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Mr Peck's Comical Character Crisis

Dime said:
The only solution is to not get hit







You might want to use the super expensive reversal that you have at your disposal:
Deathcrawl xx beam super. That shit is "0" frames and will destroy stuff lie an mvc2 Storm hail dhc. It can be good for people that think they can just filia crossup pw for free etc etc since deathcrawl is bad.

If you want some good meter gain, the best I know of is pws fully charged stingers in a combo... They give good meter. But you need to hit first. At neutral stingers are pathetic meter builders.

If you want better defense then you will need to make great use of armor. Because that and air reversal and just playing turtly is all you really have. Can't skimp on armor game if you've got no reversal assists.

Don't forget about robos and painwheels armor option selects either:

For robo: upback plus jhp. If they did a ground move you get an armored st.hp. If they did a throw you get a jump back jhp. This is easy to blow up, but if you've got a decent read on a shityy low throw coming it's decent.


For pw: upback plus hold any armored normal xx deathcrawl. If they do some ground shit you get armored move canceled into deathcrawl, if not and they went for a throw all you get is a jump back normal.


There's more to this OS, but I'm sure you can figure it all out yourself if you haven't already.

Hahaha.. Lates.
@Mike_Z


ALL things I said that deal with increased defense or meter building, none of which is about dp assists... Can't really say that I came in here preaching "nothing but" dp assists, when I also came with the meter build, the armor OS and the excellent reversal.
That armor OS for instance is great for pw cause you can get deathcrawl against a grounded opponent instead of wiffing it against an airborn one, and you can OS armor with either robo or pw into tag as well. There are other things such as armor OS into deathcrawl then immediately afterward cancel into kk super. This will OS armor into deathcrawl on the ground, and say jlp into thresher in the air.... Yet you say i didn't come with anything... Whatever dude.

The os isn't perfect. You need to make sure you don't have a kk super to cancel into or you could get DC dhc into kk super... But I'm not here to tell the myriad options available and what it loses to, like that you can also use the OS to tag... I'm just giving options.

I'm not even going to entertain the rest of your rant.

@Mr Peck

Sorry for arguing in your thread :(
 
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Mike_Z said:
I don't mind L George as much as M George, because if you successfully dodge it but keep it onscreen there can't be another one.

For the most part I feel the same way, but if big band has george following behind him I found it very hard and annoying to deal with. v-v
 
dekillsage said:
For the most part I feel the same way, but if big band has george following behind him I found it very hard and annoying to deal with. v-v
That's true, an offensive character backed by something that will interrupt your combo if you punish them benefits a great deal.
I guess it comes down to how you want to play / which characters are taking advantage of L George.

A zoning Robo, where L George will often have to walk the length of the screen to be useful, would IMO benefit more from M George since it covers the entire length of the floor fairly quickly, forcing a jump before the opponent gets too close. A rushdown Robo can either use L George the way Band would, or can use M George to get in since her dash is so fast.
Painwheel I can honestly see going either way...M George again covers the entire floor, and PW is fine with you jumping earlier, predictably. But L George, once it's out, allows you to have an extra harassment tool combined with your other assist.
One thing that swayed me, for when I picked Peacock, is that since M George covers the entire floor and comes from behind you, calling it when the opponent is about to come in even takes care of crossups and will force them to change their plan.

Dime said:
ALL things I said that deal with increased defense or meter building, none of which is about dp assists... Can't really say that I came in here preaching "nothing but" dp assists
I didn't say that, I said offering the advice "pick a different character" is not helpful in this case. And it is indeed not.
The rest of the stuff was very useful - you'll notice I only pointed out this bit.
@Mr Peck sorry for derailing that bit.
 
Skarmand said:
Maybe just switch between both L and M each round and figure out some cool patterns that go well with Robot.
For Painwheel, L Bomb is way more frustrating to get in on as long as you're very patient and approach while sticking to the bomb.

Even if you REALLY like boxcar, it's totally worth it to investigate all your assist options just to make sure you're playing the team the way you want..
I'll give this a try and see how it goes. My instinct tells me that I'll like boxcar way more than L George for Robo for the reasons Mike stated, but I have nowhere near enough experience with Painwheel's neutral yet to know which assist will help her more.

Also, I can't remember whether or not I mentioned this on the previous page but I'm probably switching order to Robo/Painwheel/Peacock. Robo builds meter and can safe DHC to hatred install if she needs it, Robo>Painwheel tag combos are easy (s.HP>tag), Painwheel has the option of Thresher>Lenny on defence (as well as that death crawl>lenny assist kill), and Robo gets H pinion zoning and conversions. It means I won't start the round with Painwheel + H beam assist, but it gives the team strong defensive options that don't rely on me landing 2+ combos before the opponent touches me so it's something I want to try.
 
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Fwiw, I really like this team in the new order. The only suspect problem is dhc compatibility but I think that's easily solved by doing robos grab super into DC.

There is a decent amount of theory tech with this team as well, which is always good... Stuff like robo AA super into install as a screen check, easy tag stuff. Call pw HK buer assist then use robo armor OS (good as a read but if robos armor gets broken then you get happy birthdayed so... Not great to rely on) :(


Just thinking about it now, there is probably another OS available....needs 3p and 3k... But that's tournie legal so:


Upback>qcf 3p+3k

you get a deathcrawl if the opponent did a ground attack, or a thresher you jumped... Might have to plink 3p first.


Lol if that works that's INCREDIBLE :)
 
I already do thresher/crawl sometimes with qcf+LP+MP+LK+MK, no macros. It works if you press them all at the same time, you don't need to do the punches before the kicks. It can be useful if you're not sure if a ground or air reset is coming, but on the other hand if you get reset during your landing frames all you can do is block so attempting a reversal will just get you hit.
 
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Mr Peck said:
I already do thresher/crawl sometimes with qcf+LP+MP+LK+MK, no macros. It works if you press them all at the same time, you don't need to do the punches before the kicks. It can be useful if you're not sure if a ground or air reset is coming, but on the other hand if you get reset during your landing frames all you can do is block so attempting a reversal will just get you hit.
You could update that with QCT,DB+buttons. ST players (and me) do this all the time on wakeup, so if you mistime your reversal you just block.
 
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Mike_Z said:
You could update that with QCT,DB+buttons. ST players (and me) do this all the time on wakeup, so if you mistime your reversal you just block.
I really really need to get into the habit of doing this as well
 
The Robo/Painwheel/Peacock order seems nice for Robo and Peacock, and I love Robo + boxcar way more than Robo + L george, but I still don't know what I'm doing with Painwheel. One of the main reasons I'm sticking with her is that I'm going to learn MvC2 at some point and I love Cable from what I've played in training mode, which means I pretty much have to pick Sentinel too if I want a standard tournament team. So I'm hoping there's enough crossover between the characters that I'll save a bunch of time if I have to learn both. Does anyone who has MvC2 experience know whether or not that's right?

If not, maybe it's time for a DP assist or a duo. Not because I don't think my current team is viable, but because I'm not having fun with Painwheel.
 
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Skarmand said:
Even if you REALLY like boxcar, it's totally worth it to investigate all your assist options just to make sure you're playing the team the way you want.
I've been doing this recently, and Peacock's s.HP assist gives Robo so much more than I thought it would. It doesn't come from the back of the screen or deal chip damage like Boxcar but it gives her a throw conversion against everyone except for Fortune, Robo and Cerebella. She can also use the 2-hit lockdown part of it with j.HP and beams to buy enough time to back off or summon a head, and she can call it during combos to release hidden missiles and set up safe resets. Alpha counter into M bang is a nice bonus too.
 
If you're planning on doing some serious zoning you can also do this thing I do to get two heads and put them at fullscreen.

The sHP hits them out of the air they don't get to tech forward like usual and you both recover at the same time.
[av]http://puu.sh/mGPvJ/4ddefd74b4.webm[/av]
 
I've been doing that already with boxcar, it's awesome! Like you said, not letting them ground tech makes a huge difference.
 
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Mr Peck said:
I've been doing this recently, and Peacock's s.HP assist gives Robo so much more than I thought it would. It doesn't come from the back of the screen or deal chip damage like Boxcar but it gives her a throw conversion against everyone except for Fortune, Robo and Cerebella. She can also use the 2-hit lockdown part of it with j.HP and beams to buy enough time to back off or summon a head, and she can call it during combos to release hidden missiles and set up safe resets. Alpha counter into M bang is a nice bonus too.
Could have sworn ive told you all these things :(

But yeah the assist is very good, and its good for pw as well.
I think youll find it isnt great foractually hitting people at full screen, but its great for covering the bottom of the screen and allowing you to cover the air witth your point.


Another unsung peaccok assist is cr.hp

Its a high damage low that goes well with both painwheels and robos high/low game.
 
I'm still running the Robo(H beam)/Peacock(s.HP) duo and it's working pretty well. I could add another character in the middle if I find someone I like using, but the duo isn't bad so I'm just concentrating on learning Robo for now.

My top priority for the time being is to try and play more sets against US players, because I've only really been playing against random EU players for the last month or two. I usually only play before 11pm GMT (6pm EST) so it's kinda tricky to find US players who are around, but maybe people will be free earlier on weekends.
 
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How much trouble have you had with getting people off you? I'd personally be wary of using that team just on the lack of defensive options that aren't just "don't get hit".

Feel free to hit me up to play though. I can usually play up until 3pm PST which seems to match up with you.
 
It's not the easiest thing in the world, but it's far from impossible. Besides, it's a strong zoning team with duo damage, so "don't get hit" isn't completely unviable.
 
I played Peacock/Robo duo in Skullbats top 8 and played awful. All I'm going to concentrate on for a while is my defence; I lost a lot of rounds because my pushblock patterns were predictable, I missed most of my PBGC DP inputs, and I wasn't managing to tech throws even when I knew they were coming. Getting better at this stuff should make a huge difference c:
 
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I've been working on my defense, but also on finding a third character. Playing against aggressive opponents with only a 30f startup assist (H beam) to protect me feels like too much, along with not having any non-projectile zoning tools to stop Eliza and Cerebella from getting in.

Peacock(s.HP)/Parasoul(pillar)/Robo(H beam) is what I've been using for the past 3 weeks. Unfortunately I feel like my style of Peacock needs a hell of a lot of meter (i.e. trio anchor) unless she has some sort of physical lockdown assist that can't be ducked under (i.e. not H beam), and napalm pillar doesn't seem to provide quite enough blockstun to be used this way. Parasoul doesn't have any lockdown assists and I don't like Robo's M/H Danger assists for Peacock, so the only remaining combination of assists with this team order is H shot and Robo s.HP. This leaves my team with much worse anti-air capabilities than I'm comfortable with, so if I want to keep Peacock as my point character I'm going to have to drop Parasoul again.

The main options I have for point Peacock teams are:
-Peacock/Ms Fortune(s.HK)/Robo(H beam)
-Peacock/Double(L bomber)/Robo(H beam)
-Peacock/Double(L gun)/Robo(s.HP)
-Peacock/Eliza(H spiral)/Robo(H beam)

Keeping Parasoul would require an order change. Something like Robo/Parasoul(pillar)/Peacock(s.HP or boxcar), or even Robo/Parasoul(L or H shot)/Peacock(L bomb). I could even put Parasoul on point because Parasoul/Beam is so good, but having a shell of Robo and Peacock seems risky.

The final option, of course, is to keep playing Peacock/Pillar/Beam and adjust my Peacock playstyle to suit the team. Much more backing off and throwing ground bombs, and less M item rushdown. I'm pretty sure I'd be capable of playing this way, but I don't feel like it's the strongest way for me to play Peacock.

I'm kinda leaning towards keeping Parasoul and going with the Robo/Pillar/Peacock(s.HP) team, but I'm not really sure. Combo Breaker is in 3 months, and I really want to lock in a team by next month at the latest.
 
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You really should just rename this thread "Mr Peck's Endless Struggle With Character Choice"...
 
Mr Peck said:
The main options I have for point Peacock teams are:
-Peacock/Ms Fortune(s.HK)/Robo(H beam)
-Peacock/Double(L bomber)/Robo(H beam)
-Peacock/Double(L gun)/Robo(s.HP)
-Peacock/Eliza(H spiral)/Robo(H beam)
I feel like Peacock/Double(L bomber)/Robo(H beam) is the most well rounded option there. You have an invincible/semi-lockdown assist and a good fullscreen assist (which seems good to make them duck when you have an item). You also get to DHC into catheads or Monster whenever you want, where with Fortune or Eliza you can't really DHC out safely. You also get a decent Alpha Counter with bomber, where you don't have many great options with the other teams.

Also, just testing it in training mode, idk if it's good, but with your back to the corner you can lenny into reverse car. It won't hit or chip, but it'll make Double spawn ontop of an injured Lenny, meaning they have a hard time starting a combo or trying to grab you, since Lenny is going to explode any second. Might not be good, but it's something I would do cause it's weird.
 
Mr Peck said:
But Peacock without lockdown or a non-projectile zoning assist is so dull :c
Let's be real you'd find this other stuff dull too. This team at least is good and you have some practice with it. This character crisis has been going on for nearly a year and is the most frustrating "will they, won't they" thing ever, just fucking kiss already. Make out with Parasoul
 
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Kyugetsuki said:
I feel you man...well half of what you feel.
Thanks!

Anyway, I'm not going to post about character crisis stuff in this thread until it's sorted out. As Peanuts pointed out, everyone's kinda sick of reading about it and the only person who can figure out the best team for me at this point is me. Thanks for all the help up to this point, everyone!
 
Putting your thoughts on paper and looking at them is fine. I wish I did it.

I enjoy reading about it.

(I can also rename the thread Mr.Peck's Comical Character Crisis)
 
Mr Peck said:
Thanks!

Anyway, I'm not going to post about character crisis stuff in this thread until it's sorted out.
Nah, keep doin' it. We're here to help, nobody is FORCED to read it, and it's entertaining. It's also helpful for other people experiencing the same thing.
Just don't post "I think I'm going to keep this character" until you really are. :^P

Mr Peck said:
The final option, of course, is to keep playing Peacock/Pillar/Beam and adjust my Peacock playstyle to suit the team.
Also yeah, IMO do this. Pillar works for M SoiD rushdown just fine, and Beam works for both rushdown and ranged.
 
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Does anyone who reads this thread play Peacock/H Beam, or know anyone else who does? I'm still having real trouble getting much out of beam assist in neutral against other zoners or teams who can threaten from fullscreen (e.g. any point character with a projectile paired with brass assist), because it has such a long vulnerable startup (~35f from fullscreen). I've been trying to make it work for a few months, but I have way more trouble trying to make room for it in those matchups than I do with any other long range assist I've used, unless I've already won neutral and forced them to block something. The main reason I want a long range assist in the first place is to make these specific matchups easier, so it kinda sucks that I can't seem to get much out of beam in these situations.
 
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For the time being, I'm gonna try running M beam assist. I'm not sure how good it will be overall but it definitely helps more in the specific situations that I currently struggle with.
 
I only used it in neutral if i have lvl2 item because once blocked you can build another lvl2 item plus most likely L bomb is somewhere in between. I liked going towards the reset rout with H beam here are some crappy basic thingies before i switched.

 
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I lost to zeknife 0-5 in his kumite with my normal team (Peacock/Pillar/H Beam), and he said on the stream that he didn't think it could deal with his team (Parasoul/Squig/Brass). I asked him about it on Steam:

21:33 - Mr Peck: im watchng our set from the kumite
21:34 - Mr Peck: and you said you didn't think i should use that team [against yours]
21:34 - Mr Peck: what team do you think i should use?
21:34 - zeknife: you played point peacock without an assist that adequately counters brass
21:34 - Mr Peck: do you think robo or parasoul have any of those assists? :c
21:35 - zeknife: probably not
21:35 - Mr Peck: can you name some of those assists on other characters?
21:35 - zeknife: so maybe something not point peacock
21:35 - Mr Peck: just so i have any idea of what youre thinking of :c
21:35 - zeknife: assists that adequately counter brass...
21:36 - zeknife: brass of course, lnl, hairball,
21:36 - zeknife: hm is there anything else

Hopefully there is something else, because I really like point Peacock and I don't want to pick Big Band, Cerebella or Filia. I guess I'll keep looking, as well as practising countercalling brass with pillar.
 
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H Beam counters Brass because the beam beats Brass, and you can follow with s.HP into two bombs which also stops Brass if they try to counter Robo. Might just be how you're using it.
Other things that counter Brass are the punch move into Argus...you can use your assists to bait Brass and then punish BB for like half life.
 
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I guess there's HK drill on Fukua too.

I don't think brass is impossible to deal with as peacock. I might need to see instances of where it was giving you trouble, but doing fake teleport (wtf is even the name of this lmao), j.LK, well timed MP Bang, or argus can be ways of dealing with it.
 
It's more that once I block brass or a tear explosion, even from fullscreen, I struggle to escape from being locked down by brass + projectiles. there are gaps in the pressure that are big enough for me to call an invincible or armored assist, or one with a fast startup, but nowhere near big enough for me to call something like H beam. It's kinda like how the Peacock mirror can be really hard if one Peacock has no assists and the other one has something like brass.

I guess that's the specific thing I should work on for the time being.
 
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