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Skullgirls PC Beta Updates Discussion

I'm a fan of the green flash on all PBGC including normals, I don't know how to do them yet but I really like when visual cues are standardized. Don't know how recent that is, but it's a design choice I would like to see more of going forward.
 
Really don't like the new Updo changes. It's just been nerf after nerf for Filia with only a few compensation buffs. It now can only be used if theyw right next to you rather than in front.

I'm surprised that L Extend is going untouched as that move imo is better than Updo and has more utility, such as enabling converts characters usually wouldn't be able to do and also enabling cross ups in the corner as it pulls you towards BB.
 
IsaVulpes said:
Poor Updo now works like every other assist in the game, what a bummer

I love how you rate "meterless throw combos" and "wtf Ringlet in neutral" as 'just a few compensation buffs'

L.extend already got touched some..
So it's your opinion that a conversion that she should have had from the beginning imo (throw conversion that does little damage, yet allows more reset opportunities: wasn't her "thing" being good up close and pressuring her opponent? ) is a willing tradeoff for a fix that makes her moves, which overall have short range, trade like everyone elses (this was also a long time coming)? For her nerf of j.hk which was, OP or not, one of her best overhead pressure tools? That's great

All I'm saying is in my mind, the throw conversion, hitbox correction, and updo change were "fixes", while the j.hk change is a "nerf".
I'm all for the changes and the updo one will take getting used to, but it is too soon to determine if she's better now. If the j.hk change was not in effect she would be though
 
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The hitbox "corrections" were pretty big... s.HP got it pretty bad.

Don't actually mind the j.HK not overhead nerf THAT much. You can still do cross ups and fast overheads. The hitbox changes affected her neutral a fair amount.
 
cloudKing211 said:
So it's your opinion that a conversion that she should have had from the beginning imo (throw conversion that does little damage, yet allows more reset opportunities: wasn't her "thing" being good up close and pressuring her opponent? ) is a willing tradeoff for a fix that makes her moves, which overall have short range, trade like everyone elses (this was also a long time coming)? For her nerf of j.hk which was, OP or not, one of her best overhead pressure tools? That's great

All I'm saying is in my mind, the throw conversion, hitbox correction, and updo change were "fixes", while the j.hk change is a "nerf".
I'm all for the changes and the updo one will take getting used to, but it is too soon to determine if she's better now. If the j.hk change was not in effect she would be though

I hate that she has a throw conversion. She still has instant overheads. She can still spiral a loss into a win with one hit. She's still going to make up a good number of teams, and the nerfs were much needed.

Any compensation for the nerfs should be viewed as MikeZ being a merciful God.
 
I'm pretty sure those nerfs and bugfixes don't make her unplayable!

Peacock also needs to use a special or need to be in the corner to do a meterless throw conversion. Same for squiggly.

You are totally free to dislike these changes, however.
 
This tends to happen whenever an "F" name character gets nerfed so yes.

Oddly enough every "F" name character has been overwhelmingly good.
 
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Spencer said:
I hate that she has a throw conversion. She still has instant overheads. She can still spiral a loss into a win with one hit. She's still going to make up a good number of teams, and the nerfs were much needed.

Any compensation for the nerfs should be viewed as MikeZ being a merciful God.
So characters with overheads shouldn't be able to convert off of throw without meter, got it
 
Broken Loose said:
So characters with overheads shouldn't be able to convert off of throw without meter, got it
Well crud, that means Big Band is too OP. Ain't gonna stop me from playing him.
 
Hmmmmmmmm.... Once again, certain nerfs might actually be buffs in disguise.

Updo coming out closer to the point character might in turn make it easier for characters that previously had troubles converting updo assist otgs, into full confirms now...

Hmmmm. I might have to boot up sg and see what the go is.
 
Was playing with the change and it hardly made a difference
 
My comp isnt setup right this second, but i doubt it would make any change to characters that could already convert it easily, whereas with painwheel, i was pixels away from converting it rather consistently.

Combine this with painwheels new increased flight forward speed, and special things might result.

Or maybe not, will need to test, eventually.

@Mike_Z

On the frame counter display at the top of the screen, how many pixels of length does 10 of those dots have from beginning of first dot to end of 10th?

I have no reference point for how much in game distance 100 pixels is.
 
Aren't the grid squares 100 pixels wide? Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not really sure what the dimensions of the grid are.
 
How is the extra health working out?
 
Skullmageddon said:
Aren't the grid squares 100 pixels wide? Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not really sure what the dimensions of the grid are.


I have no idea. They could be 100 pixels or they might be 1000.

-edit

From testing retail to beta it seems to be about half a grid square for the amount of range filia loses.


My take from this:

Much easier for painwheel to convert otg assist hits from updo now with dash lk buer because i have to dash for less time in order to be in buer range. Still cant convert from jumping back and calling assist midair unless i guess the hit, but is more doable now with painwheels buffed flight.

Speaking of buffed flight... Wow:

Pw minimum flight height has been increased to about 1/4 (maybe a bit less) of a square more than what it used to be. And that combined with the slightly buffed flight speed make it so that painwheels j.mp ramge from flight has been increased from 2 1/8 grid squares of range, to about 2 3/4 grid squares of ramge... A good increase but not to much like the first beta test. Wow.... This is exactly the change i would have asked for in a perfect world.

Idk if thats a good or a bad thing but its there.
 
Mr. X said:
How is the extra health working out?
I like it a lot, however I think if we want to add more survive-ability to everyone, the problem lies in meter, not health. It occurred to me the other day that the meter gain in this game is why it feels like a two touch game sometimes. It feels like people have the meter to kill a character (speaking in 3v3) at least 70% of the time.
 
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I've seen it a few times in beta as well, seems new
 
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Broken Loose said:
So characters with overheads shouldn't be able to convert off of throw without meter, got it

Is that at all what I said?

Like Dime said and Sage implied, these "nerfs" might ultimately be worth the buffs. A lot of people think she got a net buff.

She got nerfed originally because she was oppressive as fuck... not because she had overheads. Of course, you know that though.

Edited for clarity.
 
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Mr. X said:
How is the extra health working out?
It ruined one of my combo > reset > combo kills so

job accomplished?
 
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dekillsage said:
She got nerfed? .-.


As far as im concerned she has resulted in a net buff.

Shes lost no options at all and has gained some. Her assist has been changed. Not so good at neutral because of loss of range, but easier to confirm off of cause of that resultant lack of range. I would call this a buff for the assist if i were being real to how i feel. But in the interest of fairplay and not wanting to argue about it, i will just call it a change.

So all in all it seems like she got buffed cause of the spike buff making her ability to confirm from spikes so much better and also making her able to convert throws meterlessly.
 
Spencer said:
I hate that she has a throw conversion. She still has instant overheads. She can still spiral a loss into a win with one hit. She's still going to make up a good number of teams, and the nerfs were much needed.

Any compensation for the nerfs should be viewed as MikeZ being a merciful God.
A lot of characters in SG have a ton of really really good stuff. Filia's forte was just more annoying than the others.

Annoying yes, OP? No.

Dime_x said:
As far as im concerned she has resulted in a net buff.

Shes lost no options at all and has gained some. Her assist has been changed. Not so good at neutral because of loss of range, but easier to confirm off of cause of that resultant lack of range. I would call this a buff for the assist if i were being real to how i feel. But in the interest of fairplay and not wanting to argue about it, i will just call it a change.

So all in all it seems like she got buffed cause of the spike buff making her ability to confirm from spikes so much better and also making her able to convert throws meterlessly.
But she did lose options. s.HP was a great anti air and j.HK dodged a lot of stuff, it also made a really easy safe jump against Parasoul's Napalm Pillar (She can only cancel into Bikes on block but Filia dodges Pillar and you can punish)

Or rather she lost good tools I suppose. You can still Updo for AA sure but if you guess wrong you get punished hard.
 
ashxu said:
A lot of characters in SG have a ton of really really good stuff. Filia's forte was just more annoying than the others.

Annoying yes, OP? No.

The fact that it was nerfed begs to differ. At best, it was annoying to the point of being toxic enough for a nerf... at best.

More on topic, has anyone got a decent hands-on with the solo snap-out thing?
 
Spencer said:
The fact that it was nerfed begs to differ. At best, it was annoying to the point of being toxic enough for a nerf... at best.

More on topic, has anyone got a decent hands-on with the solo snap-out thing?
ok i'll have to correct you.

it wasn't toxic. but mike did not want filia to be a normal that was essentially a 13 frame instant overhead. it was EXTREMELY annoying but it wasn't the fact that filia could air dash wherever the hell she wanted. it was the fact that THAT SAME 13 FRAME move was also an instant overhead that to the point that you have to predetermine guess on which part to block that most people just blocked high and then you could iad j hk and crossup high for free
 
Thoughts on solo health snapback thingy:
I think I'm just echo'ing what Zid said again. Played a couple of matches in the beta and always kept my attention on the amount of red health I had. It never felt like a good idea to snap a character out and give up a potential kill via a quick reset for a meager amount of health so I could deal with a character on incoming when I already don't have an assist of my own to provide extra/safer pressure. The change is better than nothing but regenerating health was definitely better (though maybe too good).

Has anyone had any more success with alpha counters since that one change? I've heard nothing on that.
 
I think the main issue was that Filia's j.HK was just too versatile.

It was her go-to overhead, her best crossup, her best counterhit combo starter and one of her highest damage combo starters all at once.... there wasn't a lot of reason to use anything else.

Taking away one of those advantages (being an overhead) and suddenly you force Filia players to actually use their other tools. That's a good thing in my book.

Also, you reduce the damage output she gets out of her instant overheads without taking away the option entirely.
 
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But she still has her cross up stuff, Mike barely touched it. Also another killer for the new Updo is that you can convert a lot less frequently I think, even with Valentine.
 
Nah people are getting smarter. Especially since it only hits people already on top of you now. It just whiffs a lot more unless you use it strictly for reversals.
 
Who said assists are only allowed to do one thing? There's plenty of assists that have multiple uses.
 
So, you've got an Ensemble that's a pure reversal and you're worried about other characters? Other characters aren't Filia. You're ignoring everything in her toolbox if you think nerfing j.HK to not be optimal in a large variety of situations and moving her spawn point for Ensemble Updo makes these nerfs worth actually being upset about.

For now, why not just be aware the spawn point has changed and ADAPT? it's not impossible to confirm from you know!

Edit : crossups work with everyone and everyone can do autocorrect normals in the air by superjumping, that's been true since the games release. Crossup Gregor costs 1dt to perform. I'd like to know which crossups you're referencing?
 
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IsaVulpes said:
I am kind of stepping in the dark on why it would be harder to convert from Updo, now that it spawns closer to the point character

Could someone please illuminate me?


Its a val specific problem i think. She tends to overshoot some assists such as L extend if you autopilot: call assist>run forward just as the assist makes contact...

You tend to overshoot the body via crossunder or have a weirdo conversion.

A bit of first world problems, but its there and i imagine kind of annoying for some val players that use updo.
 
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