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One Big Night! One Big Show! One Big Man! One Big Band! General Discussion

c.MK hitting low would be really broken. As far as I know the only lows Big Band has are c.LK s.LK and c.HK.
 
Is c.LK c.MP c.HP xx L Giant Step a legit blockstring? It pushes the opponent back enough that they usually can't punish it with a light or medium. You can also just do A-Train instead of Giant Step if they know you like doing Giant Step.
 
ashxu said:
Is c.LK c.MP c.HP xx L Giant Step a legit blockstring? It pushes the opponent back enough that they usually can't punish it with a light or medium. You can also just do A-Train instead of Giant Step if they know you like doing Giant Step.
That's what Training Options -> Blocking -> First Hit Only is for.

And yes.
 
I meant if people use it in real games or not. I don't play Big Band.

Also I didn't know you could use that to test block strings, I used to just set the dummy to reversal super to check for gaps.
 
ashxu said:
Also I didn't know you could use that to test block strings, I used to just set the dummy to reversal super to check for gaps.

Logically if there are gaps, then it isn't a blockstring.
 
1.) How do I keep up the pressure as Big Band? It feels like I can only be seen as a threat if I pushed you into the corner and start making immaculate reads all the time.

2.) How should I go about the fukua and parasoul matchups?
 
well i don't know if this will work for you or not but i find to solve both of those problems i use one thing. armor, and lots of it. That doesn't mean just do Brass and A Trains all day long but more like quick air breaks to help close in the gap keeping you and your opponent at medium range where you can rush thru anything and punish them with a medium brass. With both Fukua and Parasoul it's important to know how good you are at parrying and what moves your opponent is most likely going to do if a Big Band is coming right up in their face. If you opponent manages to open up the gap again and they are afraid of jumping you can nab them with a heavy giant step, but that this very risky because both Fukua and Parasoul can super and counter the ground pound.

If a Parasoul is running away she will smartly throw out air tears to set up a wall if you ever decide to rush in with a Brass, but this gives you space for you to move in with out any napalm shot being fired at you. Because of this Band can move in a close the gap, forcing the Parasoul to do the napalm shots to keep you away. Just brass cancel thru them and parry the highly likely jump in that Parasoul will try to do. This can be applied to Fukua as well, just be more careful for Fukua can do her air fireball spam, land and throw out a medium shadow to snag you (beta kinda makes that harder because of the recovery frames but still wary of it) you're going to have to parry a bit more with Fukua. But if you do catch her be sure to do a full combo that finishes in Tympani and not in a normal SSJ we don't want Fukua to be thrown away from you just keep her close and do a crossup on her after the tympani.

but i don't know this is just how i handle Parasouls and Fukua's and sometimes i just say screw it and just Brass/ Super everything i see. if it works it works, if it doesn't then... sorry for wasting your time.
 
Fedora_Ninja said:
1.) How do I keep up the pressure as Big Band? It feels like I can only be seen as a threat if I pushed you into the corner and start making immaculate reads all the time.

2.) How should I go about the fukua and parasoul matchups?
My go to strategy is to spam the shit out of his j.lk when I'm upclose. Then i do j.lk fast fall mixups into throws or lows. I throw in some giant steps as well with an assist to cover for my band in case a step is blocked.

Fukua and parasoul i have no idea except i just do what BB was given, armor through fukua ground shots or jump forward and pushblock them so she gets peaced out to the corner. Once I'm close its just all j.lk pressure and throws.

At full screen ive found that of the fukua likes single or double jump heavy fireball, that i can jump backwards and then double jump forward to get over them.

But all in all its just patience game and pushblocking her to the corner. If she sees the pushblock strat then wpshe will start to go offensive which is where you can own her with your j.lk since its faster than her j.hk.

The matchup seems largely to be mindgames that fukua has the advantage on, but one correct reaction from BB and its lights out for her.



Also, ive been running a pseudo corner vortex with BB:


Non soundstun starter into launch then: j.mp,j.hp xx hk cymbal, h brass. (Go for high/low/ bait okizeme here) kill the other character when you have enough meter to otherwise just do the mixup into itself over and over again.

It isnt the STRONGEST thing ever but its surprising how effective it can be since it largely isnt affected by undizzy and yet does very good damage for such a short combo, and basically combos into itself.
 
Fedora_Ninja said:
parasoul
This range kind of sucks for BB: http://i.imgur.com/am4rSis.png

That range (a bit less than 3 squares apart) seems to be the range where she can dash jump j.lp for a high or dash c.lk for a low. Also, if you try to use j.lk as an air footsie tool at this range, para's j.lp will out-disjoint yours and you'll lose pretty much every time. You really don't want to be in this range, as it kind of shifts everything in parasoul's favor. Sure, you can do SSJ or beat extend, but she can hit from so far away and so quickly that it's hard to gauge when to throw one out.

MP rush punch is a good tool at that range (it's fast enough to use as a napalm shot punish), and LP beat extend is a much riskier option though has more reward (i haven't had much success with MP/HP beat extend in this match, as j.lp beats them clean, along with a max-distance s.lp (lol)). What I usually try to do is jump back and throw out some cymbals at a height that won't get your feet clipped by a napalm shot and try to feel out when a MP rush would work. Make sure to pay attention when you're landing because it's when stuff happens. Landing from cymbals and doing LP beat extend is a totally viable option, obnoxious as it is.

Up close seems to me like it's in BB's favor. She can't do as much against BB's j.lk at this range and if you can get a combo into sliding knockdown then awesome: meaty c.lk is totally safe against pillar. After a close blocked LP rush punch, her s.lp will beat any non-invincible/armored option that BB has but then that's also awesome: it's a perfect time to do something invincible/armored. :)

At long range just try to parry and block until you get a little closer I guess. I used to think this matchup was fucking awful for BB, but I don't think it's that bad. Still in para's favor but I like it more than the val matchup at least.
 
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@drewski

If that range is outside lp brass (doesnt look like it) then it is kinda bad. But at that range BB is going to be using a mixup of L brass, dash jump j.lk and backwards jump>double jump forward j.lk to get over parasouls j.lp

You also have the ability to space check her with cymbal... much better if you have an assist to cover wiffed cymbal.. but i digress.

I dont find that range particularly problematic against parasoul, but my lack of good parasouls may have something to do with it.

At any rate, if you havent tried out L brass (not saying you havent) then try it out. It will hit parasoul on her way up from a jump like if shes trying to dash jump you, and it isnt hittable by cr.lk from that range because of brasses higher hitbox on the extended punch. Also... And this is just you know non standard and just anti parasoul stuff in general... You can jump forward and block j.lp,j.hp and land and get a free punish on her EVERY time.. It makes her a bit hesitant to autopilot that air string.


I'm not saying that what you are saying is incorrect, I'm just giving out my personal experiences as ive heard many people say its bad, but i havent felt it... Then agains i regularly take my point band against point fukua so... Yeah anything is bound to feel better than that matchup.


-edit

Oh yeah, forgot to mention... If you block just about any ground hitconfirm from parasoul that is 3 hits or more... Its basically a free pbgc ssj, h giant step ssj for you.

Parasoul is very weak to pbgc in general and BB just exacerbates that.
 
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@Dime_x I feel you on the LP brass thing but at that range it will lose to napalm shots too. Also if it's done too late she just kinda jumps over it.

j.lp is not something I would ever think would be useful in this matchup but I guess it is pretty disjointed. The lack of active frames and angle just makes it seems like it will get totally blown up. I'll give it a try next time I play.

I also should point out that even though I play it a lot, I never really considered myself good at this matchup so yeah, definitely take what I say with a grain of salt.
 
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No worries dude :) and yeah everything comes with a grain of salt. Everything parasoul does i feel like BB has an effective counter for... But parasoul also has effective counters. So to me... The matchup feels evenish, or more like the better player wins.

That j.lp though was an autocorrect typo. I meant j.lk.

j.lk is the big problem solver to me. It forces other characters hands. It isnt unbeatable by any means, but the ways for characters to beat it ive found makes them very predictable, at least to me. Like you are very very correct about j.lp beating bb j.lk at range. But ive found that parasouls (and most characters in general) that have a way of beating j.lk... Just become super predictable about what they want to do and then i just counter them easily by letting the see the situation and then countering their counter.


But at the end of the day its all mindgames. And its near impossible to quantify mindgames in any meaningful way :(

But yeah i dont disagree with anything youve said, with the slight exception that i think its kinda BB that has the actual threats because he can counter everything parasoul does with a correct read, or barring that, with a MUCH safer and more active hitbox jumping light attack, fastfall mixups off of it, brass keeping parasoul honest at midscreen, h giant step keeping her from camping out at full screen and double jump j.lk and h brass keeping her from just being able to do dash mixups at will.


BUT...my BB is highly highly offensive whereas every bb ive ever fought is a huge turtle... So that in and of itself may be a difference in matchup values... I dont feel comfortable walking backwards with BB whereas other BBs ive seen dont feel comfortable walking forwards.


But like i said i dont disagree with anything that youve said really, and the things that i believe could just be the difference between my skill and those that i play against.
 
Thanks for the info. I've read tons of it. He's my best character, and I've used a lot of stuff from this forum to keep improving. Still have some problems w/the H B Extend off the tech, OTG cLP/cMP/cHK, but it's just me using the R1 button on a pad most likely. I do better w/the other two than cHK.

Haven't used parry much with him, though. Not sure how important it is, but when I try it, I usually get hit.
Used to parry in SF3:TS, but was never a master. Just a projectile every so often.
Maybe the timing's a bit different, or I'm just rusty from the old days. Coolest one I've done was part of Fukua's Super FB (into block). Usually just a normal projectile once in a rare while.
 
One of the more important aspects to the Parry is that BB doesn't lose any forward momentum. This can be extremely useful if you're trying to jump forward against Peacock, Parasoul, or Fukua, so rather than just blocking their projectile or pushblocking it, you can Parry and continue moving towards them.
 
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Speaking of which, you can also parry while forward dashing if you do it with two punches
Simply PP and tap forward and you'll dash forward at full speed while enjoying that nice 18f parry window or whatever it is
 
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If you're really good, you can do a charge input, press forward to parry a projectile, then press a punch or kick button to pull out A-Train or Brass Knuckle to do it right after and keep your armor.

I only know that it's possible because I did it on accident at EVO against a Fukua.
 
Nap1400 said:
If you're really good, you can do a charge input, press forward to parry a projectile, then press a punch or kick button to pull out A-Train or Brass Knuckle to do it right after and keep your armor.

I only know that it's possible because I did it on accident at EVO against a Fukua.
My pal Justo was telling me the other day that if he parries something after he had been holding downback for a while, he'll press P or K to go into Brass Knuckles/A-Train, which apparently he can do on reaction to the parry animation. Justo played 3S, though, to be fair.
 
I would much rather not get that, since I keep getting lp brass by accident if I try to s.lp when parrying after holding back

Not sure if there's anything you can do about that other than deliberately get rid of your charge before parrying
 
Maybe you can parry then hold back again before pressing the button to prevent the charge move from coming out? I don't know, can't test it out because I'm away from my game.
 
I found something in training mode just now that's maybe useful, maybe not, but I think it's interesting either way. If you input your rush punch as [4]6+HP~LK (so like plink the LK after the HP), you get H Brass Knuckles if the opponent does something that the armor can absorb, or you get Emergency Brake if they don't. So it's like, a sort of safe reversal option that loses to throws and frame traps. Again I don't know if this is useful at all but I find it interesting that it works like this.
 
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mcpeanuts said:
I found something in training mode just now that's maybe useful, maybe not, but I think it's interesting either way. If you input your rush punch as [4]6+HP~LK (so like plink the LK after the HP), you get H Brass Knuckles if the opponent does something that the armor can absorb, or you get Emergency Brake if they don't. So it's like, a sort of safe reversal option that loses to throws and frame traps. Again I don't know if this is useful at all but I find it interesting that it works like this.
why does it work like that though?

also why is it that when you do like s.hk, brass+assist ([4]6mp+hk) and you cancel the s.hk as soon as it hits you get brass+assist but if you wait a bit you get emergency brake+assist?
 
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CaioLugon said:
also why is it that when you do like s.hk, brass+assist ([4]6mp+hk) and you cancel the s.hk as soon as it hits you get brass+assist but if you wait a bit you get emergency brake+assist?

I was just about to mention this, it's like if you're in a combo and the h brass will connect, you get the h brass, otherwise you get the e-brake. if you do that in neutral, the e-brake comes out ( plus assist )
 
CaioLugon said:
why does it work like that though?

also why is it that when you do like s.hk, brass+assist ([4]6mp+hk) and you cancel the s.hk as soon as it hits you get brass+assist but if you wait a bit you get emergency brake+assist?
I propose that in McPeanut's example, the armor activating delays Band's animation and causes the LK to be too early to trigger the Brakes. Same for CaioLugon, inputting the assist-Brass combination during hit stop causes the Brakes input to be lost in the delay.

... I'm just hypothesizing, I'm sure someone will correct me.
 
CaioLugon said:
why does it work like that though?
After practicing with it more, and sometimes getting it and sometimes not, and figuring out what makes it work consistently, I think I know why it's happening. When the opponent hits you (which doesn't put you into hitstun, because you have armor), the hitstop from that attack is eating the Emergency Brake input. It's possible to fuck this up and get an Emergency Brake and die, but as long as you push the button to brake during the hitstop from the opponent's attack, the punch won't stop. It doesn't have to be a move with a ton of hitstop, either; I'm testing this by having Double do s.LPx2 as a reversal.

CaioLugon said:
also why is it that when you do like s.hk, brass+assist ([4]6mp+hk) and you cancel the s.hk as soon as it hits you get brass+assist but if you wait a bit you get emergency brake+assist?
Same thing, actually. zeknife explained this to me. If you hit MP+HK during the hitstop from the s.HK, the hitstop eats your Emergency Brake input and you just get Brass.
 
Is it ok that bigband keeps his taunt after a blocked air super? peacock loses hers REALLY easily...
 
Peacock doesn't lose hers as easily in beta, I think
 
big band keeps his taunt as long as the "taunt" doesn't come out during the super. So for air super it can whiff or be blocked, or on hit if you DHC before he does the bell grab portion it will still keep the taunt. I believe the same is true for the SSJ, but can't recall if there were any specifics to it.

the only video I've ever been able to record without crashing my PC actually contains this:

edit: the video gets a little wonky at the end, thats just part of the recording
 
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Kayn R. Steel said:
Is anyone getting a Potemkin feel from Big Band?
Kind of? He does have a grounded and anti-air command grab along with an armored rush punch, and his neutral pokes are on the large side.

On the other hand, no one's afraid of L A-Train.
 
Emuchu said:
Kind of? He does have a grounded and anti-air command grab along with an armored rush punch, and his neutral pokes are on the large side.

On the other hand, no one's afraid of L A-Train.

True, True..
(Potemkins new design reminds me of Panzerfaust)
Dangit getting off topic...
 
Kayn R. Steel said:
Is anyone getting a Potemkin feel from Big Band?

Eh, not really. Potemkin is a grappler who has to make a big effort to move in and put on a relentless offense to win, Big Band is just a heavy damage character with a lot of large powerful moves that allow him to function well on offense or defense. Big Band also has better tools for controlling the screen from longer distances, meaning he won't always be trying to push forward as much as Potemkin.

Some moves have similarities (Hammerfall and Brass Knuckle, Heat Knuckle and A-Train, Slidehead and H Giant Step, etc.), but they ways they apply to how their respective character plays are pretty different.
 
I had a question about safe jumps.

I was testing safe jumps last night against a few different reversals. First one I tried was Filia L Updo. I set it up so the dummy would randomly either wake up with L Updo or would sit there and block. I then did H Brass and tried to dash up and do a meaty j.MK. I played around with that for a while to get the timing down and eventually I found the timing where the j.MK makes contact if they're blocking but if they wake up L Updo the j.MK whiffs and you're able to block, and I'm like O.K. you can safe jump L Updo. Later I tried to safe jump Painwheel's Death Crawl, and I could not find a timing where I could block the Death Crawl while still hitting them if they woke up with nothing.

Here's the thing I'm not getting. L Updo is 8f startup. Death Crawl is 14f startup. Why is it that I can safe jump Updo but not Death Crawl? I'm guessing that it's because Death Crawl is a super and hitstop is doing... something... but I don't really understand enough about the game mechanics to know why this would happen.

If it turns out you just straight up cannot safe jump supers, that's annoying. Even if that's the case tho I think safe jumps are still viable in some matchups like against Fukua and Parasoul, and hey those are Big Band's worst matchups, so I'm gonna keep working on it.
 
Death crawl pre-flash startup is 6f, which explains your problem
You can check this by by just looking at the frame display with the little boxes on the top of the screen while doing a super, since it stops during the super flash
 
Have you tried the training mode setting where you can see what supers look like without the hitstop? Usually supers are a lot faster when you look at them that way so maybe that will make it clearer, so try that with safe-jump setups.
 
zeknife said:
Death crawl pre-flash startup is 6f, which explains your problem
You can check this by by just looking at the frame display with the little boxes on the top of the screen while doing a super, since it stops during the super flash
So it's effectively a 6f move? Is the preflash startup the only thing I should be looking at?
fenster said:
Have you tried the training mode setting where you can see what supers look like without the hitstop? Usually supers are a lot faster when you look at them that way so maybe that will make it clearer, so try that with safe-jump setups.
Didn't think to try this, I'll give it a shot, thanks!
 
mcpeanuts said:
So it's effectively a 6f move? Is the preflash startup the only thing I should be looking at?
The rest is some magical superflash-dimension startup where the other character is frozen in time
It is used for animations I guess
 
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zeknife said:
The rest is some magical superflash-dimension startup where the other character is frozen in time
It is used for animations I guess
Oh, I see. So some of those post flash boxes I'm seeing in the frame data viewer are actually frames where my character can't move. That actually does explain it. Thanks.

So yeah there's probably only a handful of characters you can really safe jump. Peacock, Parasoul, Fukua, Eliza, Squigly (I think? Gonna check this one), and Double (lmao car sucks). Actually now that I typed it out I guess that's like almost half the characters in the game, so the safe jumps are still pretty worth learning. Uh most of those characters can level 3 but they'd need 3 bars obv.
 
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