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Skullgirls Beta Aug 5th Patch Discussion

Can paraoul get reverse bikes like double gets reverse car? She can point which direction the bikes are gonna go I just want to make sure they hit in certain situations. Fortunes head being on the ground just ruins bike stuff.
 
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Cadenza said:
http://i.imgur.com/TDxw3r7.png how high up in the air were you?
The best example I have of getting caught jumping and doing something was using Sekhmet's j.hp. The video I looked at shows her being above the entire trunk of the octopus but still vertically within a box from Fukua. If you would like the footage please let me know and I'll cut it together for you.

Cadenza said:
Plus its a hitgrab.
I know that. The issue is that it's using the same artwork as a throw. Since the hitbox extends up to Fukua's chest it's visually deceiving about whether or not you'll actually get hit while airborne. A character can be above the octopus but still have a limb fall into the hitbox which happened to me several times, iirc.
 
Tank said:
Can paraoul get reverse bikes like double gets reverse car? She can point which direction the bikes are gonna go I just want to make sure they hit in certain situations. Fortunes head being on the ground just ruins bike stuff.
This could be fixable by having bike hitboxes be turned into projectiles since the head is projectile immune while Fortune is in hitstun.

Problem being that opens up other situations such as Eliza sweep going through them, Diamond Deflector on bella, and Egret Shield in the mirror matchup. Hm.
 
Liam said:
I don't think bombs are her issue, maybe that's just me.

Once you get past the bombs the tools she uses to escape have been nerfed or don't work super well, but that's how she's supposed to be.

Which takes two seconds~

Peacock isn't even dominant fullscreen, that would be nice though.
 
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Swiftfox-Dash said:
Edit: I would also like to add how I am not fond of how Parasoul can use M egret against Peacock at any range (except close up obviously) and avoid any and all projectiles without any chance of Peacock able to capitalize on over use of it. There's pretty much no reason Parasoul shouldn't be using this every chance she has unless she wants to use bike. Bike egret into shot was already one way to check Peacock, as supering in reaction got me grabbed. Does she really need this? I know it helps her against robo too but my goodness, doing Peacock's job of keepaway and using bar for chip against some characters is getting a lot harder.
2 things though in my defense...

1. Even when I successfully brought out my blocker, I couldn't punish you or anything. It just gives me breathing room to think of what to do in the next few milliseconds. Do I jump in? Do I wait for you to throw more bullets? Do I just sit there? And the cool down for him is longer than your cool down to shoot me more.

2. I can't spam the blocker because there were times you punished with teleport predicting that I am gonna throw my gas masked hero out there. Yes it's more effective than before, but did it really stop you from still locking her out? That match-up is still in your favor.
 
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Mr Krabs said:
Maybe make it so that peacock with 3 bombs has more recovery than throwing 2 bombs, or make her recover faster if she only throws one bomb, which can make it easier for fighting big band/beo in most cases.

In all good sense, implementing this in beta could be a good test to see how this would work out

Wow, I didn't expect a discussion from what I said at all, but this seems good. Less recovery for M and H bombs if they're thrown alone. Light is already really fast. I didn't really want 3 bombs to come back, that was just a stupid joke because egret's really good now. Faster start up on L shadow would be good too.
 
MegamanDS said:
2 things though in my defense...

1. Even when I successfully brought out my blocker, I couldn't punish you or anything. It just gives me breathing room to think of what to do in the next few milliseconds. Do I jump in? Do I wait for you to throw more bullets? Do I just sit there? And the cool down for him is longer than your cool down to shoot me more.

2. I can't spam the blocker because there were times you punished with teleport predicting that I am gonna throw my gas masked hero out there. Yes it's more effective than before, but did it really stop you from still locking her out? That match-up is still in your favor.
While we did just play, this wasn't just pertaining to only you but just the people I've played in the past few days. It seems I've been playing a lot of Parasouls and Robos lately =p. Also technically speaking you did punish me once if I recall. I tried going for item drop- argus chip right as you called body guard and it let you get a shot in, though you may have gotten hit by the item, that only gives you more time to get in. Or maybe that was another Parasoul, I have bad memory. Also calling guard nullifies my item drop at certain ranges, getting rid of Peacock's best anti-Parasoul move and letting you dash and jump through just two bombs which isn't that hard. It used to be risky because I could Argus, but now I can't.

I'd say it is still a good match up but it just seems that Peacock, who struggles a bit as many characters have tools to stop her zoning patterns, is going to have a harder time as characters get more anti zoning options. As of right now we have Robo, Parasoul, Big Band, Cerebella and Eliza getting these sorts of buffs potentially. It might lead to Peacock's main job of focusing on keepaway getting even more difficult than it already is now.
 
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Let her throw a bomb that's just a little peacock rocketing across the screen
 
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Going back to the H Gato loop discussion a couple pages back.
PME said:
To chime in on the previous "H Gato" conversation that was looked over a bit

There's more damaging versions I do but...
...you get the idea
(Last 5 characters can just be fuzzied into it, including Fortune, but just showing some "practical examples" just incase. I didn't think it was necessary to record Fukua too)

H Gato's damage/meter gain should be a bit lowered, but I don't think it's necessary to lose the combo itself.
So, I tried comparing a HCH H Gato loop to the normal HCH combo that I do with the H Gato loop starter (j.HP, j.HK, H Gato) and the H Gato loop only did a bit under 300 extra damage and gained ~1/6th of a bar extra. So I'm not really sure what the big deal with it is. It does marginally more damage than a typical combo but the times you get a chance to do a gato loop are either character dependent or from certain punishes/burst baits and even then, at least for the HCH combos I tried, you only get an extra 300 damage and 1/6th of a bar while building an extra 1/6th of a bar for your opponent.

So nerfing H Gato loops specifically seems a bit redundant to me since Fortune would still have access to almost the same damage as before anyway.

Here are the combos I used btw:
Gato Loop:
{j.HP, j.HK, H Gato}x3, j.LK, j.HP, j.HK, H Gato, j.LP, j.HP, j.HK, H Gato, MP, M Cat Scratch x2, Slide, dash, LPx2, LK, MP, MK, HP, H Cat Scratch x3, CSF
11344 damage, ~1.33 meter built before super and builds ~1.67 bars for the opponent.
Normal HCH:
j.HP, j.HK, H Gato, HP, L Fiber, j.HP, ADC, j.HP, M Gato, HP, L Fiber, j.LK, j.HP, M Gato, MP, MK, HK, L Fiber, j.MP, j.HP, dash, LPx2, LK, MP, MK, HP, H Cat Scratch x3, CSF
11077 damage, ~1.17 meter built before super and builds ~1.5 bars for the opponent.
Both go corner to corner with CSF at the end but the gato loop is about 1 character length less corner carry than the normal combo.

Here's a non-CH combo for reference:
H Gato Loop:
{j.HP, j.HK, H Gato}x3, j.LK, j.HP, j.HK, H Gato, j.LP, j.LK, j.HK, LPx2, LK, MP, MK, HP, H Cat Scratch x 3, CSF
10169 damage, builds just over 1 meter before super and builds ~1.2 meter for the opponent. Goes approximately 2 thirds of the screen before CSF and CSF carries them corner to corner.
Normal Combo:
j.HP, j.HK, H Gato, HP, L Fiber, j.HP, ADC, j.HP, M Gato, cr.MP, MK, HK, L Fiber, j.LK, j.HP, M Gato, dash, LPx2, LK, MP, MK, HP, H Cat Scratch x 3, CSF
9752 damage, meter built for both you and your opponent as well as corner carry is the same as the H Gato loop.

Also, it was mentioned a few pages back, but something that keeps track of the meter built for both you and your opponent in training mode would be great. That way we wouldn't have to eyeball the meter and guess at how much was built. :)
 
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idk how much work this would be but one thing that really annoys me is when I'm testing if multi-move setups are safe, if I set the dummy to random block, they will sometimes block the first hit and then get hit by subsequent moves even if they make a blockstring. Would it be possible for the dummy, whatever decision it makes on block/not block when set to random block, to keep that decision until the dummy would normally be able to act again (i.e. out of hitstun/blockstun)? Not sure if there is a reason that this ISN'T the case now so if there is please let me know.

(also, while I'm asking about training mode: does the training dummy automatically absolute guard after a pushblock and if not could that be a setting added as well?)
 
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Tank said:
Can paraoul get reverse bikes like double gets reverse car? She can point which direction the bikes are gonna go I just want to make sure they hit in certain situations. Fortunes head being on the ground just ruins bike stuff.

parasoul with reverse bikes would be really fucked up. no thank u
 
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is there a reason when Parasoul tosses a tear on her own Robo mines they just blow up? and can we change it to not do that please?
 
There is a legit way to beef up Parasoul's Bikes and let them avoid Fortune head at the same time. Let her hold back while she does the super to make all the Bike Egrets pop a wheelie.
 
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severine said:
parasoul with reverse bikes would be really fucked up. no thank u
Why? Bikes are probably one of the most lack luster supers in the game. Am I not seeing something broken about being able to reverse hit them?
 
Zidiane said:
There is a legit way to beef up Parasoul's Bikes and let them avoid Fortune head at the same time. Let her hold back while she does the super to make all the Bike Egrets pop a wheelie.
Great idea but won't extra art be needed for that?
 
repost from parasoul combo thread

GtwduJF.jpg
 
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Lex said:
nerfing H Gato loops specifically seems a bit redundant to me since Fortune would still have access to almost the same damage as before anyway.
I was just chiming in since people were complaining to me about it. Being able to get 11.6k sliding knockdown off of HCH and TOD if I have a little under 2 bars is something, but of course I'm all for keeping it the same.

I really wanna talk about Fortune not autocorrecting though...
 
BUFF BIKEs

MORE BOMBS

FIX FORTUNE
 
New m shadow feels so nice. I really miss old m shadow though. I'm torn. I like being able to have increased neutral control using old m shadow assist, but the crazy confirms and fun creative combos with new m shadow are really... fun. You replaced a fun thing with another fun thing of a completely different flavor and now I'm super torn about it.
 
If possible, mike. can you please add a strong buffer or an indicator that tells the fukua player they can initiate movement?

like i said in the previous post, sometimes i miss the dash because i input it early and i have a hard time knowing when to dash in the heat of the moment.

Another request: When m shadow hits an opponent, can fukua then set up another shadow of her choosing while the opponent gets tossed? M shadow looked like it would set up the proper set up. <--this bit is prolly too much but i thought i would ask.
 
Isn't there already a buffer for double-tap dashes?
 
Tank said:
Why? Bikes are probably one of the most lack luster supers in the game. Am I not seeing something broken about being able to reverse hit them?

im not sure how 1k damage at the end of most combos for 1 meter is lackluster, or a way to make pillar+assist as a reversal very difficult to punish.

H-egret > reverse bikes in neutral would be too strong of a callout to any zoning, without a lot of the risks that h-egret > sniper carries
reverse bikes from pillar would allow more offensive uses for pillar at more ranges, with way easier conversions on more character weights.
m-shot bikes already cuts off a considerable amount of the screen and is extremely low risk, reverse would cover parasoul considerably better.

most things i feel that reverse bikes would address are things that parasoul never had an especially difficult time with anyways, with the exception of beams and vertical space coverage.
 
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Pickles said:
idk how much work this would be but one thing that really annoys me is when I'm testing if multi-move setups are safe, if I set the dummy to random block, they will sometimes block the first hit and then get hit by subsequent moves even if they make a blockstring. Would it be possible for the dummy, whatever decision it makes on block/not block when set to random block, to keep that decision until the dummy would normally be able to act again (i.e. out of hitstun/blockstun)? Not sure if there is a reason that this ISN'T the case now so if there is please let me know.

(also, while I'm asking about training mode: does the training dummy automatically absolute guard after a pushblock and if not could that be a setting added as well?)
Skullgirls has absolute guard (REAL absolute guard), so this shouldn't be possible. You're fucking up your blockstrings.

Putting 2-way blocking as a Training Option sounds dope tho.
 
He's not. The dummy will just stop blocking at random.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
 
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Broken Loose said:
Skullgirls has absolute guard (REAL absolute guard), so this shouldn't be possible. You're fucking up your blockstrings.

i'm not really sure what "REAL absolute guard" means but as I understand it absolute guard only applies during pushblock which isn't what I'm talking about (and again i dont even know if the dummy does AG during pushblock or not). but like dhoppler said, sometimes the dummy will just stop blocking. Just set dummy to random block and do double c.lk c.mk a bunch of times (which is a blockstring, you can test by setting dummy to reversal if you want), the dummy will sometimes block c.lk then get hit low by c.mk.
 
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He's saying that it's impossible for a dummy to stop blocking in the middle of a true blockstring, just like it is impossible for a player to stop blocking in the middle of a true blockstring.

If you block a hit and then drop the controller you'll keep blocking until there is a gap or you wrong block.

Absolute guard is blocking there is a gap, (?) like say Robo's Cannon Super.
AG in SG is blocking high low at the same time during a PB.
 
It's impossible to stop blocking mid during a blockstring, but you still have to correctly block high/low, which the dummy does not do when set to Random. If you do a blockstring with a bunch of lows in it, it can block the first hit and then suddenly stop blocking low. Kinda frustrating if you're trying to use Random as a way to practice confirms, because it's not like a human opponent would ever do that.
 
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M Forever a Clone:
-- No longer goes fullscreen sometimes;

my training mode combos already gone :sad:
 
So, I can't seem to combo off of Tender Embrace + Osiris Spiral assist anymore because of Fukua's command grab changes. Maybe it's for the best, but I'm sad nevertheless.
 
gllt said:
Could BB jMK1 pull opponents in the air down a teeensy eensy bit to help with jMP jMK1 sLP from either cHP or sMK2? @Mike_Z
Nope.
CaioLugon said:
this looks fair
Nothing even CHANGED for that to happen, that's been true since Band existed? :^P You complaining from Fortune's SiDE?

BlueFeena said:
A scenario I encountered with Datagram was:

Block string with some Point -> PBGC the Point -> Try to do something grounded-> Get M Shadowed

Lowering the vertical range on M Shadow would allow punishing the opponent's Point while evading the M Shadow by jumping over it. Otherwise, there's not much you can do except block; trying to jump over it in it's current state and trying to do something can consistently get you killed. Once again, the artwork does not suggest it will hit airborne characters.
Real Game M Shadow would have hit you in the same situation, for more damage and no startup scaling, and the shadow itself would be unable to be hit by you. And it was WAY taller!
The new shadow has hella disadvantages comparatively, with the advantage being that if it's already on top of you you don't mess with it.

Psychopath said:
This could be fixable by having bike hitboxes be turned into projectiles since the head is projectile immune while Fortune is in hitstun.
Problem being that opens up other situations such as Eliza sweep going through them, Diamond Deflector on bella, and Egret Shield in the mirror matchup. Hm.
He means before Fortune is in hitstun.

Also no.

Lawnba said:
is there a reason when Parasoul tosses a tear on her own Robo mines they just blow up? and can we change it to not do that please?
AHAHAHAhahahahahahAHAHAHAHAHAHAHahahahaha! HAHAHAHAhahhahahahahahahahaaaaaaahahahaha.
Yeah, I can fix that. They probably blow up on Lenny too, although that makes more sense.

Tank said:
Why? Bikes are probably one of the most lack luster supers in the game. Am I not seeing something broken about being able to reverse hit them?
The more you talk the more I wish you would just stick to painting. :^P

Cadenza said:
If possible, mike. can you please add a strong buffer or an indicator that tells the fukua player they can initiate movement?
It's on the list.

Pickles said:
if I set the dummy to random block, they will sometimes block the first hit and then get hit by subsequent moves even if they make a blockstring.
Oh, good point, Random should just be the first hit, yeah. I'll see if that's possible.
[edit] Fixed, Random will correctly block after the first touch.

Broken Loose said:
Skullgirls has absolute guard (REAL absolute guard), so this shouldn't be possible. You're fucking up your blockstrings.
Random chooses per hit, so if it chooses high and you do a low it won't block even in the middle of a blockstring.

Fuego said:
So, I can't seem to combo off of Tender Embrace + Osiris Spiral assist anymore because of Fukua's command grab changes. Maybe it's for the best, but I'm sad nevertheless.
I didn't know that worked, send me a replay that works in Retail and I'll see what I can do. It's only 4f longer.
 
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