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Skullgirls PC Beta Updates Discussion

gllt said:
Really if you want to post in a thread you should probably read the thread.
But you guys write a lot all the time for no reason. And many times people are confused about other people's points, with a lot of "no, you're an idiot, this is why, even though I misunderstood what you said, so here are essays of us both being clueless dicks for no reason" moments every page or two.

I do read like 10% of the thread, though.
 
IsaVulpes said:
Which implications are those?
You can mash PP supers during block brainlessly, before you would actually have to time reversals out of pressure or PBGC them because otherwise you were just extending blockstun.
 
Tomo009 said:
You can mash PP supers during block brainlessly, before you would actually have to time reversals out of pressure or PBGC them because otherwise you were just extending blockstun.
Well, if that's true, and the new change encourages mashing, isn't that good cause it makes your "I'm a good player, and this is my anti-mashing setup" option better? Like how Mike said something about when upback is a more enticing option, you can change your low/grab from less of a gamble and more of a "he wants to upback, here's a low".

You could also just not do stuff that's unsafe on block and block their mashed super.
 
Cause stick players can't just use three fingers to input something still?
 
Swap said:
PP+K avoiding pushblock
That's neat!

Swap said:
Could we make this a quality-of-life change, where motion + PP during blockstun is disregarded as a pushblock input?
Not really possible since each character has different motions, sorry. I wouldn't do it anyway because I dislike when games prevent you from doing something you wanted, for all the game knows your QCB+PP could have BEEN a pushblock attempt if you were holding Down first or something. I prefer that PPK work since it is an unambiguous input that is intentionally not PP if you wish to choose, so I wouldn't fix that.

Tomo009 said:
Yeah I'm not liking the implications of PP+K allowing you to avoid pushblock.
Why not? Not hitting the buttons, or doing supers with the right timing, also allows you to avoid pushblock. :^P And it wasn't a problem with Kick supers anyway, so this just gives you the same alternative with Punch supers. It doesn't allow you to DO something that you can't normally do, it just allows you to do it a bit more easily.

It isn't even an OS, since you CAN'T get both a pushblock attempt and a super...I'm like, zero percent bothered by this.
 
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Zidiane said:
Cause stick players can't just use three fingers to input something still?
No, I mean literally the only use of 3+ buttons macroed in this game is for option selecting. Mike could even undo the prior fix and let you tech with macro all over again if the game had a hard limit of 2 buttons per macro. It solves every problem.
 
Broken Loose said:
No, I mean literally the only use of 3+ buttons macroed in this game is for option selecting. Mike could even undo the prior fix and let you tech with macro all over again if the game had a hard limit of 2 buttons per macro. It solves every problem.

Well, this is not something I PERSONALLY DO but, it seems like I've met at least -one- Peacock player that uses LPMPHP macro because it lets them dash while charging an MShadow
 
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Sorry if I'm reading this wrong but if the change was reverted and put that idea in couldn't I still OS manually? (I do it manually mostly)
 
Broken Loose said:
No, I mean literally the only use of 3+ buttons macroed in this game is for option selecting. Mike could even undo the prior fix and let you tech with macro all over again if the game had a hard limit of 2 buttons per macro. It solves every problem.
That STILL doesn't solve the problem of being able to do it manually, so solving that I don't care if you can macro extra buttons...?
 
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Broken Loose said:
No, I mean literally the only use of 3+ buttons macroed in this game is for option selecting. Mike could even undo the prior fix and let you tech with macro all over again if the game had a hard limit of 2 buttons per macro. It solves every problem.
Nope having 3 punches as a macro lets peacock dash while holding any soid
Edit : nvm gilt already said it
 
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@Mike_Z
Even though this is past the point of caring right now. I gave it a week of testing and such and here's my thoughts.
Everything thing was made fair. the L shadow being 0 makes obvious sense. and such. the j.hk being 90% or 75% i didn't care too much about. but the shadows changes are now fair to both the player and the opponent. just One concern
The shadows having added startup and such is pretty ok. However it begs to ask the question "why color code the shadows?" the obvious answer is to tell which shadow is coming out. Its cool, but with H shadow now being 30F,
it just doesn't make sense to even color code the shadows. at certain distances you can tell which shadow will be which. Close range will probably have L shadow be deployed. at mid range then it would be M shadow. Now for H shadow you want it to mainly be used for combo extensions no? cause with color coding the shadow and startup frames then that seems to be the idea.

If that's what you wanted then cool cause then i'll at least know your intentions with that. If you just want the shadows to be more distinguished then just adding the startup for H shadow does more than enough for people to jump, mash, grab etc.

TL;DR: the changes keeps Fukua limber and i like it. I just think the color coding is unnecessary for the startup both M shadow and H shadow now have. but hey i appreciate the new changes which reminds me. I have to play more beta so i can get a feel for the upback discussion.


Edit: apparently i'm bad at this game and can't read because i got some of the data wrong.
 
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If I recall correctly, the intention behind having a cooldown on chair pickup is to make accidental pickups less frequent, no?

If that's the case, then can we perhaps try either drastically reducing or completely removing the forced cooldown period? I feel like not being able to pick up the chair immediately reduces the number of options I have for interesting and varied combo paths. I want to have the option of being able to pick up the chair when I choose, but as it currently stands chair pickup feels less like a choice and more like a waiting game. Whether or not this would require a different input for chair pickup is probably a matter of experimentation.

If the intention behind the cooldown period is something else then I'd be curious to hear the reasoning behind it :)
 
Skullmageddon said:
If I recall correctly, the intention behind having a cooldown on chair pickup is to make accidental pickups less frequent, no?

If that's the case, then can we perhaps try either drastically reducing or completely removing the forced cooldown period? I feel like not being able to pick up the chair immediately reduces the number of options I have for interesting and varied combo paths. I want to have the option of being able to pick up the chair when I choose, but as it currently stands chair pickup feels less like a choice and more like a waiting game. Whether or not this would require a different input for chair pickup is probably a matter of experimentation.

If the intention behind the cooldown period is something else then I'd be curious to hear the reasoning behind it :)
I would wait for his whole moveset before saying the cooldown is too long or unneeded.
 
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I'm a fan of Fukua shadows leading to a techno dance party
 
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Mr. X said:
I would wait for his whole moveset before saying the cooldown is too long or unneeded.

That's a very good point, though I was more concerned with the reasoning behind the cooldown rather than whether or not it's necessary. I thought I recalled Mike stating at some point that the cooldown was meant to help prevent accidental pickups. If that's the case (which it very well might not be), I'm of the opinion that having any cooldown at all actually makes it feel as though I have less control rather than more control over when I want to pickup the chair.

But yes, it would probably make more sense to address this question after he has all of his moves implemented.
 
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alexpi said:
I'm a fan of Fukua shadows leading to a techno dance party
even if the special move coloration doesn't stay, i'd still like some sort of different version of her fight intro where instead of 2 clones its 3 clones (representing Red, Green & Blue) run into each other to form fukua

its a lighting joke.
 
@Mike_Z I got a problem.

So i was playing a beo mirror match and then i got kicked. So i couldn't access the lobbies at all. which happens from time to time. BUT i tried to access training mode and it just pushed me back to the menu which it had the choices to go to training mode, and tutorials.

Edit:
in the end i had to quit and then open up beta again
 
Skullmageddon said:
If I recall correctly, the intention behind having a cooldown on chair pickup is to make accidental pickups less frequent, no?
[snip]
If the intention behind the cooldown period is something else then I'd be curious to hear the reasoning behind it :)
The intention behind the cooldown period is, rather obviously, so that you can't pick up the chair right away after using it. :^) The reasons are several, one is to prevent things like j.HK combo pickup combo, another is to make tossing the chair require some planning because it's a pretty good move, and others have to do with chair mechanics he hasn't got yet like slamming people on it with finishers or the opponent interacting with it when hit.
I'll probably be making the initial cooldown after a toss/j.HK longer, too. Right now it's just whatever I first typed in.

Dreamepitaph said:
i tried to access training mode and it just pushed me back to the menu which it had the choices to go to training mode, and tutorials.
That's related to it thinking you're still online, which is the same reason you couldn't go back into lobbies. I can't reliably reproduce it or I'd have fixed it already.
 
Woah, squigly buffs!

Tremolo is looking pretty scary right now. Seems like it would be way more useful against Peacock, looking forward to giving the changes a try later today.
 
Jason said:
Woah, squigly buffs!

Tremolo is looking pretty scary right now. Seems like it would be way more useful against Peacock, looking forward to giving the changes a try later today.
What are the changes ??
 
http://steamcommunity.com/gid/103582791433982635/announcements/detail/204114899416774728
Today's patch notes BGM*, a song I was addicted to two years ago:


General
- Bugfix: Squigly's Seria Tremolo segments retract faster because there are more of them. Now is 2f better on hit than regular Tremolo, instead of being over 15f worse. Still worse on block. Domo arigato random Japanese player!
- Bugfix: Remove non-counterhit recovery frames on Filia/Fukua/Double s.LP, and Filia/Fukua s.LK. They were a leftover artifact of Filia being the first character. Thanks IsaVulpes.

Beta Experiments
Fukua
- No more color-coded shadows. That was TOO easy to read.
- She can now have one air and one ground fireball onscreen at the same time, rather than only one fireball onscreen.
Squigly
- Seria Tremolo is projectile invincible during the extension part.
- On whiff or block, Seria Silver Chord retracts faster and has shorter recovery after the tail fully returns to her.
- Seria Drag'n'Bite -4f recovery (now +11 on hit, -7 on block), can easily link into stand/crouch LP and LK.

Beowulf
- Can properly chain from s.LP to s.LK/c.LK, oops! Since he only has one LP and one LK he was supposed to be able to do this, like Painwheel. cr.LP already could.
- Reduced corner pushback on j.HP and j.MK. Thanks Zid.
- Grab mode finishers (currently F/B+P, D+K with chair, QCT+MP+MK or HP+HK, or j.D+P) cannot be done with P+K, only P or K by themselves.
- Increased buffer time on grab finisher input from 5f to 10f.
- Sped up catch-to-grab-mode animations for chairless HP, c.MK, ground throw, and air throw.
 
General
- Bugfix: Squigly's Seria Tremolo segments retract faster because there are more of them. Now is 2f better on hit than regular Tremolo, instead of being over 15f worse. Still worse on block. Domo arigato random Japanese player!
- Bugfix: Remove non-counterhit recovery frames on Filia/Fukua/Double s.LP, and Filia/Fukua s.LK. They were a leftover artifact of Filia being the first character. Thanks IsaVulpes.

Beta Experiments
Fukua
- No more color-coded shadows. That was TOO easy to read.
- She can now have one air and one ground fireball onscreen at the same time, rather than only one fireball onscreen.
Squigly
- Seria Tremolo is projectile invincible during the extension part.
- On whiff or block, Seria Silver Chord retracts faster and has shorter recovery after the tail fully returns to her.
- Seria Drag'n'Bite -4f recovery (now +11 on hit, -7 on block), can easily link into stand/crouch LP and LK.

Beowulf
- Can properly chain from s.LP to s.LK/c.LK, oops! Since he only has one LP and one LK he was supposed to be able to do this, like Painwheel. cr.LP already could.
- Reduced corner pushback on j.HP and j.MK. Thanks Zid.
- Grab mode finishers (currently F/B+P, D+K with chair, QCT+MP+MK or HP+HK, or j.D+P) cannot be done with P+K, only P or K by themselves.
- Increased buffer time on grab finisher input from 5f to 10f.
- Sped up catch-to-grab-mode animations for chairless HP, c.MK, ground throw, and air throw.

as always ima keep my mouth shut on changes and try it out for three days and give my input. Most definitely the Fukua and squigly changes. if i have anything to ask i will just ask here and hope for a reply.
 
Mike_Z said:
The intention behind the cooldown period is, rather obviously, so that you can't pick up the chair right away after using it. :^)

Ok, that's pretty straight forward. I guess my recollection was incorrect after all :P

Since that's the case, I look forward to testing out how chair interactions will play out once he has all of his moves implemented.
 
Let's give Fukua a jumping fireball and a double jumping fireball as well. It's beta, might as well try new things right?
 
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MegamanDS said:
Let's give Fukua a jumping fireball and a double jumping fireball as well. It's beta, might as well try new things right?
wat
 
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guitalex2007 said:
wat
2 fireballs per jump... jump fireball, double jump another fireball. You can restrict it but having only 1 fireball on the screen at all times so the 2nd would only come out if the first one is off the screen or hit the opponent
 
Give Fukua so many fireballs per round, but give her no restrictions. Let her chain fireballs in the air to rain fire flies on her opponent, or keep them in reserve for important moments. Let her regain fireballs by landing shadows. This is the ultimate Fukua.
 
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Zidiane said:
Give Fukua so many fireballs per round, but give her no restrictions. Let her chain fireballs in the air to rain fire flies on her opponent, or keep them in reserve for important moments. Let her regain fireballs by landing shadows. This is the ultimate Fukua.
we aigis now?
 
Zidiane said:
Give Robo Fortune so many cat missiles per round, but give her no restrictions. Let her chain cat missiles in the air to rain fire flies on her opponent, or keep them in reserve for important moments. Let her regain missiles by landing cat Georges. This is the ultimate Robo Fortune.
What a great idea!
 
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Okay serious request here. Can Filia try out two airdashes per jump? Or would this be too good?
 
gllt said:
I wanted Mike Z to tell me that, not you. :(
6k6sx5nj.png
 
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I just want to make her combos less boring, I could see how two airdashes per jump would be too dumb for jHK reasons maybe.
Can she get back more than one airdash from a hairball or something? Or one per jump AND one per hairball (but still only once per combo)?

Even after the fixes to her she just.. feels so janky and uncool to combo with. If nothing is gonna happen, that's fine too.

With two air dashes per jump her left/right game might be too good but she could probably convert off HFiber assist with jHK adc jLK jMP jHK adc jLP jMP jHK, which would be really cool. At least to me.

With only one air dash per jump, one air dash cancel from a hairball, but both allowed in the same air string, she could do jHK adc jLK jMP jHK MAirball jLK jHK or something? Which would make that combo a lot cooler.

Oh well, I dreamed. I'm gonna go do chores. I felt like its been too long since I made a post that everyone can hate. :')
 
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