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Skullgirls PC Beta Updates Discussion

That stream yesterday was awesome. Shaq Fu Punch lol...
 
What if we just remove the slowdown on character death if it won't win you the game?
 
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oh man i was wondering why it was so quick on here lol thanks
 
Just wanted to talk about how godlike peacock is now.
Lenny is incredible. If you have 2 meters, or you're approaching 2 meters, you can just throw it out if you want too.

If your opponent calls an assist, RIP that assist. If you hit your opponent with a move, like hp gun for example, prepare to get hit by lenny and argus into a full bnb.

If you have an assist, like LNL, HB, Brass, and the bomb is out then welp! You thought the peacock player couldn't call that assist because they'd risk the bomb exploding, but you thought wrong! Just argus that bomb and save your assist so good.

Remember when cerebella could reflect argus? No worries. Put out a lenny bomb, and save yourself from Cerebella who tries to reflect the argus back at you! Bomb will explode right on her goodies to give you some extra time to breathe.

Remember when parasoul could bike -> sniper shot or soldier -> sniper shot argus? I do too, but if you have lenny out, BOOM! RIP Parasoul you just got blasted right as the sniper shot peacock. Good trade!

Enjoy Lenny my friends.
 
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dekillsage said:
Just wanted to talk about how godlike peacock is now.
Lenny is incredible. If you have 2 meters, or you're approaching 2 meters, you can just throw it out if you want too.

If your opponent calls an assist, RIP that assist. If you hit your opponent with a move, like hp gun for example, prepare to get hit by lenny and argus into a full bnb.

If you have an assist, like LNL, HB, Brass, and the bomb is out then welp! You thought the peacock player couldn't call that assist because they'd risk the bomb exploding, but you thought wrong! Just argus that bomb and save your assist so good.

Remember when cerebella could reflect argus? No worries. Put out a lenny bomb, and save yourself from Cerebella who tries to reflect the argus back at you! Bomb will explode right on her goodies to give you some extra time to breathe.

Remember when parasoul could bike -> sniper shot or soldier -> sniper shot argus? I do too, but if you have lenny out, BOOM! RIP Parasoul you just got blasted right as the sniper shot peacock. Good trade!

Enjoy Lenny my friends.
Now introducing Dud Lenny. Lenny fails to detonate when argus is interrupted.
#thanksDekillsage!

But seriously, I thought the lenny explosion was considered a projectile and that Bella was projectile invincible when she reflects. I don't usually throw reflect out like that so I'll def need to play around with that scenario.
 
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Yeah she can't reflect the explosion. That makes me sad, but Parasoul getting hit for trying to stop peacock makes me even more sad.
 
I don't understand how people are just realizing Lenny's good now; he's been really good ever since he got automatic explosions like 2 or 3 patches ago.
 
Broken Loose said:
I don't understand how people are just realizing Lenny's good now; he's been really good ever since he got automatic explosions like 2 or 3 patches ago.

Peacock kinda sucked 2 or 3 patches ago tho(kinda)

Edit: This looked weird.
 
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dekillsage said:
Peacock kinda sucked 2 or 3 patches ago tho(kinda)

Edit: This looked weird. go to 24:55 since time stamps don't work?
Write some letters.
Highlight the letters.
Click the two circles (or ovals?) touching button thing in the tool bar. [Im on mobile sorry]
Insert the link with the time stamp.

Now when you click those letters it'l save the time stamp.
 
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Skarmand said:
Write some letters.
Highlight the letters.
Click the two circles (or ovals?) touching button thing in the tool bar. [Im on mobile sorry]
Insert the link with the time stamp.

Now when you click those letters it'l save the time stamp.

Thanks!
 
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Was reading the undizzy thread and got an idea. Would it be dumb if there were a sound when the undizzy bar hit 100%? Something subtle, like a swish.

As it is, my eyes kind of gloss over the bar in actual matches and I don't end up noting the difference between "almost full green bar" and "full glowing green bar".
 
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dekillsage said:
Peacock kinda sucked 2 or 3 patches ago tho(kinda)

Edit: This looked weird.
Am I taking crazy pills? 2 patches ago, Peacock took 2nd at Evo 2014. In fact, the Big Band patch (3 patches back) is when Lenny got automatic explosions. The current Beta started as a series of nerfs to Peacock, who largely hasn't changed since Unfinished Business. Peacock has been consistently awesome since she got bomb cancels, easily 2nd best in the game. Even the matchup chart from last spring had her dominating over most of the cast save for 1 or 2 characters, depending on who was asking and when.

In fact, when the nerfs started coming for Peacock at the beginning of this Beta cycle, a lot of people agreed that they were kind of due in some respects. I even think you may have been one of them.
 
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Broken Loose said:
Am I taking crazy pills? 2 patches ago, Peacock took 2nd at Evo 2014.
Oh. You weren't talking about the Beta patches. Very nice.
Edit: Also, automatic explosions aren't what made lenny good. At least not by itself. Argus goes THROUGH lenny now, making lenny argus 100% consistent no matter what, and guarantees the explosion on top of that once argus is interrupted or it ends.
 
dekillsage said:
Oh. You weren't talking about the Beta patches. Very nice.
Edit: Also, automatic explosions aren't what made lenny good. At least not by itself. Argus goes THROUGH lenny now, making lenny argus 100% consistent no matter what, and guarantees the explosion on top of that once argus is interrupted or it ends.
Shit, I forgot those weren't concurrent. Yeah, the beam going through is pretty awesome, but I think it's too cool to get rid of.
 
A sound wouldn't be a bad idea indeed, or changing the color the victim flashes to gren or something similar. However, there are already alot of indicator(including the recent broken heart indicator and other similar thing) that appear, i fear the game get overcrowded with signal!

Also, since the action can get chaotic, especially when someone get repeatedly pummeled until that bar is full, the sound would have to be loud and not that subtle to work. What kind of sound you suggest that may work here?
 
Peacock's always been dumb. A few beta patches ago, she was just less dumb.

She's never sat at below average... ever.
 
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Flotilla said:
Was reading the undizzy thread and got an idea. Would it be dumb if there were a sound when the undizzy bar hit 100%? Something subtle, like a swish.

As it is, my eyes kind of gloss over the bar in actual matches and I don't end up noting the difference between "almost full green bar" and "full glowing green bar".

like in BBCP whens Burst gest fully filled, i like to test this idea.
 
It still did the damage although it was in-fact very weird

Maybe Beowulf's super had something to do with it?
 
@Mike_Z is there anyway that Val's level 3 can either have hitstop/be unblockable post flash. It might be silly if almost point blank it can be reaction supered/blocked post flash. Either one is fine, or neither, but I think its worth considering.
 
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Hey look I'm reading the thread again now that I'm done with last week's stuff.
And I already wish I weren't. :^P

Tayoda said:
I have an idea for a beta experiment, if u have a three character team allow two assists to be used during a combo instead of one
No. Reason.

Broseidon Rex said:
Sorry if this has been mentioned before but since Mike Z has figured out how beams have worked, will there be any change to Argus Agony?
Already was, if you aren't yet hitting with it the beam is now active every frame as opposed to 1(9)1(9) even on whiff...make it much easier to catch people falling without OTG left.
Unless you meant visually.

Hidgerknight said:
is Beowulf's level 3 super will still OTG on the third hit or will it whiff now?
What? I don't understand the question.
Hidgerknight said:
haven't touched the beta in a while and haven't bothered to open YouTube because I have missed out on a lot of updates.
Annnnnnnnnnnd now I lost interest in the question. :^P "Can't be bothered to try"? Try.

winnie said:
I would like to say that I preferred Robo's air dash over the double jump stuff.
Genoisawesome said:
I have to say I miss the airdash, and preferred it - the double-jump seems to have less options for combo routes
Double jump also has fewer options for IAD pressure, which was the point.
I don't want her to have j.HK runaway AND that.

winnie said:
As sort of a compromise to air dash vs double jump why not try giving Robo full GG style air movement? By that I mean only one double jump or air dash per jump and no air dash cancels on normals.
Also to reduce IAD craziness make the IAD hight the same normal jump hight.
I'd like to not make her ENTIRELY DIFFERENT from the rest of the cast for the sake of keeping an airdash that I don't want her to have in the first place. At that point the airdash doesn't get you anything that j.HK doesn't do better, either.

Stuff said:
Because it works this way for most other characters so why not her too? You already get the red bounce back and easy to combo overhead attack you can only counter by stunting your own damage.
Doing damage is infinitely better than not doing any damage, and allows you to set up an advantageous situation afterward because you got a hit. I do not understand "it's a scaled punish" being any kind of argument for why it's as bad as NO punish. (For example, 3s players frequently discussed how Ken's SAIII in 3s would be basically just as good if it did NO DAMAGE AT ALL because of the crazy positioning advantage it gives you off of a wide assortment of confirmable situations.)

Stuff said:
Parasoul's bike stops working when you hit her.
Parasoul's bike Egret becomes sad if you hit her within 20f of the start of the animation.
Horace is not summoned at all if you hit Eliza within 18f of the start of the animation. So it kinda already works that way, just you don't see him at all if she gets hit.

Dolfinh said:
I would also strongly prefer if Horus went into hitstun when Eliza is hit. As stuff said, every other er... summon works like this.
See above, he already works like Egret Charge.
Dolfinh said:
It is genuinely the only thing in this game that I find frustrating to play against,
"It is frustrating to play against" is not a valid reason for changing something that doesn't do everything/isn't broken. Peacock is frustrating to play against for a lot of people who aren't good at differentiating between "spamming projectiles" and real zoning. Filia is frustrating to play against for people who aren't good at reacting. Fukua is frustrating to play against for all of Japan, apparently. Big Band is frustrating to play against for @keninblack because he's washed up. Etc. Horace makes you play differently, and until you get used to that sure you'll be frustrated. But do try and differentiate between "I don't like to play differently" and "this move should be worse for some real reason".
He's no longer even close to an optimal starter, nor is the move safe. I have no problem with it outside of those things.

You can also chicken block Horace and punish Eliza, or get closer without her being able to call him again. And coincidentally, chicken-block punish also works against her DP, and dodges Albus, and works against IAD j.MK, which are the other things she tends to do at midrange.

There are 3 pages left to read but I have to do other things now...
 
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Has anyone questioned yet that minimum kanchou startup is 2f faster in beta?
It doesn't sound like a lot, but from 21f to 23f is right on the edge of reactability and I would propose that it makes a difference
If pointblank kanchou is supposed to be unreactable by design I'll just deal with that, but this uncertainty is killing me.
 
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@worldjem
I do not think teams should get a guaranteed oki situation after snapping a Solo. You already removed all red health and can tech chase, I do not also wish to reward you with a guaranteed pressure situation vs an assistless character. Heck, ignoring red life entirely, if you could do that it gives every character oki after every combo vs a Solo.
Allowing the Solo to not be comboed and tech is the closest analog to what the Solo gets for snapping a team, IMO, considering the other imbalances.

WarpedEcho said:
Dickishness aside, outside of ToD's you could get against solo fortune when you snapped with certain characters, I honestly don't see a reason to not get OTG back though.
Snapping a character on a team ends your combo and gives you an incoming situation. Snapping a solo letting you continue the combo allows a full combo, remove all red health, and burst bait or reset afterwards. That's much better, they don't have two or three red health reservoirs, and they don't have assists to help them afterward.

gllt said:
Can Parasoul get a buffer for L tearshot links?
L shot is +11-12 at minimum. Linking into an LP is 5f, LK is 4f. I generally give a 4-5f buffer, so she already has the same window as other characters that got help. Other link-buffer spots can't link into Ms so I don't have a problem with Ms being (at hardest) a 1-2f link if you want to go for them.
The timing is the same after doing the move in all cases, as well. Squigly's divekick has a longer buffer period because the timing can vary based on height.
@fenster
Tearshot hitstun is not different when used midscreen, projectile travel time matters.

ashxu said:
Any chance of an input buffer after Valentine's Savage Bypass to make the air dash links easier?
The existing buffer windows explicitly don't apply to dashes, just attacks. And generally for continuing after Bypass you have to delay the dash so they fall. A buffer ain't gonna get you much with that.
(See also: Stick dashes have a built-in up to 10f buffer if you hold the 2nd direction.)

CaioLugon said:
I'd like bigband to be able to punish a parried burst.
No way! As stated, launch->parry is too easy, so is land->parry. The difference being, in order to burst bait currently you (usually) have to drop the combo by jumping back or whatever, since parry inputs don't make him do anything you do not have to drop the combo and could totally OS parry/airthrow.
Val has to spend 2 bars to guess and do it.

CaioLugon said:
also can pummel horse be an assist now?
Eeeeeeeeeeeeh no. Still gives you two poison loads and an HP followup. But good thought.

CaioLugon said:
edit: @Mike_Z LOL hurting hurl as an assist doesnt add undizzy
Neither do any other assist projectiles.

dekillsage said:
Getting dynamo after a character died even though it wasn't necessary -> Incoming character jumping in and killing me is something I do not want to happen v-v
That's a PEBCAK case, though. You're used to doing it anyway because the input would get eaten, get un-used to it and learn when you'll kill. It's unlikely life/damage are changing any further, you can do it sage!

@Dime_x
I tested everything, including "drop inputs if you kill the point character but no assist is out" and ALL of them led to worse outcomes in some cases than just not dropping inputs ever.
Ex: If you kill point character but assist is coming in, you were only hitting one. If you kill point but assist is in and has not been hit yet, you were only hitting one. Etc.
The worst thing IMO is inconsistent behavior, because it will be wrong sometimes, and those will be bad times.
So in the case of consistent behavior I vote for not dropping birthdays, which is not something you can LEARN to fix, rather than accidentally supering after death, which is something you can learn to fix. I also really liked not supering after someone died saving you the meter etc, but the tradeoff isn't worth it.
See also - supers have hitstop because the flash is only supposed to be aesthetic. Death should not drop inputs because the slowdown is supposed to only be aesthetic.

One page left!
 
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dekillsage said:
Edit: This looked weird.
OH YEAH I reallllly need to fix that bug, lemme see if I can do that now.
Easy to repro with 2 simultaneous bike supers.

Flotilla said:
Was reading the undizzy thread and got an idea. Would it be dumb if there were a sound when the undizzy bar hit 100%? Something subtle, like a swish.
As it is, my eyes kind of gloss over the bar in actual matches and I don't end up noting the difference between "almost full green bar" and "full glowing green bar".
There is a sound, the hitsparks all start to go "doink".
But yeah, maybe.

cloudKing211 said:
@Mike_Z is there anyway that Val's level 3 can either have hitstop/be unblockable post flash. It might be silly if almost point blank it can be reaction supered/blocked post flash. Either one is fine, or neither, but I think its worth considering.
Hitstop and being unblockable are the same thing.
With all the other utility it has now, plus more damage, plus a poison load, I am okay with the way it is. She has EKG for random super purposes, as well as being the only character with a counter.

DONE BYE
 
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dekillsage said:
She was below average af in MDE homie
I hate agreeing with Spencer but there's no fucking way this is true. Shit, we can pull up forum posts from those days where, as I said earlier, people agreed that she was top 3 at worst.

You even participated in a group effort to make a matchup chart for the game that put Peacock as 2nd best. Even if we use hindsight to rejudge the cast as they existed at the time, Peacock wouldn't move down-- Cerebella would just climb up the tier ladder until she pushed Double into "below average."
 
Broken Loose said:
I hate agreeing with Spencer but there's no fucking way this is true. Shit, we can pull up forum posts from those days where, as I said earlier, people agreed that she was top 3 at worst.

In MDE???? We've had Encore for a while, and I don't remember thinking peacock was good in MDE, but I could be wrong.


Mike_Z said:
Missed one:

@dekillsage
Lenny / Argus takes two levels though.

Best level 2 in the game!
 
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Mike_Z said:
Neither do any other assist projectiles.
But that's a dp assist, with all the utility it has, having it as a free combo extender is a little much...

Could you make the first frame(s) be a physical hit?
 
Well, i got an answer when i didnt expect one, and it was a very good and thought out logical answer. I can adapt. If theres one thing im good at its reading and adapting.

"Wanting" to adapt and change is a different story... But its probably because im a lazy old man that just wants to kill shit. :)
 
@Mike_Z because I think you're putting your head into a sadness echo chamber, I like Squigly in the beta. Not everything is terrible.
 
I'm happy with Peacock and Big Band in the beta. No complaints here :)
 
No one is complaining about fortune buffs. So that means either I can keep them or no one ever fights headless fortune.

Fiber buff is kinda awesome, it feels natural to do the jump after any hit and I'm sure old fortune players like it too. I don't believe it makes it so that I want to AA with it but I like it as a combo and mobility tool. I also don't feel like this would be a reason to use headless over head-on but I will say that I do enjoy headless more because of the fun changes she was given but my only gripe is the double penalty of both losing health faster and head cooldown (I am sure it's fair for being super + with the head) but I don't see those changing so I will enjoy these changes which I never thought would happen.

Edit: Hello if you're reading this post please read it in a cheerful tone in case you are not aware of the tone.

Edit2: I really appreciate the fortune changes.
 
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