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Skullgirls PC Beta Updates Discussion

:QCB:KKK is always an option, but for some reason Mike thinks pressing 3 Kicks at once is super hard to do, dnno. Maybe an issue on Pad?

:QCB:KK+K/P might also work (so QCB-KK and any other button at the same time), dunno if that would overlap with anything

:D::D::D::KK: definitely sounds very weird, but I don't have the Beta atm so I can't tell whether it's actually hard or just silly looking; :D::D::KK::KK::KK: for old Pinion Dash never felt any difficult
 
qcb KKK is not an option because it overlaps with qcb KK, and no-one needs more "EX Came out instead of Ultra".

qcb K+P doesn't make sense for Double's level 5, because it doesn't interact with team mechanics in any way. Val's level 5 does, so it makes sense for revive to be like a "super tag".

22KK instead of 222KK sounds reasonable to me though, but it might cause some people to accidentally get it while doing other things but I personally don't ever remember accidentally getting a 22 input that I didn't want in a game.
 
3 kicks is really obnoxious on pad, I hate them
 
Hi I'm going to talk.

I think monster should be 22KK.
2 Is down and monster slides into the ground.
It's like

2, oh yeah squats hmmm mm I'm going to slide into the ground

2, ohm almost done here I go going to slide into the ground and make a monster thing
KK, see I told you for real I was going to do the thing. Now I'm the floor.

Also being able to Anti air a jump in with Maoi is dope but hitting 2, 3 times leaves you open to highs.
I think melty characters place traps with 22 since it's more of a not in the heat of battle input.
 
LP.Bang will still be shit

The move this matters for is Reflect..
Now I can get a decent 8.2-8.4k damage off LP Bang for 1 meter and no assist which is nice.

Also not sure if this is intentional or not but Peacock can now end her combo into LP Bang > untechable grab, although the timing is really tight if the opponent shakes out of stagger.
 
360 is way more complicated than half circles. I don't know what's the problem. I can do half circles with pad without a worry. Don't know about sticks.
Anyway, she could also have :QCB::HP::HK: like Val.


It is a complicated issue. But i also agree with sage and mike and most fg players also hate half circle moves.

For reasons that arent in sg, as well as other things some of the reasons are:

Half circle x2 inputs being exceptionally hard to do on fast reaction and inexplicably being on AA supers such as sims super in ST.

Doing them from a canceled low move being a pain in general having to either do a mid motion style of cancel (412k,36p as an example) or having to do a straight cancel via (2k,541236p) or (2k,141236p) types of inputs.


Plus half circle moves for whatever oddball reason being on neutral game moves that are odd to have them or in blockstring moves that are odd to have them.

Whereas with 360 command grabs, most of the time they will be done via a blockstring or poke so much of their execution is hidden by simply being able to do a circle on the joystick while in hitstop.

Also 360s are and have always been more forgiving with missing a diagonal whereas with half circles, if you miss the 1 or 3 diagonal and get all the other directions, you wont get a half circle move.


All in all they were just a huge pain to deal with in capcom games because of many of the aforementioned issues plus capcoms weirdo mechanics regarding them and the kinds of moves they were used on.

Few of us that had half circle moves on characters that could have had qcf instead, want half circles back. They really were "that bad"

But some people were fine with them, the majority from what i knew though hated them.
 
Now I can get a decent 8.2-8.4k damage off LP Bang for 1 meter and no assist which is nice.

Also not sure if this is intentional or not but Peacock can now end her combo into LP Bang > untechable grab, although the timing is really tight if the opponent shakes out of stagger.
HOLY SHIT CHECK THIS PROPHET HERE.
Man peacock vortex play style might have to look into that.
 
triple down inputs are also like the easiest thing in the world compared to half circles or 360's.
 
can we have quadruple pretzel motions?

or maybe criminal symphony inputs?
 
Hi I'm going to talk.

I think monster should be 22KK.
2 Is down and monster slides into the ground.
It's like

2, oh yeah squats hmmm mm I'm going to slide into the ground

2, ohm almost done here I go going to slide into the ground and make a monster thing
KK, see I told you for real I was going to do the thing. Now I'm the floor.

Also being able to Anti air a jump in with Maoi is dope but hitting 2, 3 times leaves you open to highs.
I think melty characters place traps with 22 since it's more of a not in the heat of battle input.

*shrug* Kinda like how it is now :/


Now I can get a decent 8.2-8.4k damage off LP Bang for 1 meter and no assist which is nice.

Also not sure if this is intentional or not but Peacock can now end her combo into LP Bang > untechable grab, although the timing is really tight if the opponent shakes out of stagger.

lmao so its like, yo. Land this throw or die for going for it, no?
 
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can we have quadruple pretzel motions?

or maybe criminal symphony inputs?
Trying to separate the men from the boys huh?

We may as well go full circle and get some old mortal combat babality and humiliations as weall as samurai showdown motions going on.


Samurai showdown... Omg what an input nightmare of a game... Literal triple 360's with a dp motion or 2 added on for the wtf factor and ground roll was 11 or 33.. Wtf that game.
 
Hi I'm going to talk.

I think monster should be 22KK.
2 Is down and monster slides into the ground.
It's like

2, oh yeah squats hmmm mm I'm going to slide into the ground

2, ohm almost done here I go going to slide into the ground and make a monster thing
KK, see I told you for real I was going to do the thing. Now I'm the floor.

Also being able to Anti air a jump in with Maoi is dope but hitting 2, 3 times leaves you open to highs.
I think melty characters place traps with 22 since it's more of a not in the heat of battle input.

I have a hard time with Monster and the Moai change because I'm one of those people that remembers supers as the bigger/EX version of the special. In this case, it's weird because Monster is kind of like the super fleshstep and Moai is the super item crash, and both are going to use a 214KK with the logic I've used up 'til now.

I'd rather the Monster be the 22KK mostly because it's the newer of the two, but also because if people are legitimately using it to cancel specials with longer recoveries (i.e., fridge) and continue the combo from there with more movement/normals, the faster input is nice.
 
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lmao so its like, yo. Land this throw or die for going for it, no?

Yeah does anyone know the actual frame advantage if they shake out of stagger? Felt like it might have been a 1 or 2 frame link.

Or I'm just bad

Or both

EDIT: Actually, its way more lenient than I first thought. I was just being bad.

EDIT: Hmm... are you immune to grabs sooner after a stagger than you are to hits? After LP Bang, I can wait longer to hit with MP compared to grab even though grab is like twice as fast.
 
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I dunno you could just... use LP bang and set up a mixup off of the stagger?
 
You are missing the point though
 
Man peacock vortex play style might have to look into that.

Immediate training rooming with Throw->Item drop left/right->call H Hairball afterwards for ease of conversion and lockdown->s.LP c.MK c.HP xx L Bang, throw gets 4k at max undizzy off of each rep. Pretty respectable.

You can get L Bang->throw when stagger escape is on easily. It doesn't feel very strict, I could get it like 5x in a row with no practise.
 
EDIT: Hmm... are you immune to grabs sooner after a stagger than you are to hits? After LP Bang, I can wait longer to hit with MP compared to grab even though grab is like twice as fast.

Yep, there's like 10-15 frames at the end of the stagger animation which are normal hitstun frames that aren't throwable but normal attacks will still combo.
 
Yep, there's like 10-15 frames at the end of the stagger animation which are normal hitstun frames that aren't throwable but normal attacks will still combo.
which is why pummel horse into 360 or MGR doesn't work when shaked, btw.
 
Played some beta for like half an hour. I really really like this change to staggers but I feel like it's probably not staying because it is absurdly good. Being able to end my combo with throw and go for my throw mixups, which are probably better than my non-throw mixups, was really cool to be able to do. Like everyone else except I guess ClarenceMage I had trouble linking a throw after L Bang consistently and died for it several times, but with practice I think I could do it consistently. I don't know what the actually advantage is but it feels like a 3 frame link which is very possible to get every time with practice.
 
I'm just thinking of Beowulf when I see this change.
 
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I'm just thinking of Beowulf when I see this change.
Possibly? Although if that was the main reason for the change, there could be an exception just to Beowulf's grabs or something. And I was thinking about this earlier today, I don't think anyone else even really gets anything cool out of being able to normal throw someone in stagger. It is kind of useful for Squigly? But like that's all I could think of, and it isn't nearly as useful for Squigly as it is for Peacock. I can't help thinking the primary purpose of the change was to help Peacock, since it's incredible for her, but with anyone else it's hard to take advantage of.
 
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So far, I'm liking the sound of the new chicken blocking.

New stagger stuff lets peacock end combos in LP bang > throw and she can actually combo into her level 3!!!
 
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I dont like that upback blocks high, sorry. I dont mind that upback doesnt get hit by assists though... Cant there be like a happy medium?

The last thing this game needs is a hyper buff to upback when half the game is upback anyways.

-edit.

This also makes downback plus assist and upback plus assist even better... Which isnt something i would think would be good for the game when down back plus assist and look for the high is already so good against so many characters.
 
I'm no longer getting random L Extend confirms because I hit people when they were upbacking, so the new blocking change has successfully made the game less dumb.

YESSS I'm so happy right now
 
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Possibly? Although if that was the main reason for the change, there could be an exception just to Beowulf's grabs or something.
I could see you getting less time in grab mode after stagger like chairless s.hp or otg c.mk
 
I dont like that upback blocks high, sorry. I dont mind that upback doesnt get hit by assists though... Cant there be like a happy medium?

The last thing this game needs is a hyper buff to upback when half the game is upback anyways.

-edit.

This also makes downback plus assist and upback plus assist even better... Which isnt something i would think would be good for the game when down back plus assist and look for the high is already so good against so many characters.
Then do more lows? The critical weakness of upbacking was always you risk getting hit by lows into an unscaled combo. I always thought getting hit in pre-jump with stuff like Bomber or L Extend was always really stupid anyway.
 
Yeah at first I was like

"wow my jump aerial doesn't stop them from upbacking into the air anymore"

then it was like

"wow he is getting hit low for days"

Also I wish I had a dollar for everytime Beat Extend or Peacock's everything hit me when I was just trying to jump back.
 
Yeah I'm not really a fan of making up+back better. I was never really bothered by getting hit out of my pre-jump frames in the first place.

Then again I do a fair amount of stand-blocking.. speaking of which I don't see a lot of reason to stand block anymore....
 
I dont like that upback blocks high, sorry. I dont mind that upback doesnt get hit by assists though... Cant there be like a happy medium?

The last thing this game needs is a hyper buff to upback when half the game is upback anyways.

-edit.

This also makes downback plus assist and upback plus assist even better... Which isnt something i would think would be good for the game when down back plus assist and look for the high is already so good against so many characters.
offense is already so good that i welcome defensive buffs that don't involve buffing of reversals in general.

i haven't played games of beta fukua yet so i'm still not sure about shadow changes but in training mode she felt way better than before. i'll try to get some games in tonight and report further on what i think. meaning if someone sees me on beta feel free to ask me to play
 
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Then do more lows? The critical weakness of upbacking was always you risk getting hit by lows into an unscaled combo. I always thought getting hit in pre-jump with stuff like Bomber or L Extend was always really stupid anyway.

Did you even read what i wrote? I said that getting hit by assists in preblock was stupid. I'm not fine with that because as i said it is dumb.

But high blocking for upback? I HATE this idea. Like i really hate it and it will make pw at the very least, free to upback with only one way to beat it and that is to get heavy frame advantage and do lows.

Also...who are you telling to do lows? I remember hitting a certain someone with tons of lows because of their obsession with upbacking...

Lol telling me to do lows is like telling chris rock to tell some jokes.
Upback is already a great defensive strat and now it will just be even better... And buff characters that DONT rely on highs to open their opponents up, whereas its a nerf to characters that DO like to open characters up via highs.
 
Air grabbing is a good idea for upbackers or empty jumpers too, there's plenty of weaknesses to upbacking.

And Dime don't bring in "well you're not even good" into an argument, it just makes you seem like you don't like anyone who dares question you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
 
You don't know how much I love that you don't go into preblock when you're on the ground and an air attack happens. It makes positioning after a burst so much better.
 
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I will be honest, painwheel will get hit pretty hard with this, but hopefully i can get out of that stupid cilia slide, j. hp set up now
 
Air grabbing is a good idea for upbackers or empty jumpers too, there's plenty of weaknesses to upbacking.

And Dime don't bring in "well you're not even good" into an argument, it just makes you seem like you don't like anyone who dares question you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem


I didnt bring your strength into the equation dude. I said i hit someone with lows... A lot. Thats all. I also get hit with lows, a lot. So...

And yeah I'm not bringing your strength or lack thereof into the argument. If i did that to you, players like negus and wing and sage etc could also do it to me, rather easily. I'm just saying that your argument that i need to do more lows was in itself an ad hominem and you know it because i hit you and others with lows all day... and since our last games were pretty recent, you should remember that before you berate me for "not doing enough lows"

@KhaosMuffins

So i have to accept 50% damage scaling and giving my opponent a free bar if i do a whole throw combo or allow my opponent an opportunity out by resetting them, just to punish upback?


That doesnt seem fair at all.

What seems fair to me is asking my opponent to make good use of the already in game defensive techniques such as:

Pushblock
Pushblock autoguard
Pbgc
Alphacounter (air and ground)
Invincible super into safe dhc
Invincible assist
Throw tech


And proper spacing in the first place...
 
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