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Skullgirls PC Beta Updates Discussion

@Mike_Z You're seriously punishing the majority of your fanbase because someone said something stupid and then wouldn't listen to you?
Please don´t "punish" the rest of SG community
You think I'm punishing the majority of the fanbase because I don't want to read some BS that isn't contributing anything?
If I ask people to behave constructively and they don't, then I will remove myself. It's not punishing you, it's preserving my sanity.
I have a list of fixes and I have my same rational approach. Game balance isn't suddenly going to disintegrate.

this is why I'm afraid to post anything. Is there some sort of unspoken rule that we aren't supposed to talk about balance? I'm not a top player but I play a lot and I'm planning on playing SG for a long long time, and I'd like it to be the best game possible.
Talk about balance all you want, but don't insist that X thing is broken or OP just because YOU can't fight it. (You didn't do that, but that is the major problem here.) Objective analysis is helpful, personal complaining is not.

You should be ecstatic that people debate the mechanics and elements in Skullgirls so enthusiastically
I am ecstatic, but I absolutely do not need to have people keep requesting changes because they are playing badly, after I explain that there are not going to be changes because it is possible to play better.
It's a two-way interaction, and it's that stuff that bothers me, when it is not an actual discussion. It accomplishes nothing.

Sekhmet is extremely rewarding if you play badly against her. She also costs a resource, so I don't have a problem with her being rewarding, and in a lot of situations she can be punished super hard.
If there is more non-constructive complaining to be done, take it elsewhere.

I think if Sek does a move that's -9 on block like s.H she can't possibly avoid a reversal snapback because she's too minus. Pressing buttons can't CH the snapback and even though she recovers in time to return to neutral.... she still can't block it even if it isn't technically a "punish", she can't move fast enough to get out of the way either.
QFT. That was my point, she can't avoid or counterhit a snapback punish, even if you are too far to throw.

"Sekhmet costs like half a bar to do two mixups that may cost the opponent a character.. btw if you want to counter her, you can always just spend a full meter on 0 damage" stays a riot btw
If you want to counter her, there is an option which 100% works to do that. It's up to you to use it or not, along with other options like just running away. Don't be obtuse.

Hurting Hurl is very comparable to Fortune Headroll (safe reversal, throw vulnerable, makes you 'switch stances', allows combos on hit, long startup,
Cat Strike originally was completely invincible, which was the main problem.
Fortune can command the head immediately afterward, while she herself is able to block. Followups were originally a blockstring with a 2f gap, not enough to attack out of.
She can also recall the head at any time, and do things with it.
It is also not very easy to chicken block.
Immediate LP from Fortune is now a 7f gap, and she can still cover herself with the head, etc.

H toss places the chair a full screen away from Beowulf, and he has no way to get it back aside from moving to it or tagging out and back in. This alone is enough of a difference.
The placed chair doesn't aid him in any way. Beowulf takes extra chip damage without the chair, and loses his meterless reversal. This alone is ALSO enough of a difference.
It is easily chicken-blocked, in which case he is fully punishable.
Immediate c.LP from Beowulf is a 5f gap. This is fine. Were that to be increased to a 7f gap, it would not make enough of a difference to be noticeable, since he is still not punishable unless he sticks something out. It might make you mash after blocking more, I suppose, and get CH by Arm more. :^P
Heck, even if you pushblock it, he's just farther away from the chair.
So no, I don't think it needs to be changed.

Also was there ever an answer as to how bursts would work interact with decap attack before the change that allowed the opponent to hit the head out of decap attack? I'm just really curious why the the head would still do something when the burst would hit decap attack but then go into cooldown mid attack before the change.
Yeah, I explained a while ago. Since decap attack couldn't be interrupted it acted like it made contact with you and just put the head into regular falling anim, so it didn't incur any penalty.
 
Hey it's not a big deal but I played some solo Beowulf tonight versus a friend, I beat him the first round with H chair toss as a reversal and I was then at somewhat of a disadvantage at the beginning of the next round because I couldn't pick up my chair before the next round started. Would it be possible to make it grabbable at all times during round transitions?

This is also a dumb idea but, can his 2K at round transition be the timeout animation where he pulls a string to get his chair back?
 
Hey it's not a big deal but I played some solo Beowulf tonight versus a friend, I beat him the first round with H chair toss as a reversal and I was then at somewhat of a disadvantage at the beginning of the next round because I couldn't pick up my chair before the next round started. Would it be possible to make it grabbable at all times during round transitions?
Wait, you can't? You should be able to...

This is also a dumb idea but, can his 2K at round transition be the timeout animation where he pulls a string to get his chair back?
Nope.
 
Wait, you can't? You should be able to...

Just tested it because I thought maybe I just assumed I couldn't because it was grayed out and no, I couldn't grab it during round transition.
 
Just tested it because I thought maybe I just assumed I couldn't because it was grayed out and no, I couldn't grab it during round transition.
Just tested on PC retail, and I can.
 
I beat him the first round with H chair toss as a reversal and I was then at somewhat of a disadvantage at the beginning of the next round because I couldn't pick up my chair before the next round started. Would it be possible to make it grabbable at all times during round transitions?
The same is the case for Fortune killing with something like Zoom-Nom, where the Head Cooldown still applies during the down and makes you unable to put it back on

In the same vein, if you kill someone, then do Zoom-Nom as a Post-Death Combo, Fortune will drop on the ground to enter her win animation..
but since that needs her head, she will now proceed to just lie on her back for 2 seconds, waiting for the head cooldown to end, and the Game doesn't actually "finish" until that is the case;
Which I presume is unintended

E: Ok perhaps not in the same vein? But for Fortune this is definitely the case
 
4/23 update
General
- FINALLY fixed a longstanding bug that was giving the training dummy 1 extra vulnerable frame after a pushblock before they could take any action. This was ONLY true in training mode, and now it's fixed!
- Fixed a bug with low-velocity sliding knockdowns from assists. Thanks Zevak, you're great!
- Fixed a bug where dummy input playback would mess with reported framedata. OOPS. Thanks CaioLugon.
- Fix tutorial dummy being hit by mids and still making the !! sprite. Thanks Ryin!
- Fixed Ms. Fortune's tutorial, and made the dummy jump vs Painwheel's ground HK Buer in her tutorial. Also thanks Ryin!
- Art Gallery music no longer restarts each time you exit a picture. Thanks Eriiiic!
- Some fixes for NMO Arena effects.
- Fix some loudness issues in Under the Bridge's music.
- Talked to some characters about keeping dat PG-13 rating all up ons, naa mean?

Eliza
- Fix H UpperKhat -> frame-perfect cancel to tiger-knee'd H UpperKhat allowing a jump from the second UpperKhat before it connects, thanks Izzmo!
Filia
- Improved position of L Ringlet and Ringlet Fake assists (not like anyone uses them... :^) Thanks Israel!
Peacock
- Add unused whistle animation as winpose. Random 1/6th of the time, or hold HP to choose it. No sound yet. Thanks render!
RoboFortune
- ALL HER FRAMES ARE CLEAN, even moves she doesn't have yet! (O.o)
- Added the real music for her stage!
- Added some sounds! Yay!
- New colors!
- Her default assists are now s.HP and H Theonite Beam, which make more sense.
- First pass on AI!
- Airthrow properly puts her at Combo Stage 2, thanks Tomo009!
- Heads properly handle Robo going offscreen coming back onscreen, and dying.
- Headrone Impact (head control MK) startup for the head -5f; places itself 50px further forward; explosion now breaks armor.
- Added Headrone RAM (head control LK), a kamikaze attack.
- Added Headrone Salvo (head control HK), kitten missiles/hidden moussles/hidden fishles, take your pick. With 1 head, they come down where the enemy was when they were launched; with 2 heads, they come down where the enemy was when they leave the top of the stage; with 3 heads, they come down where the enemy was when they are about to re-enter the screen. tl;dr More heads = better tracking.
- Headrone commands, when used as an assist, will summon a head (and leave) if called without any heads. LK/MK summon one, and the HK version will summon until there are 3 heads, and will only launch with 3 heads.
- Magnetic Trap magnetism is now more like it should be; and Robo only tries to grab when the K button is released. The grab attempt lasts for 3f.
- Magnetic Trap min-scaled damage 1.5k -> 1.2k, proper damage for a Lv1 that can do what it can do.
 
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been waiting a bit for the update, glad i can get to messing with robo kitty again. Thanks Mike
 
Just tested on PC retail, and I can.

Here's a video of what I'm talking about, showing my inputs. I did it in beta for the recording but it's the same in retail,


Basically the cooldown of the chair lasts throughout the transition and makes it to where I can't actually pick it up until the next round starts. The worst case scenario can hurt him in the following round.


@IsaVulpes Oh yeah, it is the same for fortune, I've always found that end pose pause kind of funny. She does get to put her head back on before the next round starts in solo though, right?
 
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She does get to put her head back on before the next round starts in solo though, right?
If she didn't use it yes; if she killed with something like Zoom-Nom, the 2s cooldown is too long and she doesn't get to recall it during the Downs pause
 
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Basically the cooldown of the chair lasts throughout the transition and makes it to where I can't actually pick it up until the next round starts. The worst case scenario can hurt him in the following round.
Er well yeah, but you got to use the toss to kill 'em. So...not a bug, and not a thing that'll get fixed?
 
Er well yeah, but you got to use the toss to kill 'em. So...not a bug, and not a thing that'll get fixed?

Alright, there's the misunderstanding I needed to get over from the very first two messages. Thanks. It's not even something that will happen often and knowing that Fortune has basically the same problem helps.

It just seems a little strange to me coming from so many other fighting games where ending a round essentially puts both on even grounds other than with meter, sorry for bringing it up.
 
It just seems a little strange to me coming from so many other fighting games where ending a round essentially puts both on even grounds other than with meter, sorry for bringing it up.
If Leilei kills the other person with a Tenrai-ha she is not able to open the next round with a Tenrai-ha because all the balls have not disappeared yet. Etc.
 
- Talked to some characters about keeping dat PG-13 rating all up ons, naa mean?
Nope, ain't got a clue what this means :P Were some character frames revealing a little too much than they should have?
 
You think I'm punishing the majority of the fanbase because I don't want to read some BS that isn't contributing anything?
Not what I was referring to, deciding to remove yourself from that conversation you don't want to see for the sake of your sanity is perfectly logical.
 
I really like the mine changes. They're more useful and easier to see.
 
- Added the real music for her stage!
I like this tune very much. Very catchy.
Peacock
- Add unused whistle animation as winpose. Random 1/6th of the time, or hold HP to choose it. No sound yet. Thanks render!

:PUN:
YES. I've been asking for more win poses for a long time so this is very cool. Also, I'm happy Peacock is finally cutting down on the smokes.
 
A little late, but:
THE HOME STRETCH!

General
- FINALLY fixed a longstanding bug that was giving the training dummy 1 extra vulnerable frame after a pushblock before they could take any action. This was ONLY true in training mode, and now it's fixed!
- Fixed a bug with low-velocity sliding knockdowns from assists. Thanks Zevak, you're great!
- Fixed a bug where dummy input playback would mess with reported framedata. OOPS. Thanks CaioLugon.
- Fix tutorial dummy being hit by mids and still making the !! sprite. Thanks Ryin!
- Fixed Ms. Fortune's tutorial, and made the dummy jump vs Painwheel's ground HK Buer in her tutorial. Also thanks Ryin!
- Art Gallery music no longer restarts each time you exit a picture. Thanks Eriiiic!
- Some fixes for NMO Arena effects.
- Fix some loudness issues in Under the Bridge's music.
- Talked to some characters about keeping dat PG-13 rating all up ons, naa mean?

Eliza
- Fix H UpperKhat -> frame-perfect cancel to tiger-knee'd H UpperKhat allowing a jump from the second UpperKhat before it connects, thanks Izzmo!
Filia
- Improved position of L Ringlet and Ringlet Fake assists (not like anyone uses them... :^) Thanks Israel!
Peacock
- Add unused whistle animation as winpose. Random 1/6th of the time, or hold HP to choose it. No sound yet. Thanks render!
RoboFortune
- ALL HER FRAMES ARE CLEAN, even moves she doesn't have yet! (O.o)
- Added the real music for her stage!
- Added some sounds! Yay!
- New colors!
- Her default assists are now s.HP and H Theonite Beam, which make more sense.
- First pass on AI!
- Airthrow properly puts her at Combo Stage 2, thanks Tomo009!
- Heads properly handle Robo going offscreen coming back onscreen, and dying.
- Headrone Impact (head control MK) startup for the head -5f; places itself 50px further forward; explosion now breaks armor.
- Added Headrone RAM (head control LK), a kamikaze attack.
- Added Headrone Salvo (head control HK), kitten missiles/hidden moussles/hidden fishles, take your pick. With 1 head, they come down where the enemy was when they were launched; with 2 heads, they come down where the enemy was when they leave the top of the stage; with 3 heads, they come down where the enemy was when they are about to re-enter the screen. tl;dr More heads = better tracking.
- Headrone commands, when used as an assist, will summon a head (and leave) if called without any heads. LK/MK summon one, and the HK version will summon until there are 3 heads, and will only launch with 3 heads.
- Magnetic Trap magnetism is now more like it should be; and Robo only tries to grab when the K button is released. The grab attempt lasts for 3f.
- Magnetic Trap min-scaled damage 1.5k -> 1.2k, proper damage for a Lv1 that can do what it can do.
http://steamcommunity.com/games/208610/announcements/detail/208632365236128203
 
Since some people wondered what the PG-13 thing meant: Apparently Pantyshots and the likes are toned down a bit?

This is the one case I could find, but I presume there are more (where it's unavoidable, such as Bella 360 or Para sHK, nothing changed):

Bella new Copter:
j3fj5v2q.jpg

For comparison, Bella old Copter:
mdw6wlvh.png
 
Weird, that's been there since the beginning. Were there complaints? Oh, who am I kidding, there are always complaints.

Also, LOVE the new sound effects on Robo's lasers, esp the mechanical whirring on her laser supers. And the new songs. New songs are amazing.
 
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Noooo! I like that one! It almost makes me like playing against Cerebella!
 
Since some people wondered what the PG-13 thing meant: Apparently Pantyshots and the likes are toned down a bit?

This is the one case I could find, but I presume there are more (where it's unavoidable, such as Bella 360 or Para sHK, nothing changed):

Bella new Copter:
j3fj5v2q.jpg

For comparison, Bella old Copter:
mdw6wlvh.png
Either are fine, the new one just leaves more to the imagination
 
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Noooo! I like that one! It almost makes me like playing against Cerebella!
I don't think its a problem. I assume all the sprites will live on in the digital compendium too.
 
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snip [/spoiler]

if this helps to people that are purist and doesn´t like pantyshots in fighters thats is kind of hiprocite all have a few, just not UNIEL, tought. give another chance to play SG, im okay with this.

I don´t play the game for looking some 2D pantys, its for the gameplay.

PD: I don´t this discuss about art/ fanservice should get here, maybe made another thread ?
 
It's not all bad. We still have something spectacular.

2015-04-23_00002.jpg

And a bunch of others, really.

2015-04-23_00006.jpg
2015-04-23_00007.jpg
2015-04-23_00012.jpg

If anything, it looks like panties are fine, but it's butts that're being blocked.

Huh.
 
Eh, kind of odd to be worried about fanservice this late in the game development cycle. Thought the developer consensus previously was fanservice is ok unless it was considered blatantly pandering for an inappropriate character I.E Filia rejected time out lose pose. Which is why for example Valentine is still such a lewd character and Bella obviously is the kind of character that isn't particularly shy about showing panties/butt since she has been shown to be more lewd before.

I personally don't care about toning down the fanservice since I honestly don't even notice it especially during intense gameplay, but kind of defeats the purpose of toning it down if there is still stuff in this game that is still fanservice content which is still gonna get the game accussed of being "Arcana Hearts Mahvel" and the like. It would be creative to see how a censored landed Excellebella would turn out though.
 
Streisand Effect immenient

Whatever helps from having to pay the esrb from regrading.

(Looks like less underwear now tbh)

Not up for debate, also probably not the right thread to discuss it in detail either.
 
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Weird, that's been there since the beginning. Were there complaints? Oh, who am I kidding, there are always complaints.
I have complained continuously since the game came out and will continue to do so. This is a step in the right direction but give Bella shorts under her skirt like Karin from Alpha 3
 
Hey MAYN, Bella can wear and pose whatever and however she wants. Stop looking at her like that you disgusting misogynist pigs!

Jokes aside, yeah the panty shots and other such things in the game are super over the top in SG.
 
I don't know if Mike is even reading this thread anymore but I have a question about Beowulf's hop dashes. I recall him saying/typing that one of the changes from VSav's hop dashes is that they are not throw invincible. However if the Beowulf does dash lp/lk it will beat throw every time so I'm wondering what the significance of this change is?
 
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I don't know if Mike is even reading this thread anymore but I have a question about Beowulf's hop dashes. I recall him saying/typing that one of the changes from VSav's hop dashes is that they are not throw invincible. However if the Beowulf does dash lp/lk it will beat throw every time so I'm wondering what the significance of this change is?
You can ground throw him out of the hop dash itself, not the jumping normals he can do out of the hop dash.
 
I know that, I'm just wondering why Mike considers it a notable change when hopdash lk is barely a commitment and beats throws anyway.

Were empty hopdashes strong in VSav? I'm sorry I'm exposing myself as a scrub here I'm just genuinely curious.
 
I haven't played enough VSav to know that, sorry! However, if Beowulf's hop dash counted as airborne he would be able to use it for easy chickenblocks (you can block while dashing forward in SG) as well as dodging throws, so it would be a really strong tool.
 
All the robo head commands are interesting, but any chance we could try having them cancel into each other ala peacock george attacks?
 
I haven't played enough VSav to know that, sorry! However, if Beowulf's hop dash counted as airborne he would be able to use it for easy chickenblocks (you can block while dashing forward in SG) as well as dodging throws, so it would be a really strong tool.
This makes total sense. Thank you for the explanation.
 
Yes, give Cerebella's buttcheeks extremely thick lines to cover up the panties.

Make it look like she's wearin' nothin' at all.
 
Eh, kind of odd to be worried about fanservice this late in the game development cycle.
Or possibly it's been on the list forever but we only had a chance to do it now precisely because it IS this late in the development cycle and everything else is done.
It's not very much either way.

Not what I was referring to, deciding to remove yourself from that conversation you don't want to see for the sake of your sanity is perfectly logical.
Well then, what were you referring to?
 
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