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Souls Series and Bloodborne

FastLikeLightning said:
In terms of Souls-Series final bosses he's definitely number one, though it's not a very competitive market with the likes of Queen 'Roll Left' and Cleric Beast 7: This Time it's Personal.

Gehrman
is not just the greatest Souls boss, but one of the coolest and most fun bosses in video game history.

FastLikeLightning said:
Cleric Beast 7

B-but there's 2 of them. And the second one becomes completely different after hitting 50% health. Unless you're trying to say that Vicar Amelia and Moon Presence are like Cleric Beasts. But they're really nothing alike.


Also, on that subject, am I the only one who finds Ludwig a bit over-rated? I mean yeah he's cool aesthetically, but mechanically he's really just another "big giant thing with hyper armor on everything", although admittedly a very cool one. Thematically he's also a lot less interesting or well executed then Artorias IMO (who is his most obvious parallel). The "duel" type bosses like Logarius,
Maria, Gehrman
with attacks that can actually be interrupted are my favorites by far though (for both Bloodborne and the series as a whole).[/QUOTE]
 
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Squire Grooktook said:
Words


G-Daddy ain't the final boss, man. MP is. To be a Cleric Beast type boss is one that I large, and whose moves is entirely based on big sweeping motions forward that require a bunch of precise dodges, keeps on you when trying to heal, and is in general very erratic with its moves, making its tells hard to read. Bonus points if they have multiple lock-on points (One of which is completely worthless), a charge with a hibox about the size of Mars, or a big jump that you really shouldn't have been able to dodge. By this criteria, the bosses I consider Cleric-Beast like (Not including chalice bosses) would be Cleric Beast (duh), Blood-Starved, Vicar Amelia, Paarl, 1st Phase Ludwig, Laurence, and Moon Presence makes 7.
 
So it took me 30+ levels but I was finally able to kill the dogs and join Aldritch Faithful
God joining that covenant is 30 levels too hard lmao.
Now I'm 95 and am bound to not get match made with ANYONE
 
FastLikeLightning said:
MP is. To be a Cleric Beast type boss is one that I large, and whose moves is entirely based on big sweeping motions forward that require a bunch of precise dodges, keeps on you when trying to heal, and is in general very erratic with its moves, making its tells hard to read.

That sounds more like...every single boss in Dark Souls 1. The series has always been big on "big giant thing with hyper armor on everything" boss monsters, and ironically I don't think it was until Bloodborne that they started switching things up a bit (well, you could say that the gimmick -3 bosses in Demon's Souls were similar, IE Storm Ruler and Dragon God).

As for that definition, Cleric Beast itself isn't all that eratic. In fact I'd say Moon Presence and Ludwig are the only giant-monster type enemies that have that distinction. I'd say Moon Presence is more like a weaker version of Manus, given the aforementioned chaotic animations, speed, and magic attacks.

FastLikeLightning said:
By this criteria, the bosses I consider Cleric-Beast like (Not including chalice bosses) would be Cleric Beast (duh), Blood-Starved, Vicar Amelia, Paarl, 1st Phase Ludwig, Laurence, and Moon Presence makes 7.

Amelia and Blood Starved are absolutely nothing like Cleric Beast, and are good examples of how vast amounts of nuance can be lost when you reduce things to such simple terms.

Blood Starved is all about attacks with massive reach but that are incredibly narrow. This honestly makes him the complete opposite of Cleric Beast and Ludwig, both of whom will swat you like flies if you try to circle around them constantly. BSB also has a massively different arena then CB which factors into his fight massively. With BSB you want to be constantly circle strafing him to abuse his low turning speed and narrow attack range, while minding the pillars and walls so that you don't get put into a position where you have to stop abruptly (and potentially get caught by a combo or throw). CB's arena is vastly more narrow and more a contest of making sure you have space to retreat to instead of getting backed up against a wall.

I could go on about the rest but you get the picture.

Like I said, by your definition, we might as well call 90% of the bosses in the entire franchise "Cleric Beast reskins" :\ Or alternatively, every boss in Dark Souls 1 is an Asylum Demon reskin.
 
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FastLikeLightning said:
I mean... yeah? The souls series has a lot of same bosses. I'm not going to argue that. It's true.
I can't agree. There's more to designing a boss then just the basic, surface stuff (nuance, etc.). Just because something has similar mechanics, doesn't mean it can't have a massively different strategy designed into it. And at the end of the day, those strategies are really what set it apart.

Sorry to go all WORDS WORDS WORDS regardless.
 
Squire Grooktook said:
And at the end of the day, those strategies are really what set it apart.

You say that, but how many huge monster enemies do you beat by shoving your face in their lower thigh and swinging? How many human-sized bosses do you beat by strafing to the left and punishing whifs? How many huge human enemies do you beat by standing under their crotch and dodging the requisite big dumb buttslam? Souls bosses get really formulaic if you look at therm. They do break from the mold on occasion, sometimes it's good and sometimes it's... Bed of Chaos-y. I'm willing to bet that if BB2 or SpaceBorne of whatever comes out, I could give a pretty good strategy for all the bosses after fighting them for like 10 seconds, it's really not that hard.
 
Well, for Bloodborne...

FastLikeLightning said:
You say that, but how many huge monster enemies do you beat by shoving your face in their lower thigh and swinging?

I'm gonna say none, because just "shoving your face in...and swinging" sounds like mashing which just never works in these games. And their height is an aesthetic element and mostly different for each boss so...

FastLikeLightning said:
How many human-sized bosses do you beat by strafing to the left and punishing whifs?
Pretty much just BSB is the only fight that revolves entirely around strafing. You can use that tactic situationaly during a lot of the other fights, but your application of it and when you do it is going to be a lot different since each boss has different strings, not all of which are punishable.

The human/duel-able bosses in BB I actually find that backing up is more effective then strafing, since they tend to have less reach then the giant monsters, but both are needed for different attacks and phases and such.

FastLikeLightning said:
How many huge human enemies do you beat by standing under their crotch and dodging the requisite big dumb buttslam?

I don't think any of the bosses in BB actually have that move? The only boss I can really get under is Ludwig's first phase (when I actually do manage to get far enough to one side of him that his turning rate allows me to get some rush down) And so far the only boss I've used that strat against in DS3 is Vordt.

And if we wanna get into gimmicks, I really love One Reborn, Rom, Shadows of Yharnum, Micolash, Amygdala, and (as easy as they are) Living Failures. Those guys don't really play anything like anything else in the game. One Reborn's only analogue is Tower Knight, which was 3 games ago (and he's waaaay cooler anyway).

So yeah, these are well designed games with a lot of tactical variety, and deserve far more credit then you're giving them IMO. I don't want to force this, just my opinion.
 
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Made it to the Grand Archives, after finishing Archdragon peak I'm pretty sure I'm nearing the end.
Been pretty fun so far, about as much fun as I had with Bloodborne, hoping the DLC will be just as good
Can we please find out about Ocelotte
 
Squire Grooktook said:
Well, for Bloodborne...

I'm talking about the series in general here, BB has different ones, just by virtue of design. You beat every Hunter in the game by parrying, you beat beast-types by staying just outside their normal reach and pinging them on their slower, longer distance attacks.

Squire Grooktook said:
I'm gonna say none, because just "shoving your face in...and swinging" sounds like mashing which just never works in these games. And their height is an aesthetic element and mostly different for each boss so...

It's not mashing, it's getting to where the boss's normal moveset can't hit you (Which is usually directly under them or just behind their thigh) and wailing on them while they try to hit you. It's made better by the fact that bosses will usually only have one or two moves that can hit you from there, which makes dodging them much easier.

Squire Grooktook said:
Pretty much just BSB is the only fight that revolves entirely around strafing. You can use that tactic situationaly during a lot of the other fights, but your application of it and when you do it is going to be a lot different since each boss has different strings, not all of which are punishable.

The human/duel-able bosses in BB I actually find that backing up is more effective then strafing, since they tend to have less reach then the giant monsters, but both are needed for different attacks and phases and such.

That is accurate, but once again I'm talking whole-series here, more like Artorias, or Taurus Demon, or the DS2 Dude in Armor Squad.

Squire Grooktook said:
I don't think any of the bosses in BB actually have that move?

That's mostly because BB tends to cap it's boss size at 'really big' rather than 'is that an enemy or a moon'.

Squire Grooktook said:
One Reborn

Just get into his side and wail, dodge fireballs and the weird corpse-portals and it's cake. One reborn always felt more like Gaping Dragon than Tower Knight, at least to me.
 
FastLikeLightning said:
I'm talking about the series in general here, BB has different ones, just by virtue of design. You beat every Hunter in the game by parrying, you beat beast-types by staying just outside their normal reach and pinging them on their slower, longer distance attacks.

Beating Hunters with parries is more of a minor design flaw then anything. It's alleviated strongly if you're not playing a high Skill character (since visceral attack damage scales with skill), but otherwise those fights are amazing otherwise and it's worth it to handicap yourself a little if it improves them (or not, I find parrying inconsistent enough that it really is a valid risk/reward gambit that sometimes end runs and sometimes wins them).

I don't find the beast one accurate at all though. Like I don't think I even use that strategy for half of them.

FastLikeLightning said:
It's not mashing, it's getting to where the boss's normal moveset can't hit you (Which is usually directly under them or just behind their thigh) and wailing on them while they try to hit you. It's made better by the fact that bosses will usually only have one or two moves that can hit you from there, which makes dodging them much easier.

I don't have that experience with BB honestly, and barely with the rest of the series. Drastic blindspots are kinda rare imo. In general, unless you're on the other side of the arena, you're in range of several different moves/attack strings at any given time at any given position, which the ai can randomly select at almost any time.

Even when that's applicable, it's different per boss based on when they have the tendency to do these attacks and such, the hitboxes, the size, the speed, etc. Taking advantage of Ludwig's blindspots requires a lot of different movements, set ups, baits, etc. compared to taking advantage of BSB's blind spots or Laurence's.

It's too reductive to just say "oh just do this one strategy every time." It's like telling someone to just air-dash-in every match in a fighting game. Not only is it different per match up, but it's different depending on the player (or in this case, the ai peculiarities, which is always a bit random in these games anyway).



FastLikeLightning said:
That is accurate, but once again I'm talking whole-series here, more like Artorias, or Taurus Demon, or the DS2 Dude in Armor Squad.

Eh, I'd rather stick with BB, being the only game I've played through 3 times. Last DS1 playthrough was a year ago and my memory is fuzzy for some stuff in that game anyway (though I do think it does have slightly worse boss variety, but not to a problematic degree).

If I had to rank the games on tactical variety within boss fights, it'd probably be something like:

Bloodborne > Demon's Souls > Dark Souls 1

With DS3 being an unknown due to not finishing it, but probably above Demon's Souls based on what I've played so far. Haven't played DS2 either. I don't think DS1 is bad in terms of variety, but I do feel like they made more of a conscious effort to diversify the bosses mechanically in Bloodborne.
 
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Squire Grooktook said:
Parrying

Even if you have low skill, Viscerals will still be doing 2-4 times normal damage unless you're rolling something particularly cheesy like pre-patch cannon or the like. I'm also not in the business of artificially limiting myself to make the game more challenging; if I can parry the boss, I will parry the boss.

Squire Grooktook said:
I don't find the beast one accurate at all though. Like I don't think I even use that strategy for half of them.

Admittedly it's been a little while, but that's the strategy I recall using for Cleric Beast, Amelia, Curse-Ludwig, Laurence, maybe Paarl, can' quite recall.

Squire Grooktook said:
Standing in the boss

Pulling up a list on the wiki of bosses where this strategy applies:
DS1: Asylum Demon, Quelagg, Priscilla, Demon Firesage, Gaping Dragon, Nito, Iron Golem, Sanctuary Guardian, Seath, Sif, and both Stray and Taurus Demons.
DS2: Last Giant, Executioners Chariot, Covetous Demon, Smelter Demon, Najka, The Rotten, Guardian Dragon, Sinh, Aava.
BB: Cleric Beast, Amelia, Paaral, One Reborn, Moon Presence, Laurence.

Now, obviously the same exact timing won't work on every boss on this list, but the general strategy (AKA the thing I'm arguing about) of staying to a side to limit their attack options does. There are bosses that distinguish themselves, mostly by having very effective moves that below or to the side which makes it non-optimal, but many of them are either non-existent or easy to dodge.

Squire Grooktook said:
In general though, unless you're on the other side of the arena, you're in range of several different moves/attack strings at any given time at any given position, which the ai can randomly select at almost any time.

Strongly disagree. From the full room length, bosses have more options than you do. You can't hit bosses from across the room unless you're a caster, but bosses can just walk up to you and you're in the same situation. You can't back up forever, the rooms have walls. Comparatively, being up in a boss behind them or to the side means that they can't easily hit with their normal attacks (Often times you won't even need to dodge, just strafing is often enough), which limits their only effective attacks to ones specifically built to counter that positioning, all well and good until you realize that most bosses only have one, sometimes maybe two, of those attacks, which makes the boss very predictable. AI in Souls games is actually really dumb if you know what you're doing, and one of the easiest ways to break them is to get in their grill.

Squire Grooktook said:
Boss Variety

BB gets off with fewer of these, but I don't think it's a good idea to make series-wide claims using the game that's most different mechanically as a base.

------------------------------------------

Besides all that, there is a Kickstarter for a Dark Souls board game right now, from my understanding it was funded in about 3 minutes after it's launch. Seems pretty cool.
 
FastLikeLightning said:
if I can parry the boss, I will parry the boss.

That's fine. I think the mechanic is a bit questionable, and I'm not against challenge runs and such. So eh. but it's not enough of a deal breaker to me either way. I still find the "human"-ish bosses in Bloodborne to be my favorite battles in the franchise either way.

FastLikeLightning said:
Now, obviously the same exact timing won't work on every boss on this list, but the general strategy (AKA the thing I'm arguing about) of staying to a side to limit their attack options does. There are bosses that distinguish themselves...
I think the mistake in reasoning here is that just because you can use spacing to make a fight easier, that doesn't mean all spacing is the same. Like I said, taking advantage of Ludwig's blindspots is a lot different from taking advantage of Cleric Beasts blind spots or CSB's, and you still have to deal with different threats in both manuevering into position and staying here.

It's like saying all zoning based fg characters are the same. Or worse still, that all spacing in general is the same. Because spacing is really what you're describing on a fundamental level. The alternative would be if there were absolutely no difference between any relative positioning between the player and the boss.

The thing I was originally arguing is that you can't accurately call every giant monster a "cleric beast reskin" just because they share some extremely basic traits. Yes you use spacing against them, it's a fundamental of strategy that should apply to all boss fights in action games. But it's not just "strafe and punish for every boss ever", there are nuances to each fight in when you strafe, when you block, when you roll, when you punish, how you bait attacks to get into position, etc. etc.


FastLikeLightning said:
Strongly disagree. From the full room length, bosses have more options than you do.

I wasn't saying anything about player options,

FastLikeLightning said:
all well and good until you realize that most bosses only have one, sometimes maybe two, of those attacks, which makes the boss very predictable.

Between trying to stay there and trying to read the attacks, I think it's hard enough to maintain a decent challenge imo, but that's another matter entirely.

FastLikeLightning said:
AI in Souls games is actually really dumb if you know what you're doing, and one of the easiest ways to break them is to get in their grill.

From my experience and experimentation, it's not so much that AI in Souls is dumb so much as it is simply random. Most boss ai simply amounts to
>>walk towards player
>>randomly choose attack a, b, or c
>>repeat

Which I'm fine with. Keeps you improvising.
 
Squire Grooktook said:
I think the mistake in reasoning here is that just because you can use spacing to make a fight easier, that doesn't mean all spacing is the same. Like I said, taking advantage of Ludwig's blindspots is a lot different from taking advantage of Cleric Beasts blind spots, and you still have to deal with different threats in both manuevering into position and staying here.

But the spacing is very similar; for four-legged bosses low to the ground it's to the right side, for four-legged bosses standing tall and humanoid but giant enemies it's below them, and for normal-ish sized human enemies it's whatever hand their holding their weapon in. Bloodborne has different ones because of it's engine changes; enemies turn to the side faster and track herder, so the primary spot for large enemies is directly in front to get max abuse out of i-frames, and Hunters are faster and have harder to deal with weapons than normal Souls-humanoids, so strafing is less effective.

To use your fighting game analogy, it'd be like if sweeps had a universal 1 1/4 character length reach, pokes with a universal 1/2 character leangth reach, etc. In that such game, spacing would be same-y, because the characters have identical spacing. Sure, a grappler with a 3/4 character leangth grab would make you rethink relying on pokes, but you still know what the spacing on his sweep will be.

Squire Grooktook said:
Between trying to stay there and trying to read the attacks, I think it's hard enough to maintain a decent challenge imo, but that's another matter entirely.

We're not talking about challenge, just boss strategy.

Squire Grooktook said:
From my experience and experimentation, it's not so much that AI in Souls is dumb so much as it is simply random.
AI in Souls games is actually pretty predictable. Here is one of my favourite examples; by using an item outside of normal attack range, he forces the AI into a pattern of using the laser which he can punish. Similar things go for other bosses in the series; most of them are just a collection of if->than statements about player position, animation state, current health and stamina, etc.. It's pretty easy to abuse if you know about it. It's the reason that bosses always do their long-range attacks as you're healing, or always do the command grab when you're out of stamina. It's not bad luck, it's programmed to do that.
 
FastLikeLightning said:
But the spacing is very similar; for four-legged bosses low to the ground it's to the right side, for four-legged bosses standing tall and humanoid but giant enemies it's below them, and for normal-ish sized human enemies it's whatever hand their holding their weapon in.

That =/= similar though.

Let's say two enemies are both beaten primarily by strafing rather then outranging them from a distance. Those two strafe games can still be very different in application, even though they're both about strafing.

I mean think about it. Souls is a very 2d game in terms of spacing. There's no jump button. You can either back up or you can strafe. It's not like this is a very acrobatic game where you have the entire volume of the arena to manuever. I don't think there's any sin in boss fights primarily being based around wiffing and strafing, just as long as how you accomplish these things are different (which they are due to different timings, attack strings, ranges, etc. etc.)

FastLikeLightning said:
To use your fighting game analogy, it'd be like if sweeps had a universal 1 1/4 character length reach, pokes with a universal 1/2 character leangth reach, etc. In that such game, spacing would be same-y, because the characters have identical spacing. Sure, a grappler with a 3/4 character leangth grab would make you rethink relying on pokes, but you still know what the spacing on his sweep will be.

No! Not at all. Most of the big bosses have much different ranges then that. I mean, compare BSB range compared to Cleric range compared to Ludwig reach is way different. You can step backwards against Ludwig but you can't do it against BSB. Different range and timings and arcs on everything. Everyone really has their own mix up game, so to speak.

What it is more like is how some games have generally similar footsies games. KOF games you can generally communicate things in terms of that short hop vs standing jab vs low attack trinity. Street Fighter, you have the classic bait and wiff low short game. You can read Maj's old footsies guide/street fighter bible, and most of it is similarly universal like what you're talking about.

These are all very similar in general concept and on paper, but their application and how they actually end up working in the heat of the match is a lot more dynamic! Which is true here too.

FastLikeLightning said:
AI in Souls games is actually pretty predictable. Here is one of my favourite examples; by using an item outside of normal attack range, he forces the AI into a pattern of using the laser which he can punish. Similar things go for other bosses in the series; most of them are just a collection of if->than statements about player position, animation state, current health and stamina, etc.. It's pretty easy to abuse if you know about it. It's the reason that bosses always do their long-range attacks as you're healing, or always do the command grab when you're out of stamina. It's not bad luck, it's programmed to do that.

I've heard and seen a lot of contradicting things about the actual AI programming. All I can say is that, in my experience, there are a few patterns and loops but there's also a lot of random elements. I've seen a lot of situations where, when the exact same circumstance is repeated, the enemy/boss has a coin flip chance of doing a different thing each time. Maybe it's just that the spacing in the game logic is so tight that you can't tell the difference, but if that's the case it should be hard enough to be manipulate that it might as well be random. Maybe. Or maybe my experiments are wrong. Or maybe it varies on a boss/enemy basis (most likely, I can definitely confirm from some speed runner commentaries that certain bosses are a lot more random then others).

Only other thing I can note is that, aside from undead giant, enemies attacking during heals is not as common in BB to me as it is in Souls. I often find myself able to get away with a lot of spontaneous close/mid-range heals because it comes in a gap in their offense.
 
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Bit of a spoiler-y question, but is there a way to make
hollowing
stop happening? I figured out how to undo the effects, at least temporarily, but not how to stop it completely. I'd rather know sooner than later if not, in which case I'll just restart my character and not get caught up in that mess.
 
Buy the 20,000 key from handmaiden, give what you find to the firekeeper.
 
Keep in mind, however, that if you reverse that condition at ANY time, be it from Purging Stone or Firekeeper you are LOCKED OUT of the Secret Ending.
And for you Trophy hunters, yes, the third secret ending has a trophy.
 
Jutsei said:
Keep in mind, however, that if you reverse that condition at ANY time, be it from Purging Stone or Firekeeper you are LOCKED OUT of the Secret Ending.
And for you Trophy hunters, yes, the third secret ending has a trophy.
Given the nature of the condition, I'm fine with that on my first playthrough. When I'm better at the game and not dying all the time, then I'll worry about using it and secret endings.
 
Holy shit I missed the Bandit Twinblades and only just now found them.

Bloodborne dash? This game just got x10 better.
 
So, to kill the time until I can play the DLC with my main character, I'm doing an SL1 run! Well, started doing it last night, actually. Made it to Vordt without dying, now I'm at settlement. I'm excited for when the bosses actually start getting hard. Well, more like a creeping sense of dread, but hey? What's the difference, really?
 
What I'm probably gonna do is nab all the endings with my main character, then start all over once both DLCs come out.

And because I kinda wanna go for the Platinum
And boy this is one Platinum that won't fuck around
You'd think at least two playthroughs would be enough to get all sorceries and pyromancies, but it's a RING achievement that gets ya
You gotta get every single ring in the game
and some rings are only spawnable on New Game +, and New Game ++
And guess what one of the rings in NG++ is only gettable after beating the ultra tough optional boss
 
Jutsei said:
And because I kinda wanna go for the Platinum
And boy this is one Platinum that won't fuck around
I never get summoned so I tried farming Proofs of Concord and I'm going to say here and now; fuck that. I wanted to platinum it, but no, not with miracles locked behind covenants I don't.
 
FastLikeLightning said:
Which one? There's a couple of those.
I can't remember but you gotta beat
The Nameless King
on NG++ at the least.
There's also a few rings you can only get via covenants, and don't forget the miracles/sorceries/pyromancies (some ALSO behind covenant walls), all while keeping it on one single character!
 
Wow, Rapport + Aldrich's Sapphire = risk-free farming, easy Lothric Knights, and easy Cathedral Knights... Fromsoft, please never patch this.
 
A great area to farm, I've found is
Anor Londo's Bonfire, once you've figured out how to stunlock the Silver Knights, they are easy, risk free farming, you risk losing nothing if you never go past the stairs because the bonfires right fucking there and you can nab the Souls easy
 
Honestly just running through the archives is a great way to farm, there isn't really much risk and if you wear the right gear you'll be getting like 100K for only running the first half.
 
The only farming I've been doing is for vertebra shackles and conchord ears... and what grinding it is...
 
So I'm currently Sunbro-ing as a dedicated archer and... it's actually working. I'm loving this
 
Currently working my say through DaS2. I have to say...FUCK SOME OF THESE DESIGN CHANGES. I'm currently stuck on 3 bosses: Royal Rat Authority, Smelter Demon, and Old Iron King. I'm totally out of human effigies and don't know where I can grind them cause fights are getting tougher and tougher. The Iron Forge area can go straight to hell. Like wtf. Its like the black knight archers from Anor Londo on steroids. Freaking greatarrows and samurai knights everywhere.

My current build is focused on dexterity with good strength. I also have enough faith to use some healing magic, but have been mostly sticking to pyromancy. I'm seriously stuck and can't get further.
 
North888 said:
I'm totally out of human effigies and don't know where I can grind them cause fights are getting tougher and tougher.

Have you found the Ring of Binding? If the health penalty is getting you down, that ring is your best friend.

North888 said:
Royal Rat Authority

Completely optional boss, if you're having serious trouble with him it's likely because you're underleveled. Skip it for now, come back later.

North888 said:
Smelter Demon

You're rolling to early, stop doing that. Wait until their actually swinging to roll or else you'll get caught 95% of the time. Consider leveling Adaptability if it's low for extra i-frames, otherwise just time your rolls better.
Incidentally, if you've already gotten to OIK, Smelter is technically optional (You do want to beat him though, going to his boss room after he's dead will let you get one of the best rings in the game).

North888 said:
Old Iron King

One of three things is happening: you're really bad at rolling, you're really good at rolling into the lava pit, or you haven't gotten the bonfire located a single room before OIK. These things are very easy to fix (Git gud, pay more attention to the floor, and light that shit, respectively).

North888 said:
My current build is focused on dexterity with good strength. I also have enough faith to use some healing magic, but have been mostly sticking to pyromancy. I'm seriously stuck and can't get further.

You're build is stretched way too thin; consider a respec and focus on doing one thing instead of three.
 
Thanks for the help. Smelter demon mostly gets me cause I'm not very amazing at dodging. So I usually dodge a lot of his attacks, but that one combo I fail to stop kills me.

In regards to my build, I have just enough faith to cast heal, which I've reduced the cost to use thanks to the one merchant to it's minimum. So i have about 10 faith atm. All my stats are basically going into dex, with some into the health/stamina/equip load, and some into strength so I can wails the weapons I want. I use pyromancy and archery for ranged cause fire is good at stunning and archer cause massive dex. I'm mostly just focusing on the dex and upgrading my pyromancy flame istead of buffing my magic stats. It still does respectable damage like that.

Also I noticed that the pursuer just kinda stopped showing up after the first great soul enemy. It bugged me he wasn't ambushing me anymore at key spots
 
The pursuer basically only shows up in Lost Bastille, with a couple exceptions.

Also, yeah, rolling is a pain in 2, though it's more that everything is kinda clunky. I actually tested the input lag and for rolling it's about 3-4f, which is bad, but the main difference is that because you can run while locked on in 2, you don't roll when pressing the button as you did in 1, at least when rolling sideways or backwards while locked on. So all rolls in 2 are negative edge, and have a few frames additional input delay, and cancel attacks much later in the swing than 1, and use twice as much stamina. I ran all of 2 shieldless, and that was a constant struggle.

Weirdly, I found that rolling through the Smelter Demon's attacks while not locked on was more reliable.

Also, if you plan to play 3, there's some good and bad news. The bad news is that the movement systems are fundamentally the same as 2. The good news is that the move timings and stamina usage are the same as (or very close to) 1. Basically it will feel like 1 until you realize that rolls are still all negative edge.
 
Really? I found the rolling to be a bit more responsive in 2. Maybe its cause I was getting better but I was able to dodge a lot more attacks consistently in 2 than 1. Then again, It may be because of the way weight affects you in DS2 compared to DS1. As far as I can tell there's no fatty roll that is basically worthless like in the first, so even at 65-ish% my roll still feels pretty responsive compared to it in DS1. I used a lot of equip load boosters in DS1 lol.
 
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