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Skullgirls Encore Edition Tiers and Matchups Discussion Thread: The Revengeance

Icky said:
To be fair, there are no 'highly technical characters' in this game lol. I guess there are characters that are harder than others, but in the grand scheme of things Skullgirls is pretty friendly compared to other fighters when it comes to execution and technicality of characters.
Blame the tier listing website, think of that more as a who is easier to learn
 
Well the point is you tried
 
Moving this to the tier thread already in existence
 
Alright. Try to offer more than "That listing is dumb", please. You can point out it's shortcomings, just try and give reasons he can read and understand.
 
agent13 said:
Blame the tier listing website, think of that more as a who is easier to learn
You very much have the ability to name the tiers to ANYTHING you want if you click customize. Example: http://www.mmcafe.com/tiermaker/skullgirls/index_customize.html?tc=ya0-trky4bk91dergy9047cd4fei14az7khc18h453bo1cfq878t18-bkg-tiTier Chart for Persona 4 Arena-ct999999-c1000000-c2000000-tvFF7101-thDD3C3C-d1Cute as fuck-x110-d2Not as cute as fuck-x210-d3The left side-x310-d4Not the left side-x47

EDIT: wrong link the first time lol
EDIT 2: i just realized the title of it is "tier chart for Persona 4 Arena." I had no idea that game was all Skullgirls characters. LABZERO SHOULD SUE THEM...or maybe it's the other way around? :O
 
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Cynical said:
WTF at Parasoul being easier to use than Bella. My Bella was better after 30 minutes than my Parasoul is now.
I've never even had to go to training mode with my crappy Parasoul. I just watched people play and was able to do all the mid level stuff in a match just by watching. Cerebella you at least need to know how grapplers work.
 
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No one in this game is really difficult compared to other FG's because game is hella easy etc.

The only characters that I consider requiring any kind of difficulty is like... PW and Squigs, but thats mostly because getting the hit with them is so demanding since they're not that good.

Also if you don't go into training mode with crappy Parasoul doesn't that mean you need to put in time with her in training mode to make her not crappy? That comment makes no sense.
 
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ZANKj9v.jpg

never 4get
 
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Duckator said:
"image"
never 4get

Am I missing a joke here? Peacock has a s*** ton of combo variety and some of the highest damage output in the game. The only the reason I can think of putting her there is because peacocks typically just run the entire match and don't actually land combos.
 
Well I think it how much a part of their gameplan combos are. Peacock relies on them the least.
 
Eh, I don't really agree. Long range confirms are definitely a part of her game, but IMO she can't win if she doesn't rushdown and land some mix ups and resets. I don't think Peacock will ever beat a good rush down/pixie character if all she does is run away and do bang bang bang into Argus Agony all day.
 
No Peacock definitely needs to do combos as well. However look at the other characters? Rushing and long combos are a much bigger part of their game.
 
Thought I'd give this a shot
9t57prL.png


Honestly, I'm not too sure about the placement for most of the people near the bottom
 
Icky said:
You very much have the ability to name the tiers to ANYTHING you want if you click customize. Example: http://www.mmcafe.com/tiermaker/skullgirls/index_customize.html?tc=ya0-trky4bk91dergy9047cd4fei14az7khc18h453bo1cfq878t18-bkg-tiTier Chart for Persona 4 Arena-ct999999-c1000000-c2000000-tvFF7101-thDD3C3C-d1Cute as fuck-x110-d2Not as cute as fuck-x210-d3The left side-x310-d4Not the left side-x47

EDIT: wrong link the first time lol
EDIT 2: i just realized the title of it is "tier chart for Persona 4 Arena." I had no idea that game was all Skullgirls characters. LABZERO SHOULD SUE THEM...or maybe it's the other way around? :O
Wow done w/ u
 
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For people putting Big Band on their tier chart...how do you already know where he stands?
 
It's more of a guestimate without solid data (aside from hours of playing/observing the beta) than a concrete, "He's here".
 
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Broken Loose said:
uh
QxInc7k.jpg
The fact that Squigly is near the bottom lets me know this whole chart is BS and should not be used in any arguments, lest you get laughed out heartily.

Why does the character who has to charge down for a reversal placed in a favorable matchup against the character with the overhead frame traps? Why, when the only other non-crouching options that could be reversals not only cost meter but lose on reaction, even level 3? Hell, every reversal option she has loses on reaction to Daisy. j.LK beats Para's j.LP. Attempts at zoning end with an opera to the face. Jump in normals get AA Daisy'd.
 
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If "charge down is necessary to reversal" was the defining note for matchup numbers, Parasoul would be garbage tier. Squigly does NOT have the best overheads in the game. On that note, Squigly has no reversal AT ALL, so.. uh?
How does Level3 lose on reaction? And how the SHIT does Pillar "lose on reaction to Daisy"?
Para has more AA options than j.LP
Opera is really not that easy
You can't AA daisy Parasoul jumpin normals because she can just cancel the normal into tear toss after the flash and it dodges Daisy's active frames.
 
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She's actually above CB and PW in this chart if you look at the averages. This wasn't sorted properly and I think the "average" column cell formulas aren't right anyway.
 
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I feel like too many people are trying to look at the matchup chart (which was based on 1v1 scenarios) as a tier list. :( It can be used to help make one (and tbh the placing does seem similar to a lot of people's lists), but it's not a tier list.
 
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IsaVulpes said:
If "charge down is necessary to reversal" was the defining note for matchup numbers, Parasoul would be garbage tier. Squigly does NOT have the best overheads in the game. On that note, Squigly has no reversal AT ALL, so.. uh?
How does Level3 lose on reaction? And how the SHIT does Pillar "lose on reaction to Daisy"?
Para has more AA options than j.LP
Opera is really not that easy
You can't AA daisy Parasoul jumpin normals because she can just cancel the normal into tear toss after the flash and it dodges Daisy's active frames.
Trying to make it that when the Squigly matchup is apparently so severely misguided is hilarious.

What Squigly's have YOU been playing?
 
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Actually, the Squigly portion of that chart was based off Yaya's input, and Yaya kind of knows his shit. Also, the idea that Squigly j.LK beats Parasoul j.LP is a pretty radical claim and I'd like to see some hitboxes to support it.

The reality is that reversals don't determine the quality of a character entirely, or else Valentine wouldn't be considered top tier. Napalm Pillar being a downward charge move doesn't prevent Parasoul from having a huge advantage in the Filia matchup, and Filia doesn't have to stance charge her DP to make it invulnerable. Parasoul has good tools, good zoning, phenomenal hitboxes, and a consistency that Squigly lacks due to reliance on meter and stance charges. It's not a blowout but it's definitely in Parasoul's favor, especially a sufficiently patient one.
 
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Broken Loose said:
Actually, the Squigly portion of that chart was based off Yaya's input, and Yaya kind of knows his shit. Also, the idea that Squigly j.LK beats Parasoul j.LP is a pretty radical claim and I'd like to see some hitboxes to support it.

The reality is that reversals don't determine the quality of a character entirely, or else Valentine wouldn't be considered top tier. Napalm Pillar being a downward charge move doesn't prevent Parasoul from having a huge advantage in the Filia matchup, and Filia doesn't have to stance charge her DP to make it invulnerable. Parasoul has good tools, good zoning, phenomenal hitboxes, and a consistency that Squigly lacks due to reliance on meter and stance charges. It's not a blowout but it's definitely in Parasoul's favor, especially a sufficiently patient one.
I think this chart should be revised with input from 2-3 good players for each character. That way, there's a consensus on overall MUs.
 
matchupchartsg.JPG
i actually fixed up the matchup chart a while ago so here it is. this was make on my stream with my input on characters i knew and i also had the help of good players like dekillsage, fuzzy snugs, khaosmuffins, keninblack, thatoneotherdude, yaya, worldjem, and i might be missing someone else. the point is everyone that had a say in this list knows what they're talking about so if you have a problem with squigly's placement in this then you can take it up with them
 
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Broken Loose said:
Actually, the Squigly portion of that chart was based off Yaya's input, and Yaya kind of knows his shit. Also, the idea that Squigly j.LK beats Parasoul j.LP is a pretty radical claim and I'd like to see some hitboxes to support it.

Peanuts did this shit to me like 19 times in a row this weekend. It's not the worst option for squigly to go for.
 
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Um, i really don't agree with parasoul list mainly because double can piss her off with luger and bionic car
I honestly think that's 5/5
 
do you really refuse to just block. It's not like it does any damage in chip just block and move forward
 
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Did someone say...
Guitalex vs The Parasoul Nation? Show that Squigly isn't a bad* character?

* = Squigly ain't bad, in fact she's quite good. Other characters are just better, IMO.

Edit: We need a Skullgirls Illuminati Podcast.
 
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dekillsage said:
do you really refuse to just block. It's not like it does any damage in chip just block and move forward
um, i don't refuse to just block. My defense is fine, tyvm. Besides you know how i play right?
Parasoul loses to double in the neutral game, You can get horribly punished for an egret dive/napalm shot/tear. She also can get lugered out of egret charge depending on the startup and your only option is to go in. I'm just stating tools.
 
Instead of trying to beat double from fullscreen, which is the only spot double beats parasoul
howww aboutttt you don't shoot napalm shots and instead just jump forward and block. At some point doubles gonna have to stop shooting lugars or else she risks getting hit by j.lp which is the easiest to land on a standing double. Car does like how much 2k? Idk. Unless double has like 4 meters and hits you with each car getting hit by car doesn't mean ****. Double can NOT keep parasoul out forever. This isn't peacock vs parasoul, or bella trying to catch a running valentine. This is double who has 2 moves that beats parasoul from a ridiculously far range IF parasoul commits to attacks, but can't do shit to stop parasoul once she's in j.lp range other than committing.

this mu isn't even close to a 5-5
 
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as i said before, i'm stating tools
double can't keep her out forever but seriously hurt her getting in and punish her for errors in the process
when parasoul gets in, it forces double to respect her at that moment

and a) i'm not saying it's peacock vs parasoul i'm saying it's more or less even instead of 6 which the tier list put it at
 
errors in the process? just move forward and blockkkkkkk

you're not gonna take any damage for doing so

these "tools" double has aren't very good.
 
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dekillsage said:
errors in the process? just move forward and blockkkkkkk

you're not gonna take any damage for doing so

these "tools" double has aren't very good.

I'm going to play devil advocate, and if double jumps back/cross under/flesh step?
 
if she jumps back she's pushing herself to to the corner
she can't cross under parasoul doing normal jumps iirc, but even if she can you can do jump back+lk !
Flesh step is extremely unsafe by herself. You can easily punish it with whatever you want. Including j.lp!
 
but then again, am i going to randomly guess a b.lk when they jumped under and what if they blocked, it's not the safest thing? I also meant if flesh step crossed under then again if she jumps she has an anti-air luger and it's just -10 and can trade/win that's why i'm saying it's even

If i'm playing double i don't have to respect parasouls zoning game and only need to respect her until she gets in but until that point it's even and then again double has a dp just like her so that's why i think it's a match that can go any ones way

i hate playing theory fighter
 
try using j.hk
and learn that double has no tools to beat that reliably
 
KhaosMuffins said:
I feel like too many people are trying to look at the matchup chart (which was based on 1v1 scenarios) as a tier list. :(
That's... how you make tier lists.

Albeit, it would be a very incomplete one without every conceivable team/assist combination. LOL
 
dekillsage said:
try using j.hk
and learn that double has no tools to beat that reliably

absolutely but not for getting in, if double sees that she can j.hk
Parasoul still needs to get in and can make error because inching closer doesn't always work the way you want it too
that's my point to say why it's even
 
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