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Painwheel general discussion AKA GET OUT OF MY THREAD

Well I've had a little more time to play around with beta painwheel. Really like where unfly is right now. I think it's perfect with full momentum forwards and half momentum back. Also I never talked about changes to install. Which are mostly fine. However I had an instance where BB supered and I was in the middle of a move with Parasoul so I DHC'd to install and still got hit because of the 5 frames extra recovery. And BB wasn't even right on top of me, he was still a good 1/3rd screen away. I just feel it's not as good as a safe dhc as it used to be. I figured taking out the hitstop would be good enough but the extra recovery might be a little overkill imo
 
Why tho? Having a few safe DHCs around should be fine, there's still Cat heads/Peacock Bomb/Sing super/Para Bikes etc .. why does PW need to lose hers? :[
 
It's still a safe DHC

It was the only DHC before that allowed you to be safe after WHIFFING the first super
Now the opponent has to block whatever you throw out first - just like with every other safe(ish) DHC.
 
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TrulyAmiracle said:
Why tho? Having a few safe DHCs around should be fine, there's still Cat heads/Peacock Bomb/Sing super/Para Bikes etc .. why does PW need to lose hers? :[
Vulpes got it, none of those are safe on first-super-whiff. Install was.
 
Mike_Z said:
Vulpes got it, none of those are safe on first-super-whiff. Install was.

It still is with Double Car. At least punishment is very circumstantial, due to the DHC point being very far off.
 
Lord I'm sick of Peacock match ups. Assisted, unassisted, good or bad, they give me a solid run for my money. The wall o' shit takes half your health. You reach her, she tele's away... god help you if she has an assist. Just got tele/piller shoved in my face a dozen or so times. Easily my worst MU even compared to my awful track record vs Parasoul.

Any advice?

Also, any Parasoul advice.

I'm drowning in those two MU.
 
Spencer said:
Lord I'm sick of Peacock match ups. Assisted, unassisted, good or bad, they give me a solid run for my money. The wall o' shit takes half your health. You reach her, she tele's away... god help you if she has an assist. Just got tele/piller shoved in my face a dozen or so times. Easily my worst MU even compared to my awful track record vs Parasoul.

Any advice?

Also, any Parasoul advice.

I'm drowning in those two MU.

If it was Skarmand, don't feel bad.

Happens to the entire Pacific Northwest, minus Yaya and Domo.
 
Hi ok so teleport is not much of a problem, as PW can actually bait it really well. If you're in range to hit them, expect them to teleport and fly backwards and punish. As for getting in...... yeahhhh thats hard!! haha

I'd help you out with the parasoul matchup if i knew how to
 
hlvn said:
1. Distract him with 8-ball
2. Place 50$ bounty on his head
3. Hope on bracket luck
I got nothin' bro.

Weep?

@Domo (or anyone really)

Have you tried beta unfly vs Parasoul? Is it promising?
 
Spencer said:
Weep?

@Domo (or anyone really)

Have you tried beta unfly vs Parasoul? Is it promising?

Unfly DOES help a lot in this matchup lol. i didn't mention it in the last post since its not 100% going to be in the real game.
 
Psoul matchup, to help deal with j lp j hp chain, if they do it a lot, you can air armor xx super the first part and beat it clean. but if you start air armoring a lot thinking they will, they get a free air grab, so be careful. You actually outzone her with nails if flight canceled. If she tries to snipershot you as you're doing this, if on the ground deathcrawl will make it wiff and you hit her as well. if in fly frames, you can only air super, if she does it late you can armor and then refly. lp armor is your friend in this matchup, do it if you think pressure will start again, as it has 2 frame startup (I think? I know air armor is 2 frame but @Mike_Z 's frame data in training doesn't cover this for grounded armor) you can often nab combos this way out of their pressure, just be quick to chain since you will more likely than not be able to if you don't chain right away. get used to confirming off of no charge hp nail xx fly, it's really good in a lot of matchups. don't fly until unfly is in retail, even then be very careful, only doing it at fullscreen. Buers will out range all her normals, so there's that if you want to footsie it, however, psoul has the advantage since her move speed is way better than yours on the ground and can close in to hit you faster. cr hk will low profile her projectiles, allowing you to cancel it into your own nails to get zoning started. Finally, if mike is reading this, I have a small concern when you have the time to answer. There is so much autocorrect in this game, but if you armor and you're opponent crosses you up, you're only real option is to cancel to lk buer. Is there no way that armored moves could auto correct as well once they come out. Probably not since animation etc, but just curious, I think it would help in a lot of matchups if it were the case.

edit: don't forget that blocking in the air will allow you to pbgc fly which can get you a little momentum
edit2 pw boogaloo : back hp hp tear shot chain is punishable if you pushblock the first one and pbgc into lk buer
 
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also, I didn't realize how sad the install hitstop nerf made me. It used to be that if someone was negative 4 or more on after an attack, if you installed it was a guaranteed grab punish (I think). Spending 2 bars to do this made me feel it was reasonable. Not anymore. Certain install combos (as in cancel into install contiune combo) don't work anymore as well.
edit: I realize why the super was changed, I just want to whine haha
 
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@WarpedEcho

A lot of great advice. I never actually considered PBGC into flight, to be honest. I'll have to try some of this out.

If you are flying when she sniper shots, you can get a full combo from a huge distance away. You can hg j.hp on reaction xx fly > j.mp, though I assume you mean she catches you transitioning into fly and not already in it? I'll have to try the hg lp, I never use it. I really do love hg mp though.

And I have to echo the sentiment that no autocorrect on armor is super frustrating. It seems to be fair on the slower armor moves, s.hp especially, but I lose my mind when I read the stupid Filia spam, armor s.mp and whiff it because she crossed up, and it doesn't autocorrect... only to be hit by an autocorrect double butt assist 15 seconds later. I've actually stopped using hg mp entirely as its use is super niche.
 
Before I even attempt to look at that, is that you getting crossed up after you're touched, or as you're touched?
I'd be willing to like, on the frame you get touched you'll correct, but that's probably about it. MAYBE "if you hit her once she lets it go she corrects" but that seems really good, ain't no other move that works THAT way.

[edit] Assists autocorrect on the landing frame, not after the move starts, you whiny people.
 
Spencer said:
And I have to echo the sentiment that no autocorrect on armor is super frustrating. It seems to be fair on the slower armor moves, s.hp especially, but I lose my mind when I read the stupid Filia spam, armor s.mp and whiff it because she crossed up, and it doesn't autocorrect... only to be hit by an autocorrect double butt assist 15 seconds later. I've actually stopped using hg mp entirely as its use is super niche.

I use cr.MP almost exclusively because of this. It has the most rear-reaching hitbox of all her moves, and it's active for a long time. Because of this, when people habitually press buttons after they cross up, they can actually get hit out of move-startup. Hurtboxes tend to extend before a normal becomes active. It's like sticking your hand into a blender. Hoo hoo hoo.
 
Spencer said:
@Krackatoa

Yeah, c.mp is super strong and is probably my favorite hg all-purpose.

Really the only ones I haven't found a use for are lights and s.mp.

I try to think of charged s.MP as a Guilty Gear 6P and tend to use it in similar circumstances.
 
Like jump ins?

The problem is with 1 armor it gets crushed more often than not.

Admittedly I've had some luck throwing it out there vs a grounded val, but I'm always so surprised it hit that I don't follow up.

Generally, in my experience you're going to whiff vs Fil and MF or eat two or more hits from the rest of the cast.

I'm not saying it should necessarily be changed, but unless you find something niche with it, I think there are always better options.
 
Lol i must be the only PW that only uses the heavy's armor >__>; I'll try out c.MP armor to see if I can find some uses for it..
 
The heavys are the best, the mp ones are funny but non powerful for the most part, the st.lp is a great as an armored tick throw.

Best overall is probably cr.hk as a frame trap since it hits low and can be combod from plus has fast armor startup.
 
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I should use it more, I would beat the better backdashes too moreso that charge hp.
 
CR.MP armor is amazing. Some korean dude or w/e bodied my solo bella by beating my jump in j.hk's with cr.mp armor -> full combo.

Didn't realize what he was doing until I died.
 
dekillsage said:
CR.MP armor is amazing. Some korean dude or w/e bodied my solo bella by beating my jump in j.hk's with cr.mp armor -> full combo.

Didn't realize what he was doing until I died.
Oh wow, they can do that?! Really afraid of the day when the general Painwheel populace learns how to utilize all of her armor moves effectively.
 
Yeah the heavies are super solid. I especially love hg s.hp as mash bait. It works wonders vs stupid Fortunes who just spam their ungodly fast lp knocking you out of all kinds of resets. My problem with heavies is that they have a fairly one dimensional hurtbox and a charge time just slow enough to eat a ton of damage.

So all that said, I've easily got the most mileage out of c.mp. I've had a ton of luck with hg c.mp into ratchet poppy into full combo.

Anyone have decent advice for charged lp, mp, mk, or c.lp? I've not ever really got them to work for me consistently.
 
Krackatoa said:
You mean to tell me this whole time none of you have been using cr.MP..?

guyspls. plsguys.

It's my "go-to" panic button which I probably should not admit publicly.
 
Mike_Z said:
Before I even attempt to look at that, is that you getting crossed up after you're touched, or as you're touched?
I'd be willing to like, on the frame you get touched you'll correct, but that's probably about it. MAYBE "if you hit her once she lets it go she corrects" but that seems really good, ain't no other move that works THAT way.

[edit] Assists autocorrect on the landing frame, not after the move starts, you whiny people.
I'm talking about as you're being touched, like charged to anticipate val's jump/dash in but it just crosses up and my moves whiffs, I get punished into full combo. The second option you mentioned is what I'd prefer (obviously) but I agree that that shit is really good. That's like some melty blood shit. The first option I am fine with, as long as there is something I can do about getting crossed up on a hit prediction I'm happy.
 
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Another bit on the Parasoul matchup, Pillar xx Bikes is easily punished in the corner if you mash pushblock during bikes super flash. You can pbgc counterhit throw or any faster button (7 frames or less) if done properly (pushblock the instant the bikes touch you.) All characters can do this if you have the tools

Also, If parasoul does this to any teammate, if you mash painwheel tag you get a clean punish if they don't dhc anywhere midscreen
 
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Anyone have any luck with c.HK?

I've been trying to work it in lately since it's her longest range HG attack and nobody ever expects it. I've been cancelling into MK Buer (or LK Buer is close enough) or Death Crawl, but I'm wondering if anyone else has messed around with it and have better ideas.
 
ButterKnife said:
Anyone have any luck with c.HK?

I've been trying to work it in lately since it's her longest range HG attack and nobody ever expects it. I've been cancelling into MK Buer (or LK Buer is close enough) or Death Crawl, but I'm wondering if anyone else has messed around with it and have better ideas.

I charge it at round start against bellas sometimes.

If they run, let it rip. If they do something else, fly cancel it and start taking space or go in.

There's a few anti-pushblock strings I'm trying to work out with c.HK + bomber call for someone that gets used to pushblocking c.MK, but nothing concrete yet.
 
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