ShadeMoneh
We have a h8r
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I mentioned this in the Peacock General thread, to save the small trouble of searching for it here is what Mike Z told me:Could someone please explain to me how the first combo doesn't trigger undizzy while the second one does?
In both combos, as soon as Argus starts, I'm at 210. The item drops and goes to 230, then the gunshots bring it up to 250. This is true for both but only in the second one does undizzy come up. Why?
The tl;dr explanation is:
You are linking off something, and by the time you hit with the linked-into attack the undizzy is above the limit.
The complicated explanation is:
A projectile will ADD undizzzy if the character is still in the state that created the projectile when it hits, but it will ACTIVATE an undizzy burst anytime if it could have ever added undizzy.
If a projectile hits while you are still in the state that created it, that state counts as "having hit" like a regular attack. If you are not in that state when the projectile hits, it is ignored.
Projectiles and assists are ignored for purposes of figuring out when chains end or start.
So you are actually linking off the state BEFORE the Argus, but it is still true that to your character you are just "linking with full undizzy".
If you do a chained Lv1 item drop, Peacock is still in the item spawn state when it hits, so it will add undizzy but will not trigger it and does count as chained-into.
If you do a chained Lv2 item drop, Peacock is not in the spawning state any longer so it will trigger undizzy but does not count as either chained-into or chained-out-of.
If Peacock or Parasoul were allowed to hold a hit that counted as either chained-into or chained-out-of for long enough to use it in a different chain, there would be exploitable sequences that would not trigger bursts. (See also: SDE Peacock, heh.)
[edit]
If the shots have to travel, by the time you get to the 2nd/3rd shot you are no longer in the state that spawned the 1st/2nd shot, so it works how you noticed. You can check by doing a combo that leaves them right next to you and looking at what 3 slow shots that continue the combo do, which will be different.
TJ already posted the explanation, but basically:Could someone please explain to me how the first combo doesn't trigger undizzy while the second one does?
In both combos, as soon as Argus starts, I'm at 210. The item drops and goes to 230, then the gunshots bring it up to 250. This is true for both but only in the second one does undizzy come up. Why?
TJ already posted the explanation, but basically:
Projectiles count as chained-into as long as you are still in the state that created them when they hit; if they hit after that, they will not count as chained-into and can trigger undizzy.
Each shot of her gun is a different state. I guess I could fix that, but it's really difficult to do (and honestly I'd rather just not have you shoot there, heh).
In the first combo, all the shots hit while she is still in the state that spawned them.
In the second, they don't, so it'll trigger undizzy.
Well, yeah. You're staying in the state that produced each shot until it hits, that way. Not surprising.
Er, no. That's a side-effect, you're nuts if you think this level of thing was considered by a designer on any game. :^P
uuhh but, does it work with other characters?, i mean double is pretty heavy though.
After further consideration I probably should learn these since I use Peacock/Big Band as a counterpick for other Peacock teams, and it turns out I don't actually remember how to do combos without Drag 'n Bite assist.Just for you @mcpeanuts
Oh, there are two adcs in there. XD And I've never super jumped in a combo... I'll try practicing to see if I can get it. Thanks for the reply.
The midscreen conversion off throw is like, throw xx L bomb + release M item. It's really hard, and I don't think it even works on every character, so I don't go for it.Well, I don't see a thread for resets anywhere, so I might as well drop this here. Has anybody else been cancelling the first hit of s. HP with Shadow Of Impending Doom to create a grab reset? I've heard that you can convert off of Peacock's grab if you have a shadow charging, but I can't seem to get it without using an assist.
It's at frame advantage, so you can block reversals, and if they try to jump back you can either catch them with c. MK or just drop the item to knock them back towards you, and even cross-under them if you'd like.
I suppose I haven't seen this because Peacock players prefer to just throw out a full combo into Argus Agony for maximum zoning potential, but personally, I like to be a tricky bastard with this kind of thing.
It depends on the item. Level 2 barrel pushes your opponent away from you when it hits them out of a throw (edit: only when facing right!) so most characters are usually too far away for L bomb into s.LP>s.MP or s.MK, whereas most (all?) of the other level 2 items bounce your opponent towards you so you can combo them. It makes rushing down with Peacock annoying at times.
I didn't know that. I mean that sounds like a bug to me. There used to be something similar where there was one level 1 item that behaved differently from all the rest, and when Mike found out about it he changed it.It depends on the item. Level 2 barrel pushes your opponent away from you when it hits them out of a throw so they're too far away for s.MP or s.MK after you link L bomb into a jab, whereas most (all?) of the other level 2 items bounce your opponent towards you so you can combo them. It makes rushing down with Peacock annoying at times.
I just tested this again and much like the old bug with the level 1 item, this problem only happens when you're facing right. I guess it's a similar thing.
So I've been trying to get a universal, mid-screen double Argus combo, but I've been having trouble getting it down on Miss Fortune consistently. It's not impossible to land, but her narrow hurtbox and fall speed seem to be what's throwing me off. Here's a video of what I've been using:
I'm not sure why I'm able to land it sometimes. I've tried changing up the timing of moves and reducing the number of hits for j.lk, but no success. Any hints/suggestions to improve the consistency?
Be sure to test that with Stagger Shake on.
So, if you have an item other than Tenraiha, I assume you can't combo after the Double tag because you use your OTG, but can you at least still combo INTO it? Having a way to tag to Double safely would be really handy.