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Skullgirls Beta Aug 5th Patch Discussion

missingno said:
Any reason why? Changing inputs will be very confusing to players who aren't paying close attention to every patch note, so it's generally not something that should be done unless there's a very good reason for it.
You are going to blame peoples' lack of reading patch notes for a game they want to get good at as a reason not to patch something?

missingno said:
I don't see how it even makes any sense. Alpha counter out of blockstun is f+MP+MK/HP+HK, why would alpha counter out of burst use a different input?
That would presumably change with it since it's the alpha counter being changed in the programming. It will stay consistent.
 
MegamanDS said:
Maybe I wasn't clear... When you want to counter in during a burst, make it lp+mk instead of the current lp+lk

EDIT: I now understand what you are saying. So wouldn't that make my point even more relevant? I'm asking it to change to assist call since you get their assist. Currently, it's programmed to QCF + tag
Okay, now I understand what you mean. You're talking about changing the input, not changing the move that happens when you alpha counter the burst. I guess it would be more intuitive that way, since you're inputting assist and you're getting that character's assist. I'm inclined to agree with missingno, though. Forward+tag has been the input for a while and it's what people are used to, I don't think it's a good idea to change it this late into the game.
 
MegamanDS said:
You are going to blame peoples' lack of reading patch notes for a game they want to get good at as a reason not to patch something?
I'm not saying inputs should never ever change. I'm saying they should only do so if there's a very good reason for it, which you haven't given.
 
MegamanDS said:
I agree, no need to change anything with bursts as far as indicators go. You as a player should know when it's the right time to burst.

The 2 things I would like to see with burst though are:

1. During burstable times, I would like the burstee to be able to hold forward and press any button to burst. If the burstee is holding forward, then the opponent flys TOWARD me instead of away from me.

2. Make alpha counter on burst "assist call" instead of "tag".


Don't like the first one from an offensive standpoint. There are often times I wanna put myself away from the opponent when they burst. Especially, since it would be a gold burst which means they can push buttons. I have a distinct feeling that would actually lead to "Burst starter conversions" unless you specifically change burst so that it couldn't do that. Especially since burst has Alpha counter too which means burst>AC>BEEEEAAAATTTT. Also what does that do about crossunder gburst setups?

From a defensive standpoint I already got 123819273127381237 options on defense anyway so I don't really think that another one is necessary.

Second one I'm meh about. It would be fine cause you are using the assist as the input but as far a general themes go it flows well as it is now. That and I don't AC enough anyway for it to change how I play dramatically.
 
Hammerschmidt said:
I never said that you were a fool, although I did come across quite harsh, sorry about that. I just genuinely believe that it is a simple concept that doesn't have an issue to be addressed. I'm a newcomer to traditional fighting games as well, and I figured out pretty quickly the different types of bursts and how IPS works, etc.

I wasn't aiming to pick a fight either, (Been through enough of those on Sonic forums, omg.) so it's all good. It really is a simple concept, but there's no in-depth explanation for it in the game, and the one suggestion Mike wanted to take won't work because of the PS3's limitations. All I can really do about it is shrug and adapt.
 
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WarpedEcho said:
Is there a reason why squigly cr hp causes knockdown on air hit? Wouldn't it make more sense for it to pull down to make confirms into chord and other stuff more consistent?
I didn't know this until this morning but apparently this only happens on the 4th hit, so you can catch them with chord if you cancel on an earlier hit.
 
Lawnba said:
When you use Hp in a button dash or an assist call with headless Fortune could it perhaps not activate the head? I would like to play Peacock with headless Fortune but the button layout I use for Peacock gets in the way of headless.
stick IAD/Dash. this was something i ran into with pad since i use MP+HP for button IAD.

if that's not an option for you, maybe hold HP when you do the input?
 
This may not be super important since the move might not be final, but Peacock's new punch-y LK Teleport can't be super-cancelled at any point. It's the only special I can name that's like that, and it was copied from her tag-in, so it doesn't sound like this is intentional to me.

Either way, I freaking love this move (it feels more fun and less abuse-able to me than the backwards teleport), but I'm also mildly disappointed at the lack of potential shenanigans.
 
hilaryyy said:
stick IAD/Dash. this was something i ran into with pad since i use MP+HP for button IAD.

if that's not an option for you, maybe hold HP when you do the input?
holding HP doesn't really help because the head will keep moving now. I'll just have to get used to dashing with the D-pad instead of button dashing when I play headless.
 
ProtagonistHero said:
This may not be super important since the move might not be final, but Peacock's new punch-y LK Teleport can't be super-cancelled at any point. It's the only special I can name that's like that, and it was copied from her tag-in, so it doesn't sound like this is intentional to me.

Either way, I freaking love this move (it feels more fun and less abuse-able to me than the backwards teleport), but I'm also mildly disappointed at the lack of potential shenanigans.
can you super cancel teleports?
 
You can't super cancel Wolf Shoot past like frame 4.
Lawnba said:
idk if you are referring to my post or if you are even serious? and if you are I did do a good amount research.
I was talking to somebody else.
 
Broken Loose said:
You can't super cancel Wolf Shoot past like frame 4.
Who is this in response to? :S
(You should quote people)
Oh, nevermind I see now you were saying they exist.
Yeah you can't cancel command grabs into supers because Excellabella > 360 was really dumb and Wulf Shoot > Anti Air grab would also be really dumb.
 
ProtagonistHero said:
This may not be super important since the move might not be final, but Peacock's new punch-y LK Teleport can't be super-cancelled at any point. It's the only special I can name that's like that, and it was copied from her tag-in, so it doesn't sound like this is intentional to me.

Either way, I freaking love this move (it feels more fun and less abuse-able to me than the backwards teleport), but I'm also mildly disappointed at the lack of potential shenanigans.
Adding onto this the move also deals zero chip damage.

And for some reason every time I do the attack in training mode I get different frame data I don't know what to make of it.
 
Can headless fortune lose the head hurtboxes on her jab?
 
Don't like Peacock teleporting fullscreen and to be invincibly in front of me while dropping a disjointed projectile I have to hold.

L Teleport is really unsafe, but it can be very + if you drop the shadow late so that makes sense, it's the better AA / jump in call out option compared to Fake Tele + Item Drop.
cLK, cMP, L Teleport + Shadow drops I think solve the issues that she was suffering from which is having more tools to deal with the opponent once they're close.

Fullscreen teleport then Item Drop is a step in the wrong direction and just feels like improving something that didn't need to be adjusted.
She has to make a choice on how she wants to escape once they are closer, but moving towards the opponent uncontested because she's nearing the corner and then being plus feels very strong.

Everything else is cool.
 
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I have a question. So, Peacock has effectively 3 bombs now. Alongside, having Lenny (for a bar) block projectiles and has item drop and LK/MK teleport. Is there a reason as to why the feint still spawns a bomb on the ground at your location? Could it just be a way to teleport in place instead of also pretty much being another bomb on the screen?

Just some initial thoughts.
 
Early peacock impressions:

-Haven't had a chance to try out j.LP very much in a match. Speed and hitbox adjustment is nice but the extended vulnerable area totally removes burstbaits she used to have.

-New LK teleport is interesting. Can actually use it as an antiair and it seems like I can make it safe with a held shadow.

-MK teleport + holding a shadow seems really really strong. Don't think its necessary.

-c.MP combo'ing into HK is nice. Thanks.

-I'm getting a tiiiiiiny bit less damage on average with the argus change it seems. About 100 or so? HP Bang > argus might finally be better than MP Bang > argus though. I do get more damage in the corner now typically though which is nice.

-Lenny changes are nice.

EDIT: Would be it possible to to extend the very first hitbox of LK george closer to peacock? Currently, peacock can only do a meterless conversion from a grab if she has her back to the wall with LK George. If she is facing towards it and gets a grab, she is forced to use meter to convert because LK george hurtbox starts beyond where the opponent is. It's just weird to me that you get a meterless conversion from being in a disadvantageous position but not from the advantageous one.
 
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Re: New Training mode stuff
I found a bug where if you do a combo, then end in snap, it won't show the last accumulated Drama (undizzy) value of your last combo.

And I still don't know how the rounding works for damage scaling.
It doesn't seem to matter whether I round to 3 decimal places or if I just let the whole number rock.

For simplicity, I'll use an example with Ms. Fortune doing 5LP~LP > 5LK > 5MK > 5HK at x1.00 damage with only using up to 3 decimal points for the scaling itself, and this is what I get in excel:
Code: 
Scaling - Base DMG - Calculated Dmg (Rounded Down) - Calculated Dmg (no rounding) - Actual Damage
0.875     270                     236                      236.25                      236
0.766     360                     275                      275.76                      276
0.670     270                     180                      180.90                      180
0.586     315                     184                      184.59                      185
0.513     540                     277                      277.02                      277
I have no idea why it rounds down on the 180.9, but rounds up on the 184.59 and the 275.76.
 
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Liam said:
Who is this in response to? :S
(You should quote people)
Oh, nevermind I see now you were saying they exist.
Yeah you can't cancel command grabs into supers because Excellabella > 360 was really dumb and Wulf Shoot > Anti Air grab would also be really dumb.
Sorry; there were so many posts I was quoting at once that I just ended up deleting them all and throwing caution to the wind.

Masqman said:
I have a question. So, Peacock has effectively 3 bombs now. Alongside, having Lenny (for a bar) block projectiles and has item drop and LK/MK teleport. Is there a reason as to why the feint still spawns a bomb on the ground at your location? Could it just be a way to teleport in place instead of also pretty much being another bomb on the screen?

Just some initial thoughts.
She's always had this, except now Lenny is as useful in neutral as he was intended to be. If fake teleport didn't have the bomb, there'd be no use for it. It'd just be a way for a Peacock player to make a gap in her zoning pattern for a potential mixup better done with M teleport. Or, I guess, just a way to punish Peacock players for blowing their execution during a teleport while using an item or assist with imperfect timing.

That reminds me, does having block sparks appear on Lenny for friendly projectiles that hit him sound appealing? What about just having him flash like when when a hit is absorbed by armor?
 
Broken Loose said:
Sorry; there were so many posts I was quoting at once that I just ended up deleting them all and throwing caution to the wind.


She's always had this, except now Lenny is as useful in neutral as he was intended to be. If fake teleport didn't have the bomb, there'd be no use for it. It'd just be a way for a Peacock player to make a gap in her zoning pattern for a potential mixup better done with M teleport. Or, I guess, just a way to punish Peacock players for blowing their execution during a teleport while using an item or assist with imperfect timing.

I'm asking because all this other stuff is extremely good, now why does she need the feint bomb. I see your point. I don't agree, but I can at least see the reasoning. Meh...I feel like it's unnecessary but w/e.
 
Masqman said:
I'm asking because all this other stuff is extremely good, now why does she need the feint bomb. I see your point. I don't agree, but I can at least see the reasoning. Meh...I feel like it's unnecessary but w/e.
What's wrong with the feint bomb? It's by large her least oppressive projectile.
 
Masqman said:
I'm asking because all this other stuff is extremely good, now why does she need the feint bomb. I see your point. I don't agree, but I can at least see the reasoning. Meh...I feel like it's unnecessary but w/e.
If you feel it's unnecessary, then that's a good reason to buff Fire in the Hole! as opposed to outright removing it from the game.

As it so stands, it does very little to aid Peacock's weaknesses while only slightly reinforcing Peacock's strengths. If Peacock were able to do semi-permanent lockdown mechanically, it would be super cool, but as it stands it only tests opponents who don't know how to pbgc, call assist, or alpha counter.
 
Broken Loose said:
If you feel it's unnecessary, then that's a good reason to buff Fire in the Hole! as opposed to outright removing it from the game.

As it so stands, it does very little to aid Peacock's weaknesses while only slightly reinforcing Peacock's strengths. If Peacock were able to do semi-permanent lockdown mechanically, it would be super cool, but as it stands it only tests opponents who don't know how to pbgc, call assist, or alpha counter.
You can also just throw it or jump in and the bomb whiffs.

Fake teleport is a really weird move to have any gripes with.
 
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My initial impressions on Peacock changes by just messing around in training mode is very similar to iLink's Remikz's thoughts.
•J.lp feels nice though I personally didn't notice a change in my j.lp burst baits, I didn't try against every character though.
•I'm happy that c.mp links into s.hk now, I'll have a go to anti air string that seems reliable currently.
•The argus change is interesting, I get about the same amount of damage and I seem to get better argus damage in the corner. Tested in both versions and seemed to get similar amounts when I argused from MP/HP bang, s.hk and such. I did notice it actually gives Peacock an extra hundred or two in chip damage which I'm more happy about than anything as argus chipping has been getting harder as of late.
•Need to practice more with Lenny to see just how good it is in certain matchups.
•L teleport is amusing for sure, with M item it's probably a very good anti air now.
•I think the M teleport with item out is a bit too strong especially as I can hold M item to scare people from wanting to approach then at any time teleport in their face with a level 2/3 item to threaten with. And worst of all I actually don't like the item drop scaling that comes with this haha, it is needed with the whole M teleport thing, I agree. But it actually costs me quite a bit of damage considering lv 2 item was(and probably still is) her most reliable way to get a starting hit.

PS: Still waiting anxiously to see if anything becomes of her level 3 =p
 
Oh wow I have over 10 pages to catch up on. Welp, that was my day. For Robo-Fortune, I tried to pick her up because I thought she was supposed to be an alternate option to Zoning that isn't Peacock. Peacock was my first attempt at finding a main. I could not figure out for the life of my how to make her work. I'm a casual scrub so the only thing I can really figure out how to use with Robot is beam spam with an odd missile barrage, but her zoning felt kind of weak. Her melee game also felt really strong for a zoner. I'm excited to see all of this hit retail since I haven't really gotten a strong grasp on her anyway.

ProtagonistHero said:
And as long as adding that stuff to training mode is still possible, I might as well throw this out: would it be possible to see how much super meter each character has as a numerical value? I'm just generally curious about metergain values for stuff and like the idea of being able to compare combos without just eyeballing some screenshots.

Just think it'd be cool, that's all.

Meter isn't stored as an integer. It's stored as a floating point decimal due to the fact that meter gain undergoes scaling so that the longer your combo, the less meter you gain and the more meter your opponent gains. Implementing this would require a maximum amount of visible decimal values. This would be nice though. Last I checked the Shoryuken wiki was really outdated for some characters and is still missing a ton of info for others. That's not even talking about Beta changes. That's talking about just keeping up with retail.
 
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Bug:
When sage was at my dorm playing me with peacock today, his argus agony set of ths ips on my assist?
Weirdest thing ive ever seen. My point died it was crazy and then a bunch of red sparks on my assist
 
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So are universal instant double jump overheads staying or can I not worry about having to practice that
 
Squigly's Raging Demon still requires both seria charges as a DHC. Is that intentional?

Also while charging Dragon Breath's the default assist macros work and call assists but when charging Sepernt's Tail only the default Assist 2 macro works. The default Assist 1 macro stance cancels.
 
Is there any way that Fukua's M shadow could always put the opponent directly in front of her after a c.mp, c.hp, m shadow hold, c.hk. The reason I ask is because that string is super inconsistent and it makes trying to micro dash into a s.lk difficult due to which way the shadow tosses the opponent. I don't know if I'm the only person having trouble with this.
 
A suggestion--

Have you ever tried Parasoul's LK detonate be changed to a 623+LK motion?
I can just picture this being really fun to control space with tears and detonations.
 
That might make it so you can detonate too easily in neutral, considering you get a confirm off detonate
 
Dagwood said:
A suggestion--

Have you ever tried Parasoul's LK detonate be changed to a 623+LK motion?
I can just picture this being really fun to control space with tears and detonations.

But she can already do that
 
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Lenny is actually a pretty cool super to use in neutral now. It makes the Peacock mirror match pretty derpy though because the other peacock can't do anything so they end up also putting down a Lenny and then it gets crazy.
 
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is there a reason when Peacock ends her first ground chain with item drop it immediately sends you to stage 5 in a combo, and doesn't allow another chain if your undizzy is full? this has been bothering me for a long time.
 
Lawnba said:
is there a reason when Peacock ends her first ground chain with item drop it immediately sends you to stage 5 in a combo, and doesn't allow another chain if your undizzy is full? this has been bothering me for a long time.
Doesn't do that for me, post an example video.
 
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