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As part of the relaunch of Skullheart, ALL previous threads have been archived. You can find them at the bottom of the forum in the Archives (2021) section.
The archives are locked, so please use the new forum sections to create new discussion threads.
The second part - not all Dagonians being fish people - is an already-known fact since we know that there are non-fish Ferals that have been called Dagonians. For example, Tom is a salamander/axolotl Dagonian. I think the first part, that not all fish people are Dagonians, is more interesting.
The Umbrella thing is also interesting so I kept it in the screenshot but since it's said in a less clear manner I won't add it to the OP.
Entry added:
- Not all fish people are Dagonians, and not all Dagonians are fish people
I think it fits my own theory that Dagonians refers to a place or a group of people, rather than a term for aquatic Ferals as a whole. Dagon, of course, is a sea god from Lovecraft stories Dagon and The Shadow Over Innsmouth. In the stories, Dagon human followers breed with underwater creatures called the Deep Ones to create hybrid monstrosity that can live in underwater cities. Perhaps there is an entity or a place in the SG universe called Dagon where the Dagonians are connected to or derived from.
New entries:
- The hot secretary lady that appears in the Webtoon and the background of Bunny Burrow is called Evelyn Ivy
- The names of Dahlia's bunnies are:
-- The Timeout Assistant Bunny: Bookie
-- The Shotgun Bunny : Bonnie
-- The Pistol Bunny: Buttercup
-- The Knife Bunny: Killer
When I have the time, I'm also planning to rewrite the intro to the first post a bit to update the status of the official stories which now includes the Webtoon. Also gonna try to make it a bit less bloated.
So while I was doing research for the previous post, I got sidetracked into trying to find the backup of the original "canon lore info thread", since a lot of the older information came from there. The unexpected result of my search is gonna be kinda long so I'm breaking this into several sections. Please bear with me lol.
Background
For people who don't remember it (basically everyone who joined this community less than 9 years ago lol), the Skullheart forum had a huge disaster in 2013 where all the data was completely wiped with no backup made. This means every thread, every comment and even user data were lost forever. That's why even the "oldest" members here have join dates in 2013 even though this forum had been around for longer.
One of these threads was "Big Fat General Lore Discussion - What We Know", which is basically the precursor to this thread (the "What We Know" part in this thread name is a tribute to it). Throughout 2013, we had been collecting lore info that were confirmed by Alex and other devs in that thread. After the forum went down, we were able to recover (some of) the first page through Google Cache, but there were 3 pages of info and most of them were lost forever. Unlike my thread, the OP didn't regularly update the first post with new info, but the worst part is that the first post had all the info archived in spoiler tags, the contents of which didn't get cached by Google, so it would have been pointless anyway!
When I originally made this this thread (or at least the previous version of it before the pre-2021 forum got archived), me and a few other fans basically just had to recall items from memory and regurgitated them into the new thread, but obviously we didn't remember a lot of them and I'd given up that the info were pretty much lost.
The Good News (Kinda)
While I was searching, I actually came across a Japanese fan thread on shitaraba.net (https://jbbs.shitaraba.net/bbs/read.cgi/game/54363/1332489387/) (archive URL: https://archive.ph/s9Yd7). It seems that there were English-speaking Japanese fans who were translating what we posted in the Big Fat Lore thread into Japanese for other Japanese fans. These seem to include info from the later pages that I thought had been lost forever. I'm not sure I can quite convey my excitement through text.
So, here they are. I'm not very good at Japanese so I used machine translation and had to edit some wording or spelling.
It's obviously worth to note that these are tertiary sources (translated from Japanese translated from English from forum posts of information confirmed on streams that had been deleted), so the reliability of the info is probably not the highest, but honestly it's not much worse than most of the info already in this thread. Usual disclaimers apply.
- The Medici family once ruled the Kingdom of Canopy, but at some point the Renoirs supplanted them (Already in this thread with slightly different wording)
- [Cerebella] is a circus performer who entertains her fans, pleases her friends, and is devoted to Vitale, the man she loves as her father. (Not significant since it can be pretty much worked out in her bio and story)
- [Cerebella] is a pure and selfless daughter (I think this is supposed to mean young girl), but she ends up benefiting evil. (Same as above)
- If Valentine is an anti-hero who has been driven by her principles, Cerebella is the opposite - she is what we might call an anti-villain. If that's the case, then perhaps it is her destiny to be defeated by Peacock, the hero. (Interesting that Peacock is given example here as the hero)
- The existence of Lab 0 was not made public, and therefore it was possible to conduct unethical experiments. (Already collected)
- Lab 8 specializes in the development of synthetic parasites. Lab 8 specializes in the development of synthetic parasites. (Already collected)
- Parasites are immortal as long as they are parasitic on the host, but they can only live for a short time when they are separated from the host. (Somehow the Parasites being immortal part is not already in this thread even though it's widely known -__-")
- Samson is very bad at keeping his hosts alive. He changes hosts often." (I could have sworn I already had this info in this thread but apparently it's not)
- Hunger eats anything, but spicy food is his favorite. (Already collected)
- Feng is 17 years old. (Already collected)
- It was King Franz who put an end to Queen Nancy. (Already known)
- It is undetermined whether Franz's umbrella is the umbrella of death or the umbrella of conquest. (Already known)
- Yu-wan has a brother named Shumai. (Already collected)
- Adam's last name is Kapowski. (Already collected)
- It is no coincidence that both Isaac and Aeon can manipulate time; they are related.
- The fact that the Lab 8 kid was in danger or that the big band needed help is the story of Ileum. Ileum's story is that she decides to join the fight.
- Aeon's torso can rotate.
- The details of Panzerfaust's past have yet to be established. (Sorta outdated due to SGM main story)
- The mother goddess may also have a parasite, but Alex was not forthcoming.
- Annie has beaten Skullgirl in the past. She has also drawn with double.
- Black Dahlia and Ottomo are both major figures in the mafia. (Already known)
- Black Dahlia is not very fond of Ottomo, but they have a good [working?] relationship.
- Patricia has also worked as a maid. (Outdated as discussed in previous post)
- Marie is 14 years old. (Outdated)
- According to official information, synthetic parasites are extremely difficult to mass produce. Natural parasites are impossible to reproduce.
- As long as they are parasitic on humans, they can live semi-permanently, but they cannot produce offspring. Samson, for example, has a big appetite but no sex drive.
- The production team said Hungern is more powerful than Krieg, which is why Parasoul gave Hungern to Umbrella. (More-or-less outdated as of Umbrella's story establishing the reason why Hungern was given to her)
- Parasoul is called the Warrior Princess of Steel. However, compared to Valentine, she is not as fierce. (Kind of weird term {鋼鉄戦姫 - machine translated to warrior princess of steel}. Without the original English I'm not too comfortable to use it)
- There used to be several ninja nurse units, but all but the Last Hope have already disappeared.
- This is because the transplantation of synthetic parasites is extremely dangerous, and the mortality rate of the patient is high.
- In contrast to Lab 0, Lab 8 is often regarded as a benign entity. They may be mad scientists after all. (?)
- According to the official information derived from the live broadcast, theonite is a kind of element. (Already collected)
- One of the original ASG labs was [inspired by] the CIA's MK Ultra project, specifically Lab 7. That's the department where Valentine and Brain Drain were from.
- Umbrellas are 10-11 years old (Already confirmed)
- Leduc is 14-16 years old (Possibly outdated since newer info says he's "about 16")
- The grand war lasted about 10 years before it ended 7 years ago. (Already known)
- Hurting is not a Living weapon, but a very sturdy chair. (Already collected)
- Grendel's mother and Scythana are not related.
- At least Delilah was a very important host for Samson, he said. (Already collected)
- Alex thinks that "Valentine" is a code name and that her real name is Valerie. However, he is not sure and will reconsider. (Outdated since Valentine's real name is confirmed)
A lot of these info are probably things you might have seen floating around the fandom before. Most likely they were also independently collected from the old thread or the original streams, I just hadn't verified them previously.
If anyone is good with Japanese, please feel free to check the thread and let me know if anything is not accurate or if I have missed anything.
New Info added to OP
Based on the above and comparing with what I already have on this thread, I will be adding the below entries to the first post. There are some entries I'm quite sure about since they have been collaborated by English-speaking fans, so I'm marking the ones that don't seem as well-collaborated with notes so people can make their own decisions:
Filia & Samson:
- Samson is very bad at keeping his hosts alive. He changes hosts often.
- Since Parasites cannot produce offsprings, Samson, for example, has a big appetite but no sex drive. (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
Cerebella:
- If Valentine is an anti-hero who has been driven by her principles, Cerebella is the opposite - she is what we might call an anti-villain. If that's the case, then perhaps it is her destiny to be defeated by Peacock, the hero. (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
Annie:
- Annie has fought Double to a stalemate
Black Dahlia:
- Black Dahlia is not very fond of Ottomo, but they have a good [working?] relationship. (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
Isaac:
- It is no coincidence that both Isaac and Aeon can manipulate time; they are connected. (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
Ileum:
- Ileum's story is that she decides to join the fight, as the Lab 8 kids are in danger or that Big Band needs help (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
Scythana:
- Grendel's mother and Scythana are not related. (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
Aeon:
- Aeon's torso can rotate (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
Parasites:
- Parasites are immortal as long as they are connected to a host, but cannot produce offsprings
- Synthetic Parasites are extremely difficult to mass produce. Natural Parasites are impossible to reproduce. (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
- The transplantation of Synthetic Parasites is extremely dangerous, and the mortality rate of the patient is high. (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
The Trinity:
- The Mother goddess may also have a Parasite, but Alex was not forthcoming with details. (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
ASG Labs:
- There used to be several ninja nurse units, but all but the Last Hope have already disappeared (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
- In contrast to Lab 0, Lab 8 is often regarded as a benign entity (Achieved from old lore thread by Japanese community)
- Lab 7 was inspired by the CIA's MK Ultra experiment
A bit of cool info revealed last week I didn't get around to posting, so here it is.
Adding to Fortune's entry on the first post:
- The names of the Fishbone Gang members are Eli (the eel with an apron), Toady (pufferfish with bandana), Sinker (eyepatch guy with hook on his lip), Leon (open shirt guy) and Nadia
EDIT: As BallotBoxer pointed out, the Webtoon spells the pufferfish's name as "Toady", which should be the correct spelling since it appears in the story. So we'll go with that unless later stated otherwise.
The names of the Fishbone Gang members are Eli (the eel with an apron), Toadie (pufferfish with bandana), Sinker (eyepatch guy with hook on his lip), Leon (open shirt guy) and Nadia
Can't believe I lived to see that information. Really.
The Fishbone Gang, from left to right: Leon = lionfish Dagonian Eli = eel Dagonian (maybe part catfish? look at those long barbels) Toady = pufferfish Dagonian Sinker = piranha Dagonian Nadia = feline Feral
Note: Cellsai called him "Toadie" but the webtoon has "Toady." Which should we go with?
The Fishbone Gang, from left to right: Leon = lionfish Dagonian Eli = eel Dagonian (maybe part catfish? look at those long barbels) Toady = pufferfish Dagonian Sinker = piranha Dagonian Nadia = feline Feral
Nice! I was trying to identify Leon and Sinker's fish species but couldn't figure it out at first glance. Seem to be correct to me. Sinker is the only one I'm not 100% sure about because his body shape is generic enough that it could fit with something else.
Eli is definitely meant to be an eel especially given his name, but yeah, the barbels are very catfish like. Very similar to Yu-Wan's who is a catfish Dagonian, and he's even wearing an apron. Perhaps they are related?
I'm willing to cash in on the "Eli = eel" idea, but I'd like to complicate matters by pointing out that there is such thing as "eel-tail catfish", and they do have barbels.
There are also "cusk-eels" (which are not "true" eels, apparently), some species of which share the trait of barbels too.
I'm willing to cash in on the "Eli = eel" idea, but I'd like to complicate matters by pointing out that there is such thing as "eel-tail catfish", and they do have barbels.
There are also "cusk-eels" (which are not "true" eels, apparently), some species of which share the trait of barbels too.
Hmm interesting. I looked them up and cusk-eels are definitely a possibility since they actually do have long bodies sort of like a true eel. Eel-tail catfish though just look like a catfish with a different tail lol, so that's probably not it.
But yeah, Eli = Eel definitely makes sense from the SG-style naming scheme. Same with Leon = Lionfish (Leon actually meaning lion in Greek). A toadie or a toadfish is a type of pufferfish so that also makes sense (note that the spelling is the same that Cellsai used, not his name as spelled in the Webtoon lol).
Sinker is the only one whose name doesn't seem to link back to his species, as I think it refers to the fishing equipment. Or... maybe it does? Perhaps he's supposed to be some sort of bottom feeder fish, and "sinker" refers to the fact they stay close to the bottom of the water.
The physical copy is in Japanese but it also comes with a digital copy in English. Using EMS shipping option, it arrived to my place in SEA within a couple of weeks, and the buying experience on the website was very smooth.
So you might be wondering what the hell this has to do with lore. Well, the book has an exclusive interview with Alex Ahad, where he actually reveals a couple of lore tidbits that had never been revealed publicly anywhere else before. Apart from the cool fanarts printed on very high quality paper, you also get that, as well as an exclusive interview with Kira Buckley.
Since I got my copy, I have been two-minded about whether I should post the lore info on this thread or not. On one hand, it is publicly revealed info, but on the other, it's printed exclusively in the artbook, and the interview was one of the reasons I decided to get it. It's a very good product and I do want to support the artists by encouraging people to buy it.
After some thought, I decided that I'll wait a couple more months and let people have a chance to get the book themselves and read the interview first-hand, if they are interested, then I'll post the info here later.
Finally, it's worth to note that Alex isn't involved with Skullgirls development anymore, and any information he reveals might not be reflected in the current version of the lore, which he himself said as much in the interview. As with any other info found on this thread, things are always subject to change, so they need to be taken with a touch of caution. But it's still very interesting to see the intention and evolution of the stories and characters, even if they become outdated.
I love Kuroirozuki, but damn he saved me a little trouble if he put the English translations (or de-translations) in the book instead of the digital only.
I love Kuroirozuki, but damn he saved me a little trouble if he put the English translations (or de-translations) in the book instead of the digital only.
I guess printing the book in both Japanese and English or having separate versions would have cost them more money. The artbook was probably primarily intended for the Japanese fanbase so they decided to go with Japanese as the primary version.
But yeah, having the digital version is actually useful for me because I can easily refer back to it for the interviews, and not needing to pull out the book to reread it lol.
Cool lore drop related to Panzerfaust. Not super unexpected since we've seen concept arts of several Panzer-like soldiers, but it's good to have it confirmed that it still exists in the lore.
New entry added under Panzerfaust
- Panzerfaust is the specific name to the character who hangs out with Parasoul, but there are other surviving tank-handed soldiers with their own names. The original draft for Squigly's Origin Story actually featured a different one, but it was changed to Panzerfaust to avoid confusion with introducing another NPC
So this was something confirmed a while ago and it's one of those things that I thought was already obvious so not something I need to document. But It was recently pointed out to me that this fact is not as obvious to everyone else as it is to me, so I'm adding it to the list.
New item added under the Skull Heart:
- Skullgirls always manifest every 7 years, but the Skull Heart can appear before that. Which is why Queen Nancy was carrying it for years before she turned into the Skullgirl
Note: the forum seems to be having some issues and I can't update the second post
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