The Legendary Bounty Hunter! Metroid/Samus Aran Thread

[Ruin]

maybe samus would have more muscle is she did more wrestling
SAMUS ARAN IN A PLACE WE'VE NEVER SEEN HER BEFORE
OOOOOH
RKO OUTTA NOWHERE

 

[Dr.Sanity]

And Samus is a well respected Bounty Hunter in both intelligence and tech. If the Power Suit actually enhanced her physical abilities why wouldn't she make her original physical abilities even better without the suit? Go She Hulk on the situation and what not and buff up?

 

[Ktulu]

Maybe she does work out, but it's offset by the obscene amount of Zebra Cakes she eats.

 

[Ruin]

cuz she isn't wrestling enough
IT'S THE CHOZO'S ELBOW

 

[Sotherius]

She actually has muscle mass, see the concept i showed before, those shoulders, those arms, doesn't come naturally. She is not a bodybuilder, but she is not a fashion model, she has military training. Anything more muscular than samus is, come from exercises that has the purpose of building muscle mass, that are pretty useless in combat or running, or anything like that.

 

[Squire Grooktook]

It's almost like the supermodel body type currently given to 99% of women in video games is possibly boring as well. Thanks for saying that Samus having muscle mass makes the Metroid experience boring due to the five minutes of before and after the entire game where she doesn't wear her suit.

I play lots of different types of games with lots of different kinds of male and female characters, so I don't experience that "99%" static.

For example, right now I plan on 1cc'ing Cave's Guwange, and the female lead (pictured both in artwork and gameplay right and center, respectively)

Spoiler

while atractive, isn't exactly what I'd call steriotypical super model material. I could think of a lot more examples. But I like her design (and particularly her gorgeously fluid pixel art walking animation) neither for being "sexy" nor "realistic".


Anyway, I didn't say it makes the game boring, but a general adherence to rules of "reality" is generally not what I consider wise. Half of the game mechanics would have to go. How on earth would energy weapons travel at 1mph? If you're going to make something closer to reality, you have to do it for a reason. Metroid might be one of Nintendo's darker franchises, but it's still firmly rooted in the realm of the fantastic, to the point that I don't see these complaints as especially valid.

Now, I think there IS some validity in arguing that having Samus depicted in a bikini or a body suit designed to emphasize her ass is questionable. I personally don't care too much, but I wouldn't be upset if such elements were toned down or excised.

That doesn't mean that every single game should cater to such a belief. The fact that Samus has no muscles whatsoever doesn't fit in even in the Metroid games. Why does realistic=gritty? Why can't Samus have even a little muscle?

I seem to recall she had abbs in Super Metroid. I don't mind her having muscles. I'm just saying I think arguments need to be made based on entertainment and aesthetic principles rather than realism or game logic (for which things can easily be handwaved). Why does PSO2 use Jet Boots instead of Jet Packs? Because air dashing and executing flaming kicks to the face are cooler, that's why.

As for "not fitting" in the Metroid games, I think that's a bit of an exaggeration. Samus isn't super buff, but she generally looks pretty athletic to me. Also a lot of her supposed strength comes from alien-based genetic engineering, so I don't think it requires a great suspension of disbelief to imagine that she's vastly physically stronger than she looks.

You know, citing the character that has every single incarnation with muscles and use it against an argument that states that Samus should probably be buff in ANY way is not the sanest method of responses.

Cap has been drawn by tons of different artists. Compare the movie depiction to any of the game depictions to any number of comic artists. He tends to be buff and athletic, but much less broad and buff looking than Thor or Hulk or whatever. I think Samus is fine with an athletic look, I don't think its necessary to go out of the way emphasizing her muscles or anything like that.

 

[Dr.Sanity]

Chozo abs

Maybe she does work out, but it's offset by the obscene amount of Zebra Cakes she eats.

I am almost certain that's not how it works

 

[Ruin]

HERE IT COMES
HERE IT COMES
THE MOST ILLEGAL MOVE IN THE STAR SYSTEM
BOOM
THERE IT IS
THERE IT IS
THE MOTHER BRAINBUSTER
YOU DON'T NEED AUTHORIZATION FOR THAT ONE, DADDY
AAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAH

 

[Ktulu]

I support wrestler Samus 100%.

 

[Dr.Sanity]

Okay I'm going to say this right now I'm complaining about the recent designs of Samus not the older ones.

I play lots of different types of games with lots of different kinds of male and female, so I don't experience that "99%" static.

For example, right now I plan on 1cc'ing Cave's Guwange, and the female lead (pictured both in artwork and gameplay right and center, respectively)

Spoiler

Okay, that's... one female character of near adult age. Do you not know that the oversexualization of females in video games is so common it's considered a constant force at this point?

Anyway, I didn't say it makes the game boring, but a general adherence to rules of "reality" is generally not what I consider wise. Half of the game mechanics would have to go. How on earth would energy weapons travel at 1mph? If you're going to make something closer to reality, you have to do it for a reason. Metroid might be one of Nintendo's darker franchises, but it's still firmly rooted in the realm of the fantastic, to the point that I don't see these complaints as especially valid.

I don't want reality! I want Samus to be buffer than not at all! The implication that Samus being buffer means all of Metroid has to go is insane! Making Samus buffer doesn't make the game realistic, it just means Samus is buffer. That's it. I don't understand that the entire reality of Metroid would collapse if Samus was buffer than how she is now. People DIE ALL THE TIME in Metroid and Samus being buff is the thing that makes it too realistic???

I seem to recall she had abbs in Super Metroid. I don't mind her having muscles.

She does. But not now. Because that's not Samus now. That's not the Samus that's being presented now. The Samus being presented now (From Other M and the interpretation of that to Smash Bros.) is not that Samus. The Samus right now is the Other M Samus. There is no arguement to that. This means that Nintendo doesn't want that, to the point of even an acknowledgement. I hate this Samus and I want it gone. And I want a new Samus to be as far away from that Samus as possible!

So yes, wrestler Samus all the way!

 

[Ruin]

eh
we'll know what nintendo wants when metroid actually gets a new game
I think they just went with Other M Samus in Smash because it was just the most recent game at that point. It also has the plus of not having Other M Samus's awful personality and writing, which is the bigger problem than boobs, butts, or heels ever will be
if we get a new game and that one has boobs n butts help me daddy samus then yeah whatever go ahead and be mad
but wrestler samus, gangsta rap samus, magical girl samus, or any other samus won't actually make a difference if Samus is still Sakamoto's fap fantasy.

 

[Dr.Sanity]

Look the thing that really grinds my gears here is looking at Samus from beginning to end. And all I can see right now is a downward slope. Just go from Super to now.

She went from 6"3' to 5"1' in Other M. She went to a decently buff lady to skinny I guess (judging from her Zero Mission endings) over the years. She's been given high heels. She's been slowly diving down over the years and it worries me.

 

[Squire Grooktook]

Okay, that's... one female character of near adult age. Do you not know that the oversexualization of females in video games is so common it's considered a constant force at this point?

Yeah, I know. But like anything, it depends on where you look. I tend to dabble in a lot of more obscure and interesting works, so I come across a greater variety of styles and presentations than what you might see in the purely hollywood genre/demographic.

Okay I'm going to say this right now I'm complaining about the recent designs of Samus not the older ones.

She does. But not now. Because that's not Samus now

OOOOOOOOH

Okay, I misunderstood. Yes, I agree. The recent depictions of Samus are not what I would consider ideal. Smash 4's depiction is completely over the top, and doesn't really fit the character all, in my opinion ("is that all?"-taunt, I thought she was a tough and noble minded hero, not a dominatrix?).

I don't think it's a grave sin, but it is jarring, and if it were up to me the hyper-sexualized elements would be excised. She can be a beautiful female knight, but she doesn't have to have a giant ass in a skin tight suit that's constantly shoved in the players face. If I wanted that, I would just look up naughty fan art. No need for it to be incorporated into canon.

 

[Ruin]

The "Is that all?" taunt was there in Brawl too :V
Personally, I just see Smash 4 ZSS as an indirect Bayonetta rep
i mean
weaponized heels
come on
who else does that but Bayo

 

[Dr.Sanity]

I just don't want it to go farther, and I'm afraid it will because of her history so far. Her being buff is the quickest route to stray away from that kind of character that I can think of.

 

[Arcana]

Prime is pretty fun, Scanning everything is cool learning about all the fucked up ways space pirates died

Spoiler

though the fact that the SPace Pirate's species is Space Pirate, is gonna crack me up for ages

 

[Squire Grooktook]

I just don't want it to go farther, and I'm afraid it will because of her history so far. Her being buff is the quickest route to stray away from that kind of character that I can think of.

Agreed. They need to back pedal furiously from Smash 4, and the Zero Suit in general imo. I honestly don't know what they were thinking.

Anyway should probably get off this topic, it's a hot button topic I know ^_^

Prime is pretty fun, Scanning everything is cool learning about all the fucked up ways space pirates died

Spoiler

though the fact that the SPace Pirate's species is Space Pirate, is gonna crack me up for ages

It's really a fantastic way of incorporating story telling into every moment of the game, without bogging it down at all. Really brilliant idea.

 

[Ruin]

the space pirates are fucking great in Prime
especially them trying to reverse engineer samus's power suit

 

[Dr.Sanity]

Uh, anyway. Double arm cannon Samus to reference amiibo defect in the next game please. Add grapple beams for extra God of War enemy swinging action.

 

[Squire Grooktook]

It's odd that I have so much praise for it despite not liking it nearly as much as Super or Zero Mission, but I must say that the grappling hook in Prime is much more fun than the one in Super IMO.

The arc of the swing feels juuuuust right. Exhilarating stuff.

Although, I am partial to the part of Super where you use the Grapple Beam on walls to vertically ascend them in Mardia. That was pretty fun and an unexpected new use of an ability you'd had for a while.

 

[Dr.Sanity]

Grapple Beams of War. Snap snap. You can even grapple missiles in the air and throw them ba-OH SHIT SONIC BOOM

 

[Ruin]

grapple enemies so that you can just do fucking DDTs and suplexes

 

[TheMightyBox]

Woah, hey, I didn't know this thread existed.

Okay, so like,
to get it out of the way, Prime 1 + Prime 3 controls = best Metroid.
Super is also really good but Prime is the best.
And, like, Metroid is one of my favorite series, and Samus is one of my favorite characters, it means a lot to me, you know.

So, onto the complaining about Samus' character, but in a spoiler box because I can see that you've all just now steered the conversation away from complaining.

Spoiler

First of all I'm gonna plug this video because it's the greatest summation of all my opinions on the series as of late and really that dude is cool and needs more attention.

But also, like, it's insane to me how much Samus has been defined by a single stealth section in only one of the games. You can probably pinpoint the apex of Samus' fall at the buttshot in Zero Mission, tho I do feel like Brawl was what really escalated it.

Smash 4 was definitely the worst Samus has ever been, well ZSS is anyways PSS is still perfectly fine, but Brawl kinda started all the issues, the whip and dominatrix-esque taunts, the fucking camera swerving from the ass to the titties before finally reaching her face, and this weird distinction people seem to have between Samus in the Power Suit and Samus out of the Power Suit.

 

[KaboomKid]

I agree with earlier points that Fusion Samus is still the best depiction of her out of the suit so far. She's not chiseled, but she still has a tall and athletic build, and she actually looks like she could fit in the suit. Some of the Japanese win screens even made her look more buff, so it's obvious the artist had clear direction on how to handle her physique at the time. Somehow Nintendo lost that image of her in their transition to ZM, where she started to look more like a blonde Jody Summer, and then finally in Smash where they basically made her Princess Peach in tights.

Regardless of whether this is fantasy or not, I think it makes perfect sense for Samus to be a physically imposing figure in and out of the suit. She's been doing intense physical training since she was a child, and is constantly willing to take on hordes of opponents more than twice her size, all by herself. Since the suit has the occasional tendency to malfunction, she's gotta be ready for anything. If something happened to the suit and she was forced to run 100 miles back to her ship, she'd better have the legs to do it, or she's dead!

Not to mention, the Federation is almost as greedy as the Space Pirates when it comes to mining new technologies. If Samus really had as many exploitable weaknesses as she was shown to have in Other M, both physically and mentally, then undoubtedly the Federation would have taken advantage of those a long time ago. They'd have waited for a vulnerable period with her out of the suit, quietly sudbued her mind with manufactured Nightmares of Ridley, shoved her soft little body into a test tube, and then held her there for years while they looked for ways to extract the Power Suit tech from her. Nah, the real Samus had to be ready for all that shit!

 

[Dr.Sanity]

I think the reason why I'm so up and arms about Samus maybe being buff is, at least it feels like, this wouldn't be questioned at all if it she was a guy?

Like uh, that Zarya character from that Overwatch game. I've seen plenty of people saying she's unrealistic because of her muscle mass and so on and so forth (Which is weird cause her canon explanation is "world champion weight lifter"). But I went to the overwatch page and the dwarf guy was more muscley than she is, along with a couple of the other guys coming close. It's that kinda thing, you know?

 

[Dr.Sanity]

People are arguing against me on Tumblr and saying the latest Samus is plenty buff, after I showed them these pictures:

Spoiler

What do.

 

[Ruin]

honestly I just want the next Metroid game's reveal to have absolutely no indication of what samus looks like under the suit
literally nothing to go on and no reveal of how she looks until people actually get the game and speedrun that shit to get the best ending

but more importantly I want the next metroid game to have the reveal that she's wearing

this suit

that's all I fucking want
and wrestling

 

[Squire Grooktook]

I would ignore people on Tumblr on 4chan is what I would do ;)

 

[Dr.Sanity]

The worst part is they brought up real images of a female boxer to compare to Samus. But... those pictures...

 

[Sotherius]

People are arguing against me on Tumblr and saying the latest Samus is plenty buff, after I showed them these pictures:

Spoiler

View attachment 10074
View attachment 10075

What do.

wow, i haven't played smash bros.

But as i said, to me in zero mission for me her design is perfect

"she isn't buff"

The thing is, people get muscular, by doing exercises to get muscular, specifically that, with the exception of very specific exercises. No man gets extremely muscular by doing a military training only, and woman gets even less of muscle mass.

I've know some people working for the army or the police (my family has a lot), and while the training is extreme, and they are prepared to do a lot of stuff that a regular person can't do that easily, they don't get muscular, they don't get ripped, they don't even have that much of thick arm, thei get slightly stronger, a body prepared for action.

And as Samus being saw as a sexual object, and buttshot and other things, you know why she was kinda buff in super metroid, with abs and so? because that was considered hot in the 80's and 90's. Since they decided that samus was going to be a woman, they decided she would be a very sexy woman.

Considering her weight and height, she couldn't be that much muscular (from that ond chart from the first games), she would be heavier.

And i'll keep the opinion that her design in zero mission and fusion are the best =P

 

[Ruin]

I've said this before
Samus is a fucking cocktail of alien and Human DNA and genes and shit
if you told me she could casually break her own back and shit, I would be believe you
Smash's presentation is where everything lies, with the unneeded focus on the twists and contortions as if they are actually sexy not implying that Samus is a cocktail of alien bullshit with a probably jelly skelly

 

[Arcana]

I wonder what the story of the next metroid will even be, Ridley is dead and we cant have a metroid without Ridley

 

[Squire Grooktook]

Really have to wonder whats going to happen with the series, going into the future.

Like Konami, they probably think another 2d game wouldn't sell. The Prime series is finished, and they'll probably be reluctant to try something like Other M again, gameplay wise.

I guess Nintendo will just surprise us, like they always do. Let's just hope the series doesn't end on such a lowpoint, or that we don't have to wait another two console generations for it (*cough*Fzero*cough*).

 

[Sotherius]

Really have to wonder whats going to happen with the series, going into the future.

Like Konami, they probably think another 2d game wouldn't sell. The Prime series is finished, and they'll probably be reluctant to try something like Other M again, gameplay wise.

I guess Nintendo will just surprise us, like they always do. Let's just hope the series doesn't end on such a lowpoint, or that we don't have to wait another two console generations for it (*cough*Fzero*cough*).

There are rumors of a 2d handheld and a 3d console metroid being made, but are just rumors.

 

[KaboomKid]

Sadly, you don't even need real world references to find someone buffer than Samus these days. Even modern depictions of Wonder Woman tend to have thicker arms than ZSS's waist. Smash Samus is practically a parody at this point.

As far as the future of the series goes though, I still think the best move for Nintendo would simply be to have Retro in charge of the next Metroid installments. To top it off, they should also honor Retro's previous work by finally confirming the Prime games as canon to the series. Retro may not do everything perfectly, but they've definitely done a better job than Sakamoto at filtering out bad ideas, and they obviously have a clear respect for the franchise. Regardless of whether they opt to "buff up" Samus or not, you can be sure that they won't squander the opportunity to make Samus, and the Metroid series, the top of their class once again.

I'd also love to see Retro apply what they learned with the DKC games, and possibly bring us a 2.5D Metroid done right!

 

[Ruin]

i've fucking already said this

retcon that genetic stabilization bullshit at the end of Fusion (really easy to do), and make the next game about Samus's genetic cocktail fighting the shit out each other and making her overall unstable, perhaps giving her a sense of dread at the idea of further degeneration and descent into frenzy and madness. However, this new terrifying state comes with new powers, much like the X that she eradicated, Samus can assimilate other lifeforms that mutate her suit in different ways. Furthermore, the instability has allowed her to tap into abilities of the metroid that saved her life so many times over, by allowing with interaction with different kinds of energy that could alter the effects of Samus's normal beam attack for the purposes of exploration and puzzle solving and shit. Maybe she comes into conflict with local wildlife that she can't combat yet, maybe the Feds pursue her and she needs to avoid them or terrify them into retreating by using her powers to perhaps instill a sense of dread into these pursuers that she may need to shake off.
Perhaps she can't overuse these powers of hers, making it so that she needs to manage these limited resources in her explorations and escapes while on her journey to stabilize her condition
but that's just me

just give me something that takes place after fusion and don't feature a mole of any kind

 

[IsaVulpes]

I must say that the grappling hook in Prime is much more fun than the one in Super IMO.

Grapple Beam in Super is what nightmares are made of. SO shit to control. I believe it is intentionally shit so you FEEL THE DIFFERENCE when you finally get access to SpaceJump and are just able to fly

 

[Ktulu]

dread

I feel like Prime 3 nailed dread with her body deteriorating throughout the game. You can slowly see her eyes sinking in and veins popping up on her face as the game progresses.

 

[TheMightyBox]

Prime 3 was more about the corruption of Samus' body than the deterioration.
Thus the subtitle.

Like, the fear there came from becoming another Dark Samus or ending up just like Rundas, Ghor, or Gandrayda.
Whereas in this conceptual sequel to Fusion, Samus would actually be literally falling apart.

Of course, i suppose they kinda did that with Prime 2, where just being on Dark Aether would slowly kill you, and I absolutely hated that as a gameplay design, so I'm not sure if they could do something like that in the new game that at least I personally could get down with.

 

[Dio Brando]

I actually still feel that the next game should be after Fusion so we get to know what happened with the whole "you disobeyed orders and killed a potential biological weapon" thing and Samus's overall fate, also that having Metroid and Chozo DNA is a plotline that should be looked further into in future games, i wonder if having Metroid DNA has affected her more than just losing the cold resistance.

Btw i find it interesting how in most games, there are some areas so extremely hot or cold that, even with the Chozo DNA that increases her heat and cold resistance and the power suit, she still takes humungous amounts of damage just by being in those rooms, to the point where she needs the varia suit, which makes me think, if a normal person without a suit or Chozo DNA goes into those rooms, he/she would more than likely die in a matter of seconds.