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Skullgirls PC Beta Updates Discussion

Mike_Z said:
I quoted you to ping you.

Mike you broke alpha counters in the beta. Fizz was going mad about it and I thought he was crazy and then I checked.
 
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For a second I felt really dumb cause I thought I couldn't do an Alpha Counter. Nice to know it was the game and not me.
 
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Pw sweep is useful too. Because you can charge c.hp for the overhead or charge c.hk for the comboable sweep and even fly cancel the charge to overhead j.lk
 
That new super with the referee probably made me smile more than it should!
 
General
- Same DHC-to-grab-super fix for Fukua's Lv5 as was done yesterday for Cerebella's 360.
- Bugfix: Expand hitboxes on middle/end hits of Filia and Fukua's c.MK so that last hits won't whiff as often when the first hit connects at max distance.

Beta Experiments
- Fix Stunt Doubles (alpha counters) in the Beta. Thanks mcpeanuts!
- Stunt Double freezes the opponent for 9f longer than in the Real Game while jumping in. There is still a gap where the opponent can react, but it is much shorter.
- Squigly's Tremolo is no longer projectile invincible, but her head hitbox has been redrawn so that it more closely matches the art. Seria Tremolo still hits low, but regular Tremolo has been reverted to a mid hit.

Beowulf
- New palette! IGG backer color.
- More clean frames!
- "New" attack, Chair Stampede: j.D+HK. This is his old j.HK that kicks the chair, and regular j.HK now does not kick the chair.
- j.HP versions of grabs do correct damage, not Super damage. Thanks Mr. X.
- s.LP -3f recovery when not holding the button. Feels more like an LP now, was just slightly too long before.
- All grab mode finishers now keep him the correct distance from the wall.

I'll def be testing the alpha counter buff. since i'm one of the few to always use it.
 
That might actually hurt that burst bait set up off of squigly's liver mortis. It's pretty cool because if they burst it whiffs, they dnt burst you get a free charge, if they burst into alpha its still safe (maybe alpha into ssj punishes but i never tested). If alpha burst is stronger, I might have to stop doing this. I'll test after work today.
 
Not too thrilled about the un-buffs for Squigly but Tremolo is still better than it was before so its all good. Hmmm... I'll have to experiment a bit and see if there are other things that Tremolo can low-profile under, aside from Projectiles.
 
Honestly I agree yaya. Projectile invul was really good plus I don't think she really needed it. Is canceling ashes to ashes into tremelo faster than seria cancel into c.lk? Does making tremelo a low allow it to catch an up backing opponent from full screen?
 
Adeveis said:
Does making tremelo a low allow it to catch an up backing opponent from full screen?
Probably. Worth noting that it currently works this way right now in retail.
 
Adeveis said:
Honestly I agree yaya. Projectile invul was really good plus I don't think she really needed it. Is canceling ashes to ashes into tremelo faster than seria cancel into c.lk? Does making tremelo a low allow it to catch an up backing opponent from full screen?
6HP x Tremolo isn't as fast as 2LK, but Seria cancel has a very distinct animation and flashy color effect that Tremolo doesn't have which makes it bonkers and hard to follow.

Uncharged being mid atleast requires her to get the charge first and spend it so she can do it once.
(Though it's pretty easy to get a charge all the time if you pick SquigBand)
 
If tremolo can't be both a low and projectile invincible I'd rather have the latter. It just seems like a better tool to me against some of her harder match ups.
 
Can someone link me the patch notes for this patch which say the assist version of HK Drill functions differently from the point version.
I checked the patch notes awhile ago but couldn't find anything.

It's set up in a way right now that almost looks like a mistake or at least I don't get it.

It goes like


ASSIST:
◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘
-----------------------------◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘------


POINT:
◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘
-----------------------------◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘------

What's the point of having the little tiny window of Strike invincibility for an assist on the startup?
Seems like all it would do is just cause confusion or 'Would have not whiffed the assist punish and would have been a happy birthday if you pressed that 1F later' things.
Seems like it should be all green / all teal?

Yes I understand the 3F's of non invincibility for assists.
 
It's there to luck out if the opponent's hitbox happens ends during that very brief invincibility it would have otherwise hit

Kind of like how retail MK Hornet bomber works
 
Skarmand said:
What's the point of having the little tiny window of Strike invincibility for an assist on the startup?
Seems like all it would do is just cause confusion or 'Would have not whiffed the assist punish and would have been a happy birthday if you pressed that 1F later' things.
Seems like it should be all green / all teal?

Yes I understand the 3F's of non invincibility for assists.

Because thats way too much invul for a forward moving assist that also locks down. It was nerfed because it was too good. See - How many times Hornet Bomber has been nerfed.
 
I'm saying why have such a small window then.
Why not just make it non invulnerable.

Like the other guy said, the small window currently just 'lucks out the opponents Hitbox'

Seems kinda random unless it helps for calling while you're blocking to get people off you or something I else I overlooked?
 
Skarmand said:
I'm saying why have such a small window then.
Why not just make it non invulnerable.
I still don't know what the single grab inulnerable frame on Bella's MGR is for. MGR is 4 vulnerable frames, 6 hit invulnerable frames, 2 fully invulnerable frames, 1 grab invulnerable frame. It's active through the full and grab invincibility.
 
I knew Drill was different as an assist than it was on point, but I thought it has NO invincibility as an assist. I didn't realize it still had 3 frames of invul. Natezer keeps calling it like it's vanilla Hornet Bomber and I keep telling him not to do that cause it's not invincible, but I guess I was wrong?
 
I mean you shouldn't use it like lk bomber against peacock because it shouldn't be projectile invincible at all.

Shouldn't use it like bomber regardless it doesn't go upwards lool. That's like the reason you use bomber.
 
dekillsage said:
I mean you shouldn't use it like lk bomber against peacock because it shouldn't be projectile invincible at all.

Shouldn't use it like bomber regardless it doesn't go upwards lool. That's like the reason you use bomber.
I meant more in terms of calling it at neutral without any regard to what was going on on the screen (vanilla was an exciting time)
 
Shouldn't be doing that anyways :x Keep telling him to stop lol
 
how do people get to 3 bars with Eliza?
considering that it uses a lot of meter that she is using for Sekhmet stuff often i dont think it is too much imo
 
Some general thoughts on the squigly stuff:

  • Daisy pusher change feels like it may be a little too good. I think now that we can actually PBGC Level 2 Draugen Punch this isn't really needed.
  • On the other hand, it is really nice that Daisy Pusher isn't completely escapable now.
  • After playing some today, I honestly can't tell if Tremolo(w) is really really strong or if it was just a tool I never used before. It definitely gives her some more fullscreen pressure, which is fun.
  • Didn't play vs peacock or fukua while it had projectile invincibility, so I can't give any feedback on that. I already feel like this character might be too strong now,
  • There is WAY MORE incentive to get kick charge now, which I like. Both charges allow you to get a little more damage and open up some different neutral game tools, which is really fun. Before when I had the chance for only one charge I would always use punch charge and ignore the kick charge unless I knew I could safely get both.
  • Didn't really notice Silver Chord change.

Overall I don't think that Beta Squigly (right now) is too strong, but player-character bias is probably affecting that. Non-squigly players could give better feedback on how strong it actually is. One thing that I like is that I'm frequently asking myself should I use my charge here or hold onto it in case I need to reversal in a bit? It feels like both charges hold weight and there's a little more thought to my decision making when using them. Charges don't feel like I'm making subpar specials usable now, it feels like i'm making subpar specials fucking awesome.

General thoughts on beta changes, now that they've been here for a while:
  • PBGC change is awesome and should stay.
  • Change to assist calls and pushblocking should stay.
  • Post-Flash blocking with Undizzy is awesome and should stay
  • Undizzy draining slower when higher (ie: incentive to reset early) is awesome. I think the optimal way to play the game is to reset as soon as you can when the undizzy bar starts filling, as this is both the best time to reset AND bait a super mash with blocking post flash now being enabled.
  • While I don't like that LK bomber is harder for me to convert off of, I think that all of the bomber changes are better for the game and balance out your choice of lockdown assists better.
  • Solo healing is awesome. I definitely think it should only be vs teams and not in 1v1, since 1v1's are paced very differently.
  • All of Doubles changes feel great and should stay. As somebody who plays a very gunshot heavy neutral game with double, I like these changes. The new super looks cool and feels good to use, although I haven't messed around with it as much as others have. It definitely makes her feel more "weird" though, which is exactly how she should feel in my opinion.
  • In general, I am super excited for the Beowulf patch because the beta right now feels really good to play, and I think all of these changes are better for the game in the long run.
 
is there like a pastebin or something with all the current beta changes?
 
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I can make a summary at some point, like with the next notes maybe? But I dunno if there's a general list otherwise.
It wouldn't be too hard to collate one from the existing notes.

There will be some more that people may like less. :^P

I'm not sure how I feel on Daisy change, on the one hand it's useful, on the other hand I may end up just going and adding tech to remove your ability to tag or something.

@worldjem
4.1k fully scaled is a lot, innit.
 
@Mike_Z yeah!!
I really really really miss the full list of current changes you used to do.

Rather than clog up each page with the same walls of text maybe you could just keep the current changes in a Google docs and link that each time at the bottom?

Ex:

New!
- Beowulf LvL3!
- Counter hit chairless jHP allows ground finisher!
- Removed Daisy pusher change

Current Full change log:
<drive link>
 
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Mike_Z said:
@worldjem
4.1k fully scaled is a lot, innit.

Yeah it is. It should be less. I also really don't like how the last hit is 1800 damage. wtf it should be like 800~1000.

In fact, Eliza gets way too much reward off any hit in general.

and I don't think dive bird should start from infinite height either.
 
So are we(you) still in an experimenting mood?

I hope so 'cause I was kinda hoping I could call an assist after fiber jump because you can't do that not even if you air dash I figured it worked like hairball rules but it turned it doesn't.
(also don't do that to H fiber because that's super jump height I mostly would prefer this on L fiber M is questionable because I'm unsure of its height)

The only reason I can think for it being this way currently is that it's a special cancel I can space out and also practically jump right back in and I guess adding an assist would make it too good? or maybe it's because then it would be taking away what headless can do since it's possible to do that but you just gotta use the head for it and not an assist.

I'm starting to think this was not a good suggestion but I'm leaving it here anyway.
 
Eliza having the most damaging lvl 3 after max scaling seems fine considering she is the only character that uses up her meter on not supers/alpha counters

I'd have to compare its damage with other lvl 3s to gauge how much more its doing, but I think it should probably stay the strongest

On an unrelated note: Can the headbutt grab finisher for Beowulf not knock the opponent so far away + knock them slightly higher up?
 
Eh. Eliza spends meter on sek but she doesn't do it enough to the point where she can't reliably build 3 bars. What ends up bugging me more is that you can combo off it when it carries you into the corner, and you can kinda combo off it midscreen too?
 
I mean there are plenty of other level 3's that allows for combos afterwards and while yes she can still build a good amount of meter she takes a lot longer to get to level 3 of Sekhmet imo
 
RemiKz said:
On an unrelated note: Can the headbutt grab finisher for Beowulf not knock the opponent so far away + knock them slightly higher up?
i felt the headbutt finisher is just okay, you can combo off of it just fine (to make it not otg it requires a cr.lp or lk link but it works). the Knee finisher is the one that's meant to send your opponent flying away from you.
 
Ninja said:
i felt the headbutt finisher is just okay, you can combo off of it just fine (to make it not otg it requires a cr.lp or lk link but it works). the Knee finisher is the one that's meant to send your opponent flying away from you.
You can't even avoid using the OTG with LP/LK on light characters unless you are up against the corner. Mostly wanted the change so it is more reliable to link into c.MP after the hitbutt on light characters and maybe LP/LK on heavies without forcing otg.

Actually, just maybe letting him act out of it a bit sooner would do the trick.
 
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