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Scientist Documentation

skullheart is less than pleasant when it comes to ongoing game discussion.

match up discussion; vague, useless comments, and fighting
beta discussion; wild suggestions, useless comments, and fighting
character discussions; vague

I'm not even really mad at the wild suggestions in the beta thread because the way I see it, it's just throwing darts at the board. If it can't be shot down immediately, then why not try it for a little bit?
 
@dragonos451 as long as the beta thread exist then its kinda impossible to enjoy the game. From certain gettings buffs they had no reason to get buffs to characters to getting over nerfed(was my big issue but that's the past). At this point as bad as this game is at certain times i would to just try shit(not the mahvel jumps) for better or worse of the game.

And even now i disagree with some changes fundementally BUT IF IT MAKE THE GAME BETTER then i'll learn to sit quietly and have fun
 
Dreamepitaph said:
Nonono.

The main thing is that the game is always changing meaning a bad thing and good thing people can come up with good ideas but most times its a shitty idea and three years of shitty ideas unfortunately make the community less.... positive to some comments and rather bash them than explain and debate why its bad.

Which frankly is more of the reason i want the game finished because i know i'm stuck with the game knowing if my character is going to stay shitty or not.

I also has a belief that just about everyone is pretty bad including i and neve record matches or look at their gameplay. Thats just me tho
That's exactly the reason a lot of my buddies stopped playing. Thay got sick of the constant changes and said they'd come back when the game was "finished"
 
ReSpAwNz67 said:
That's exactly the reason a lot of my buddies stopped playing. Thay got sick of the constant changes and said they'd come back when the game was "finished"


Did you tell them to just play the retail version so they're not constantly getting things changed on them? Ignoring the beta is an option. Retail isn't getting an update every other week despite what some would lead you to believe.
 
Some time ago retail was receiving some frequent non-balance-related changes along with Beta, so I guess this is what they're saying.
Take a look at the patch notes and you'll see what I'm saying.
 
So they quit because Mike was fixing glitches? Ok.
 
Look at Fortune pre and post Big Band patch lol. Even from Skullgirls > Encore there were plenty of changes. From patch to patch even on consoles things get changed constantly. And I'm sure if we go from day 1 Encore to now the changes would be pretty big.
 
I love the "sick of constant changes" thing. Players of other games complain it isn't fixed often enough, SG players complain it's fixed too often. Moral of the story is some people will just complain.

OK, as with any advice I will try to focus on things you can improve with practice, awareness, or knowledge, as opposed to random in-match happenings.

Game 1
- Using j.LP->j.HK instead of j.MK->j.HK(->HP) or j.HK->HP for loops on Big Band, and doing those for the full length instead of more damaging combos.
- Getting extreeemely predictable with autopilot air fireballs at punishable distances.
- Not using Gregor->Gregor or Gregor->dash OTG to help yourself combo after a ground Gregor from the corner.
- You jump a loooooooooooot.
- Dropped the basic combo after the 360 because of mistiming the j.HK.
- Not cancelling to Dynamo when the LnL hit after the SBO, since you should've known it was gonna hit and it would have gotten you both characters.

Game 2
- You jump a lot, upbacking and randomly jumping was what got you hit nearly 100% of the times you were hit in this game.
- j.LP for loops again.
- You dropped Cerebella j.MP->j.HK again.

Game 3
- Starting Filia seems like a better choice to me, Fukua is helped by having meter for super fireballs.
- More upbacking and IADing up close. By now if I were your opponent I would be seriously taking advantage of this, and Yaya is.
- Dropped the combo on BB to reset early when you could have built up two bars and gotten Fukua out while doing way more damage.
(- Not remembering that armored grab isn't a great reset tool when the 2nd character has a command throw super.)
- Missed the combo after the burst bait c.HP, that sucks. :^(
- Pushblocked after airblocking Squigly's divekick, without pushblock you can punish on landing.

Game 4
- Got double-snapped, it happens. Though you have been assisting on wakeup a lot and not blocking or reversaling much to go along with it.
- Dropped another combo at an easy spot because of doing s.MP. Lotta simple drops!
- GOOD airthrow after blocking SSJ->SBO.
- Not prepared to capitalize on the Updo hitting right after that though her airthrow always gives you okizeme.
- You jump a lot.
- Arpeggio on incoming is punishable when you land, before the last stab...although I guess not a lot of people do this or he wouldn't do it very much?

Game 5
- Certainly is a shame that ambiguous safe reset doesn't work anymore, innit? :^P
- Got CH on wakeup in the corner, you DO NOT block on wakeup AT ALL. This is another thing I would have started taking advantage of by now, and Yaya did.
- Started your punish after blocking SSJ with c.LK. >.<
- Thought Fenrir would kill, it didn't (you can tell that so you could've known) but good presence of mind to block afterward.
- Punished after blocking that SSJ with c.LP. I know it was gonna kill him anyway, but just for completeness you could have thrown him to get more meter and better positioning.
- Pushblocked after airblocking divekick again.
- Started your punish after blocking Squigly's DP with c.LK again.
- Dropped the easy combo after that c.LK.
- Dropped the combo after Gregor, seriously just do dash up OTG...

Game 6
- Dropped the combo after the crossup j.HK.
- Punished BB assist with launcher in case of counters, good.
- No DHC to Fukua after Fenrir for oki? Fenrir gives very poor positioning afterward...
- Good DHC to get Filia out.

Game 7
- Didn't start the punish vs Squigly tag with c.LK, good!
- Not aware that Big Band can't act after air super if any part of it is blocked, but not if it whiffs completely, which is probably why you got hit by falling MK in the other game.
- Finally got a j.MP->j.HK restand with Cerebella!
- More reversal instead of blocking on wakeup, that gets you killed.
- Dropped the last combo to block for some unfathomable reason?

General:
You jump toooooooooooooooo much, with no purpose. You don't block on wakeup. You don't throw very much. You don't take into account what your opponent's habits are a lot.

Fukua specifically:
Work on not dropping simple combos. No HK drills when you had meter, barely any shadow use on point. Over-reliance on fireballs - sure, they're good against BB/SQ, but that's why players of those characters will (should) know what to do against them.

Filia specifically:
Work on not dropping simple combos! Work on pickups off Gregor. Work on resets. No Ringlet poking ever?

Cerebella specifically:
Work on not dropping j.MP->j.HK. Work on mixups, like Kanchou etc. Learn to combo off her assist better with other characters.

Hope this helps...
 
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Dreamepitaph said:
do you c.lk,c.mk (delay) j.mp j.hk? i think that might help my conversion better.
No, I don't do anything special. I'm honestly not sure why people drop it so often. :^S

[edit]
And I dunno how much it helps but that kind of stuff is what I usually look for in match analysis - consistent situations that are either problems, very poor choices, drops, or lack of awareness, rather than "oh you got hit here" because it's a fighting game, you'll never be perfect every time.
 
You can make the restand easier on squigly by delaying the c.mk. Never delay j.mp, it's no use.
 
The way I do it is to delay the jump so Squigly comes back closer.
 
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playing video games are bad for you just like fukua.
overall fukua is more straight forward, easy and honest more decisions go into how you place the fireball and what not and looking for other tools to use like s.mk kara cancel shadow. making you come to her and making you guess how you approach her with her fireballs instead of monopolizing the opponent's movement. i'll always keep playing this character no matter what!
 
Dreamepitaph said:
playing video games are bad for you just like fukua.
overall fukua is more straight forward, easy and honest more decisions go into how you place the fireball and what not and looking for other tools to use like s.mk kara cancel shadow. making you come to her and making you guess how you approach her with her fireballs instead of monopolizing the opponent's movement. i'll always keep playing this character no matter what!
What has that got to do with anything? I guess it's a diary so okay. :^)
 

Things i should prolly think as i am a fukua player

1. learn to block when on hard knockdown its not as bad as it seems. plus your reflexes*me* aren't as bad as you make them out to be.
 
ok from WB i was highly disappointed in how i did against peanuts. HOWEVER it made me realize that i like my team. i really do. i liked how it worked i liked the synergy i like all of it so i will continue using it and WILL get better with the team. i will also need to buy a fus1ion since my current ps3 controller randomly ghosts inputs it seems.
 
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Yo when's peacock mirrors? So we can learn how to beat her.
 
Oh I see! Just wait and see my peacock cause she gonna be nice as hell in like a month
 
ok i look forward to it. peacock players think its in filia's favor but i kinda want to think otherwise since peacock can do w.e the hell she pleases as long as she has a wall(assist) of some sort.
 
I'm not going to use a wall assist. I plan on trying to learn her solo game to ensure that I do not fall into the trope of let me throw stuff at you but not actually combo or learn anything but QCB mp and QCF lk,mk,hk argus
 
Dreamepitaph said:
i dunno. @mcpeanuts can we try next week for a set of some sort? or do you need to practice stuff for beta? if so then i will fight the other person that gave me big trouble at Winter brawl
That should be fine. It's gonna be a while before I'm used to all the beta stuff, so it's not like I'm gonna completely stop running sets while I'm working on it. Just HMU
 
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#FukuaTwerkTeam: i'll be honest
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i fully disagree with using ringlet
#FukuaTwerkTeam: ever.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: use to punish assist sure
#FukuaTwerkTeam: but in neutral
#FukuaTwerkTeam: no
Isacae: yeah the assist sucks
#FukuaTwerkTeam: on point
Isacae: ionno maybe it only works in EU because we are patient players
#FukuaTwerkTeam: maybe but i don't like it
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i can also see why wing got a little defensive about filia
Isacae: it goes under tearshot/tk toss/sLP, outranges cMP and is actually hard to punish for Soul since dashjump jLP whiffs and gives filia time to recover
Isacae: every hit is a free full combo
Isacae: and thats just v parasoul who previously was imo her worst matchup
#FukuaTwerkTeam: the thing is.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: that's it
#FukuaTwerkTeam: and nothing makes a dumb ass stop upbacking at mid range
Isacae: even previously it was really good, but harder to use
#FukuaTwerkTeam: any person with half a brain will go "upback"
Isacae: if they upback at mid range you get them into the corner for free?
Isacae: ionno
#FukuaTwerkTeam: who knows.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: but i can see why one side was like "filia is a unreactable mixup"
#FukuaTwerkTeam: but i also see why wing's like "but she isn't all that"
Isacae: filia is an unreactable mixup with a shit neutral against not-peacock
Isacae: it is what it is
Isacae: is why you usually run her 2nd and gregor in, then shit neutral doesnt matter
#FukuaTwerkTeam: which is obvious.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: who knows
#FukuaTwerkTeam: usually upback is the answer
Isacae: anyway you are the filia player
Isacae: you are free to disagree!
Isacae: filia players also seem to still disagree that iad jLP solves a lot of problems
#FukuaTwerkTeam: it solves alot but doesn't keep you in
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i
Isacae: I can just give my impressions from playing her a bit and fighting her very little
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i'm not worried of the twit that will attack me cause they usually upback like the twits they are
Isacae: am i an upbacking twit
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i'm annoyed that even when she's in people will still upback like a twit and now i'll commit to a low or throw.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: both get beaten into 360
#FukuaTwerkTeam: then players do not feel like guessing so they'll mash plus DHC
#FukuaTwerkTeam: which is excellent (and typical for them) but terrible for me.
Isacae: i definitely do that one
Isacae: I suppose you are insulting me in 3rd person )(
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i'll insult you directly if i wanted to.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: this is in general.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: cloudking is notorious for his upbacking
#FukuaTwerkTeam: same with tj
#FukuaTwerkTeam: same with mayor
#FukuaTwerkTeam: and beta allows them to do so.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: of course you can do an airgrab but that's a high level risk. its not even considered a reset anymore but a read instead.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: before you could do dumb easy shit with jhk
#FukuaTwerkTeam: which is fine that its taken away
Isacae: filia iad airthrow carries very little risk (at least not more than any of her other options) and beats both upback and 360 + if they werent mashing then its too fast to really react to it so you just get another mixup afterwards
Isacae: Filia sure got harder to play in Beta..
#FukuaTwerkTeam: tis fine with me
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i just don't like(but also like) the upback change
Isacae: iunno people upback a lot so you can low them a lot and then they die
Isacae: i dont really feel like its too good and I dont even airthrow
#FukuaTwerkTeam: who knows
#FukuaTwerkTeam: atleast it makes filia more reactable(kinda)
#FukuaTwerkTeam: but it def favors bella ALOT more imo
Isacae: bella
Isacae: huh
Isacae: bella has only one low, no good blockstring, lost mgr/knuckle halfscreen 50/50 and lost half her gameplan of jump jMP/jHK+assist lala you are glued to the ground and have to eat my assist while I come down on you with a disjointed button that converts into death
#FukuaTwerkTeam: tis ok if you want to see it like that
#FukuaTwerkTeam: it does make sense.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i just don't see how people complain about filia so hard even in beta
Isacae: people complain about everything
Isacae: if the neutral of both players sucks, filia neutral being bad doesnt matter
Isacae: and then its just a walking mixup that feels dumb because she doesnt even use a special or anything to approach
Isacae: just iad/dash into button and then something dies
Isacae: so people complain
Isacae: Filia isnt very good aside from her team value I dont think
Isacae: and team value drops down when one cant put her anchor
Isacae: shrug
Isacae: Filiass etc
Isacae: oh yeah crossup gregor is fucking retarded, valid source of complaints
#FukuaTwerkTeam: here's my thoughts
#FukuaTwerkTeam: retail she was very very very good
#FukuaTwerkTeam: beta: she's still good but you will realize that playing comes with a great source of failure at neutral and you may die trying to get back in
#FukuaTwerkTeam: and then do subpar damage and hope your reset doesn't make the twit just mash out of desperation
Isacae: well yes Filia in beta is what I think she should have been from the beginning
Isacae: a team value character that kills easily on touch but still has to think, and the scariest resets in the game + top assist + top dhc + top defence come at the price of a bad neutral
Isacae: Designwise I think she is well made now!
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i agree
#FukuaTwerkTeam: its w.e in the end
#FukuaTwerkTeam: Skullgirls will stay skullgirls
#FukuaTwerkTeam: and there's always a twit i'll have to play against online or in tourny so i might as well not stress too hard over it.
Isacae: btw I still dont get why "there are twits, but youre not one of them" and "i disagree with your opinion on ringlet" causes you to play borgbarg
Isacae: But ~owell~
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i didn't say i wasn't a twit.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: and frankly you catch me at the worst times.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: last time i actually played against you.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: this time when you ran fortune my first thought was "oh.....i know what's coming."
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i know how the character operates and the times i "reset" and didn't do anything was to see what you were going to do.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: tis fine since it works. it doesn't matter what i do to keep players from doing things cause the one time i didn't respect the player. the player will do something completely "unexepected"
#FukuaTwerkTeam: which almost begs to ask when and how to reset
#FukuaTwerkTeam: or whether to reset at all
#FukuaTwerkTeam: the person doesn't press buttons at certain points but mashes at reset points
#FukuaTwerkTeam: but then doesn't mash at resets points and its quite annoying
Isacae: reset into assistcall + jumpforward block delay airthrow is pretty much safe against everything and keeps your pressure on while identifying opponents habits
#FukuaTwerkTeam: and lastly you proved a point i didn't think was true at first
#FukuaTwerkTeam: the best way to play this game is to play safe 100%
Isacae: huh
Isacae: you arent going to hit non-mashers like that
#FukuaTwerkTeam: but you don't get hit either.
Isacae: yeah thats not helping much you know
Isacae: i dont really see what this has to be with playing safe
Isacae: it has to do with keeping momentum up
Isacae: which definitely is the best way to play the game
#FukuaTwerkTeam: once you get a hit
#FukuaTwerkTeam: play safe
Isacae: nnnnno
Isacae: if you play safe after landing a hit, you wont land another hit lol
#FukuaTwerkTeam: you won't get hit by a mash either.
Isacae: this isnt "do a mixup vs block+assist"
Isacae: this is "block vs block+assist"
Isacae: clearly the latter is superior
#FukuaTwerkTeam: maybe so.
Isacae: when yo uwant to bait reversal, call assist when doing it, so you get to keep pressure up if they didnt reversal
#FukuaTwerkTeam: its possible that i'm playing way too much of a different medium of players
#FukuaTwerkTeam: silly players
#FukuaTwerkTeam: decent players
#FukuaTwerkTeam: respect too much
#FukuaTwerkTeam: or respect too little.
Isacae: you baited my stuff a lot by backing off halfscreen, thats essentially killing your offence
#FukuaTwerkTeam: and?
Isacae: if you called assist prior to doing that *and had a decent assist to use*, thatd be the same safe play while keeping your momentum ticking
#FukuaTwerkTeam: and?
#FukuaTwerkTeam: 1v
#FukuaTwerkTeam: *1v1
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i do the same thing.
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i think i'll stop it here since i'm feeling a little annoyed by you using the example of our fight for the example.
Isacae: shrug
#FukuaTwerkTeam: i thank you for your input and will be copying and pasting for future viewing.
 
#FukuaTwerkTeam: but it def favors bella ALOT more imo
Isacae: bella
Isacae: huh
Isacae: bella has only one low, no good blockstring, lost mgr/knuckle halfscreen 50/50 and lost half her gameplan of jump jMP/jHK+assist lala you are glued to the ground and have to eat my assist while I come down on you with a disjointed button that converts into death
#FukuaTwerkTeam: tis ok if you want to see it like that
please explain how YOU see it.
 
Most of Filia's game is in the air, and excellebella and devil horns are something.
Bella's low is +6 on block and +3 on hit, so low throws are strong. It has a gigantic reach and is 8f. Not the fastest, but one of the best.
Bella's j.mp beats a lot of shit that Filia tries to do, and elbow drop beats some crossunders.
PBGC H LnL xx Dynamo is a thing against her offense if you manage to block.
 
how did the beta upback change any of this?
 
dragonos451 said:
how did the beta upback change any of this?
Easier against filias that constantly try to crossup with IAD j.hk, IAD j.lk j.hk... this kind of stuff.
 
How you train is how you play. how you play is a reflection of your training.

Need to train more but not now. whenever i'm back into looking intensely for good matches.

I still need to fight mcpeanuts, now to fight Dolphin and any other player that may give me insight on this game.
 
From your WB matches:
Reset characters that suck in the air, IN THE AIR.
Seriously, try just ending your combos with a launcher. They are in superjump after hitstun so they can't call assists, and they can't mash reversals. Undizzy drains, YOU can call assists, and it puts them at a severe disadvantage. This helps a ton vs Cerebella, for one. It LOOKS like you gave them a lot of freedom, but that's not really the case.

Also you were nervous. It happens. Unfortunately the only cure is to place high enough in tournaments that you get used to it. :^P
 
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