resets with assist+flesh step. It's gross.
-I would have more things to say but I am not good at double
 
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  • do not, under any circumstances, get put in the corner of glass canopy where that creepy archangel dragon unicorn ROTC thing lives. once you have made eye contact, you will never make it out of this corner alive.
 
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adjustments:
  • if you pushblock a spiral flare, PBGC it to hit parasoul then and there. Don't pushblock and then wait for the next high/low/throw.
  • more PW sMP's to CH low air approaches
  • more PW c.MP to try and armor your way out of ambiguous filia IAD things
  • more filia IAD airthrow/jLK
  • if playing very patient/observant kind of match, consider switching to LK bomber.
  • actually use updo on point!
  • actually call updo assists!
execution fixes and things to continue practicing:
  • filia airthrow conversion
  • Parasoul crossunder 6LP/2LK drills
  • gregor airthrow conversions
  • install enders
  • cat-head conversions
  • more midscreen duck route for filia.
  • armored cMP > sHP into combo on confirm
  • fleshstep + assist
things to steal:
  • catheads > car (don't push any buttons while they're mashing pushblock during the car blockstun) then catch them for backdashing and convert.
  • filia in the corner from sHP: jHP jHK Hairball ADC jMP jHK sLK sHK Hairball cLP sLK sMP cMK cHP Hairball Fenrir. Easier than Duck's route, uses what you already know from sev's optimal jHK combo.
  • on Double conversions where there's already undizzy, jMP jMK Fridge. When Undizzy is full, consider using wait > H-Luger and convert with dash cLK
  • all those Taluda sHK/sMP left/right mixups
neat things:
  • filia cHK can beat fugazi sometimes for no real reason?
  • filia ringlet doesn't get hit by H-Egret bike call?
  • filia can dodge napalm shots with ringlet with the right timing.
  • double can teacup between full screen napalm shots to make sure they don't get blocked and accumulate on your half of the screen.
 
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Isn't running filia on point with two lockdown assists rather redundant?
 
Camail said:
Isn't running filia on point with two lockdown assists rather redundant?
If you think you can win with filia plus assists alone... Then yes. If you think in more realistic terms and figure that filia has a good chance to die no matter what your assist shell is and your second character might really like a lockdown assist as well, then, no.
 
If you look at his team painwheel is 2nd and he is always going to run hornet bomber, your point is only relevant if double manages to get in after filia is dead. Seems like a corner case to me.

Hlvn, why not run painwheel on point with updo/bomber? That seems stronger than your current configuration. Painwheel doesn't have flexible assist options, seems kinda natural that you would want her on point. I'd rather have filia/bomber than pw/bomber if my point dies.
 
Painwheel is terrible at building meter for a trio.

Filia is great at building meter for a trio.

Point doesn't have a safe DHC if Filia is second.

PBGC Butt > Car > Install doesn't work if Double isn't in front of Painwheel.

Filia is my weakest/newest character and needs to get hazed 24/7.
 
i second that what camail said.
only because of filia dying you lose updo...you lose conversion (i don't know how to painwheel so no judging me PLZ)
PLUS she's good as hell on back burner while double is a good middlemen(woman?) certainly better than filia
plus if you run double as 2nd and filia on backburner(3rd) you can have updo and still convert REAL well for sure
 
Filia: jaRaf, Pikmario, blandaid, Duck
Cerebella: TJ, Icky, Midiman
Parasoul: Skarmand, Konkrete, Sev
Peacock: McPeanuts, TJ, Skarmand
Squigly: McPeanuts, Fuzzy
Fortune: Savarin, Khaos
Valentine: Duck, Duck, Goose
Big Band: Icky, Peanuts
Painwheel: Konkrete, Satan, Domo
Double: Negus, Sev, Satan
 
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  • Pushblocking may disrupt someone's offense, and I've gotten a lot of mileage with it, but this is not the case with the older SDE guys. They either have the eyes or experience to recognize them and generally seem to have really fast reactions. Guessing it's because they either know their normals' ranges really well and/or how to cover a space or break in offensive flow with the right assist or traveling special.
  • Pushblocking just to dash in or go for an airgrab is not going to be reliable against them, and generally puts me back in the corner/blockstun at best, or killed at worst.
  • To expand on that, I really need to read airgrabs better/deeper than I have been as a matter of speed for someone that is habitually upbacking as opposed to decisively upbacking.
 
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Corner
cLK cMK cHP H-Buer x Fly
jMK jHP (the important part)
sLP sMP
(9)jMP* jHP x Fly
(7)jMK (IPS) | Airthrow (the trigger)
>> If jMK(IPS) and no burst, fly (3) back in and get the airthrow?
>>> Probably some way to mix it up and involve jHP armor through the burst just to add another layer.

convert burst whiff via
jLP jLK jMK?
jLP jLK jMK air L-buer?
jMK air L-buer?

This can probably be tuned up a bit to be faster and get more damage on the followup, just too late at night for me. The whole thing works with the cHP corner loops as well, or any route with a jMK past stage 3.

I dunno. I'm still not really sold on burst trigger vs airthrow as a 50/50. They're still super fast ankle checks and still great to use, but I just have this feeling like people should be able to hedge their bets by just teching based on proximity once you know what the mixup is.

Airthrow is probably going to be in the 7f range, most jLP/jLK buttons will be in comparable territory. The difference between them being that someone is either moving away with an ADC/fall during what would be the 13f tech window if it's a bait, and staying in your face if it's a throw. 13f is really fast so yeah, it's probably going to require prior knowledge of the mixup point and still be hard, but I think you can kinda anticipate in that "anticipation vs. reaction" kinda way.

I really just don't like the idea of giving up and resolving myself to a blind guess, and maybe this should be a guess that I'm too stubborn to take.

also cHP H-Buer Fly jMK jHP starter is neat for just holding the armor down until it lands and going low. :^)
 
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Theory followup to burst thing above.

Assuming opponent whiffs burst and you get the counter-hit bonus for the first jMK:
[1] jMK L-Buer
[2] jMK L-Buer
[3] OTG L-Buer x Fly
[5] jLK cMK sHP L-Buer x Fly
jLP jLK sHK
jMP L-Buer x Fly jMK jHP jHK
sLP sLK sMK sHP L-Buer x Death Crawl

Everything up to the final chain adds up to 285 undizzy, which would be just under the 290 limit (240 + 50 CH Bonus) and should work.

Not sure if I can actually hit that jHK at the end or not.

There may also be better routes by opening with jHP and cancelling quickly into something else to get the 100 CH bonus instead and squeeze another chain + LP nail in and launch with sMP instead of sHK, but scaling sucks so it'd probably require cancelling the jHP into Buer really quickly after the first hit or two which also kinda sucks for scaling purposes.

I am not very good at Theorycraft. :(

Assuming opponent whiffs burst and you get the counter-hit bonus for the first jHP:
[1] jHP, L-Buer
[2] jMK, jHP, L-Buer
[3] OTG L-Buer, Fly (20)
[5] jLK cMK sHP L-Buer (85)
jLP cLK cMK sHP L-Nail (100)
sMP jMP jHP jHK jHP (120) 325/340
sLP sLK sMK sHP L-Buer Deathcrawl
 
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8.8k-9.1k at 1.0
11.8 or so at 1.3

kinda varies by weight since you may not get all of your multi-hit normals' hits/charges on the heavier characters.

 
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Updo lets you do interesting things
 
0-20 something to Skarmand.

Discouragingly free.
 
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When playing against him have you ever thought of trying to zone/bait his peacock out of pillar range so that its hard to telepillar? And do you ever try to bait pillar with armor?
 
hlvn said:
0-20 something to Skarmand.

Discouragingly free.
Hm, makes me feel a little better I could take 4 off him in our FT7.
 
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