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Her Parasite is as Deadly as her Beauty - it's the Blood Goddess Eliza!!! Thread

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I really hope that Eliza isn't like Slayer or Elizabeth in that she's the type of character that only loses on purpose and everything is just child's play to her.

Like I hope that when she loses a fight, she actually loses.
 
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Mysterygamer3k said:
Actually Sekhmet is looking at her nails, clearly showing that it's not a big deal and then makes a display before getting up finally. Like she's saying, "Fine, if I must."
Oh wow, I totally didn't see that. Eliza's animations are really staggering. Some of the most elaborate animations for a fighter I've ever seen.

Denizen said:
I really hope that Eliza isn't like Slayer or Elizabeth in that she's the type of character that only loses on purpose and everything is just child's play to her.
Like I hope that when she loses a fight, she actually loses.
I'm getting the impression that even if she does lose a fight she would never admit that she actually lost.
 
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Mysterygamer3k said:
The vain nature of the pair and how amazingly they seem to get along really is quite different from Filia's relationship with Samson.
It's been somewhat semi-confirmed that Eliza and Sekhmet are essentially one entity due to being bonded for so long.
Which does make me wonder how Sekhmet will act given her feral stance and that "oh! I think I chipped a nail..." act seem very opposite mannerisms.
 
Balder said:
It's been somewhat semi-confirmed that Eliza and Sekhmet are essentially one entity due to being bonded for so long.
Which does make me wonder how Sekhmet will act given her feral stance and that "oh! I think I chipped a nail..." act seem very opposite mannerisms.
I kinda think Eliza puts on a different mask depending on what the situation is.

Remember, Sekhmet is when Eliza's blood is stripped off.
 
Balder said:
It's been somewhat semi-confirmed that Eliza and Sekhmet are essentially one entity due to being bonded for so long.
Which does make me wonder how Sekhmet will act given her feral stance and that "oh! I think I chipped a nail..." act seem very opposite mannerisms.

Well, that's true but I was thinking about that and how they can separate... Maybe Sekhmet emerges when you use a (what I call) Blood Install, similar to blood pack for A.B.A from Guilty Gear, she consumes blood and begins losing health rapidly but becomes incredibly fast and strong for a limited time, losing health as she does so, sort of like a berserker/feral mode until it expires or you run out of health.

So maybe Sekhmet like absorbs Eliza's blood inside of herself, leaving only Sekhmet visible for a limited time, turning her into a rush down character. o.o

I'm probably very wrong or mistaken on that and it's all just guessing on my part but I think that would be pretty neat to have as part of her kit.
 
Mysterygamer3k said:
Well, that's true but I was thinking about that and how they can separate... Maybe Sekhmet emerges when you use a (what I call) Blood Install, similar to blood pack for A.B.A from Guilty Gear, she consumes blood and begins losing health rapidly but becomes incredibly fast and strong for a limited time, losing health as she does so, sort of like a berserker/feral mode until it expires or you run out of health.

So maybe Sekhmet like absorbs Eliza's blood inside of herself, leaving only Sekhmet visible for a limited time, turning her into a rush down character. o.o

I'm probably very wrong or mistaken on that and it's all just guessing on my part but I think that would be pretty neat to have as part of her kit.
nah, i think they are two different characters
 
Mysterygamer3k said:
Well, that's true but I was thinking about that and how they can separate... Maybe Sekhmet emerges when you use a (what I call) Blood Install, similar to blood pack for A.B.A from Guilty Gear, she consumes blood and begins losing health rapidly but becomes incredibly fast and strong for a limited time, losing health as she does so, sort of like a berserker/feral mode until it expires or you run out of health.

So maybe Sekhmet like absorbs Eliza's blood inside of herself, leaving only Sekhmet visible for a limited time, turning her into a rush down character. o.o
This is what I'm thinking too. Her old concept art (which may or may not still be accurate) shows she has a 'Staff Form' that Eliza changes into when Sekhmet is running around by herself:

Tumblr_mjxv2ugrzw1s4c693o3_400.jpg

ElizaLover4Life said:
nah, i think they are two different characters

Explain?
 
ElizaLover4Life said:
nah, i think they are two different characters

Haven't we already confirmed that they aren't going to be two separate characters? I could have sworn that this was stated on stream at some point, specifically pointing out that she would NOT play as stated in the igg backer.

Even if it isn't confirmed, I highly doubt they will be two different characters. Having two characters in one literally doubles the production cost, and she was only funded to the same extent as any of the other new dlc characters.
 
Skullmageddon said:
Even if it isn't confirmed, I highly doubt they will be two different characters. Having two characters in one literally doubles the production cost, and she was only funded to the same extent as any of the other new dlc characters.
Yep, this is what's confusing me so much. They've said she won't be two characters because it's insane from a production cost view, but then Sekhmet has her own fully animated standing idle and crouching idle.
 
Well my thinking isn't even so drastic as her being two separate characters so much as that just being a part of her move set, changing her normals when it's just sekhmet running around and everything, not changing her blockbusters or anything like that. And Sekhmet could only be out for a limited amount of time and Eliza takes periodic damage while Sekhmet is running around like that. But it's just me being crazy with theory crafting and craving A.B.A style combos which I like a lot. >>
 
Cellsai said:
Yep, this is what's confusing me so much. They've said she won't be two characters because it's insane from a production cost view, but then Sekhmet has her own fully animated standing idle and crouching idle.
At this point, only time will tell. But the likely hood of making Sekhmet fully animated with a separate move set and everything seems just too much for Eliza's game play style. Something would have to go. So either two characters in one due to taking damage, or the blood traps. You pick.
 
Mysterygamer3k said:
Well my thinking isn't even so drastic as her being two separate characters so much as that just being a part of her move set, changing her normals when it's just sekhmet running around and everything, not changing her blockbusters or anything like that. And Sekhmet could only be out for a limited amount of time and Eliza takes periodic damage while Sekhmet is running around like that. But it's just me being crazy with theory crafting and craving A.B.A style combos which I like a lot. >>

While not getting the double characters thing is disappointing, if true, to their credit the gameplay descriptors in the Indiegogo were "speculation" and Eliza's even said she will "probably" have two stances, so dropping that isn't changing what they promised or anything like that.

Problem with that idea is that you still need to have full mobility and normal attack frames for Sekhmet, so instead of 2x sprites to make, you're proposing they have... 1.6x?

Which is sadly still a lot to do if you're on the Indiegogo budget alone. Maybe she could've had both if she showed up in a properly funded Skullgirls 2. :( Or maybe not, but it's fun to speculate. I wouldn't be surprised if she's blood trap only now, although it does make me wonder why Sekhmet has an idle if they cut that...
 
Ninja said:
At this point, only time will tell. But the likely hood of making Sekhmet fully animated with a separate move set and everything seems just too much for Eliza's game play style. Something would have to go. So either two characters in one due to taking damage, or the blood traps. You pick.
If it comes to that I'll take the two characters over the blood traps. I'm inclined to agree with people on Eliza's tranformation being more like an install than a permanent change. I'm an A.B.A player on GG and her Moroha form is temporary to begin with and can be shortened by knocking her down. If Sekhmet requires blood to be on the field, or willingly sacrificing health if no damage has been taken, to start that seems like a fair tradeoff for allowing a second fully functional character on the field.
 
Another thing that makes me think that she does have a second "stance" like Moroha mode is the fact that a lot of her normals seem very slow from what we've seen. Her s.HP is quite long on it's animation and seemingly slow just from glancing at it. her c.HK is also a very slow animation, though it probably hits multiple times as well. Which just makes me wonder about it a little more is all. Though if they don't have a Moroha mode substitute in the form of Sekhmet then I'm fine with it but I would like something of a mix of A.B.A's gameplay which is a high risk, high reward, high and consistent pressure style gameplay mixed with the traps would be interesting.

Would also give you a reason to actually use her Normal mode, unlike A.B.A which was probably her biggest issue was that Normal mode was basically worthless.
 
Mysterygamer3k said:
changing her normals when it's just sekhmet running around and everything, not changing her blockbusters or anything like that. >>

I think you have a bit of a misunderstanding behind what it takes to produce one of the characters. The MAJORITY of the production cost for each characters is in their normal moves! Each character has at least 18 different normal moves, all of which are unique (and not counting any extra normals). On top of that you also have special moves to consider. If you just took out having unique blockbusters then the cost is pretty much the same as doing an entire character.

Edit: I forgot to mention the plethora of additional animations that have nothing to do with moves, such as blocking, jumping, running, etc. Even if Sekhmet just uses Eliza's animations for these as well, replacing all of the normals would take an incredible amount of work and time.

It's more likely that Sekhmet will be some sort of stance change, either through a super or special. Sekhmet might have some unique normals and specials, but I would be surprised.

Ninja said:
So either two characters in one due to taking damage, or the blood traps. You pick.

PaperBag_Sniper said:
If it comes to that I'll take the two characters over the blood traps.

I think you're missing the point here. Having Eliza act as two playable characters in one would cost them double the development cost of a normal character, while having blood traps would simply be a part of her gameplay mechanic that would be entirely planned and accounted for within the normal cost for production. These two things have nothing to do with one another and are in no way equal with regards to production costs.
 
Mysterygamer3k said:
Well, that's true but I was thinking about that and how they can separate...
Fair enough. I was only speaking from a lore perspective. Gameplaywise...indeed we can only speculate. Personally, I was hoping for a "no strings attached" dual stance character, like SFIV's Gen but I think your guess has a better chance at being right.

Skullmageddon said:
Haven't we already confirmed that they aren't going to be two separate characters? I could have sworn that this was stated on stream at some point, specifically pointing out that she would NOT play as stated in the igg backer.

Even if it isn't confirmed, I highly doubt they will be two different characters. Having two characters in one literally doubles the production cost, and she was only funded to the same extent as any of the other new dlc characters.
The discussion sparked from a idle comment by Mariel Cartwright where she stated working on Eliza is as taxing workwise as working on two characters. Sekhmet having a stance and crouch of her own further fuels that idea. It will certainly be more elaborate than Squigly's stances, that I think is a fair wager.
But your statement that it has been pointed out the IGG description is no longer entirely accurate is certainly intriguing. Well, que sera, sera...

Mysterygamer3k said:
I would like something of a mix of A.B.A's gameplay which is a high risk, high reward, high and consistent pressure style gameplay mixed with the traps would be interesting.
I'd wager Eliza will be more focused on footsies and spacing while Sekhmet will be about pressure, possibly rushdown. In which, I can see the character being resource-management heavy and the player has to decide on where to "invest" the blood - powering up Eliza's specials and Blockbusters or unleashing Sekhmet?


There's a lot of moves shown but sadly none seems to hint at either the blood mechanic or Sekhmet.
 
I think sekhmet would be used for something like a super in the idol stance or something
The only thing i can see her being similar to a.b.a with is possibly just having a blood pack
 
Skullmageddon said:
I think you're missing the point here. Having Eliza act as two playable characters in one would cost them double the development cost of a normal character, while having blood traps would simply be a part of her gameplay mechanic that would be entirely planned and accounted for within the normal cost for production. These two things have nothing to do with one another and are in no way equal with regards to production costs.
I understand what is being said, but you presented two options. One that you think is outside the realm of reality given financial and time constraints, and one you think is the more likely compromise. I merely picked the one I find more interesting in the long run as the outcome I would like to see.

From my standpoint, If Sekhmet is her own playable character in tandem with Eliza she will still be limited. She will likely have no blockbusters and a limited number of special inputs. This would be fine by my accounts because you gain more than you lose.
 
It's really fun to think of the possibilities honestly. I mean we haven't even seen anything more about the blood mechanic since it was first shown in it's early, early prototype format which was in the works before the voting was even finished on the IGG campaigns for all the different characters that would be added. So many things could have changed by now as far as how they wanted Eliza's gameplay style to be. I'm sure they still have the blood mechanic in there, but even when it was first demonstrated there were 0 absolutes given about what it would do or how exactly it would be used, beyond being extra damage in the demonstration, and that was only with a block buster activation.
 
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To be frank I'm going to wait and see. Also I'm going to need major sleep for I have loss of half a weeks worth of sleep already. And this coffee is not helping. Let's not lose our heads here. :PUN:
 
Ninja said:
To be frank I'm going to wait and see. Also I'm going to need major sleep for I have loss of half a weeks worth of sleep already. And this coffee is not helping. Let's not lose our heads here. :PUN:
Sleep, and dream of Eliza.
 
For the record, the reason ABA is financially feasible while Eliza is not is because ABA doesn't change a lot when she Installs.
The head of her key changes and she gets a few more moves, but on the whole her sprites don't actually change - ie they don't need to be reanimated from scratch.
With Eliza, her and Sekh are completely different visually so it would be really hard to reuse their assets between forms. As Skull mentioned, normals and basic movement make up the vast majority of animations in the game. 18 normals (plus command normals), 2 walks, 2 idles, 3 jumps, super/double jumps, 2/4 dashes, 2 blocks, 2 pushblocks, multiple hit animations (regular, sweeps, staggers, etc), 4 throws + whiffs... etc. And that's for each character - not both combined. The list of required animations is seriously long, and that's before you even start on specials.
 
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Cellsai said:
For the record, the reason ABA is financially feasible while Eliza is not is because ABA doesn't change a lot when she Installs.
The head of her key changes and she gets a few more moves, but on the whole her sprites don't actually change - ie they don't need to be reanimated from scratch.
With Eliza, her and Sekh are completely different visually so it would be really hard to reuse their assets between forms. As Skull mentioned, normals and basic movement make up the vast majority of animations in the game. 18 normals (plus command normals), 2 walks, 2 idles, 3 jumps, super/double jumps, 2/4 dashes, 2 blocks, 2 pushblocks, multiple hit animations (regular, sweeps, staggers, etc), 4 throws + whiffs... the list of required animations is seriously long, and that's before you even start on specials.
Good lord. I wonder what they ARE gonna do for it then.
 
PaperBag_Sniper said:
I understand what is being said...

Gotcha, and I agree that having two stances would be the most interesting. I just wanted to point out that comparing the idea of a two-in-one character to that of one with the blood trap mechanic is in no way a fair or realistic comparison because the two are in no way comparable to one another.

Plus that was more of a comment to what Ninja said than what you said :P But at any rate, I'm also excited to see how she plays.
 
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Cellsai said:
For the record, the reason ABA is financially feasible while Eliza is not is because ABA doesn't change a lot when she Installs.
The head of her key changes and she gets a few more moves, but on the whole her sprites don't actually change - ie they don't need to be reanimated from scratch.
With Eliza, her and Sekh are completely different visually so it would be really hard to reuse their assets between forms. As Skull mentioned, normals and basic movement make up the vast majority of animations in the game. 18 normals (plus command normals), 2 walks, 2 idles, 3 jumps, super/double jumps, 2/4 dashes, 2 blocks, 2 pushblocks, multiple hit animations (regular, sweeps, staggers, etc), 4 throws + whiffs... the list of required animations is seriously long, and that's before you even start on specials.

Of course, I'm not trying to be unrealistic, I prefaced it all by saying it was just me going on theory crafting sprees and talking about what I would want to see out of her gameplay style. Though the trap gameplay is also very interesting as well and I'm sure it'll be fun too, it still raises a lot of questions about the idle animations for Sekhmet. Though to be logical and realistic again, that could just be for victory stances after the battle or something like that.
 
One possibility (not sure if anyone has said this before) is that she may work somewhat like double. In other words, Sekhmet would transform back into Eliza in order to do faster versions or variations of Eliza's normal moves, much like how double does. Of course, this still requires a lot of unique animations for basic movement. I suppose they could share some frames for those actions as well, but that would be pushing it...

I don't necessarily think this will be the case, nor do I have any reason to believe that she will play like this. I'm just providing another thought as to how Eliza might work.
 
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Ninja said:
Whoa there Water, I'm not a pervert. and I said beside her not with her. big difference there. all though you could show me... for educational purposes...

Right, I think we all know that there's very little education involved with such a thing Ninja.

So, who thinks the end of Eliza's grab will be her golf clubbing the enemy out from under her using the microphone stand as a club and who thinks it'll just be a kick? I was thinking about that after I looked over the thumbnails for her grab animation and I realized there was no real ending to it, other than her grinding the bottom of her microphone stand into their guts. It's either that or they sort of just, mystically fly out from under the mic stand after the grab animation is done, which is also a possibility.
 
Mysterygamer3k said:
Right, I think we all know that there's very little education involved with such a thing Ninja.

So, who thinks the end of Eliza's grab will be her golf clubbing the enemy out from under her using the microphone stand as a club and who thinks it'll just be a kick?

I'd like her so much more if she did an empress heel and then kicked them away
 
Skullmageddon said:
One possibility (not sure if anyone has said this before) is that she may work somewhat like double. In other words, Sekhmet would transform back into Eliza in order to do faster versions or variations of Eliza's normal moves, much like how double does. Of course, this still requires a lot of unique animations for basic movement. I suppose they could share some frames for those actions as well, but that would be pushing it...

I don't necessarily think this will be the case, nor do I have any reason to believe that she will play like this. I'm just providing another thought as to how Eliza might work.
This was actually one of my thoughts on it too that I discounted. It's definitely a possibility as it cuts out so much work, but as you said, it would still require most of her movement options and would look a little silly maybe.
Mysterygamer3k said:
So, who thinks the end of Eliza's grab will be her golf clubbing the enemy out from under her using the microphone stand as a club and who thinks it'll just be a kick? It's either that or they sort of just, mystically fly out from under the mic stand after the grab animation is done, which is also a possibility.
I just figured it'd the latter. Maybe animate it so the last grinding motion she does it just a little more severe, so it looks like she shovels them out.
 
Mysterygamer3k said:
Right, I think we all know that there's very little education involved with such a thing Ninja.

I'll make a quick little comic out this tired induced conversation Water, bleg.

Ninja out for the night I mean day... why is so bright outsid- oh wait that's my lamp for my light table... :(

Ta-
 
Cellsai said:
I just figured it'd the latter. Maybe animate it so the last grinding motion she does it just a little more severe, so it looks like she shovels them out.

Ah, true I didn't think about it being animated quite like that but now that you've mentioned it, it does sound like the most plausible and reasonable way for it to be handled considering how it's animated already.
 
Seems to me that Sekmet's animations will be much simpler and easier to animate than any other character.
 
Hmm, maybe, but it would still be a ton of extra animation that they would have to pay for that they may not be wanting to. If that's the case then Sekhmet will probably just remain as a part of Eliza's other moves or in victory/losing animations.
 
So I was thinking more about how Eliza's blood mechanic may tie into her actual gameplay and even though it's late in the game (pun intended) to be spitballing ideas here's what I got.

One trait of A.B.A's moroha mode is that it is constantly draining and getting knocked down which causes a huge chunk to deplete. If Sekhmet has a similar timer, any blood units left on ground could be used to replenish a fraction of it to keep her active longer simply by walking over them. The compromise for this would be a timer that drains fairly quickly so the player would have to choose between using blood as Eliza to continue combos or put pressure on the opponent or going for big money with a faster, more mobile character. Likewise it plays into Eliza being an attack from disadvantage character because the more damage she takes, and the more blood that is on the field, there is the potential for Sekhmet to be on the field longer.
 
Mysterygamer3k said:
Ah, so Eliza's blood forms the shape of Nut in the sky, with sparkling blood and everything, interesting. Although I still see Sekhmet looking at her nails like she doesn't give a damn about what's going on really or isn't concerned, which I like. The vain nature of the pair and how amazingly they seem to get along really is quite different from Filia's relationship with Samson. Still wondering what kind of history Samson and Sekhmet supposedly have with one another as well.

I'd imagine they had some kind of falling out or splitting of interests at some point and Sekhmet became bitter and started harboring a grudge against Samson for leaving.

Myself, I would like that Eliza and Sekhmet were evil (ruthless ambition, gluttony, pleasure seeking and cruelty) like old time vampires. Also, we need more proper villains in the current playable roster (Val doesn't count after you finish her story).

Balder said:
It's been somewhat semi-confirmed that Eliza and Sekhmet are essentially one entity due to being bonded for so long.
Which does make me wonder how Sekhmet will act given her feral stance and that "oh! I think I chipped a nail..." act seem very opposite mannerisms.

After being together for some much time their personalities rubbed each other so much that they ended similar to each other.
 
I don't think I would consider Eliza and Sekhmet evil and evil is also a matter of perspective. She's consuming the blood of others purely as a means to an end, she's not doing it just out of the spite of doing it. She does it because it's how she sustains her eternal life and beauty and that's all there is to it. Sure she is cold about it but it's because to her it's just what she has to do to continue living indefinitely.
 
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