Mr Peck's Comical Character Crisis

[Mr Peck]

I think you're actually so plus from this move that you can drop it, tag to Cerebella, and get a mixup. I'm trying to do it more often too since it gives me a meterless way to tag safely.

That's what I meant by 'safe tag outs', I should have been more specific. It's hilarious.

 

[Mr Peck]

I've been messing around with tenrai-ha more. Holding an L item drop to protect yourself while taunting is way better than I expected it to be, so I need to start building it into my gameplan. I just have to get used to releasing that item before it reaches level 3 so I don't immediately waste my tenrai-ha, unless I'm using it as a way to tag out ASAP.

Also, I should use L item drop more in general. You can hold a defensive item and throw out M bang at the same time! Imagine that.

 

[mcpeanuts]

These ideas are gr8

 

[RemiKz]

LP SoiD is actually pretty great to use against someone like Filia who has a tendency of airdashing past MP SoiD because it doesn't track as aggressively as in the past.

 

[Sydoh]

You could always use the team I used at EVO 2014. =P

Peacock(Boxcar)/Fukua(dart H)/Filia(Updo H)

 

[Mr Peck]

It's a good team, but it doesn't play to my strengths. I don't wait to sit fullscreen and throw projectiles with Peacock, I'm bad at Filia (especially as an anchor) and I'd rather use Cerebella than Fukua. I'm going to carry on under the assumption that I'll enjoy Robo Fortune, and if that backfires I'll start thinking about other teams again.

 

[Mr Peck]

It looks like I'm almost definitely going to love Robo Fortune, so I'm sticking with Peacock and Cerebella for now and not worrying about picking up new characters who I'll almost definitely drop for Robo.

Welp, never mind. Just realised that Robo might not be usable at Combo Breaker and I really hate playing solo or duo, so I'll need to start learning a third character ASAP. Probably in the second slot as a Peacock/X/Cerebella(Copter) team.

I really *want* to be good at Filia but I don't understand approaching with her at all despite using her for longer than any other character including Peacock and Cerebella, and a couple of other players have told me they don't think she suits me. I feel like Beowulf might be closer to the playstyle of the characters I'm already decent with, but he doesn't really appeal to me and I'm worried about him maybe having a lack of reset points compared to other characters. I did badly with Valentine before but I still think she's cool so I could put more effort into her this time? I don't really get on with Painwheel's playstyle and I want to try a character that's harder to learn than Fukua, so I'm going to ignore those two for the time being.

There's no point getting stressed over character choices I guess, so I won't think about it for a few days.

 

[mcpeanuts]

I would probably just plan to run Filia as your third character for Combo Breaker, you're not gonna get up to the level of matchup knowledge you have with Filia in 3 months with another character

I also don't agree that your Filia is bad. It's good, actually

 

[Hilary]

going through old videos and found this thing

i don't know if you do it but it looks like a Peck thing

 

[Sydoh]

Val X Peacock / Bella?

2MK X Plane / Copter

 

[Mr Peck]

going through old videos and found this thing

i don't know if you do it but it looks like a Peck thing

Awesome! Infy did a similar thing back in vanilla where he cancelled the j.MK into adc airthrow whiff for a double crossunder into high/low/throw, but I never thought of going into backdash j.MP. That's pretty cool c:

 

[Mr Peck]

Val X Peacock / Bella?

2MK X Plane / Copter

I don't know what the X part means. Does Valentine kiss Peacock

Really, I don't know if you mean I should do a Val/Pea/Bella trio or I should have two duos of Val/Bella and Pea/Bella. I'd be tempted to use bypass assist if I used Val with those two characters but c.MK would work too.

 

[mcpeanuts]

I don't know what the X part means. Does Valentine kiss Peacock

This is NOT canon.

 

[Hilary]

This is NOT canon.

mannnnnn Valentine is all about kissing on lab rats when they're passed out

she's kind of the worst

 

[Sydoh]

I meant they were interchangeable as opposed to it being a set order of Val/Pea/Cere.

You could run point peacock or point val.

 

[Mr Peck]

Makes sense, thanks!

 

[Hilary]

Point val with beta cross and plane or l-george ohohohoooo man

 

[cloudKing211]

mannnnnn Valentine is all about kissing on lab rats when they're passed out

she's kind of the worst

That's a matter of taste
Unless you mean ACTUAL rats, then fuck that GTFO

You could change the point based on matchup: ie peacock point except vs peacock or val, or point val except vs pw and bella, stuff like that. Also plane with Val is silly good, but i dont have a peacock so i dont use it much. You might have better luck though

 

[Mr Peck]

I would probably just plan to run Filia as your third character for Combo Breaker, you're not gonna get up to the level of matchup knowledge you have with Filia in 3 months with another character

After running Val for a couple of weeks, it looks like this is probably true. Also, Robo Fortune is looking to be a zoning/runaway character instead of the B.B. Hood/I-No rushdown with projectiles character that I secretly hoped she was going to be. So because of all that, I'm grinding Filia again. After all those months of experimenting with characters I'm back to the team I used almost 2 years ago, albeit with Hairball assist instead of Updo.

I feel like the main things I should work on with Filia are:
- Execution, and speed in general. My hands and brain can't really keep up with what I want to do when I'm using Filia, to the point where I sometimes have to back off and think while rushing people down. That's really not good.
- Not making unnecessarily risky assist calls. Way too many of my Filia losses against solos or duos come down to me resetting someone 3 times, making a terrible assist call during a reset, eating a reversal, and losing both characters to the follow-up combo.
- Strong resets. I have a bunch of random gimmick resets and I feel like I can make decent reads while running resets on people, but I should work on having a range of resets that leave me in stronger situations and deal more damage against the whole cast.
- A stronger post-gregor combo. I'm still doing a lazy cut-down version of my old SDE combo...
- Reversals. I get counterhit out of updo attempts way too often.
- Remembering the beta changes. I should really be hit confirming ringlet spike by now, and I've got no excuse for still using setups that rely on j.HK being an overhead.
- Not upbacking all day against Cerebella. I know she has grabs, but I get caught by c.LK way too much.

This post is kinda dull so I'll stick a video at the end. Here's a combo I accidentally made while I was playing around with anti-Big Band resets:

 

[Sydoh]

You should start getting used to land canceling things and using pb where appropriate.

 

[Mr Peck]

You should start getting used to land canceling things and using pb where appropriate.

?

edit: Is this general advice for Filia players, advice to me based on how you feel I play in general, or advice based on a recent set I played that someone else recorded or something?

 

[Hilary]

Big Band is fucking huge, and I am always fascinated with this.

this, but start with another air normal if you can so scaling isn't eaten alive.

 

[Sydoh]

?

edit: Is this general advice for Filia players, advice to me based on how you feel I play in general, or advice based on a recent set I played that someone else recorded or something?

Just general advice because most people don't take advantage of it. Like knowing when to PB in the air to keep yourself in place as opposed to just letting yourself land and being able to move instantly (I've had the bad habit of mashing PB low to the ground myself, so I know. lol).

 

[Mr Peck]

- A stronger post-gregor combo. I'm still doing a lazy cut-down version of my old SDE combo...

Well that was easy. Turns out I can go straight into my beta combos on anyone other than Squigly and Cerebella, and I don't have to adjust things much for them anyway. Time to go back to working on resets and playing sets.

 

[Hilary]

Well that was easy. Turns out I can go straight into my beta combos on anyone other than Squigly and Cerebella, and I don't have to adjust things much for them anyway. Time to go back to working on resets and playing sets.

Share. I'm still on some TK H-Airball > duck stuff.

 

[Mr Peck]

Share. I'm still on some TK H-Airball > duck stuff.

I'm just doing OTG c.LK>s.HP /\ j.HK adc whatever. I'd only ever tried it against Squigly so I assumed it whiffed against the whole cast, but it works on everyone aside from her and Cerebella. TK H-airball is probably better than that, to be honest.

 

[Hilary]

I'm just doing OTG c.LK>s.HP /\ j.HK adc whatever. I'd only ever tried it against Squigly so I assumed it whiffed against the whole cast, but it works on everyone aside from her and Cerebella. TK H-airball is probably better than that, to be honest.

d a n g

TK airball is kinda wonky on some of the heavier cast members.

 

[Cadenza]

what if you already used otg?

 

[Mr Peck]

I just kinda wing it and do whatever. Start with s.HP or s.MK>s.HP.

 

[Mr Peck]

- Strong resets. I have a bunch of random gimmick resets and I feel like I can make decent reads while running resets on people, but I should work on having a range of resets that leave me in stronger situations and deal more damage against the whole cast.

I learned a few Filia air crossunder left/right/airthrow resets against Cerebella that beat mashed elbow/j.LP/airthrow and can go into 5 way ground mixups once the opponent starts blocking and respecting them. And one at the end of the video that doesn't go into airthrows or ground mixups but I recorded it anyway. There's probably nothing new here, but it's a start:

 

[Sydoh]

You need to make sure those kinds of crossunder resets aren't mashable.

Lots of times, the opponent is out of stun early and they can mash a j.LK/LP on the way down and tag you.

 

[Mr Peck]

You need to make sure those kinds of crossunder resets aren't mashable.

Lots of times, the opponent is out of stun early and they can mash a j.LK/LP on the way down and tag you.

I learned a few Filia air crossunder left/right/airthrow resets against Cerebella that beat mashed elbow/j.LP/airthrow

They beat j.LK too

 

[Hilary]

psst

Spoiler

cMP (7)IAD-F [jLP jLK > crossunder | airthrow | jLP jLK > land airthrow]

also if they get buttony on the jLP crossunders, a lot of times you can sHP to beat them. it's mostly the people trying to double jump out of crossunders that take special planning.

 

[Mr Peck]

I'm slowly getting better at things! I've fixed most of my problems in my previous post and I'm finally sort of learning to block too, so that's an improvement.

My main issue now is that I have no idea what to do against competent Peacock players, and I struggle hard against characters who stay in the air all day like Painwheel and Val too. It frustrates me to the point where I'm considering dropping characters, but that's probably not the solution. Especially because it's only two months until Combo Breaker.

I've been using hairball and lock n load, so maybe I should switch to updo against PW/Val? Maybe I could fall back to a Filia/Cerebella duo or a solo when I play against Peacock, but that feels like a cop out too. I kind of like having the same team for every matchup, but I haven't found the right order/assists for that yet. Filia (updo) / Cerebella (lnl) / Peacock (M item drop) or Filia (updo) / Cerebella (copter) / Peacock (H george) feels like it should cover every matchup, but I'm not sure my Filia is up to it. Bleeeeeeeh team choices

 

[Dime]

This is just me, and though this doesnt encompass the whole of my entire strat... I see sg as "kinda sorta" a counter based game.

It isnt as obvious as something like st though, and the "counters" are weakish at most points, but i still feel they give me an advantage.


So, some of the "counters" i personally have identified and wont hesitate to use against opponents if i see them with a team structure or character i feel i either can counter, or i need to counter:


1. Peacock gets countered by h brass assist.
2. Painwheel and val get countered by invincible AA assists.
3. Trio point character gets countered by duo bad matchup (duo with brass assist against point trio peacock, brass is superpowered and peacock is underpowered as far as damage and life are concerned. Point trio parasoul gets heavy countered by duo point peacock etc etc)
4. Duo with AA invincible assist gets countered by duo with brass assist (brass outranges and straight up beats many AA assists as well as doing a huge chunk of damage to any assist, as a counter assist call to lockout and do damage.
5. Beat extend assist users get countered by robo h beam because it easily meaties any predictable assist call. Also makes it so that one can get a free mixup against someone without having to worry about their AA assist coming and ruining stuff since the beam assist will meaty their AA assist. So you can call beam and just run in for near free (watch out for point charatcer low profile attacks though once they get used to the strat)
6. "Highly mobile characters" when used on point get countered by going trio and having a very good neutral game invincible assist along with a long range neutral assist. So that the highly mobile character cant easily take advantage of easily spacing against either assist, which is duos primary downfall imho... Speedy characters that make duos one assist option, be it a long ranged option, or a short ranged one... A bad decision because speedy can just bait them all day or easily stay out of their space.
7. Solos get countered by duos. Duos get the advantage of the assist against the solo, but arent gimped nearly as hard by hp or damage, so they can kill the solo easier and faster and it feels harder to get randomed out by solo damage when playing duo, for me at least, i dont like trio versus solo since im bad and can let the solo random me out sometimes. In this instance i will take the games help.




Bla bla, im sure you already know most/all of this. I only write it here because you ask the question of "should i just switch to an invincible AA assist against pw and val" which to me is very obviously, yes.

As i said, none of these "counters" are anywhere near like 9-1 they mostly just give an obvious advantage like 6-4 or a less obvious one, like 5.5-4.5 but in any competetive game im always looking to use whatever "advantage" i can get, be it a small one or a big one... It just makes the game fun for me to try my very hardest to win rather than be dogmatic with any 1 team (plus i just think this game is very counter based)

The very last thing is of course that sometimes a team will be very hard to counter. Teams such as peacock with a painwheel or filia or val on them become very hard to figure out hpw to meet "at the board" so you arent losing at the character select screen. For instance, if you have a peacoc/painwheel/band opponent team, and you as a counter picker such as myself go and pick brass to counter peacock, thats all wel and good, but once pw gets on the screen... Brass becomes a liability since pw just flies over it. So nowbrass becomes a more combo laden assist to pump damage and a counter assist to beat on painwheels hopefully already hurt assist partner... But shit happens and the game can break down here. The same thing happens when peacock is second and the first character is a high flyer like val/painwheel/squigly whoever... You pick the AA assist, kill the forst character then peacock runs a reain because you have no range.

The answer to this question isnt always black and white and keeps things very interesting. Best answer is probably just to get better. But part of getting better is picking good teams and not allowing onesself to be countered.

Anyways, just how i approach the game. Maybe it will work for you as well.

 

[Mr Peck]

I played a load more sets over the weekend, and I think I'm dropping Filia again. I love her hairball assist and I have fun when I'm using her against most grapplers or zoners, but I don't enjoy using her against any other rushdown characters or a few other outliers like Parasoul or Big Band. I've come to realise that I don't really get on with standard rushdown characters who have to fight against other rushdown characters on their own terms; I'd rather use the sort of character who has to make space and set up a projectile or two and use that to their advantage when they go in. I know Filia can use her amazing movement to bait things out and get an advantage that way, but it's not really what I'm looking for.

So even though I'm not a huge fan of duos, I'm back to Cerebella(copter)/Peacock(boxcar) for the time being. I enjoy both of those characters, they work well together, there aren't any matchups I hate fighting against with the team, and I can figure out a third character in my own time.

On the bright side, Cerebella command run with boxcar assist seems like it's amazing against Eliza. I used to struggle hard in that matchup, but this seems to force Eliza to respect Cerebella way more than my old playstyle did. Next on the list: Figure out some decent Peacock air resets that work on Big Band! In the last set I played, he was safe DHCing out of any reset that I pulled on him when he had low health and 2 bars.

 

[Sydoh]

I think you should give fortune a shot. The puppet-ness isn't even that bad and headless goes along with the whole "make space to set up something to help you get in" ie.: use the head to help approach then do w/e.

 

[Mr Peck]

A lot of people have suggested her to me. You're the second person to tell me that today, in fact. I didn't like her the last time I used her and I don't think I'll be able to learn her in time for Combo Breaker, but I'll give her another try anyway because so many people have told me to.

How does she deal with characters like Val and Painwheel who stay in the air all day? What do you do with the head in those matchups? I guess I should check the Ms Fortune forums instead of asking in here.

 

[Mr Peck]

Hey, it's a month later! I didn't feel confident with any of the new characters that people suggested to me so I'm sticking with my Cerebella/Peacock duo until Combo Breaker and I'll figure out what to do with my team after that.

Instead of trying to get close and run mixups with Peacock, I now try to get close and chip them to death with bombs and lockdown assists. As much as I love rushdown Peacock, this flavour of it seems to be way less risky and is still pretty fun. I feel like it's strong enough to build a team around, especially if I switch out my Cerecopter assist (440 chip damage) for Eliza's twirl (900 chip damage). Anyway, as I said, I'll worry about that after Combo Breaker.

I played a whole bunch of sets today and discovered a couple of areas that still need a lot of work: I'm dropping way too many of my resets and my weird Peacock + Cerecopter confirms, and I have no idea how to deal with Painwheel + Beat Extend. More specifically I'm not respecting the range of Painwwheel's c.LK and air-to-air c.MP, and my methods for making space and charging an item drop were also giving Painwheel enough space to throw out some nails and rush me down. It's late now but I'll have to work on this in training mode tomorrow.

So even though I still haven't settled on an exact team, I feel like I finally have a Peacock strategy that suits my playstyle while still taking advantage of her strengths. Now I just have to start refining it.

 

[Mr Peck]

Seeing Mike Z pick my team on Ultrachen and immediately say "don't pick this team" wasn't the best morale booster the day before I go to Combo Breaker. Oh well!

(Since making that last post in this thread I added Filia back to my team, because I really don't like duos and I have fun playing her)