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Shin Megami Tensei and Persona

But can I fuck 'em?
Can I finally romance Cu Chulainn?
 
Jutsei said:
I read on Siliconera that SMT V will focus on some real world problems that we ourselves are facing.
Unemployment, fear of nuclear war, all that good stuff.
Does this mean we can get more conspiracy theory demons like Chemtrail?
 
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They made the Law ending a little less Law.
Look, we get to live in houses now! Praise YHVH!
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What happened to "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image"?
 
on Sundays we go to the giant Gaga and say our prayers. No matter what anyone says, she does not "wanna hug like a motherfucker"
 
This change actually kind of sucks, I thought it was funny whenever Law people would bitch about the ending since it is taking Law to its logical conclusion and they didn't want to deal with that.
I still don't understand the point of an SJ remake one system later without really overhauling anything, if they did something like make it Press Turn that would have been a big enough (and likable enough) change to make it appear like there was any point to this.
 
the entire dang point is that both law and chaos taken to their conclusions are both absolute trash, you can't make either ending good or satisfying.
Even True Demon Ending in Nocturne is short, basic, and shitty for all you gotta do for it. That's the point!
 
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Jutsei said:
I read on Siliconera that SMT V will focus on some real world problems that we ourselves are facing.

Please don't make my megaten another shallow anti trump soapbox or a drama about korea, china and senkaku islands
 
Ruin said:
Just make each route worth doing and actually make "neutral" a choice instead of having to waffles between Law choices and Chaos choices the entire time
To accomplish this they need to give you some representative for Neutral to work with. In the Original you had the old man who was sort of that figure and Strange Journey has Arthur. But there is also the bias each game has to consider. SMT1 is biased towards the Neutral ending, SMTII I believe is biased towards Chaos, SMT3 is biased towards True Demon which I consider the Chaos option despite the reasons being a divergence from the previous alignment options. , Strange Journey is again biased towards Neutral.

Once you give the neutral side their own "hero" to work alongside/along with the game stops being you just getting jerked around by the other alignments representatives.
 
PaperBag_Sniper said:
To accomplish this they need to give you some representative for Neutral to work with. In the Original you had the old man who was sort of that figure and Strange Journey has Arthur. But there is also the bias each game has to consider. SMT1 is biased towards the Neutral ending, SMTII I believe is biased towards Chaos, SMT3 is biased towards True Demon which I consider the Chaos option despite the reasons being a divergence from the previous alignment options. , Strange Journey is again biased towards Neutral.

Once you give the neutral side their own "hero" to work alongside/along with the game stops being you just getting jerked around by the other alignments representatives.
Strange Journey also has Gore on the Neutral path, and SMT4 sorta(?) had Isabeau considering neutral is the only path where she doesn't freak out and off herself
Nocturne didn't have proper representatives of L/N/C beyond ol' Lu egging you to become True Demon, but the game makes a deal about forming your own Reason, which I'd say makes Demi his own Neutral Hero, in that way
 
Randomly playing P5 a bit again and I just remembered a small thing I HATE about the game...

Pyro Jack was reverted to Jack O'Lantern after over 10 years Q_Q
 
Ruin said:
Strange Journey also has Gore on the Neutral path, and SMT4 sorta(?) had Isabeau considering neutral is the only path where she doesn't freak out and off herself
Nocturne didn't have proper representatives of L/N/C beyond ol' Lu egging you to become True Demon, but the game makes a deal about forming your own Reason, which I'd say makes Demi his own Neutral Hero, in that way
I view Isabeau as more along the lines of the Heroines of the SNES games; They go along with the player, might have an inclination for a route, but ultimately aren't really a champion in the same sense as the Law/Chaos hero and more a support for the player.

Edit: About Nocturne, when I talk about a bias I mean the route the game puts the most weight behind. For SMT1 you are explicitly told early on by the sage that you should avoid either law and chaos. For SMTII because it's a game where Law took over and went full "1000 year kingdom" and it's made a point multiple times that the hero of the first game going Neutral didn't fix anything so Chaos works. It also helps that SMTII shows that demons and humans can co-exist far better than in any game as well as humans being just as much a threat to the demons as evidence by the Makai and concentration camps.

For SJ between Gore and Arthur strongly leaning towards completing the mission that's a strong foot. I barely remember IV so I can't really remember what the bias was, just that getting Neutral was more convoluted than previous titles.

Nocturne on the other hand strongly leans towards True Demon ending from the get-go and offers the most rewards and challenges for doing so. And since the Demi Fiend never gets to create his own reality despite the games early pushing because ultimately you don't have a strong enough will or image of what you want (on a narrative level since the character is a mute, blank slate) so that line is a bit deceiving.
 
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Of course the #1 demon is exactly who you'd expect. 2 as well, to be honest.
 
Moh Shuvuu being in the top 10 seems super random. Nothing about the demon really jumps out at you, skills or design-wise.

My boy Trumpeter was robbed. He deserves to be in the top 10. He's a good toot tootin' boy.
 
Moh shuvuu is popular in Japan because it's a Loli

Cu chulainn being top 3 is true justice
 
BeatNinja said:
Moh Shuvuu being in the top 10 seems super random.
Really? I figured she would be top 15 at least, same for Cu Chulainn. I knew Mothman was popular but top 10 surprised me, same for Mastema, though since this poll is tied to SJ I assume that explains that.
 
Mastema is also a meme with the Japanese fanbase iirc. I forget how but I know that much
 
Jutsei said:
Mothman is bizarrely a huge favorite over on Tumblr, not surprised.
How can you not love Mothman? He's adorable and does his best.
 
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RE: Nocturne's Neutral representative

I believe that would count as Yuko. Albeit a strange example in that she doesn't have the strength to pursue it herself, but I think if you thematically read between the lines on her and Aladia's text, there's a bit of encouragement for Neutral there.

TDE gets the most gameplay content, and it's certainly spectacular, but I've come to view the Freedom / Neutral ending in Nocturne as the most uplifting and interesting ending, these days.
 
Aleph is clearly Nocturne's neutral rep.

So my copy of Kaneko Works V got here and someone please remind me why Devil Summoner never came out here.
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Atlus USA probably thought that Western audiences couldn't handle it and that there was too much that would need to be censored in order to please the console makers at the time. Bernie Stolar hating pretty much anything that wasn't sports games was probably also a factor.
 
I actually remember reading somewhere that Musubi (Noah) is supposed to be based on the neutral route. Something about being an individualist and all about self determination in isolation. Yuko and the Freedom ending are however a bit wonky to me because it's kind of Neutral/Chaos depending on your interpretation.

Since the world before the conception had a heavy influence from Chaos and the Gaian cult it's possible that returning things to normal just put them back in power. However, neutrality is all about allowing humans to choose their own fates which is what the freedom ending offers.
 
Nocturne doesn't follow the normal law/neutral/chaos route.

In my opinion, the closest to the "neutral" route is split in two and both end tragically: the manikins and yuko takao

Both want something very simple: a world where everyone is equal and happy, but the idea is so vague that it doesn't form a reason. Also, it's implied that God Himself kicked them out of the new world competition because they weren't in His plans (Also, the demonic sponsor of Yuko is the embodiment of burnt witches' suffering.)
 
All the reasons are sponsored by YHVH, and all of them fit into the "ordered" system of cosmic death/rebirth and telling people how to live,. All the reasons are Law.

Likewise, all the demon endings are chaos.

Neutral is just the Freedom ending. Kagutsuchi's dialogue pre-finalie to you on it is textbook neutral.
 
I still find it funny that Chiaki's full-tilt darwinist Reason has the backing of classic law figures like Angels and Thor, when survival of the fittest has always been a chaos thing
 
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Ruin said:
I still find it funny that Chiaki's full-tilt darwinist Reason has the backing of classic law figures like Angels and Thor, when survival of the fittest has always been a chaos thing
I mean.

In a sense, Darwinism is kind of a Lawful perspective, because you are technically upholding the laws of nature that have existed since time began.
 
That must mean he's Dar-winning.
 
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Artbook for Persona 5 is out, was able to snag some details off a tumblah with some amusing tidbits

  • Ryuji shaves his eyebrows
  • Akira’s original transformation into a Phantom Thief was his hair slicking back and his eyes changing color
  • The face on Captain Kidd’s ship is something the creator imagined Ryuji would draw on there
  • Morgana was initially able to transform into anything, not just a car, and his concept art is frankly terrifying
  • Ann is not wearing her Phantom Thief outfit by choice (the suits are created by an outside force an just appear without any input from the wearer)
  • The creator had a hard time with Ann’s pink gloves because they kept looking like rubber dish gloves
  • The keys on Yusuke’s belt are for lockers that hold things dear to him
  • Yusuke’s shirt isn’t part of the uniform and he was originally supposed to be from a high school from a previous game
  • Makoto’s irises are the only ones that touch the lower lashes, a sign of her lack of self confidence
  • Futaba dyed her hair orange out of spontaneity
  • Haru is a ballerina
  • Haru started off with a Noh mask but looked too terrifying
Some outside force eh? "Hmm lets see... what do I forcibly make these clothes to? Phantom thief, Biker chick, Rowdy rough boy, noblewoman, Yokai, Spy gear, and THE OUTFIT OF HARLOTS."
 
Superior Logo coming through. Lack of translations have been delayed at the previous station.
SMTIF_logo.png
 
90s sitcom font is absolutely the best logo aesthetic the series could ask for
 
Ruin said:
90s sitcom font is absolutely the best logo aesthetic the series could ask for
"What's the deal with Law path's? It's like, we were given free will to be strong, but now it's what's holding us back? What is that about?"
 
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So my cousin and I were talking and I'm curious about it too: Of all the Persona games, which ones had the most direct impact in the Persona world as far as saving the world goes?
 
Aden said:
Innocent Sin.
WHY CAN'T I LIKE A POST AT LEAST 70 TIMES?!
 
I keep hearing about P2 a lot in this thread, but unfortunately that games plot is kind of out of my reach. Can someone give me a summary of P2's plot? I think I remember bits of it but its kinda hazy...
 
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