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Skullgirls Beta Aug 5th Patch Discussion

Oh yeah
I guess I had some weird hallucination that head moves weren't assists, heh
 
Chairman Mao said:
you could do that before if you stinger canceled
I couldn't, but now it's available to all for non hitbox execution :)
 
Really hyped to see Beowulf being reconsidered :)
Some ideas:
-Get hype for every hit (just a tiny bit)
-Lose hype when getting hit (won't take away previously built hype, but would have to rebuild the next)
-Gain less hype when slam into chair so that only taunt gives you a full hype.
-Other effects when slamming into chair (Ex: opponent bounce up for combo when slam killa into chair)
OR just simply:
-Being able to combo of slams by slamming into chair and spending a hype (maybe by holding the button to differ from just slam to gain hype)
 
KTFS said:
Some ideas:

Gaining and losing hype on hits sounds ridiculous and would break him. What if you have 3 hype and you are stuck in the corner getting hit repeatedly. When you have a chance to reversal, you have barely any hype left. I do NOT like the sound of that.

I do not want to increase or decrease the amount of hype that he gains. It is fine the way it is now. If the hype is reworked and is more versatile, people need to change their gameplay and attempt to gain more hype themselves.

Being able to combo off of slams is already possible with a numerous amount of assists. Brass knuckles and Drag n Bite, to name a few. Heck, you can even convert off of a Danger Position and airthrow Grendel Killa with the right assists and timing. What more could you possibly want?
 
KTFS said:
-Get hype for every hit (just a tiny bit)
maybe this could be a thing if it only got you to level 1
reason for this is: low level/casual players never see this hype level thing ever if they're the type who never touch the training mode (alot I think)
KTFS said:
opponent bounce up for combo when slam killa into chair
cool because this would also be a thing low level/casual players could see
for comparison, canis major on chair doesn't give visible hype every time, only a tiny damage boost
 
Rabbleflaggers said:
How would you display 1/3 hype gaining when you canis major press onto the chair
1/3 hype doesn't have any indicators
maybe at level 0-.999 hype, every canis major on a chair gets you to level 1
levels 2-3 only give 1/3 hype
this probably was a thing before
 
Mike_Z said:
As for discussions I'd LIKE to have...I want to rework Beo's hype completely so that it becomes a more key gameplay thing. I guess I'd like him to be more like HOS...?
Random ideas, none of which require new art:
- If you've used hype anywhere in a combo, as long as you started with full, on a kill you can get the pin. (gonna happen)
I was asking before if Beowulf's level 3 could do this. Looking forward to this change.

Mike_Z said:
- All slams generate hype, those on chairs generate more.
I personally think this might be a bit much. Maybe if he doesn't get a full level of hype from regular slams, but this would probably be a bit much if he got a full level of hype from any slam.

Mike_Z said:
Allow grab finishers to be supercancelled with hype use?
This could be interesting to see happen. Curious to see how much hype is needed though. Do you need to consume more hype to cancel into a super that already requires more meter?

Mike_Z said:
- Improve Wulfamania by giving you 2x hype uses during it.
Nononononono. If I'm reading this right, that means 7 total throws. Unless you do some serious damage nerfing then at max hype this thing could do 12K damage by itself. That's not even counting two unscaled hits before or any other boosts in damage that combo. That's a recipe for ridiculous damage. Maybe this would be acceptable if Wulfamania was a level 5 but as a level 3 I do not think it should he capable of doing this without a large damage reduction to make up for it. Anybody else?

Mike_Z said:
- Chair recall for 1 bar and 1 hype.
You could also make it cost one level on activate then drain meter/hype/both as it comes back to Beowulf. Will this be an attack?

Mike_Z said:
- Super taunt?
Exactly what is this supposed to do? Spend a bar, get max hype instantly? Spend a bar or two, temporarily get infinite hype like it's Hatred Install? Spend a bar, not get hit for a vulnerable taunt before super flash, suddenly your opponent has no meter? Spend several bars for temporary Hyper Armor? Spend a bar, as your opponent's super meter constantly drains you build up hype or meter yourself, maybe with some requirement that getting hit cancels it? Spend a bar, now your attacks drain your opponent's meter instead of giving it to them for a little bit? I like the idea behind a Taunt Super but to me it begs the question of what that means.

Mike_Z said:
- Reduce overall damage slightly so that hype use helps more...
This might be required. Although, if we're doing that, could perhaps Canis Major Press could simply do more damage at max hype at the cost of consuming a level? I mean I'm sure there was a reason the referee did a small amount of damage but whenever I go for it it just kind of makes me wish Press did more damage at face and the ref was just for flavor. I dunno if this is bad idea though.

Everything else in this list I'm pretty much on the fence about or will reserve judgement for if it gets implemented.

Also I'm guessing it would be really broken to have Gigantic Arm match the rest of Beowulf's Arm attacks by giving it super armor. That said, what if it had super armor equal to hype, and tanking a hit would consume that hype? Even just one hit point that requires at least one level and drains one level if you make use of it could be interesting. Though I'm sure somebody could tell me why this is a terrible idea.

KTFS said:
Some ideas:
-Get hype for every hit (just a tiny bit)
I would liken this to even whiffed attacks giving you meter when you're below 1 meter. It would be something for below one level of hype, but not above. Actually, up until the first level of hype I could see it working that hype is built up similar to meter where each attack has a set amount of hype that it builds up and that doing a three or four chains would get Beowulf to 1 level of hype.

KTFS said:
-Lose hype when getting hit (won't take away previously built hype, but would have to rebuild the next)
If Beowulf had, say, a Super Taunt that caused him to gain constant hype build-up until he got hit again, then I could see getting hit suddenly stopping it as a viable option. Otherwise I don't think this is a good idea.

KTFS said:
-Being able to combo of slams by slamming into chair and spending a hype (maybe by holding the button to differ from just slam to gain hype)
I think this was in the list of changes Mike Z had in mind, albeit he listed it causing damage scaling,

Pickles said:
regarding hype: i like the idea of it being a resource you can spend to do cool stuff like extend combos or get conversions or whatever. i am very opposed to it being a passive buff you can build up and then sit on without expending to gain benefits.
This. If hype should be this important a resource then I think it should be spent whenever it does anything. Even if hype would buff Beowulf's damage or reduce his chip I think it should be consumed for it. Like I don't know how the hype numbers work but if it does reduce chip damage, it should cost a percentage of his built up hype whenever he takes chip. If it boosts the damage of a throw, it should consume a level of hype upon using a throw.

These are my current thoughts and suggestions for the moment. Though I have no idea how broken or useless my suggestions would be.
 
yukideumoreru said:
- Throw Tech makes easier.
・put a mark on the opponent's head.
This doesn't help you react, I promise.
yukideumoreru said:
・Throw Tech work by crouching LP+LK as well.
As Broken Loose said, this is intentional. The only choices to avoid the "crouch-tech" option select (OS) are:
- 2LP+LK = throw AND 2LP+LK = tech (like Blazblue)
or
- 2LP+LK is not throw or tech.
I went for the 2nd choice.

yukideumoreru said:
- characters can move after burst soon.
The character who bursted, or the character who got hit by the burst?
 
Hype discussion? I'm in.

Mike_Z said:
- All slams generate hype, those on chairs generate more.
I would personally like to see another method of hype generation and this sounds wonderful. I imagine the values must be something like 1/3 for regular slam and 2/3 or 1 for on chair. I'm thinking that in order to make hype become a more key gameplay thing, hype generation must be greater/easier to get than s.lp, taunt, s.mp and finisher on chair.

Mike_Z said:
-- Increase hype generation from [s.LP]
I would like to see this by about 20-30 frames. Reason being that its somewhat more threatening for Beowulf to generate hype. At the same time, more functions for hype could accomplish the same thing.

Mike_Z said:
- Allow him to pick up from Moonsault with hype use.
I could see a cancel using hype right after the 3rd hit that would knock the enemy up similar to chairless cr.hp.

Mike_Z said:
Extra Blitzer redirects (5?) with hype use, or choosing to air recover to neutral after non-grounded Blitzer redirects with hype use.
Beowulf doesn't need an extra blitzer. Ground blitzer has just the right amount and air blitzer with a third would be quite luxurious I feel.

Mike_Z said:
- Chair recall for 1 bar and 1 hype.
Instead of straight up chair recall for 1 bar and 1 hype(1 bar doesn't feel worth it). How about arm super will also send the chair flying in the same direction as the enemy hit and lands directly below where the enemy happens to wallsplat?

Some suggestions:
-Hitting the enemy with chair toss as the first hit of the combo will generate hype. I think this would be amazing.

-Unrelated to hype- I would like to see d.jHK have some more use. I don't think I've seen a single beo use this move purposefully. My suggestion is to have it restand the enemy with enough hitstun to combo. Edit: Actually I can see it being used to stop anti-air normals and maybe it will have some use with people trying to land on the chair more often. Ignore this suggestion, but it would be hilarious if d.jHK made them sit on the chair on hit.
 
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havick9 said:
reason for this is: low level/casual players never see this hype level thing ever if they're the type who never touch the training mode (alot I think)

It's in his tutorial, if you're playing a character without even playing the tutorial then you have no one to blame but yourself.
 
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I AM ALL FOR BEING ABLE TO CHAIN GRAB OUT OF SUPERS, SUPER TAUNT AND ALL OF THOSE BEOWULF CHANGES
 
Now that I've proper time to read these, I wanna go over some ideas of my own for Beowulf:

- Spend Hype to have Hurting come back on a slam? <maybe use the animation from M/H Hurting Hurl?>
- +1 for spending hype to Blockbuster cancel finishers
- I LOVE the idea of a super taunt. Maybe let it be like SBO where different button combos give you different amounts of hype <for an equivalent of tension?
- Not sure if I agree with doubling the available move slots on Wulfamania, but I am not sure on what could add to it beyond more damage or move slots
- Spend Hype to hold-button-charge dash grab's distance?
- Spend Hype to get a groundbounce off of chair slam?
 
I see a lot of BeoWulf changes and buffs being bandied about and I'd like to put my two cents.

I don't mind if BeoWulf players get new features or things they want; however, as someone who must fight BeoWulf, and as an Eliza player, I find this matchup to be very difficult. It seems as if his meta game is very hard to contend with, and many of the changes being proposed would make him even harder to mentally fight. For example, at fullscreen, one can usually predict what another character will do -- Parasoul will likely begin using fireballs, Filia will want to get closer, Fukua wants to use shadows, and so forth. This mental simplification never seems to happen with BeoWulf -- at fullscreen, you must worry about his five and half block armored sweep, AirWulf -- which I think is invincible on startup, meaning that BeoWulf can simply fling it out on a whim -- and must still contend with his oppressive normals and fullscreen Gigantic arm, along with the already safe Wolf Blitzer. Like I said, I'm fine with BeoWulf players getting what they want, but would it be too much to ask that his meta be simplified so he is not such a constant chore to fight? I feel like that the BeoWulf V Eliza matchup is already heavily in Wulf's favor and this matchup looks like it could become even worse; in the likely event that I'm wrong I would greatly appreciate education on this because I have been stumped on this matchup for a while. As always, take what I say with a grain of salt.
 
OH, forgot to mention a thing

Maybe Beowulf could get a bonus amount of Hype gain when he hits an assist with chair slam?
 
BlueFeena said:
along with the already safe Wolf Blitzer

Wulf blitzer is not safe. It is easily punishable with armored moves (Sekhmet) and is not safe when he cancels the 3rd blitzer, or 2nd if he uses it in the air, onto the ground. Use your DP against his j.HP. You can also punish Airwulf on its descent. To me, it sounds like you are not playing the match-up correctly.
 
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He's not getting anything that will change matchups(at least nothing said so far seems to do that). He's getting more ways to gain and spend hype which means conversions or damage after finishers, etc.

edit: or more hype from his current hype generators.
 
Also all these ideas for extra ways to get hype make it too easy. If hype is really going to be THAT useful, I think players should work for it rather than being able to get it without even thinking about it. In my opinion, the way he receives hype right now is perfectly fine.
 
I'm probably super late to most discussions but my take on things;

Fortune: Like I said earlier, I think she's fine as is. I don't think one mode is way better than the other and each has it's purpose. Admittedly, I do think headless is more risky to play. If anything, I'd maybe like to see IAD minimum height brought back down a bit and maybe let her cancel zoom into stuff on block again, but I wouldn't cry over not having them.

Peacock: I also think Peacock is mostly in an ok state. One thing that kinda stands out to me is that she hasn't gotten nerfed but characters have generally been getting better tools that hinder what she can do so it's kind of put her in a worse spot. If I were to make a suggestion or two, I'd say:

Quality of life changes to c.MP. Remove the vulnerable areas on the knives so it can maybe be used as a AA. Have it not knock air-born opponents so far away; it makes followups to it impossible at certain ranges. Improving the hitstun on it a bit so it can combo into s.HK would also be nice as long as it doesn't make it too good.

Maybe a buff to j.LP? I've noticed the hitbox is kind of deceptively small when you compare it to the actual animation.
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Maybe expand the hitboxes up and down a bit more? This would help in more close-up confrontations on-top of actually making a few combos more consistent, as I've had instances where I drop airdash cancel follow-ups with j.LP even though I'm right next to the opponent and it looks like the hammer animation is making contact with the them.

Beowulf: I'd love for hype to be more prominent in his gameplay. As it is now, it's kind of a super vanilla version of Bullet's Heat-up mechanic in Blazblue. I'm super willing to try all the changes @Mike_Z mentioned in his earlier post. On top of those things he mentioned maybe-

Have some permanent visual indicator of how much hype he has at a time? If you are going to be gaining and using hype more often throughout a match, this would be nice to have. Maybe some sort of aura thing like Bullet from BB? As long as it isn't super obnoxious.

Maybe instead (or ontop) of a direct chair recall, have some sort of way to move the chair closer to you. Having a Peacock/Robo keep you out from reaching your chair while taking extra amounts of chip damage can be super frustrating. Like some new command where he uses his s.LK animation to shake the stage and cause the chair to bounce up closer to you maybe? IDK just throwing out ideas.
 
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TechPowah said:
Now that I've proper time to read these, I wanna go over some ideas of my own for Beowulf:

- Spend Hype to have Hurting come back on a slam? <maybe use the animation from M/H Hurting Hurl?>

You want a legit reason to say "come on and SLAM" mid match
 
RemiKz said:
Have some permanent visual indicator of how much hype he has at a time?
Maybe use the confetti that tracks Beowulf on gaining a second Hype with a blinky type thing where it stays active depending on how much Hype you have
 
Rabbleflaggers said:
Gaining and losing hype on hits sounds ridiculous and would break him. What if you have 3 hype and you are stuck in the corner getting hit repeatedly. When you have a chance to reversal, you have barely any hype left. I do NOT like the sound of that.
I didn't make myself clear
What I meant was:
Say Beo's hype points range from 0 to 300. Every 100 points get him a level of hype.
He gets one point for landing each hit and lose one point for getting each hit.
If Beo had built up to 135 points of hype, then he got hit by a 65 hit combo,
his hype points would only go down to 100 and still remain at level 1 hype
Same goes for 200 and 300.
Hope that clarifies what I meant. Sorry for the confusion.
 
After playing one set and trying a few things out in training mode, here are my thoughts on this patch:

I'm find with Fukua's new M clone currently, though there were times I wished the shadow would slam the opponent on the exact same spot, not a little behind or forward, just the same spot. Only reason really is because for the life of me I cannot get Pummel Horse to connect. :P

In case launcher M clone never comes back, maybe extend H Clone hit box a little upwards to catch jumping opponents?

Held shadows I'm a little iffy about since the only way you can get a real set-up is from BFF, which does make that super serve more purpose but I wish she had another hard knockdown option (like maybe Cr.HK or forward command throw). Plus, as a Dizzy player, I would like if a held shadow (but not an attacking shadow of course) can protect you for one hit. Which would add to her mix-up options and scare her opponent to think carefully on when to press buttons. But I imagine it wouldn't be easy to make and may break the way the game handles happy birthdays or something.

Don't have too much to say for Bella or Big Band.

Mike_Z said:
- Super taunt?

If it's two bars so that it's non-abuse-able then we good. Though maybe make it exclusively give level 3 (grab) more damage so that it's like a level 5?

PS: I suggest to change the game's sub-title to "Skullgirls: Final Encore" since I imagine that this balance patch will only come once the console lobbies work. It's pretty much the last "new" feature that could be offered at this point to warrant the change (besides replays).
 
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Rabbleflaggers said:
Wulf blitzer is not safe. It is easily punishable with armored moves (Sekhmet) and is not safe when he cancels the 3rd blitzer, or 2nd if he uses it in the air, onto the ground. Use your DP against his j.HP. You can also punish Airwulf on its descent. To me, it sounds like you are not playing the match-up correctly.
Wolf Blitzer most certainly is safe, Mike himself even said it was. The fact that it can crossover, hit from the same side, or allow BeoWulf to simply cancel back to the floor requires a near super human pushblock to do anything. You can't pushblock preemptively because you don't know if Wolf Blitzer will even hit in the first place.

With a dash-jump, BeoWulf's j.hp can reliably hit Eliza from five blocks away. Hitting that with Sekhmet or a DP would also require a super human read because I'm already worried about getting hit by his command grab, or BeoWulf could just do nothing and punish me for attempting a hard read with either Sekhmet or a DP. If Sekhmet or the DP whiffs because you did either preemptively, Eliza dies big time.

How do you punish AirWulf on it's descent? BeoWulf can simply cancel into anything on the way down, at the apex of his jump to be precise. His feet do not need to hit the floor before control is returned to him.
 
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Horace is on Eliza's payroll for a reason, yo

Dive of Horus is an excellent anti-air vs Beowulf
 
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RemiKz said:
Peacock: I also think Peacock is mostly in an ok state. One thing that kinda stands out to me is that she hasn't gotten nerfed but characters have generally been getting better tools that hinder what she can do so it's kind of put her in a worse spot. If I were to make a suggestion or two, I'd say:

Quality of life changes to c.MP. Remove the vulnerable areas on the knives so it can maybe be used as a AA. Have it not knock air-born opponents so far away; it makes followups to it impossible at certain ranges. Improving the hitstun on it a bit so it can combo into s.HK would also be nice as long as it doesn't make it too good.

Maybe a buff to j.LP? I've noticed the hitbox is kind of deceptively small when you compare it to the actual animation

That's an interesting thought, c.mp being able to link into s.hk would make that move much more useful. As of right now I only really use it in corner combos and against Filia/fotune when they have a sliver of heath, which isn't often. Though it is a decent anti air against Beowulf's j.hp and a few of Eliza's aerials, it's hard to get in the proper position for the move.

Quality of life is also a good way to put it. Peacock isn't bad by any means, but she is sort of not in a great place currently and as you mentioned the beta is giving a number of characters more answers to her. A few minor things here and there would help her out. The things you mentioned could help as well as her level 3 getting buffed could be done. Perhaps HK bomb not getting canceled if she is hit out of the startup, faster fake teleport. These sorts of things would be helpful but not extreme I feel. The most extreme things I'd consider her having would be things like getting startup invincibility on teleports back, better chip or even just a fast projectile game.
 
BlueFeena said:
Wolf Blitzer most certainly is safe, Mike himself even said it was.
I encourage you to play around with wulf blitzer to take a look and the situations where it is safe and where it is not. The most safe it can be is -2 on block when beowulf is at the height of doing wulf blitzer from the ground. This is when beowulf ends his wulf blitzer on the second hit in the direction of 1 2 or 3. The next most safe is -6 I believe. This is when he does M air wulf blitzer low to the ground. After that is -8 in which the third hit is in the direction of 1 2 or 3. Everything else can be unsafe. Things like L wulf blitzer , 6, 4 is -24. I think this can be hit by H upper khat. This is just frame data. Seriously play around with it.
TechPowah said:
Horace is on Eliza's payroll for a reason, yo

Dive of Horus is an excellent anti-air vs Beowulf

Sometimes dive of horus will lose to wulf blitzer.
 
Kyugetsuki said:
I encourage you to play around with wulf blitzer to take a look and the situations where it is safe and where it is not. The most safe it can be is -2 on block when beowulf is at the height of doing wulf blitzer from the ground. This is when beowulf ends his wulf blitzer on the second hit in the direction of 1 2 or 3. The next most safe is -6 I believe. This is when he does M air wulf blitzer low to the ground. After that is -8 in which the third hit is in the direction of 1 2 or 3. Everything else can be unsafe. Things like L wulf blitzer , 6, 4 is -24. I think this can be hit by H upper khat. This is just frame data. Seriously play around with it.

What is stopping him from doing just the safe version, all the time?
 
BlueFeena said:
With a dash-jump, BeoWulf's j.hp can reliably hit Eliza from five blocks away.

I've never seen anyone use "blocks" as a measurement of distance... are you talking about squares on the training stage floor? Nobody uses that AFAIK, just use "<fraction> screen" like "1/2 screen" or "2/3 screen" like everyone else :S.

On this note, st.MP anti-airs this quite reliably but pretty much any DP assist does even better.
If you don't have a DP assist, play solo Eliza or everyone else is dead then it's your own fault.

I don't know what you're talking about it regards to the command grab. You should be able to react to the jump easily.

In regards to punishing his invuln super, no you can't punish the end of it but you can catch it on the way up... it's just kinda hard sometimes.
 
BlueFeena said:
Wolf Blitzer most certainly is safe, Mike himself even said it was. The fact that it can crossover, hit from the same side, or allow BeoWulf to simply cancel back to the floor requires a near super human pushblock to do anything. You can't pushblock preemptively because you don't know if Wolf Blitzer will even hit in the first place.

With a dash-jump, BeoWulf's j.hp can reliably hit Eliza from five blocks away. Hitting that with Sekhmet or a DP would also require a super human read because I'm already worried about getting hit by his command grab, or BeoWulf could just do nothing and punish me for attempting a hard read with either Sekhmet or a DP. If Sekhmet or the DP whiffs because you did either preemptively, Eliza dies big time.

How do you punish AirWulf on it's descent? BeoWulf can simply cancel into anything on the way down, at the apex of his jump to be precise. His feet do not need to hit the floor before control is returned to him.

Beowulf cant be punished on the way down AirWulfing because you can punish him on the way up if you can react to it. Wulf Blitzer is safe but negative meaning anything beowulf does afterwards will not beat your quickest move. Eliza jab will always be faster than whatever beo can do after blitzering. If he decides to runaway with his last blitzer you can chase him down and he will still be minus or in some cases counter-hit. Chicken Blocking his J.Hp will also let you easily punish it if he is not spacing them right. This is all just matchup stuff anyways and shouldnt really be talked about in the beta thread anyways.
 
cloudKing211 said:
What is stopping him from doing just the safe version, all the time?
You put yourself directly in front of the opponent at a slight disadvantage. Most opponents I have faced jab me after.

And in certain match ups, putting space between you and your opponent is better if you're looking to be safe.
 
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Bonanzo said:
Beowulf cant be punished on the way down AirWulfing because you can punish him on the way up if you can react to it. Wulf Blitzer is safe but negative meaning anything beowulf does afterwards will not beat your quickest move. Eliza jab will always be faster than whatever beo can do after blitzering. If he decides to runaway with his last blitzer you can chase him down and he will still be minus or in some cases counter-hit. Chicken Blocking his J.Hp will also let you easily punish it if he is not spacing them right. This is all just matchup stuff anyways and shouldnt really be talked about in the beta thread anyways.

beo can super you, and his reward off grendel super is very great, enough to make people hesitate to even push a button against him. Being minus but not punishable is super good, especially if you have a safe super dhc to allow you to disrespect things.

Kyugetsuki said:
You put yourself directly in front of the opponent at a slight disadvantage. Most opponents I have faced jab me after.
If you wulf blitzer as a mixup tool/pushblock bait (which it is very good at), then the risk reward here is in beos favor . Not being punishable, and not minus enough to be meatied low is really good. He doesnt get away for free because that would be really dumb, but he is still safe (to a punish) and must think about what to do after.

Edit: My comment was referring to in any event where your opponent blocked blitzer, why not do the safe version, it is up to your inputs
 
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cloudKing211 said:
beo can super you, and his reward off grendel super is very great, enough to make people hesitate to even push a button against him. Being minus but not punishable is super good, especially if you have a safe super dhc to allow you to disrespect things.


If you wulf blitzer as a mixup tool/pushblock bait (which it is very good at), then the risk reward here is in beos favor . Not being punishable, and not minus enough to be meatied low is really good. He doesnt get away for free because that would be really dumb, but he is still safe (to a punish) and must think about what to do after.

Edit: My comment was referring to in any event where your opponent blocked blitzer, why not do the safe version, it is up to your inputs

The risk reward exists in the inverse also. If someone calls you out on you doing arm as a frametrap after blitzer you can be punished with a HCH and lose the meter. Assuming you DHC to something safe you have now spent 2 bar to get out which a lot of characters can do and is nothing new. Assuming you dont have a safe DHC you sacrifice the character you DHC to. Its just like any normal frametrap except it spends meter and is unsafe I dont really see the problem?
 
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