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Skullgirls PC Beta Updates Discussion

Dolfinh said:
Is this like that undiscovered Megaman 9 secret that still hasn't been found?

It never existed i bet, unless it's like those atari game that have an insanely complex way to makes one extra name appear on the title screen. That, or a tester found the secret before it was released, thought it was a bug and removed it!
 
Would it be unreasonable to request Peacock's lp bang to jump cancel on hit?

Its uses are:

set up lenny combos
beat throws

however, you don't really get anything for beating a throw without meter if your opponent knows you can mash out of stagger. Not even a safe teleport.

If that's unreasonable or outside of Peacock's design parameters, might I suggest longer stagger times on counter hit? Mainly because if you get hit with a stagger move by any character you either got beat or did something very wrong.
 
You can link into st.mk even if you are too far for jab from lp bang.
 
I also remember Peanuts saying he could get L Bang, Throw during that beta experiment where you couldn't tech.

So, I think it's fine how it is.
Combo from throw reversal is a good enough reward.
 
It depends on the range, but in the corner and stuff you can do anything off of LP Bang. Relatively sure s.LP with dash should more or less always work, also. I don't think we need to give Peacock more midscreen combo potential, one way or another lol
 
I don't really like the double jump changes that much whenever playing Squigly. Being able to do double jump and then j.hk + an assist was a really nice option. Being in the air with her feels a lot more awkward now.
 
Curious. Why is Beowulf's HP Chair Throw projectile invincible? It makes his neutral verse zoning strategies absurdly good. Does he really need a free way to get access to an armored sweep that covers 2/3rds of the screen and doubles as a invincible approach?

I feel like Wulf Blitzer is already more than enough of a mobility tool to let him approach zoning.

In other news, if you record chairless c.HK and the playback is set to reversal, he does it ENDLESSLY since it thinks ground tech means a reversal is needed.
 
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Played a lot of robo and fukua today and I'm really not liking the double jump assist calling. Not being able to hit the skies with robo I guess I can deal with, but the no assist calling is really bugging me for zoning and assist baiting/counter calling.

Lots of baits start with jump forward, wait for there assist, double jump back, call assist, punish. This double jumping with no assists helps the opponent in meta gameplay quite a bit
 
Beamsprouts said:
Curious. Why is Beowulf's HP Chair Throw projectile invincible? It makes his neutral verse zoning strategies absurdly good. Does he really need a free way to get access to an armored sweep that covers 2/3rds of the screen and doubles as a invincible approach?

I feel like Wulf Blitzer is already more than enough of a mobility tool to let him approach zoning.

In other news, if you record chairless c.HK and the playback is set to reversal, he does it ENDLESSLY since it thinks ground tech means a reversal is needed.
Try playing his neutral against zoners like Peacock without c.HK. It's not fun.
 
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And 2 more things with Parasoul I noticed...

1.Please turn Engret bike back to red bounce. Characters are very low compared to an anti-air assist where green bounce makes sense.

2. bike doesn't pick up val off of red bounce because something wrong with hitbox im guessing? picks everyone else up but touches val and drives over her.
 
Is it possible to make it so you can't call assist while rising in the double jump? This way you can still call it on the way down or do a move on the way down and call it. A little more flexibility while still preventing jump-doublejump call assist so your opponent has to deal with it way before you start falling closer or away from them
 
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the grab box for bike egret really should go all the way to the ground I don't see any reason why it shouldn't considering how niche its uses are especially with the blue bounce it has.
 
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Egret Bike has red bounce, not sure what you mean with Blue
Yes, it would be cool if Sekhmet couldn't crouch under it and the likes

Red bounce for Egret Bike assist would make sense from a balance perspective since it's not very good,
but would be incredibly inconsistent with how every other knockdown-move works.. just confusing
And it would still not be much better, so I doubt the gain outweighs the downside here?

No, Peacock doesn't need jumpcancel out of L.Bang
She can already link sMP easily even against shake
I don't understand "longer stagger on CH", CH stagger is already unshakeable so you have.. plenty time
In general the move just isn't very good and won't magically become good because throws are also just beaten by jumping, which is better
But it is kind of hard to buff because the problem is that it's unusable in neutral.. luckily, Peacock doesn't need buffs

I like the Doublejump change a lot
It doesn't come into play for me very often, but every time it does I think "Yeah, I really shouldn't have been able to call assist here"
Jump to the very ceiling of the screen, press a strong button and call assist at the same time to guarantee the opponent wont be able to beat it out.. that's really not very interesting to play or play against
Squigly Fukua Val Robotune whoever sure have ways to play that don't rely on this at all .. you can get very similar effects to it by just calling assist right before you DJ; it is merely a bit more committal.. which it should be
"Lots of baits start with jump forward, wait for there assist, double jump back, call assist, punish." so why not do jump forward, wait for their assist, call assist, doublejump back, punish? It is the same thing, yes
Fukua has plenty setups after airthrow that don't rely on calling assist after DJ, so again this is a complaint I can hardly follow
Making things (here: Doublejumps) a bit more committal means you have to think harder while playing, and your actions have to be a nudge more deliberate. I don't see the bad in this..
It also (very slightly) strengthens assist lockout and makes SJs more appealing; both surely nice things to have :)

P.S. "Meta Gameplay" MMDS, please.
 
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Tank said:
the grab box for bike egret really should go all the way to the ground I don't see any reason why it shouldn't considering how niche its uses are especially with the blue bounce it has.
I agree




IsaVulpes said:
Egret Bike has red bounce, not sure what you mean with Blue
Yes, it would be cool if Sekhmet couldn't crouch under it and the likes

Red bounce for Egret Bike assist would make sense from a balance perspective since it's not very good,
I like the Doublejump change a lot
Right now in retail, it's red, in beta, its green. But I agree with you, it should be red since it's very impractical and a bad move. I also think sniper needs faster recovery on hit even if that means reverting the air sniper shot back to bounce instead of crumble. That was more of a nerf than a buff now that people have been using it.

IsaVulpes said:
I like the Doublejump change a lot
It doesn't come into play for me very often, but every time it does I think "Yeah, I really shouldn't have been able to call assist here"

"Lots of baits start with jump forward, wait for there assist, double jump back, call assist, punish." so why not do jump forward, wait for their assist, call assist, doublejump back, punish? It is the same thing, yes
It's not the same because at the point I see their assist, I am going to have to block it or land by the time it comes out which means I can't punish an assist bait I successfully got by reading my opponents moves (which I should be rewarded for) similar to MvC2.

IsaVulpes said:
Jump to the very ceiling of the screen, press a strong button and call assist at the same time to guarantee the opponent wont be able to beat it out.. that's really not very interesting to play or play against
Am I playing the game to play interesting and entertain the crowd or am I am playing to win? This character's purpose is to zone and lock out the opponent (according to Mike). Also, Mike took out dj hk to the ceiling so this argument isn't even valid here.

IsaVulpes said:
P.S. "Meta Gameplay" MMDS, please.
:) Hi Isa
 
MegamanDS said:
in beta, its green
It's red actually.

why does napalm pillar count as a new chain if you delay it after c.hp?
 
CaioLugon said:
It's red actually.

why does napalm pillar count as a new chain if you delay it after c.hp?
the assist is green, that's weird.

and because it you are linking it instead of chaining it. Done on purpose. I asked in vanilla 2 years ago
 
CaioLugon said:
why does napalm pillar count as a new chain if you delay it after c.hp?
Because what you actually do is that you jump cancel the c.hp and then cancel the jump with napalm pillar.
Edit : or you link it I guess. c.hp has that much hitstun?!
 
MegamanDS said:
Right now in retail, it's red, in beta, its green.
No

Egret Assist is Green in Retail as well
No idea what you are on (as usual..)

I also think sniper needs faster recovery on hit even if that means reverting the air sniper shot back to bounce instead of crumble.
That was more of a nerf than a buff now that people have been using it.
Definitely not. Sniper is godlike in Beta

It's not the same because at the point I see their assist, I am going to have to block it or land by the time it comes out which means I can't punish an assist bait I successfully got by reading my opponents moves (which I should be rewarded for) similar to MvC2.
Can you give me the exact sequence of what you are trying to do?

Do you want to hit the opponent's assist with your point?
Do you attempt to countercall?
Is your assistcall merely to distract the opponent?

I have no idea what you are attempting to do that doesn't work anymore by just calling assist earlier

Am I playing the game to play interesting and entertain the crowd or am I am playing to win?
You are playing to win, so you do it
That's why I like if it's taken out and "playing to win" doesn't look this way :)

Quite logical, is it not?

There was a time in this game when "playing to win" meant 1 minute long meterpositive ToDs after every touch
That was, you know, grossly boring - both to do, and to fight against. And it was taken out. Hey, we got a precedent!

This character's purpose is to zone and lock out the opponent (according to Mike). Also, Mike took out dj hk to the ceiling so this argument isn't even valid here.
Doublejumps by themselves reach the ceiling
Is the purpose of Squigly and Valentine also to "zone and lock out the opponent"?

P.S. Do you know which character's purpose is to "zone and lock out the opponent"? Parasoul.
And she does this without Doublejump into Assistcall! You would be surprised 8]
 
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dragonos451 said:
Because what you actually do is that you jump cancel the c.hp and then cancel the jump with napalm pillar.
Edit : or you link it I guess. c.hp has that much hitstun?!
It's definitely not a link, but I don't think it's a jump cancel because it counts as a new chain even if you press hk before pressing up
 
I'm guessing MMDS' issue is similar to the one i ran into with Squigly vs Peacock. I need to double jump to snake through the projectile waves. If my opponent calls an assist like Brass, I want to be able to jump over it and call an assist to either lock out brass for a bit or to force Peacock to block for a moment so I can continue moving forward. If I have to call the assist before double jumping, chances are that I'll get pegged by either air George or a SoID and forced to block the assist.
 
retail sniper > beta sniper except vs peacock. i would rather not play para vs pea either way though, so i'd rather have retail sniper. not sure what's so godly about the beta sniper. you can't really follow up without corner or certain dhcs, and you lose any neat setups on crumple wake up, so it may as well not crumple at all.
 
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not a huge difference since you're assuming that the sniper will trade.
 
Bike > sniper vs ground is the same as in the main game
vs air you can't combo after it but it'll still grab and you can combo with a dhc or whatever

For the record beta sniper is incredible and more useful than the old one for pretty much everything
 
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just one example:

in retail -> you do raw Sniper shot, opponent does raw tag, sniper shot misses
in beta -> you do raw Sniper shot, opponent does raw tag, incoming character gets boom headshotted
 
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Sniper shot will always hit if the opponent is doing something that is not blocking.
The only cases that this does not apply is H Drill xx BFF (hard to do, since now H drill has smaller startup), Double Car and Deflector (for obvious reasons).
 
zeknife said:
Bike > sniper vs ground is the same as in the main game

If it doesn't trade it's actually a tighter window to get the pickup after the sniper shot due to the longer recovery, which I guess has to be the thing MMDS is meaning when he thinks its nerfed? Still exactly the same when trading + air buff so idk.
 
CaioLugon said:
It's definitely not a link, but I don't think it's a jump cancel because it counts as a new chain even if you press hk before pressing up
if you press hk before pressing up, then napalm pillar came out because of negative edge. You press hk, then up, start jumping, release hk, napalm pillar cancels the jump.
 
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double jump changes feel really weird and awkward to me. never in any vs game that i've taken semi seriously have i ever had to deal with no more calling assists after a double jump. it also makes fighting peacock more difficult, which i'm definitely not a fan of. i honestly do not think this change makes the game any more fun to play nor do i think that this makes skullgirls a better game at all. all it does is stop me from calling assists in ways that i do not believe is bad for the game at all.
 
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This is going to sound crazy, but what about having double jump put the opponent into unblockable prevention state? That way, you can have your anti-Peacock strats and you can even do your stupid "scroll the opponent off the screen and call assist" replacement for neutral, but doing it with a low assist isn't nearly as free.
 
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alexpi said:
I'm guessing MMDS' issue is similar to the one i ran into with Squigly vs Peacock. I need to double jump to snake through the projectile waves. If my opponent calls an assist like Brass, I want to be able to jump over it and call an assist to either lock out brass for a bit or to force Peacock to block for a moment so I can continue moving forward. If I have to call the assist before double jumping, chances are that I'll get pegged by either air George or a SoID and forced to block the assist.
That is one of the MAJOR things to beat peacock, you hit the nail right on the head.
cloudKing211 said:
is egret bike to sniper any better?
You can combo off sniper to bike in retail, you can't combo off sniper to bike in beta. The recovery on hit is way too long to do anything besides DHC

Negus Eyoel said:
double jump changes feel really weird and awkward to me. never in any vs game that i've taken semi seriously have i ever had to deal with no more calling assists after a double jump. it also makes fighting peacock more difficult, which i'm definitely not a fan of. i honestly do not think this change makes the game any more fun to play nor do i think that this makes skullgirls a better game at all. all it does is stop me from calling assists in ways that i do not believe is bad for the game at all.
100% on point
 
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Broken Loose said:
This is going to sound crazy, but what about having double jump put the opponent into unblockable prevention state? That way, you can have your anti-Peacock strats and you can even do your stupid "scroll the opponent off the screen and call assist" replacement for neutral, but doing it with a low assist isn't nearly as free.
There is an assist light that goes red you know : ^ )
 
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